/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

They obviously should have released more legacies back then. 4 books of bloodlines, but only two on legacies.

How about the Bokor? Also, I have a bone to pick with your handling of the Mind part of the second Attainment for the Reality Stalkers. I like that it's Incognito Presence, but costing a point of Mana to activate and then only lasting for up to 5 turns at maximum makes it seem like a pretty trash Attainment. Like you would have literally no reason to opt for it over just casting the spell yourself.

How does one become an enccentric inhuman mage and still be swag?

forgot pic

Daksha?

Make a weird and unique Legacy.

Or become a Lich.

So I've been invited to a Mage: The Awakening 2e game recently, and I've never played any of the CoD/WoD books before. I've read over the rules a few times to wrap my head around particular sections and I think I've got a decent handle on the system, but I've heard that M:tA 2e is infamously unbalanced and I'm not sure what I should be looking out for when I'm making a character. Most of all, the GM is implementing a couple of his own houserules and I have no idea how large of an impact it's going to have on the game since I'm hardly familiar with the vanilla version.

Does anyone have any general tips for building a character in M:tA 2e? Are games run in the system generally combat-heavy enough to require combat-ready characters, or is it fine to roll with peaceful characters?

And would anyone be willing to answer a few more in-depth questions as well? For ease of reading I don't want to overload one post with a hundred small inquiries.

The Reality Stalkers were the first Legacy I went with. Before I had my 'keep Attainments useful' policy.
The benefit of that Attainment over simple spellcasting is that you can use it safely when observed by Sleepers.

It's an Instant Action for enough time for you get the fuck out of there, which doesn't cause Paradox, doesn't require a test, needs no Yantras to function, and doesn't cause Quiescence (Dissonance is irrelevant, given it's a few rounds).

I'd probably change it to a scene duration. Actually I probably will do that next update. Given it's limited to self-only, and that I'd be cutting out both the primary, and secondary spell factors. I'll probably add a 'Attainment ends if you get violent' clause. Because incognito presence is crazy enough, without being able to beat people senseless from 'invisibility' without causing Quiescence.

But yeah, sure I'll make the Bokor.
Really they're not my favorite Legacy.
They take a moderately interesting real-world mystic practice, and reduce it to being little but zombies.

Why are you even looking for balance in CofD game? this isn't D&D

Awakening is only 'infamously unbalanced' when it's running with other gamelines.

Otherwise it's fantastically balanced within itself.

At least they aren't the Neocologists

>What game are you playing right now? If you aren't playing a game, what game do you want to be playing? Post characters.

I am running Forsaken and playing Changeling. I wish i could play Forsaken on a PBP. Sadly i haven't found a game yet.

Any advise for running my first cwod vtm game? //spoiler// i'm scared //spoiler//

I've read the book and have nothing better to do. Hit me.

For your initial questions, 99.9% of complaints leveled at Awakening in regards to "balance" involve other splats and how Mages have wider rooms and higher ceilings compared to them, so to speak.

When making a character, just make a character you want to play, with an approach to magic you want to play. When the situation calls for it, you can cast no non-sense direct damage spells with every Arcana, so you don't need to be investing in a combat heavy character, unless that's one you want to play. The game is more of an investigative, cold war, cloak and dagger type anyway.

Any idea what the houserules are?

>I'd probably change it to a scene duration. Actually I probably will do that next update. Given it's limited to self-only, and that I'd be cutting out both the primary, and secondary spell factors. I'll probably add a 'Attainment ends if you get violent' clause.
That sounds good to me. My main picture of using the Attainment was well, stalking. Like using it to hang around unnoticed while casing a place, or following someone. I didn't consider the "get out of Dodge" part of it.

Why would you run cwod and not cofd?

No gripes with playing in an unbalanced system, it's just my first time jumping into the game and I'm unsure how far in both directions the balance can swing. I want to avoid accidentally crippling myself or invalidating the other player, and I'm too inexperienced with the system to tell how easy it is to accidentally fall into either of those outcomes.

Noted! Thanks for the reassurance.

I do have the houserules! The two biggest ones are that Rotes are banned outright (he said that they made players far less likely to try improvised casting), and that your initial Path only decides one of your two Ruling Arcana, not both; you get to pick the second one yourself so long as it's not your Inferior Arcana. The third houserule is that he's merging Arcane Beats/Experience with regular Beats/Experience, and the fourth is that we're not affiliated with any of the Factions at character creation, so no merits having to do with them allowed.

What sort of impacts would these have on a game, you think? Is getting rid of Rotes going to drastically change how we would normally play? Does merging Arcane/Regular experience into a single pool seem like a good call? Does getting to choose your second Ruling Arcana make any more interesting options available?

that literally can't happen in mage because most Arcana are so powerful and can do similar things.

Wow, those all sounds like amazingly huge turnoffs at first glance. Like holy shit. The point about Rotes is incredibly stupid. They're meant to be useful, but you would have to know a LOT to be using them more than you would be going for improvised casting. There's also not much a tangible distinction mechanically that would make them a problem. You still cast the spell the same you would as improvised, with a dicepool and yantras and everything, just with extra Reach to use. He's robbing you of useful tools and ways to flavor your character and the opportunity to use that flavor in play, showing what spells they consider worth learning as Rotes and the Skills they would use for them (a combat character would have Rotes of combat spells, that use combat skills for example).

Which makes the stuff about Ruling Arcana weird, because it seems like he wants to let you have more choices, but it also fucks with the fluff supremely. He's probably trying to get around the lack of Legacies. And by lack I mean "near total absence". We have a wonderful guy here updating Legacies to 2e, maybe show them to your ST? I don't have the most recent version but someone will post it, I'm sure.

The stuff about Orders is probably something to do with the story he wants to tell, so while I disagree with it, I'm not going to pick it apart and criticize it. He might be intending to let you join up later and get the free benefits for all I know.

Merging regular and Arcane beats/XP seems pretty pointless, since a lot of things "Arcane" can be bought with a combination of two. I guess this just means you have more XP to spend on whatever you want. Nothing wrong with that that I can see.

I bought the 20th anniversary edition

FOOL

:(, it's actually pretty good though

Be brave.

>Implying nú-nWoD is anything but 100% distilled cancer.

Xir should apply a spiky object to hir juggular to free hirdself of xír detestable lack of intelligence, then return to the tumblr that spawned xer.

>Any advise for running my first cwod vtm game? //spoiler// i'm scared //spoiler//

Well, let's see...

First, don't be afraid of throwing some dangerous foes at the PCs. Vampires are powerful when compared to ordinary mortals, but if a rampaging werewolf smashes through a nearby wall, the first thing on their mind should be "FUCKING RUN!" rather than "meh, we can take him". Maybe have some vampire-mentor (their Sires or otherwise) mention how any surviving vampire really needs to listen to their fight & flight instincts. If they decide to stay and fight a far more powerful foe when they should have run, let them take the heat for their actions.

Second, don't be afraid of punishing the PCs if they make a stupid decision. For example, if they're listening to the Prince of the City talking, and one PC goes "I'mma go punch him in the face, lol, i'm so random :D" don't hesitate in letting his character get ripped to shreds as an example.

Third, vampire is a game of personal horror, where a character's morality is all-but-condemned to die a slow death as the character slides into more and more questionable activities. First they steal something, then they kill someone who doesn't maybe deserve it, and so on. In short, don't be afraid of making Humanity checks.

Fourth, no Mary Sues. While there's no major harm in letting a player pick some of the more exotic bloodlines (within reason), don't be afraid of smacking their hands or heads if they start going "I wanna be a free Blood Brother who joined the Camarilla and is also a potent thaumaturge and the local Sheriff :D".

Fifth, make sure players understand the difference between In-Character and Out-of-Character. Let them know that needless drama will get them kicked out of the group.

Anyone running HtV(or run it in the past)? I'm gearing up for a chronicle and could use some ST advice.

My plan is to have sort of slasher conspiracy(sorta like hunt club) being afoot in the region. Thing is I want to throw red herring in form of vampire often appearing up in conspicuous circumstances to divert my players attention from the ongoing slasher threat that is a subject of their investigation. I want them to be completely invested in idea that the killer is vampire while in reality he is probably their only ally.

How would you go about it?

Oof, that bad? The GM seemed to make sense when he originally pitched the No Rotes rule, but you make a good point that having a few free Reaches doesn't seem gamebreaking enough to warrant a change. Having a 'mastered' spell or two at the start seems flavorful, too, so that houserule is a little saddening now that I know what it actually does.

His reasoning for the Ruling Arcana choices was because he didn't like how certain Arcanas were paired together-- such that if you wanted to specialize in the Death Arcana, you HAD to also specialize in Matter and ignore Spirit. It made enough sense to me, but the book does go to great lengths to pair certain Arcanas based on the Paths that specialize in them like you said. I do like how I can specialize in both Space and Matter at the same time, though, since they both seemed fun. In any case, I'll definitely bring up the Legacies list to him when I next get the chance, if I can find the link. Thanks for that info!

Still working on getting a solid character concept down for the game, but I'm probably rolling with Space •••, Matter •• and Time • for starting arcanas, going for a cosmic theme. Have any ideas for fun spell combinations with those?

dont know why you would post a pic that has nothing to with what you're talking about

but ok

Yeah, the lack of Rotes is a real turn off. Especially if he's making it so that they don't even exist. They're a big deal.

As for Paths, I'm not going to badger you to death on how fucking with Arcana pairings is badwrongfun and should never be done ever, BUT I will say that Paths aren't actually paths as they are starting points. For example, you can totally play a Moros for Death, and then ignore Matter and go for Spirit. It's just a little harder. By RAW, it means that you can't choose Spirit at character creation, but you can learn it later up to 2 dots like you would any other Arcana, and then for the last 3 you would need a tutor. Because what it means to be Inferior is that that Arcanum's symbols are only barely in your Path's realm, and so it doesn't come to you as easily. If you raise it up, it works the same as any other Common Arcanum. Plus, if you take Spirit spells Praxes and Rotes (I suppose just Praxes for you), they would work the same as if they were from your Ruling Arcana. No Mana cost. Plus plus, there's nothing stopping a Moros from taking a Spirit Legacy and gaining it as a Ruling Arcanum.

If your ST is upset with how the pairings work, I would suggest to him to not mess with them, but allow you to spec in Inferior Arcana at character creation up to 2 dots, allow Praxes AND Rotes, and incorporate the players' desired Legacies into the game from Legacyfag's updates. The fluff is always wonky to mess with and more trouble than it's worth.

>Have any ideas for fun spell combinations with those?
Not really. This isn't a way of saying that the spread is bad but that I have no clue how conjunctional spells are supposed to work in 2e. Still waiting on Signs of Sorcery.

Can I marry my Sleepwalker?

And here's the latest version of the updated Legacies. Over 40 to choose from. If you want to look up the fluff for any of them, he lists the book they're in and you can go get it from the pastebin. He updates it a lot, and only posts it here (I think), so check back.

How many dots to have an artifact that can turn you into living electricity?

He must have confused that picture of a dashingly handsome human for a picture of a vampire. Which is an understandable mistake to make, but I am most definitely not a vampire.

Hi Vlad.

That reminds me, what would be his disciplines/arcana in WoD game?

4 or 5.

>What game are you playing right now ?
None.
>If you aren't playing a game, what game do you want to be playing ?
Vampire, Changeling, Demon, Hunter, Beast, Mortals, Mummy, anything but Mage and Werewolf.
Several campaigns are on hold, including the one with Hopefully, user will put together a halloween game that'll be awesome (like every one of your games) and I'll finish figuring out the plot to my Demon game.
>Post characters.
Maybe later.

I'm running vtr at the moment
>Post characters.
Player characters are
>Vampire adventurer archeologist - was sent by his egyptian sire to deliver some important stuff to head of local CoC and got stuck in Poland. Obssesed with blood sorcery. For whatever reason thinks every other supernatural is a mummy
>That carthian dude - as a human had to move out of Poland during the rise of antisemitism in 1968 only to get turned into vamp to be used as a fooder in war against Invictus. He survived and years latter is back in Poland with revolutionary cry(only to discover that local Carthians and cozy and unwilling to do anything crazy)

How about I do you one better.

>Version 1.36
Now with the Bokor. Not really the biggest fan of this Legacy to be honest. Their taboo on fucking with souls seems a bit hypocritical when they bind Ghosts (which they see as soul fragments) to Corpses as Revenants to do their bidding.
Especially when their fluff explains they try and destroy Ghost's anchors to set them free so they can heal, and never raise corpses which are anchors for Ghosts...
But for some reason stitching that Ghost to that corpse as a Revenant is better?
FFS, they didn't think this Legacy through properly to my eyes.
Also while they distance it from actual Vodoun in the fluff, that really doesn't make it that much better.

Also how they're influential in the Free Council is beyond me.
These guys are corpse-slave-drivers, their second goddamn Attainment is about marking people that they want to later kill, to raise, to do their fucking heavy lifting, or work on a farm, clean their shoes, or suck their dick.
Still, hope you get some use out of it.

Still taking requests.

Yeah, use this. This is great.

Oh, also it was annoying trying to make their new attainments. So in the process I might have made the first one a little too powerful, and the last one a bit boring.

Also I removed their psychic damage attack. Which was utterly retarded. I guess it'll make it harder for them to kill without qualms. But that's probably one of the few things stopping them from getting labelled as outright Left Handed.

what mage order can I dress up like Elias?

Wow, are they really that bad? I only asked you to do them because I'm re-reading Broken Diamond and I saw that you didn't have Bokor on your list.

Which is also why I asked you to do Uncrowned Kings forever ago.

And Soul Cage is why I asked you to do the Daksha. I hadn't read much of the official material back then.

I'm exaggerating a little bit.
Their perspective on death is an interesting take/shake-up on the Moros perspective, that corpses are just dead matter, nothing special there. Might as well make use of that matter going spare.

However then they shit it up a little bit by introducing a weird respect for ghosts, which they then break in their 'third' attainment (now 4th).

I guess I'm also a bit annoyed that it was so hard to come up with the new attainments. Many other Legacies just have stuff that fit, nature extensions of principles and theme. But for a Legacy about zombies, who don't want to deal with ghosts, and for whom I've already added a debuff-style attainment, it was annoying to try and figure out the 4th and 5th attainments. Especially for the optional, which doesn't come from the host Path. Really, given the use of Mind and Space, and the inherent selfishness, it should probably be a Mastigos path.

Also they're yet another bloody 1e Legacy which doubles-down on a Ruling Arcanum.
They really did that too damn much. Even DaveB's expressed his dislike for the amount of Legacies which double down (in a roundabout way, when discussing the Clavicularius). He probably had a more nuanced way of fitting them into his game than I managed to get out of the Legacy from about less than an hour of jamming out an update.

Also as a less than spiritual pursuit and more a hunt for power, they seem like less of a perspective that would actually manage to reach Legacy-dom. Which also makes their requirements less than sublime, and their Yantras pretty basic-bitch tier.

thanks my man

Playing a Werewolf the Apocalypse LARP. Julian 'Cutting Tongue' Kincaid, Shadow Lord Philodox. The first actual First Change in his family in 5 generations, Julian focuses on a lot of the mortal side angles; he's a high-profile criminal prosecutor and spends a lot of time with the mortal world, keeping avenues open for the Garou to utilize to cover their activities. He's the 'leader' for lack of a better term, of the Concordat of Stars of the Sept of the Gathering Flames.

Headcanon: God-Machine isn't above stealing Infrastructure from other supernatural entities. Whenever It Logistics detect any suitable component that is no longer being actively maintained by its creators It sends down Psychopomp or two to standardalize Its new acquisition and add it into Occult Matrix. Plenty of Concealment Infrastructure used to be Labyrinths or non-Mage equivalents of such.

Oh, and also helping a friend design her 'vampire cold war' Masquerade setting for Los Angeles. For the /v/ refugees in here, my accounting of the Camarilla of LA draws heavily from Bloodlines.

Cant quite work out what banning rotes are supposed to do other than be an annoying nerf.

Has your ST ran 2e before or is this his first time and his "houserules" are just his thoughts as to what will happen?

Sounds like he hasnt ran it before and is just making up shit.

Depending on how involved or omniscient your particular God-Machine is, technically every single thing in the world is some kind of Infrastructure.

Yeah, true but I was thinking more factory/suspicious cult laboratory Infrastructure pieces that are concealed from mortals beyond three dimensional space. Would sound completely reasonable that It would happily assimilate anything built by other entities, even if for bit silly "Hey, I built that! What the hell is going on in here?" -crossover storyline.

I don't think Infrastructure would even need to have been abandoned for the God-Machine to be making use of it. Infiltrating and subverting it is pretty fair game.

What exactly do other entities build?

Wtf are you talking about exactly?

Hunter: The Vigil. Dark fantasy setting. Yes?

Replace Computers with Ciphers, Guns with Bows, Drive with Ride like they suggest in Dark Era.

It feels like a natural fit and a pretty good system for it.

How far could It get away with exploiting others' before they would start catching on?
I mean obviously in Demon game, God-Machine could be running ever Labyrinth for Concealment, all Freeholds as Defense, and each Elyseum as Elimination Infrastructures with no one on the inside any wiser, but where would it be pragmatic to draw the line?

Going to go ahead and repost this, then. I made changes since the last time. Like the Shadow Name, trimmed down the Merits, moved skills and such. Also went ahead and put in Reality Stalkers as a Legacy, since that's what I would go with in a game.

The name is tricky. I didn't really like Mercury in the first place. Too on the nose, and every Mage and their grandma names themselves after mythical figures. So instead I feel like being the instrument of the mythical figure is more oblique, and how it's oblique has meaning in itself. I also decided to go all in on being a Mystagogue, principles and view of magic and all. Which is why "Doublespeak" is a specialty and Subterfuge is at 3 dots instead of Stealth. Mystagogues can't lie to another Mage about magic, but they also believe that Mages shouldn't know things they aren't ready for. I'm going to try and take that further if I ever get a chance. Plus, Mercury was a trickster god, and outright lying isn't really trickery. So mechanically that means I could actually be good at tricking people without resorting to lies or magic.

Also put one dot from Drive into Academics, to show that he was properly educated and would actually know all the stuff he would need to consider to pick that kind of Shadow Name, instead of it just seeming like I went on Wikipedia.

>Also put one dot from Drive into Academics
From Crafts into Academics, my bad.

I like it. Now lets brew some dark ages compacts and conspiracies

You need to create some sort of problems for the characters that only their coterie can fix. Once I started a campaign where a primogen's favourite Ghoul was found dead in the coterie's hunting grounds and they had to cover it up until they found a way to clear their name.

You could take that idea if you like, or a spin on it. Maybe a blood born illness like syphilis is spreading near the coterie's hunting ground and now they have a personal reason to investigate and see if there's a plague spreader. Maybe a bunch of murders with occult overtones have occured near the coterie and they're threatened by possible Sabbat packs.

Or a goodie is a possible Masquerade violation that the coterie has to cover up. Maybe they find out that someone took a picture of the Nosferatu character and they have to DELETE THIS before it spreads. Or maybe you can start in media res with a character getting caught while feeding and the mortal witness escapes. Now they have to find that witness before hunters-or worse, the city scourge- find out.

Basically take whatever big scale conspiracy you have planned, and find a way to make it affect the coterie directly so they have a reason to try and fix it as damage control.

Honestly, I was just going to re-frame the ideologies of existing ones in a dark fantasy light.

Malleus Maleficarum and AKD are easy. There's the Hototogisu from Dark Eras who would be super fun to use in a fantasy setting.

The question is whether i make monsters a well known thing or keep the subtleties and unseen world of Hunter

To be fair, they'll almost always default to blaming one of their many, many rival/enemy factions. That, plus the fact that it's *not* infiltrating everything, everywhere, just some things in most places means that it could go on undiscovered for a good long while, or at least until your PCs stumble into it.

Nobody cares.

>"Those Meddling PCs and their stupid morality pet!"

To be fair most Changeling society's stuff would make for good Logistics with their Markets, hidden shortcuts, and constant bargaining.

>Changeling the Lost will enter Kickstarter in coming week
Great!

... oh joy.

Are their Kickstarters worth it? I usually just get the books when they are done as I have been somewhat burned by RPG Kickstarters of other companies. CtL is my favorite CofD game, however (besides maybe MtAw).

>I'll start a solo game where I'm a Dreamer (from Hurt Locker, and yes, I know tg opinion about the game)
What's their opinion on it?

Spoken like a true trenchcoat and fedora wearing assholes from the heyday of 'Gothic Punk'. I can't decide what's worse about cWoD; its bloated and clunky rules, its wacky and hilariously stupid metaplot, or its fat cringy grognard fanbase. Shouldn't you be out protesting the lack of Szechuan sauce at your local McDs?

IF you want the deluxe version and easy access to 'one time only' content, then yes. If you just care about the book, wait until they're done with the KS and get it from DTRPG.

What sort of "one time only" content. As for the deluxe version, I can live without it, especially since picking up stuff from customs can be rather tedious.

Haven't some of the previous KS had extra book/written content that only went to KS backers? I could've sworn they did, but the only KS I've backed so far is Beckett's Jyhad Diary.

What books are essential for Mage the Awakening aside from the core book?

There are currently no other 2nd Ed books for Mage. There are some pretty good books for 1st Ed, but I'm afraid some of that material will also be in the new books as well.
The Abyss and the Grimoire book should remain useful.

Don't stat your Primogens or Prince. Or, if you absolutely feel the need to, give them Celerity out the dickhole and fudge rolls if the players decide to try and punch them into the stratosphere - A Vampire focused for it can delete just about anything at a terrifying speed, as one of our underprepared GM's found (Though we were being dicks for an assortment of reasons. Your players shouldn't be as terrible as us.)

Next, remember that Guns are fucking terrifying in WoD, especially anything with full auto. I used to try make excused for players not to have them, but that just seemed to make them more desirable, so I've since found that the best solution is to Murica it up and have guns everywhere, but only to match escalation - if the PCs don't start a firefight, I leave the guns away, but if the players decide to pull out automatic shotguns for every problem, turns out a bunch of people in the club were concealed carry nuts.

It really does depend on the players, though. My players have a habit of being overly aggressive, and we kind of accept that we like the idea of WoD, but are really bad at playing it out because we tend to just decide that things have gotten too hard and everything must die.

>I used to try make excused for players not to have them
You don't even need to make excuses, there is no populated place that will allow you to carry long arms or automatics without getting a shitton of attention.
Even then, cops, crime scenes, etc. Logical consequences are essential for reining in players in WoD.

Tends to just end up with one of the players Obfuscating everywhere with whatever assortment of murder in their pockets. Or using Thaumaturgy to Summon Shotgun, or conjure shotgun, or etc.

No, pretty much everything from KSes end up on Drive-Thru. It just takes a long while.

Ahh, I see. Nevermind then!

How much magic are you talking about? Are you thinking something like Witcher or Dragon Age? Or something lower like Conan or GoT?

The core 2e book

Which MTAs book has all the info on the Nephandi?

I'm in a similar situation, really appreciate the answers so far.

>playing Nephandi
>wanting your Chakras to be misaligned
>wanting your chi to destroyed
>wanted your humors to be out of wack
No need to thank me kiddo, i got rid of all that madding garbage.

God I hate him

I still want to know more about the Nephandi.

I am actually surprised that there's not a reference here, but...

whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Nephandi

That's a good, basic rundown.

The Book of Madness and BoM Revised are really what you want that detail Nephandi.

Thanks, asshole.

Woah. Easy there, chuck.

Guns vs vampires...

Lol.

You're welcome, cum-guzzling thundercunt.

Woah, calm down there, billy.