This is the ideal Lawful Good. You may not like it but this is what peak lawful goodness looks like

The actual fuck is this kind of logic going through his mind?

>You are wrong.
Check the Emperors orders mate. Its clear as day. Have some Valdor arguing with Russ because he refuses to follow the Emperors orders.

So Valdor is a robot uncapable of adapting to circumstances... why is he in charge of guarding the Emperor again?

Also lad, you might want to check the Emperor's actual decree. It was pretty open ended, far from set in stone and he did leave it's execution up to Russ' discression

>Yiffs
>logic
Pick one.

refusing to do something fucking retarded =/= not adaptable. Also, the source he just posted even says that the Emperor wanted Magnus alive (possibly to chill on the Throne so he could go unfuck everything else).

Read the Emperor's actual order

>... why is he in charge of guarding the Emperor again?
Because he follows the Emperors orders? You know instead of letting his own personal feeling get in the way.

The Emperors orders were vague except for one explicit order. BRING MAGNUS TO TERRA. To bad Russ made it clear that he wasn't going to do that.

Well he shouldn't have let Horus relay the orders then

Wanting a yes man as a bodyguard is retarded

He didn't. Jesus fucking Christ read the lore before commenting.

t. Literal retard

Actually the order gave Russ full freedom to do what he wanted. That plus the sisters, custodes and ordo sinister under Russ' command proves that the Emperor secretly wanted Magnus killed

Go ahead and name a single benefit that would be gained by having an unquestioning Yes Man as the guy in charge of your safety

YOU read the lore

The orders state to bring Magnus to Terra. That's a fact. Your delusional head canon can't refute that.

As for your argument that the Emperor wanted it done then why did Valdor disagree? Why did the orders state the opposite? The Talons were there to ensure the job was done. Sadly Russ had other ideas.

Valdor wasn't just a yes man. What he was was loyal. Besides he wasn't acting as a bodyguard here he was acting as a commander. In this case retrieving a valuable person that was needed to salvage his secret project. Yeah Magnus fucked it up but he could be made to sit on the throne and save it too.

Post your evidence then champ. Unless you somehow think Horus ordered the mustering of the Emperors personal guard? Russ received the Emperors order first. It was only when the Sons of Horus detachment arrived in Beta Gammon that Russ changed his mind to killing Magnus. Go check Inferno if you want.

Nice blog faggot, read infernus before shitposting

>Valdor wasn't just a yes man. What he was was loyal. Besides he wasn't acting as a bodyguard here he was acting as a commander. In this case retrieving a valuable person that was needed to salvage his secret project. Yeah Magnus fucked it up but he could be made to sit on the throne and save it too.
You are so retarded I hope they name a disease after you

I have. What part are you even referring to?

Do you have an argument or are you just going to keep denying facts with insults?

Oh how about the time when the Khan fought his way to defend the imperial palace, when he got there Russ told him to go away.

Russ is a jerk.

It was probably something similar to this:
youtube.com/watch?v=yzcEG_JoVuo

Because Magnus was important as fuck.
You know, he could've even managed to sit in the Golden Throne for a while with better results than Malcador.

The Khan was pretty much the greatest of the primarchs. Redpilled and mature as fuck.
I wish we had more lore on him

Khan and Alpharius are basically top tier

Alpharius is a meme. Got misled by Xenos the fucked everything up and got killed by Dorn. Truly the worst of the Primarchs.

He's at least smart. He didn't fall to chaos, or suffer from a mental disease.

He also managed to have the most successful legion, who took an entire segmentium and messed up the ravens clones.

We have literally no proof that he gave into the xenos, or if he is off doing his own thing.

He's objectively the best chaos primarch and just below khan and vulkan on the loyalist side

"Russ Horus is evil"

"That's just what you want me to think. Or is that what you want me to think you want me to think? Or perhaps what you want me to think you want me to think you want me to think? I bet you think you're so clever planting all that evidence you're right, or perhaps you want me to know its false, making me more convinced of your earnestness by the lengths you go to to convince me. Or perhaps you only want me to think you want me to think Horus is evil, making me think he's good, and if Horus is the good one it means the Emperor is evil. Is that your game, to make me think the Emperor is evil?'

"Please Russ stop trying to think."

The fanboyism is strong in this one.

The Alpha Legion wasn't even close to the most successful legion. They're not even in the conversation tbqh. Alpharius was with his legion for what 20-30 years? Barely even relevant.

>We have literally no proof that he gave into the xenos
John Grammaticus.

>He's objectively the best chaos primarch
Alpharius is a Primarch who did so little during the Heresy authors can put him where ever to add to their plot because he has nothing else to do other than loiter in space scaring the wolves. Then in a real fight he got his ass handed to him by Dorn of all people. And it was his master plan that got him there in hand to hand combat to try and talk to Dorn as if he'd even listen. He's a meme that somehow got popular.

If he had given into the Xenos he would have made sure Horus won, as that was the best end to the cabal. However he basically did little to nothing, proving he was on their side but not doing anything but the bare minimum.

>not the best chaos primarch
Let's look at the others
>converted to chaos by a knife
>converted to chaos by a sword
>angry 100% of the time
>hates the warp and got space aids for it
>disobedient son who summoned demons after being told not to
>psychopath with murder visions and no idea how to run an empire
>idiot who complains about the tough jobs despite having signed up for them.
>character so religious he turned against his father to worship a god

Alpharius
1) had the willpower to never fall to chaos
2) set up his legion in a great way
3) dorn killing him just activated his other half and rowboat lies about killing him so badly that his sons disbelieve him

We have little info about him but what we do know is that he is no idiot and is strong enough to resist chaos. That's something that the other chaos dudes don't have.

>That's something that the other chaos dudes don't have.
Joining Horus for retarded reasons but dying before falling to chaos isn't a positive mate. Its called being irrelevant. And going 'wow look how well his legion did even without him around' just means that again he's irrelevant.

Most of the Chaos Primarchs at least have a reason for their fall thats interesting or serves a purpose or relates to their nature. Alpharius just does what he does because of reasons that don't even matter because he dies anyway. Pert doesnt become a daemon prince until after the seige. Mort doesnt fall to Nurgle until he' on his way to Terra. Alpharius is just dead already so ok he didnt 'fall to chaos' but he followed Horus the same as the rest of them.

Jesus Christ. Wtf Russ?

The Khan was a Khornite

Fuck psykers, Mortarion did nothing wrong.

Nope, the khan was probably the least likely to fall to chaos as there is no chaos god of going fast

He got his butt handed to him on a silver plate by the Khan.

>wrong things mortarion did: 1

Khan loved fighting and was all about "the hunt". He also hated the Emperor. Also had just as many traitors as the Dark Angels. I really dont understand the meme of liking him on here.

What? Morty never lost to the Khan, maybe on Terra but we dont know yet

1) he beat mortarion
2) he showed up Russ
3) he stayed out of all the drama
4) he was a friend of Magnus
5) he wasn't a huge jerk
6) he hauled his butt all the way across the galaxy just so he could defend the emperor.

If anything khan is a Gork and Mork follower.
>likes going fast
>likes fighting

>We have little info about him but what we do know is that he is no idiot and is strong enough to resist chaos. That's something that the other chaos dudes don't have.
Konrad Curze didn't fall to chaos either

Their logic is very simple.

Everyone is scared shitless of the Thousand Sons, and for good reason. In the whole lead-up to the battle of Prospero, the Space Wolves are constantly wondering: "Oh fuck, what's he going to do now?"

Sure, Magnus calls off the fleet, lowers the defenses and so on. But no-one knows exactly what he can do with sorcery - For all they know, he's basically going to unleash hell on them. It's like walking into a room full of unknown explosives, then fumbling for the light switch.

This is basically why Russ is taking absolutely no chances. From our perspective, he seems like a moron. From his, however, he's being completely reasonable because he doesn't know what Magnus can do.

Remember, Magnus just reached across the galaxy and nuked the Emperor's project. No-one has ever done that before.

Because those people were perfectly suited to take Magnus back no matter what. The Emperor was like "Look, we need that motherfucker alive. It's THAT IMPORTANT. Best bro, take everyone you need, make sure Russ doesn't fuck it up."

None of those things are positives. Khan was a sensitive pansy who like to pretend it was cool to be the guy no one thought about but got pissy everytime someone over looked him. Perturabo tier.

Hating the Emperor just makes him better.
He was willing to side with someone he hated because he understood that he was the best option to lead mankind.
He also understood that the powers of the warp could be usefull, if used in moderation.

The Emperor says to Malcador that Russ was justified and is one of the few true Primarchs in Vengeful Spirit. Magnus was also amply warned several times before.

The thing about Alpharius is that he believes himself to be a lot smarter than he actually is. More, he can't account for raw force or raw stubbornness.

This is what kills him. Like, at the end, he expects Dorn to listen to him or at least be curious. But Dorn is so sick of his bullshit, the moment he shows up in the room, he's thinking "I'm going to kill the fuck out of Alpharius."

He doesn't, in fact, say anything to Alpharius. He just tells his men "Fire" and then it's down to the face-punching. More, Alpharius just didn't expect Dorn to fucking tank his spear with his entire body.

No he really didn't get mad about being overlooked.

He said to Fulgrim that he would kick his trash simply due to the fact that Fulgrim knew nothing about him.

He probably had warp power and was one of the best warrior primarchs(the lion or wolf tier)

I think you don't know khan very well.

The Khan genuinely didn't care. This what made him a mirror to Mortarion, of all people: He outright states "I'm no tyrant. You, though? You REALLY, REALLY WANT TO BE ONE."

He had all right to be careful, but the Emperor's orders were clear. Magnus was to be taken to Terra, not murdered.
He should have suspected when Horus gave a order that contradicted the Emperor's orders

Again, no-one knew that Horus had turned traitor. No-one believed it. Everyone liked Horus! It's like someone told you "Dude, you know your best friend of all time? He's turned to the Dark Side, man. He's completely evil now. The voices in my head told me."

Horus probably went "Russ, you and I both know it'll be better for everyone if Magnus was dead." Or "Russ, Father doesn't really want Magnus alive. He won't say it, so I will - Kill Magnus."

...

For being the lapdog of the emperor Russ sure was bad at double-checking sources.

Never mind the fact that Russ was biased against Magnus. Big E should have sent Khan or Sangiunus

>
Horus probably went "Russ, you and I both know it'll be better for everyone if Magnus was dead." Or "Russ, Father doesn't really want Magnus alive. He won't say it, so I will - Kill Magnus
That's a very stupid logic. If the Emperor wanted Magnus dead, he would've ordered it.

>Horus probably went "Russ, you and I both know it'll be better for everyone if Magnus was dead." Or "Russ, Father doesn't really want Magnus alive. He won't say it, so I will - Kill Magnus."
But believing that after hearing of Magnus' warning is just retarded. Get direct orders from the Emperor changed, ok fair enough. From the guy who you just got warned might be a traitor. Its doesnt even matter if you dont believe it its too suspicious not to second guess. Not Russ tho.

The problem is that no-one believed Magnus. Imagine if right after 9/11, Osama tried to tell everyone that the Jews were responsible for Oklohama City Bombing. No-one would give a shit at that point.

At the very least you just follow dads plan.

Taking Magnus is a good plan until you get conformation from dad. You can always kill him later

You dont double check orders fucktard. Not to mention the warp was all fucked up thanks to fuckery making communication impossible

Your metaphor is shit and doesnt take into account the arrest order or the accused changing the goddamn Emperors orders.

Look at the convoluted logic Russ spouts in Prospero Burns He was just looking for an excuse to off Magnus.

When communication is down, your orders change into the exact opposite of what your dad gives you, AND the dude you are attacking is telling you the order change is false it might be a good idea to take him alive and kill later.

But NOOOO, Russ had to kill Magnus and was willing to take any excuse to do so.

You missed the part where a demon disguised as Ahriman assaulted a Space Wolf and one of the Custodians.

Also, when someone used black magic to mutate one of Leman Russ's troops. Remember, at this point, no-one knows that Chaos exists. No-one's heard of daemons. The only thing that could possibly do it is magic, and there's one ONLY DUDE who's good at magic.

It's like if someone gets shot, and there's only one guy in the house with a gun. It might not be him, but he's obviously the number-one suspect!

That doesn't mean you take a flimsy excuse and your burning hatred of him and go kill him, despite your DAD telling you to take him alive

Again, it's not like Magnus is innocent. He did blow up part of the Palace. I mean, sure, he had the best of intentions, but no-one knew that.

The whole point of the Heresy is that no-one saw it coming. Remember, the mastermind behind the whole thing was...Lorgar. You know, the redheaded stepchild of the litter. I mean, the other Primarchs were going "Lorgar did all that? Fucking really? *Lorgar*? Wow. I'm fucking furious, but I'm also embarrassed I didn't see it coming."

>as Ahriman
You mean Amon. And no its not an excuse. When your logic is as flimsy as that its just further proof Russ fucked up.

>but he's obviously the number-one suspect!
Yeah dont bother with a trial just murder him and all his family.

This thing had ALREADY HAPPENED to Russ.

He put down the two lost legions. There was a track record of this happening.

Yeah, but then it makes it even easier for him. "Looks like it's time to take ol' Magnus out behind the woodshed."

>He put down the two lost legions.
No he didnt. There is literally no evidence for this.

He was given express orders to kill those guys.

However he was told to capture Magnus.

He just wanted an excuse

Why would anyone trust Magnus when he betrayed every ounce of trust he had?

>flimsy excuse
Stop samefagging

You know, besides the fact that he was the emperors executioner?

Do you know what evidence is? Because that isnt it.

>lawful
nope

>good
maybe

hes CG at best

One of those is mine, the other I didn't write.

You where told by your dad to capture him alive.

You get there, Magnus is telling you not to attack him and that Horus is a traitor, and then Horus tells you to kill Magnus despite that being the exact opposite of what your dad told you. And you have no reception to double check this.

I mean come on, the emperor doesn't change his mind like that.

...

Who else would've done that? Russ is the only one who would have done it and not:

i) Bragged about it
ii) Been badly affected.

The only other guy I can think of (who pulled the trigger) is the Lion. Maybe Rogal Dorn, or Sanginus, but the last one would be fucking disturbing.

Do you know what evidence is? Because that isnt it.

No, I don't mean it as a rhetorical question. I'm genuinely curious as to who else could have filled the role, assuming that Russ didn't do it.

I honestly can't think of anyone.

Do you know what burning history books is?

Cause that's what happened.

When you have different hypothesises and no proof to prove one of them right, you pick the simpler explanation.

>muh proof
Its as obvious as a turd in a punch bowl that Russ put down at least one either the II or XI primarch and legion. Or do you need everything spelled out for you? Read the books man

Do you know what evidence is? Because that isnt it.

We dont know. Some rumours say that they join the ultras, died to xenos or never got off the ground. But theres no evidence for any off them because thats the entire point.

Put the pieces together user. You are a human being capable of critical thinking. I believe in you, or are you just being obtuse?

BL writers are hacks.

Its simple. You just show the evidence and you win. But you cant because there isnt any.

Do you think the sun is the size of a quarter also?

The Emperor forbade magic right? Then Magnus bursts in all "Hi dad! I been balls deep in chaos but just listen real quick". No one is siding with Magnus over Horus here.

One last chance for user to show any evidence for his belief. I dare you.

>no one SAW the murder therefore the client is innocent
>not knowing what circumstantional evidence is

I hope you arent in criminal law user

The Khan is the worst. If you rank the primarchs by relevancy to the Horus Heresy the Khan is at the butt bottom. Even his participation and accomplishments in the Siege of Terra pale in comparison to Dorn (the guy basically in charge of everything) and Sanguinius who performed a back breaker in midair on a bloodthirster. Sure the Khan took back a strategically important space port, but seriously it pales in comparison to the other two. After the heresy the Khan is still so boring that even his disappearance is uneventful. Imagine a marine from the Space Wolves, Raven Guard, and White Scars getting together to talk about how their primarchs disappeared.

Space Wolf: "Russ had a vision and left to pursue our foes but promised us he'd be back for the Wolf Time"

Raven Guard: "Corax gave the Emperor's Mercy to the mutants that fought and died for him. Corax mourned for a year and left to go fight the enemy, saying 'Nevermore'"

White Scar: "uhhhh Jaghatai disappeared into the Eldar webway."

>called the emperor's executioner by Malcador and The Emperor himself
>left alone to do his own thing as he saw fit in the crusade until the Emperor needed him for a specific task
>legion developed in secret and in isolation from the rest, as were the alpha legion and salamanders
>huge swathes of REDACTED conflicts
>time line matches up, Russ was 2nd found and the 2nd and 11th were dead before many others were found
>Guilliman says to Lorgar that the Emperor should have fed him to Russ
>master of telepaths says when Magnus fucks up that "The Wolves will be unleashed again"
>Kharn and Sevatarion's musings back up the Wolves as the emperors chosen sanction

how is that even an argument...

>Leman Russ
>Lawful
I'll give you neutral at most
>good
>anyone in this setting being good
I don't know, I guess he's good compared to everyone else. He was certainly a loyal warrior of the emperor, I'll give you that.

Primarch truthers BTFO. Dont forget in Lorgar's vision its Russ who kills him if the Emperor catches wind of his plan.

the emperor just had his son ruin his massive project from half way across the galaxy, he probably didn't know whether it was an accident or on purpose, so he sent his primarch-killer son bring him back, and if magnus absolutely is 100% evil, kill him.

The emperor would rather lose just magnus than lose magnus and any other primarch.