That guy has to bust out the calculator app on his smartphone in order to do basic addition and subtraction with...

phoenix command

>adding 54 and 24 is important

The game being played doesn't change the nature of basic arithmetic.

Veeky Forums, no. Don't be this plebeian.

I have a friend who needed to use a riceroller app because he had to roll literally 400 dice. Serves him right for playing dirty conscripts

If he can't do that then he probably didn't pass high school math. Or he could have just been tired or lazy at that moment. I'm not saying we should dumb down society but the opposite. Bitching doesn't fix the problem unless you act on it.

Not being able to function as a normal, capable adult is a personal problem to be dealt with in his own time. I'm a DM, not a social worker.

In the meantime, I'll allow calculators and grit my teeth while suggesting he at least TRY to do the math in his head.

Just tell him to start from the right to the left, he may be dumb but he can't be retarded enough to not being able to solve 4+4 and move to 5+2

>he can't be retarded enough to not being able to solve 4+4 and move to 5+2
I don't think being retarded is the problem.

The calculator is there, it's easy. He apparently didn't need arithmetic to finish high school. He apparently hasn't ever really needed it since. He could learn for the sake of a game, but everyone and everything up to this point in his life has apparently taught him that it's not necessary.

He's been made lazy, not retarded.

Literally does, dumbass

I have Dyscalulia and I feel like a retard when people talk numbers in front of me. Its like I can see the symbols in my head but everything is so slow to connect, like a rope moving through glue. I don't want to DM specifically because I don't want my friends to suffer for me.

I'm a lot better than when I was a kid, couldn't read clocks (analog or digital) until I was like 16.

Don't know about your guy, but the calculator on my phone makes me feel just bit less retarded.

>people giving a shit about literal anonymous assholes throwing out labels like "plebian"

Don't be this retarded.

Addition and subtraction function exactly the same whether you're playing D&D or GURPS.

"please Veeky Forums, care about my insults"

>everyone and everything up to this point in his life has apparently taught him that it's not necessary.
>Learning basic math is unnecessary.
So not only he surrounds himself with retards, he's a retard for believing them.

>I replied, but that doesn't mean I care!
Found the tsundere.

>2+2 is identical to 35+30-20+10+10+10

You /a/nimals are experts at protecting your feefees

Jesus Christ.

It's doing the same thing repeatedly. Nothing changes about what you're actually doing.

Do it in steps if a long sequence of numbers frightens you.

You can GM games that don't require the master to fiddle with numbers and shit.

This is the state of Veeky Forums today.

Do it in steps? Like putting it into a calculator?

...

Some people simply aren't good with numbers.
Stop grasping at straws and try to enjoy your game or go being an engineer somewhere else

thats 95 you dingus

No, like adding up 35+30 to get 65, then 65+20 for 85, then 85+10+10+10 for 115, all of which should take about fifteen seconds.

whoops, lack of sleep
thats correct

It was actually -20, famme

WTF you guys are on about? its 75

Jesus Christ how are you guys so bad at math?

He thought it was +20 instead of -20

Gotta double check. DnD/related hobbies are not homework. Fuck minimum effort. Plus I tend to drink enough to assume I can't do math.

>Riceroller.
So like is this popular in China?

I can't do simple math either. Just can't don't know why. I aced all 3 modules of mathematics in my CS bachelor tho. No problems with abstract concepts and formulas just actual calculation which rarely happens in my field of work.

Anyone else?

>Work together to get better.
Wat?have you been reading the thread? Yea he doesn't do head math, we assume we either can or can't (can't be wrong) meaning he can probably learn to either not be lazy or learn to do it.

Working together for progression of 1 person doesn't call for your unbased shittalk

Eat my (you) and my cock.

Maybe it's an age thing? They don't teach long division in school anymore, instead they subtract the number an x number of times until they can't anymore.

I love math and learned well beyond what even my STEM degree required me to learn out of sheer interest for the subject.

That said, I can understand the concept of using a calculator for most calculations in order to not mess anything up with quick math done in your head. I think we've all had those moments where we add something simple together and get the wrong result because we're rushing and not really thinking about it (granted I'm more talking about 3+ digit addition, but if you have it as a general policy you prevent all errors).

I'm not saying that I personally would do it, but I can understand why someone would want to.

Adding modifiers to a roll doesn't really require long division though.

I'm 27, have two degrees and a stable job. However I have Dyscalculia and I need a calculator or I get flustered. Have come pity and let him use whatever he needs.

Source for that? I don't believe that's true at all. I tutor chess for some kids (age range kindergarten to 7th) and they seem mathematically competent when it comes up.

>I'm a lot better than when I was a kid, couldn't read clocks (analog or digital) until I was like 16.
Me neither. You know where you and I differ? I never had a fucking dipshit doctor tell me
>I have Dyscalulia

Lo and behold, trying long enough got the pieces to click.

I'm sorry mate, I was taught from grade 5 up, to use the calculator, no one after that really bothered much to teach me to calculate things in my head.

Rolled 24 (1d100)

Your bonus to the roll is +63.

A pretty vocal part of Veeky Forums apparently needs a device in order to solve this.

....is it 87?
Also what kinda bonus is +63?

+53 due to skill ranks, +10 situational.

>Also what kinda bonus is +63?
A rookie one. My character has longswords at 214.

>muh le bootstraps son!
any other nuggets of wisdom, Cletus?

It's called "natural learning", since it's apparently more natural to subract since you can see what you're doing. It's being done in some Euro countries, but I don't know if America does it. I have a sister who is 10 years younger than me and I help her with homework at times so I see this shit pretty often. The chool says it does not moattr since calculators are more widespread now and they don't need to know advanced things like long division or fractions.

I'm good at algebra (logic) but shitty at arithmetic. When I'm playing I usually just lie about my numbers to speed things up, nobody ever calls me out on it.

Discalcula. I fucking hate it, and it drove me to depression and anger in my teens, and my teachers who thought it "didn't exist" resulted in me suffering anxiety whenever anything to do with maths is brought up.

So pardon the fuck out of me for my brain being knackered.

This is reminding me of someone claiming that some 70% of students don't know that an = sign is. When I finally got a citation from him, it was something like Wang Chong's Alternative School For Slant-Eyed Dinky Chinks.

there's fewer things better than smuggling in some numbers because your table thinks you're good at the maths and they don't bother to check.

It's faster with a calculator.

It takes like 3-5 seconds to type shit into a calculator.

I'm not seeing anything like that when I google natural learning. I'll grant you I'm American so maybe this is some Euro-only thing but it really doesn't seem to be happening here at all, which suggests to me that this isn't a "real" thing barring some very unusual schools, as I tutor for montessori schools sometimes as well which often are showcases of particularly absurd teaching practices (not always, or course, some montessori schools are really the best option for certain types of kids, but here in America if you're going to see some ridiculous bullshit teaching methods, it's going to be at a montessori school)

Maybe if he had some device that did the math while was focusing on writing the numbers...

Only if you're a lazy retard.

It's Common Core in America.

>Common Core

I don't think you know anything about Common Core Mathematics. It has essentially become a meme idea on the internet and in real life for people to shit on Common Core, despite the fact that they have no actual understanding of what is being taught and the reasons for why it is being taught. For example, you often see pic related as an example of why common core is stupid, but the "engineer" father is actually a complete fucking idiot. The worksheet is clearly meant to teach the concept of the number line, and how it relates to concepts like addition, subtraction, etc. The error is clear, the student neglected to account for the subtraction of the tens digit, hence why his answer was incorrect. There is, in reality, nothing wrong with the lesson being taught. The issue is only with the parent having preconcieved notions of what should be taught and how subtraction should be done, when in reality teaching the concept of the number line becomes very useful when you consider it's implications in things like understanding different sizes of infinity, imaginary/complex numbers, etc.

So my point here is that I think this idea that we're teaching our kids some weird "non-math" that's hurting them intellectually, or forcing them to rely on calculators is entirely a meme. In fact most schools I see ban the use of calculators (or at least the /regular/ use of calculators, e.g. use them for science work or checking your work, but not during actual math work).

>gotta go basic math
>be fucking dumb
>almost have it done in your head
>some asshole whips out his phone to do it

Fuck sake, just let me have this.

What are some good resources to use to brush up your math?

>he doesn't use scratch paper

From what I can gather, it's based on the Sudbury model, which is founded on teaching children at their own appropriate level. So basically the material gets dumbed down if you're not good at it.

>There is, in reality, nothing wrong with the lesson being taught
Yes there is. Number lines are already retard level maths that shouldn't be used after second grade. There's no point to things like this because anyone with an IQ above 80 can figure shit out by himself.This exercise expects the pupil the correct the mistake in this slow, fiddly and over all bad method on the grounds of the method used instead of giving Jack the answer he would get in the real world: 'use a real fucking mathematical procedure you retard.'

Overall it discourages the student from using faster and better methods to teach a 'concept' that everyone but niggers and downies already knows. It's symptomatic of breaking education down to the lowest common denominator.

tl;dr: Common core is cancer designed for the dumbest porch monkeys and retards and literally holds back normal students.

Common Core is literally special ed concepts applied to regular students. Fuck off if you think the lowering of standards is a good thing.

This does look like the homework I had to look over, but they only used it for dividing.

You and everyone else. Doctor's note or gtfo.

>inb4 "you believe in eugenics, don't you user?"

>number lines are retard level math
Keep in mind we're talking about children here. Children at the age where they are learning to subtract 3 digit numbers. Everything is retard level math at that point. Number lines are an incredibly useful tool up until algebra level. Decimals, negative numbers, fractions, complex numbers, and different infinity sizes are all key concepts that are made easier to understand by the use of number lines. (I even know people in their mid 20s who don't understand that infinities can be different sizes, but if you show them a number line it's absolutely intuitive)

You're not dumbing down anything, you're teaching concepts for the first time to literal children because children don't come out of the womb knowing how to do math. Not everything you learn in math is meant to make you super fast at solving problems. If that were the case why the fuck would we ever learn long division? You know how many times I've used long division in my real adult life? Literally never. That doesn't mean it wasn't useful to learn. In fact, that's how my particular teacher actually taught it to us (if I remember correctly), "You will never use this in real life but it's important you know how to do it because it helps make sure you have a full understanding of division".

So again, there is no problem with that problem or with common core (that I've seen). Of course you'll always have dumb teachers fucking up and making bad problems, but that has nothing to do with the overall system.

source? Proof? These are blind accusations that hold no merit without an explanation behind them. You've done nothing to refute what I've said other than making baseless accusations because you fundamentally do not understand the system your criticizing.

Do people really never use long division? I'm a mechanical engineer and I use it pretty often to quickly calculate things on site or on sketches, along with long multiplication.

Here's an example of what I mean:

How would you explain pic related in a more easily understandable way than using the number line like I did (the concept being that C contains more numbers than A or B while at the same time all three contain an infinite number of numbers)? There simply is no easier way, so getting a small child to understand how to use a number line and how a number line works (and how it can be used to do things like group sets or other concepts) is useful when they have to deal with more conceptually harder concepts. And keep in mind, for a very small child the concept of "these are all infinite but some are still bigger than others" is a complex concept. When I was in algebra I distinctly remember kids vehemently disagreeing with me when I told them that anything divided by zero is infinite before they were explained it by a teacher.

I personally don't. Maybe others do, I might be biased because I have always been very mathematically inclined. I was the "But I can just do it in my head" kid, to the point where some teachers almost thought I was cheating off other kids because there would be no work shown, until they got to know me better and understood that I was doing everything in my head.

Third-world Slav here, and, honestly, I think that the concept of "teaching specific lessons" to a student is a ridiculously dumb approach to problem solving.

Problem solving always, always required a generalist approach. You can't solve a problem simply by applying previously learned "lessons". This isn't some sort of Aesop shit, where there is always a moral to be learned at the end of it.

To truly learn problem-solving, children have to be thrown off the deep end.
They need to be forced to self-study, to find creative solutions, to apply themselves.
What they don't need is to be spoonfed knowledge and "lessons" as if it was some sort of godsend.
And they certainly as fuck don't need to be told that their methods are wrong, because, hey, guess what? They'll find it out themselves when they face a problem that can't be solved with the method they usually apply, and they will be forced to change their paradigm.

>the concept being that C contains more numbers than A or B while at the same time all three contain an infinite number of numbers
That's completely wrong, and not what people mean when talking about different sizes of infinity.

I'm an electrical engineer and I usually eyeball arithmetic problems. If you need a precise answer, you can always use a calculator (or a slide ruler), but I usually don't care about shit beyond the fourth or fifth digit.

>player has problem adding numbers but get result by using a calculator
>instead of helping him out you get mad and complain about it on a Mongolian board

What a great friend you must be.

>tfw verbal IQ of 116, but spatial IQ of 82.

Life is suffering.

Yeah, GURPS' 2+2 is way better than D&D's shit, I agree.
Such a simple and elegant system.

Though let's be honest, it's more likely to be like 14+1+1 for skill checks.

>I was the "But I can just do it in my head" kid, to the point where some teachers almost thought I was cheating off other kids because there would be no work shown
As a teacher, these kids were always hard to deal with. Not because they didn't use the method I taught them since I don't care as long as you get to the right answer, but because they tend not not write down their thought process so that I can't see where they went wrong if they did.

Yeah I know it was a bs example but I'm a little drunk and just used that since explaining the concept of bijection and the actual different between the sizes of countable infinities is beyond how much effort I wanted to put into paint. The argument still stands though, as a number line is still the easiest way to explain the concept of countable infinities.

So my bad for cheating but the point still stands.

This is true and it's why teachers would incentivize us to show our work by their A) giving partial credit if the work was shown and you made a silly error such as copying something down wrong or B) gave no points for no work.

División by 0 is not infinity, is undefined

>playing 5e
>"Okay, what you need to do to get your stat roll modifiers is you take the stat, subtract it by 10 and then divide it by 2. If you have a decimal, round down."
>they stare at me like a deer caught in the headlights
>sigh
>"Like if you have a 13, you subtract 10 for it to be 3, then divide it by 2 to get 1.5, since that's a decimal it becomes 1, so you have a +1 to all rolls that use that stat."
>they write that down next to where I assume they had a 13 then just keep staring

these are grown adults

Countable infinites are better explained with a table, and using the same table to explain that there are greater sets of infinities, the number line in this concret example is bullshit.

>1.5 rounds to 1
Wut? Shouldn't it round down to 2?

>round down
>down
smaller numbers = down

youtube.com/watch?v=i7c2qz7sO0I

I think this video is perhaps the best explanation of differing sizes of infinity, and it relies heavily on the number line.

Ok but you're not teaching problem solving, you're teaching math. Math is often quite literally using previously learned lessons to solve a problem. Maybe there is a language issue at play here because your whole post didn't make much sense at all to me.

Oh i was confused, the way i was taught was 1.0 to 1.4 rounds to 1 and 1.5 to 1.9 rounds to 2

>implying fractions are real numbers

1.6 to 1.9 rounds to 2

Will watch it after work. But until then I maintain my point that a table is the best explanation

>fractions are complex numbers
The fuck are you on?

>I'm smart because I can do addition in my head
Yeah wow that guy sure is dumb for using a calculator user, you're such a smart and special boy.