Why do people play games like MTG and Warhammer 40k? They are WAY too expensive for what they are...

Why do people play games like MTG and Warhammer 40k? They are WAY too expensive for what they are, and you can play a game that's just as good or better for a small fraction of the cost.

They don't.

MTG: As a game, it's basically dead. But as an investment, it keeps growing and growing. MTG is essentially a form of cryptocurrency at this point.

W40k: When was the last time you saw anyone playing that game? It's dead, end of story.

Because they are popular and for people with no friends it is easier to find opponents.

Or they could just play superior alternatives.

MTG is a slow-paced, expensive, paper TCG. It's a relic of the 1990s, and there's no reason to play it over a game that's much faster paced (Yugioh, Vanguard, Dragonball), an online TCG that isn't an ancient piece of trash like MTGO (Pokemon Online, Hearthstone), or a cheaper alternative (LCGs). MTG offers nothing of value to players, and at this point is only good as an investment a la crypto.

And why play W40k over an MMO like WoW, a MOBA like League, or a much cheaper alternative like Settlers of Catan? Again, no good reason to play W40k.

cause its fun and you dont need to spend 1000$ if you only play commander
people that spend that kind of money are just social outcasts that are so deprived of self validation that they need to spend 1000$ on magic so they can feel better than people playing a card game

>faster is better
lmao

>Hearthstone

no

not sure what rock you're living under but you're clearly not actually going into stores to see whats going on.

I don't play magic but see it played at my FLGS daily, with event nights bringing in 20-30 people easy.

As for 40k, 8th edition did much to help make the game fun again. Back in 7th the game was unplayable. Getting a game in felt like a chore. Now it's much faster, rules are far easier to look up, Allies were massively toned down, formation cheese is gone, and in general the worst stuff in 8th is pretty minor gripes with the odd unit or the cover rules. Ever since 8th dropped my store's playerbase quintupled and it's brought in a lot of new players too. The game is far from perfect but it's much better than it was and at least people have fun playing now.

They are the two games that wherever you go, you can always find people to play against. Yes, other games are cheaper, but they have smaller player bases and can be harder to find a group. 40k and magic have massive player bases, and stores tend to push those games as their main sellers, so when new people come in, those are the games they are pointed to. It's kind of a self fulfilling prophecy. Back in 7th, 40k almost died. X-Wing, Bolt Action, War Machine, and countless other games were all eating into GW's playerbase. Had they not released 8th when they did 40k would've lost it's top dog spot and you would see people asking "why does everyone play X-Wing now?"

Another point in 40k's favor is the lore (at least some of it) and the models. No other game is quite like it in the setting department, so it really stands out on the shelves compared to other games.

why in the hell would I play an MMO or a MOBA to get my wargaming fix? Or settlers of Catan?

Had you recommended Dropzone commander, Bolt Action, Warmachine, or any other number of tabletop Wargames, your question would make sense. Instead you suggest alternatives not even close to 40k.

Why not? With online TCGs, you don't have to go to a foul-smelling collectibles shop just to play them, and you don't have to worry about your cards getting stolen. They are much more efficient in every way.

Actually commander players are the ones who spend the most on mtg. I don't see standard players bringing multiple 4000$ decks with them. In EDH? All the time

Because I have the disposable income and free time to. Now back to your field peasant.

Go back to your hedge fund elitist scum.

Because the game is terrible. You don't have to worry about your cards getting stolen and you can sit at home and watch youtube in the background, but it doesn't mean that it's good product because of that.

>MOOOOOM HE HAS SPARE MONEY AND I DONT!!!

>W40k: When was the last time you saw anyone playing that game? It's dead, end of story.
>40k
>just released a new edition, and more players are active in it than have been in years
>dead

This HAS to be bait.

lol

I install cable.

I play 40k and have around 7 armies and counting.

Learn how to manage your money better, you don't need that $6 starbucks every day.

What is a modeling and painting hobby for 40k for 100 Bob.

It's more then just a table top game you fucking mongaloid

Hey Chris, your sister is fucking hot.

The best part about posts like these is how cheap wargames and card games are as a hobby compared to so many other things.

Look up the cost of mountain biking, or trilathons, or woodworking, or so many other hobbies, and tell me 40k is still expensive.

>Hearthstone
I hope you enjoy playing in a meta that's 41% one deck goober. And besides that, mtg is a deeper game than hearthstone, even if MTGO is a piece of shit.
Also, Yugioh is literally a game where the newest sets are mandatory because Konami can't keep the power creep in check. At least in MTG the older cards are the most powerful and Wizards learned their lesson about busted cards for the most part.

No one is comparing 40K to biking other than you. People are comparing 40K to other games, which is generally cheaper.

The base complaint is that they're far too expensive, when the truth is that they're pretty damn cheap is the point.

I can play KoW for almost half the cost of anything GW produces, I think is the point.

OP was quite literally asking why you would play 40K over a cheaper game. I don't agree with him as 40K and MTG have their merits, but he was always comparing them to other games rather than bicycles as you are.

Do you play Dungeons & Dragons?

Agreed

t.salt water fish owner

Git r done

>you don't need that 6$ starbucks every day
>spends upwards of 100 dollars on an unpainted, unassembled chunk of plastic that cost mere cents to create

I don't know either. I used to play 40k, but I jumped ship for cheaper alternatives.

I still play magic, but I don't think I've ever spent more than $10 for a deck or draft.

D&D is actually cheap though thanks to OGL and the rules being freely available on SRDs.

>mtg is expensive
>spending 100 bucks per week for entertainment is expensive
Maybe get out of your mom's basement and get a job?

40k is fucking expensive for a wargame.
It's also expensive compared to Chess, or Soccer, or Tabletop RPGs, or Reading, or Drawing...

I play 40k among other wargames, and it's fucking expensive compared to many other games. It's also not magically cheap or even good value just because Yachting requires several millions.

Neither MTG nor 40k are expensive compared to many ''adult'' hobbies

It's cheap if you compare it to expensive hobbies. Yeah sure there are cheaper hobbies like reading books or some other shit, but people who puts mtg and 40k as some paragon of expensive hobbies are just unemployed poorfags.

It's a good thing that OP was comparing those games to other games rather than yachting then.

>unironically recommending league to people

Yeah, no. That game is the most tilting thing I have ever touched and it's impossible to have anything resembling a good time playing it unless you're dicking around in normals. Even URF got ruined by people spamming Sona.

>you can play a game that's just as good or better for a small fraction of the cost.
Name them then

>but people who puts mtg and 40k as some paragon of expensive hobbies are just unemployed poorfags.
But he never did that. OP said that you can play other games that are a fraction of the cost. I don't think that anyone who is complaining about the prices of MTG and 40K are comparing them to other hobbies.

Song of Blades and Heroes
Kings of War
Of Gods and Mortals
DBA/HoTT
Nearly any historic wargame
Frostgrave

The list can go on. All of these games either allow you to use any models you want or offer much cheaper alternatives

I like them. I find playing them with friends enjoyable. Why else would you play anything?

If you want to compare it to other tcgs, then it became a matter of preference. I like mtg and i don't like other tcgs.
Also, mtg can be the cheapest or the most expensive depends on what format you want to play.

>Why do people play games like MTG and Warhammer 40k? They are WAY too expensive for what they are, and you can play a game that's just as good or better for a small fraction of the cost.

Miniature war games and TCG/CGGs are multiplayer games. If I don't have someone to play against, it doesn't matter how good the game is, because I can't play it.

I'd rather be playing other games, but nobody else wants to.

Some people spend hundreds of dollars getting drunk. You underestimate what constitutes an "expensive" hobby.

But you can't spam in URF anymore

You can certainly spend more on alcohol than on a Magic deck, but OP was pretty clear that he is referring to those games as expensive compared to other games of the same type.

Standard players spend the most over time. They need to keep spending $500 a year just to keep up with the rotations.

>WoW or assfaggots
>a replacement for a wargame
The fuck? You've clearly never played a wargame before, because those are not a replacement for why people play 40k. It'd make more sense to say they should play and RPG

That's why I like EDH. Not necessarily because of the format itself, but because I don't need to grab too much beyond what works with my deck.

I agree. My friends are trying to get me to play warhammer and I refuse. It's just cringey. Painting like army men? What is this fourth grade?

I'd consider it the reverse. Magic isn't a particularly expensive hobby, the others are cheap.

>people who enjoy thing spend money on thing

a novel concept, i know

Then you and OP have never googled to look at how much the price of a tcg booster pack. Sure mtg might not be the cheapest but it's far from being the most expensive.

Hahaha this.

For a booster pack? Sure, the price is standard. But for a deck that won't make you always lose at FNM the buy in is larger. That is more because of MTG's popularity than anything of course, only LCG's break that rule, and even then some less prominent MTG formats (Pauper, EDH) are cheaper.

Because they have a playerbase, regardless of how good or shit they are they are marketed to hell

Show up at the lgs with your spellfire deck or a chainmail army and im sure you can find people to play against, because im sure at least 4 people in the world have had 1 game since last century

Play draft.
Also LCGs need not apply, they should spend more time trying to find someone to play their dead game rather than badmouthing tcgs.

>Yugioh, Vanguard, Dragonball, Pokemon Online, Hearthstone

These games are all complete shit, though.

You have a point with 40K. There are a lot of legitimately much better games out there, and anyone who sticks with GW is a battered housewife at this point. But pretty much all MtG's competition is total ass.

Normally I don't make judgement on taste, but holy fuck.

>spellfire

Holy shit, nostalgia'd hard

>play mediocre game just because everyone else does
>play a game you actually like, rarely find an opponent


It's a shit choice. I refuse to give in to the bullshit though so I will take my once or twice a month game and play it happily rather than trudge along pretending I give a shit about the meme.

>But for a deck that won't make you always lose at FNM the buy in is larger.
Who says you HAVE to play competitive FMN? You and three friends can pick up mtg for kitchen table play for like $200 or less split between all of you. Nevermind that you can play sanctioned, competitive limited for like $15. Claiming that Mtg is expensive based on standard, modern, or legacy is like claiming racing is an expensive hobby based on the price of formula one vehicles.

>And why play W40k over an MMO like WoW, a MOBA like League, or a much cheaper alternative like Settlers of Catan? Again, no good reason to play W40k.
Those aren't even decent vidya.

Mediocre bait or retarded?

>Mediocre bait or retarded?
Probably both.

>implying your friends don't already play modern and have amazing decks you'll never beat

This stops you playing limited with them how exactly?

If they only want to play standard then why would you try to play a a game non competitively with friends that play it competitively?

I play 40k because it lets me get closer to unsupervised twelve year olds in confined spaces without it seeming weird, sometimes I can get close enough to smell their hair

Pokemon would be vastly more successful in that regard

I don't try to. And they get pissy, and I look for new friends.

I dont think ive even seen a person in the flesh that actually plays pokemon, only on youtube, also asians dont do it for me

Sounds like they just want an excuse to not be friends with you.

I can't say much for MTG, but 40ks popularity is understandable.

Although its models are expensive, if you compare its quality of model with similar quality products made by different companies, you'll see a much smaller gap in price than if you just look over the market as a whole.

In addition the lore of the game is well designed to allow players "structured creativity" wherein they are given the bones/scaffolding of a race, but are then allowed to take liberties and get creative within those bounds. It allows a lot of creativity whilst retaining a unique identity for all of their factions.

Yeah but it's still a 3 cent piece being sold for a 50,000% profit.

Naw, 40k is for retards. Models, story and gameplay are all wet hot garbage.

Many things are hyper inflated in the modern world.

What's an alternative that is better than 40k in all three categories?
I don't know if you're baiting or not, but if you aren't I'm sincerely interested.

I'm not defending GW prices but this plastic cost argument is idiotic. Mold costs are in the five figure range. Not counting the workload and other equipment.

People play what they like and for some 40K is not expensive. Or it is as expensive as it should be to keep poorfags like yourself of the hobby.

Instead of moaning on the internet just go and find a better job. If you criticize something and not prize something that you like it means that you are a butthurt moron that just can't deal with life.

Let us say you have a thing that costs $10 each to make.
Let us say that when you price it at $200 each, they sell slowly.
Let us say that when you price it at $20 each, they sell slightly less slowly.

To stay in business, the models need to be sold to not only cover their own costs, but also other costs like maintainance (janitorial and mechanical), market research, advertising, site upkeep, and employee paychecks.
What's more, tabletop wargaming is a niche hobby. Selling more of a thing isn't an option when not many people care about your product. So GW goes another route: an inexpensive product sold at a high price.
Who cares if they don't sell as much? They weren't selling that much to begin with. Only now, they're making more profit.
I do think a few heigher-up people could stand a pay-cut, though.

I don't know much of the lore, I'll take lack of complaints as a good sign, but Malifaux is pretty good. It's weird and the designs are polarizing but actually technical quality are pretty good, minus few hiccups.

No, steampunk and malifaux are shit and they leave no room to be creative

This.

t.paraglider

>no room to be creative
This matters why? No one cares about your sonic oc donut steel

>Make your dudes
>Use fitting rules
Wow, that was hard

Let's be real, even the cheapest plastic crack provider sells characters - or comparable sprues - between 5 and 10$.

GW is overpriced but by large they still are within reasonable limits.

>"Lol just play casual kitchen table"
The only way players can enjoy casual magic is if they're all victim to the Dunning-Krueger effect. The second one person learns how to play the game your whole groups dynamic is ruined by his "unfair" decks.

One of the best baits if read in a while. You literally threw it all out at once. Good job.

Do you not understand how things are made or what?

Direct, operating costs to produce a spess marine aren't as low as you might think. The molds and injection machines they use cost a shit load and do wear out.

I wouldn't be surprised if the tooling alone for a new model runs six figures.

>OP makes a post criticizing the cost of a game, specifically comparing it to other games on it's category
>Dozens of retards desperately strawman and compare said game to things outside of it's category in order to justify the prices

The eternal state of this board

just because your playgroup is a bunch scrubs doesn't mean everyone else's is

play draft

Calling out an unsubstantiated argument is not strawmanning.

>playing constructed mtg
>not drafting

lmao

the Netrunner core set costs $40
pokemon starter decks costs $12
Yugioh starter decks cost $10-$15
MtG starter decks cost $10-15

Netrunner booster packs cost $8-$12 and include 40-60 cards
pokemon booster packs cost $1-$5 and contain 10 cards
Yugioh booster packs cost $2-$5 and contain 5 cards
MtG booster packs cost $4-$5 and contain 15 cards

Buying the complete Netrunner sets runs around $500-$700 depending on if you buy in bulk or used singles
top tier pokemon decks cost $100-$300
Yugioh top tier decks cost $500-$700
top tier standard decks in MtG run around $100-$300
top tier modern decks can range from $100-$600 with some outliers in the $700-$1500 range

where the fuck is the strawman?

When I was working at wal mart I had this rather good looking guy come up to me and ask me to let him know when our next shipment magic the gathering cards come in. Said he had shoe boxes of the stuff under his bed because he liked playing in tournaments. Big guy too, looked like he went tot the gym alot.

>Yugioh
>LCGs
>Vanguard

LMAOOO Good luck actually finding people to play those dead games with

Would you rather spend your money on starbucks or plastic crack?

>top tier modern decks can range from $100

Even "budget" decks like 8whack and mono green stompy are way over 100$.

>They are WAY too expensive for what they are
Not really.

A 40k army costs several hundred dollars, but if you care at all about the modelling and painting side of the hobby, you're getting hundreds of hours of hobby time building and painting that army. And after you're done with that, you've got infinite replayability. And if you ever get tired of your army, you can sell it on eBay and recoup much of the cost.

Compare that to vidya, where you spend $50 on a new game on Steam with maybe a 10-hour long set of story missions, and multiplayer that loses server support after a couple years and has no resale opportunity.

Hour for hour, there aren't many hobbies cheaper than 40k other than purely pen-and-paper RPGs.

I play mtg because it's fun and I'm not poor.