EDH/Commander General

Helps to know the collector number on the lands. If you use magiccards, just search up a basic, navigate down to the block you want, and go to the tcgplayer link

Anyone got some fun Grenzo lists I could take a look at? I run Zada and it's getting stale, so I figured playing other people's decks and making them kill each other would add some much-needed spice to my table.

Its weird but looking at him now, I wonder if he would be more fun than Gonti as far as playing my opponents decks

You should consider exchanging meteor shower for comet storm. Same flavor, better card.

Higher potential number of cards you'll be playing from opponents decks but mono black is superior to mono red, that's the trade

red in general has the more fun effects though. i sure do love me some disrupt decorum.

>put together a grixis pirates deck from what I have laying around
>mfw it all fits together flavorfully and perfectly
>there's all these cool options, like a fucking SKYSHIP
>and a pirate that throws monkeys at people
>and cool and strange artifacts that they might find in various island tombs / treasure vaults, like a blade that makes illusory copies of themselves, and a ring that gives you anything you want, three times.

I fucking love building this deck, anons.

>a pirate that throws monkeys at people

It's technically just the same monkey several times.

True.

But seriously, this deck is so flavorful that it makes my head hurt.

Got bored and updated my list. Added repeatable draw since people seemed to object to my not including it before.

Any other obvious cards I'm forgetting?

>thread question

Pic. I figured even with Mirari and other copy engines it would still underperform but I ended up blowing everyone out of the water. But it still has nothing on my most beloved deck Gitrog

Small creatures with modest draw effects on etb are potentially relevant in reanimator things like Meren or Alesha.

Pic related is one such reasonable inclusion.

>hedonist's trove

Greedy pirate bastards.

>underworld connections
no shit.

>the c17 curses
>curse of vengeance
There was always a curse involved in these things.

>devastation tide
>cyclonic rift
Storms at sea are unfortunate, but common.

>scourge of fleets
giant sea creature that eats the boat.

>ancient excavation
Digging up buried treasure!

>baleful strix
Every captain's got a pet of some sort.

>shifting loyalties
Pirates are greedy bastards.

>>>dark depths

The unknowable horrors of the deep.

Also missing saguinmancy

I'm very curious as to why you want these. Are you brewing ANT and just filling it with ways to dig?

>Sanguimancy
Thanks, user. Didn't notice that one. I didn't include Parting Thoughts because it's ridiculously conditional.

Honestly? I was just bored and decided to make lists of good non-blue draw cards.

i just bought like a hundred old basics on ebay. i just search by expansion.

Here's the list.
tappedout.net/mtg-decks/sasaya-returns/

Basically, your first turns are setting up for a Sasaya flip, which requires you to have 7 lands in hand. That's the hard part.
You basically never play Sasaya until you have 7 lands in hand, and flip it instantly once you do.

Once Sasaya flips, every land you play drastically increases the amount of mana you have. One land drop typically nets you between 5-20 mana, so every untapped forest you have in play is crucial.
Use that mana to cast spells that put lands into play untapped, like Wood Elves, Nature's Lore, or Summer Bloom, each one will basically ramp you 10-30 mana.

With a draw engine in play, like Tireless Tracker, Recycle, Staff of Domination, Seer's Sundial, etc you can pretty much keep yourself going indefinitely until you hit a crucial combo piece.

If you have a card like Genesis Wave or Animist's Awakening you basically win on the spot, gaining +200 mana and triggering every landfall effect there is.
Cloudstone Curio also easily wins the game by bouncing cards like Eternal Witness and Wood Elves back and forth to generate infinite mana, Regal Force to draw all the cards in your deck, Magus of the Candelabra or Skyshroud Ranger with Concordant Crossroads also gives near unlimited mana, etc.

Win the game by casting Squall Line for +1000 with a Glacial Chasm in play, or just exiling all your opponents permanents.

The deck can probably be made much more streamlined, but I made it only last week, my playgroup already hates it.

i think you need a higher land count for consistency

and dryad arbor

I've been thinking the same, but I just can't for the life of me decide what is worth cutting.

I started at around 45 lands and took out lands when I put in cards that were essentially lands in disguise, like Traverse the Ulvenwald and Gatekeeper Vine.

I want the list to have around 40-42 lands

i feel like you could go with a lot fewer direct ramp cards and go balls deep in your "flip sasaya" plan.

Help me Veeky Forums! I have the urge to build a new deck but I can't settle on a commander, or even a color combination. I currently have slivers, Shirei, Kruphix, and Edgar Markov built. I'm not a huge fan of spellslinger decks, and I want to build something that won't have too much overlap with any of my previous decks.

What other cards for well with this theme? (flavor, not mechanic)

I goldfished your deck like 5 or 6 times and the only time i got Sasaya to flip was a Sylan Library opener. You definitely need a higher land count.

So just cut Cultivate and Nature's Lore?

those two, skyshroud ranger, wood elves, summer bloom, and recycle are all decent cuts.

all those cards are good once you get sasaya to flip, but that's not a very common event with this current build

Yeah, flipping her can be a bit hard. Cards like Sylvan, Rites of Spring and Sprouting Vines are basically a must.

I can see Skyshroud and Recycle, but why Wood Elves and Summer Bloom? Reusing those is amazing and usually what lets me win after flipping.

cut harrow, not cultivate, cultivate is fine

what colors? For blue propaganda comes to mind instantly.

What, blatant racism? Not much.

>propaganda

You seem to enjoy creature-based strategies. More tribal decks, maybe?

>Inalla Wizards
>Beckett Brass Pirates
>Gishath Dinosaurs

You already have tribes for 5c and Mardu, so these all fit the bill for 'something different'. Wizards is inherently more combo-y, Pirates are just really cool, and Gishath is timmy.dec. Play big dude, swing big dude sideways.

Decklist now has 44 lands, see how flipping Sasaya is now.

Wonder if I should add Scroll Rack now.

see if you can fit thaumatic compass, journey to discovery, and gaea's bounty in there

>Thread Question
Licia. I think she's an overall really cool card and since she doesn't fit into the Edgar deck my roommate was more than fine just giving me his. It took a few weeks of brewing to figure out how to actually utilize her and make a solid build but she has won pretty much every game I've played with the last couple of weeks and has just been really fun. As a guy who just got the white mana symbol tattoo'd on him the other day, having a huge lifelink beater as a commander warms my heart.

Oh damn, I thought for sure I had journey already in the list.

Gaea's Bounty is already there, but my problem with Thaumatic Compass is that it costs 5 mana to replace itself, it's not actually been worth anything until after you have spent 8 mana on it.

COP:Black , white, red

What something wrong with it?

flip nissa is also pretty good. and magus of the library works well because you're keeping a pretty big hand the first few turns.

greenseeker is a 1-drop that can filter any card in your hand into a basic land in case you get your dead cards early.

How do I stop losing to my friends' dumb infinite combos

I'm a relatively new player and I like playing, but I don't like losing 100% of the time because I don't know what cards to look out for and/or my own decks aren't as good

What do

you already have journeyer's kite on the list, the compass is the same card but it flips into maze of ith later.

All of those cards are cards I've been intending to try out, figuring out which cards to replace for them is the hard part.

Yup, considering cutting the kite as well. Think I'll take it out for Journey.

ask them to stop playing infinite combos? Explain to them you don't like them and that for you they are unfun.

Or add counters (destroy effects, counters, or other cards that can stop their combo or remove the combo peices) to fight back

Learn the combos and how they work. Learn what the key combo pieces look like.

Then, learn how to react to each piece to disrupt their combo. Sometimes that involves a counterspell. Othertimes, the right removal. Regardless, it will require fun, interactive magic. Sometimes you'll just lose, and that's that.

You could also try talking to them and explaining that you don't like playing against their deck.

Are you constantly losing to a very specific combo or is the deck built with a variety of versatile combo piece/combos too fast for anyone to honestly deal with?
If it's the former then the rest of your playgroup has to all add in enough instant spot removal/counters to just stop them. If it's the former and the rest of the group is having as much trouble as you are just see if they can not play that deck/tone it down a bit for the benefit of the group.

Blood gift demon.

build a control deck and lose to the other player while you prevent infinite combos from going off

eventually hell get tired of being controlled and change the gameplan like you got tired of losing to cancer

What's your favorite green and/or black card that fits nicely into gitrog?

Thanks, user. I'm pretty sure I forgot a bunch of creature-based draw effects since I wasn't searching for creatures initially.

Same with planeswalkers (ob nixilis)

squandered resources is the funnest shit. I also love Hatred, Tainted Strike, Berserk for some fun blow outs. Ob nixilis landfall edition and tooth and nail for some other goodstuff.

There isn't a single fun commander, period.

Literally 3 posts above you.

Who is your favorite commander to play

What is Kaervek the Merciless then?

...

Learn his combo. Either ask him to explain it to you or look it up and study it.
You should be paying attention during the game though. When he does his thing, tell him to slow down and play out his combo at a speed that allows you to absorb what's happening. Then, with that information, figure out how to break it.

>"Every deck plays the same" frog monster
>fun

Not that guy but c'mon man

I feel like asking that'd make me look like a little bitch

What should I play to be able to have consistent access to removal/counterspells when I need them? I have a couple cards that do that in my one deck I've already built for myself, but I feel like I never have them at the right moment. Also, I suppose I don't know what to look for usually.

They all have a whole bunch of shit that sometimes seems like it involves 10 separate cards at once. I honestly just can't keep up with it.

I am thinking about that, but I feel like I'd be very bad at control in my current state of honestly not knowing what most of their cards do. I feel bad about having to keep asking to look at their cards all the time. Maybe I should just suck it up and keep losing until I learn from experience? I dunno, it feels bad.

It's multiple people and it's multiple combos, across several decks. I do pay attention, but it just feels like way too much to keep track of.

gitrog can be plenty varied. I've seen multiple enchantment matter style decks, to voltron , to black green goodstuff. If you wanna go for the dredge combo shit sure, but thats boring. I don't get why people clump so many commanders into 1 playstyle. And he is probably the most fun golgari commander imo

>He doesn't want to get on Mr. Bones' wild ride

Commanders are only as boring and same-y as you make them.

All commanders are one of these

>fun mechanic, too strong
Leads to unfun/imbalanced games

>fun mechanic, too weak
unplayable, lose your game, no fun

>boring mechanic, regardless of strength
Unoriginal goodstuff decks, no fun

Obviously the first is ideal in a balanced, high powered meta, but those are few and far between. No commanders with a fun mechanic are "fair"

Who is your favorite commander to play

How do I make this work

Sounds like you need to join the combo train, then.

Or stax. Stax sounds good, too.

Stax refers to a strategy of a one-sided denial of resources, ensuring that your opponents don't get to do jack shit because they have no lands / can only cast so many spells per turn / can't attack with creatures for X reason. You basically tell everyone 'no' at the same time.

Cards like Winter Orb, ensnaring bridge, rule of law, spirit of the labyrinth, eidolon of rhetoric, possessed portal, etc.

Could end the game with something like Teferi's Puzzlebox & Notion Thief, too.

Or Contamination + Awakening Zone, against decks that aren't heavy in black mana.

He doesn't play commander. This user is just here to troll /edhg/.

I have played gwafa the most

Blitz him in end of combat with Zirilan

Remember to have them sac outlets, tuck effects and/or a Sundial of the Infinite

Well no shit you think this, your commander falls so hard into the second category it left an impact crater on the Yucatan Peninsula.

Play Godo against a jankfest meta, shit's rad

Ah, thanks for explaining that, I'd heard the word before but didn't know what it meant. That sounds even more unfun than losing to infinite combos, though, so I figure I might as well just join the shitty club myself.

What kind of combo/control decks can I build that won't cost me a ton of money?

Seems like he'd be cool in Neheb

The Locust God lends itself really well to that kind of strategy.

Mairsil, the Pretender as well- though you need a higher density of activated abilities than counterspells / draw spells, in his deck.

>halfway tempted to build Bruna Voltron for the sole purpose of slapping Eldrazi Conscriptions on her
>also self-milling half your deck with traumatize and throwing everything in your graveyard onto a Bruna seems funnier than shit

You can build a serious Grenzo Doomsday list for $100. He is my go-to "curb the combo arms race" commander

Neheb or Rakdos for synergy?

My roommate plays locust god sometimes, I don't want to copy her. Will look into that other guy, though!

also looking this up. Do you have a decklist, for inspiration?

I can recommend a couple cards for Mairsil:

>Quicksilver Elemental

It allows Mairsil to activate abilities multiple times a turn, instead of just once.

>Aetherling

Makes it really easy to put new stuff on Mairsil.

I don't have one online, and I'm about to fall asleep. Ill make up a list tomorrow. If you look up Grenzo Doomsday on tapped out just make sure to include the doomsday combos (most important), as many tutors as you can afford, and cheap duals (depletion lands are great on a budget, dont use lands that enter tapped)

How fun is crazy snake lady?

very fun

The first relevant deck I found costs over $2k...

I will keep looking

something I don't get about cards like this

How the hell do you get a 2/2 without flying, trample, or unblockable to EVER do combat damage to a player?

You give it flying, unblockable, shadow, whatever through the use of other cards, user.

Or you remove your opponent's creatures first.

Or, in Hapatra's case, you play cards that do stuff with -1/-1 counters so that she just has to be present.

In edh they work better against creature light opponents, and in many metas, there is generally at least one creature light opponent in a pod of 4, if somebody only has 1 blocker you can get damage through with removal

It's definitely a big weakness to have a combat trigger with no evasion though, no doubt

there was a fucking pikachu pokemon card in my cheerios box and i want to use it as a proxy for something

what commander is most like pikachu?

the combat trigger is pretty irrelevant, it's the second bit that really matters.

she's a two-drop. if she had evasion naturally she'd be way overstacked.

wtf are you me

also got a foil pikachu in my cheerios and also wanted to use it in one of my decks

Vial Smasher.

There's lightning all over the art. She deals random damage to opponents with lightning.

You just need to find a trainer.

Ravos, Bruse Tarl, Silas Renn, Ludevic(prof oak?)

That's a good point

hapatra is a very well designed for commander in general.

>very easy to cast early and recast later, giving her a constant presence in games
>feeds into a popular and unique archetype, but doesn't require total build-around, so the deck doesn't collapse without her
>unique ability balanced by a clear weakness (no evasion) that can be remedied
>powerful for its cost, but not outrageous (compare to something like yidris in terms of impact per swing)
>still has room for unique builds since you can still decide how much token saccing/stax, token swarming, -1/-1 counter, deathtouch etc. synergy you want in the deck, unlike something like edgar markov where every deck is just the best 30 vampires in the format added to a deck with a bit of mardu goodstuff

she's actually a better addition to commander than almost anything wotc has specifically printed for the format

Depends on how fun you want to make it. as noted you can do whatever the fuck you want. Swarm with tokens, kill gods with -1/-1 counters etc. Or if you feel like a being a dick, having blowfly infestation on the field makes creates infinite death triggers

I've tried both and he's not at all.

Here's how an average turn with Grenzo goes:
>pray to god no one removes Grenzo for some reason or wipes the board
>spend all your mana on dorky goblins
>if you already have dorky goblins, spend all your mana on making the goblins unblockable because everyone can block those weak fuckers
>connect if you're lucky, forced to goad or else you'll die next turn because everyone has flyers or trample
>you somehow manage to get cards exiled from the top
>it's a land
>o-oh...
>it's a counterspell
>o-oh...
>it costs one mana too much
>o-oh...
>end the turn, go to bed, cry yourself to sleep because you're in monored

Meanwhile for Gonti:
>oh my god why can't I hold all this big black mana
>jesus fuck all this big black mana lets me get all this big black card draw
>I cast Gonti with Panharmonicon and Minion Reflector to steal 4 cards
>then I throw down a board wipe and cast Gonti again for another 4 cards
>want to attack me? sure I'll block with deathtouch, thanks for letting me recast him
>oh you want to cast Cyclonic Rift? here's your Swan Song back bro, have a bird