Could Master chief be considered on par with a regular space marine(assuming the said marine was a rookie who only recently became one) I know obviously that a bolter is superior to everything chief has but im talkins strictly armor and feats. My aspy of a brother is telling me that chief could beat an Astartes anyday. He refuses to listen to me so Im asking you all to tell him what you think
Could Master chief be considered on par with a regular space marine(assuming...
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Pretty sure a bolter round or two would have him ded. Comparing anything to the 40k universe is dumb since everything in 40k is ridiculously overpowered. Chief can get 1 shot by rocket launchers and shit in game, bolters fire rocket propelled munitions at hundreds of rounds per minute, do the math.
Rather silly comparison that ignores the nature of fiction, and especially so since it’s between two different settings where there is no standard point of reference.
The main characters, be they a space marine, or a spartan from halo, are as strong/fast/skilled/talented/smart or otherwise or opposite of those listed as the story and author wants/needs them to be.
Having said all of that. In isolate I would say they are comparable for their settings. Both are 7ft genetically engineered super soldiers.
Harry Potter could probably beat both.
Shouldn't the chief have at the very least a 4+ armor and a 6+ invuln?
Also last time I checked a direct hit from a rocket launcher leaves you barely alive.
Nope, chief's bones are reinforced with concrete or something, not super-duper-spess-ceramics, just to give one example. However, he's certainly above most Imperial special forces like Scions, Stormtroopers, Kasrkins, ect. Come to think of it, he might be comparable to a SOB Cuseress
Rowling explicitly said a single muggle with a shotgun could have taken out Voldemort.
rocket-propelled munitions =/= rocket launcher
He fell 2km from orbit and was fine.
That's due to the suit's armor lock, not Chief's own badassery.
Take your autistic nerd fights elsewhere
Bolters are more or less rapid fire rocket launchers though.
I don't think people give chief near enough credit. He's got an energy shield on top of power armor (the armor itself is probably a hair above SoB or Inquisitor tier), he is at least as strong as a marine, probably faster than one, and he's got an AI jammed in his head.
But as another anon said: it's all author fiat and handwoven bullshit made to suit whatever they want, so any comparison is tough to quantify.
Standard bolter rounds are described as being .75 Cal consisting of
A solid-fuel rocket propellant base
An outer casing containing conventional charge
Mass-reactive fuse. Has a split-second timer to delay detonation upon >impact until after the shot penetrates the target.
Hardened diamantine penetrating tip. This allows for the bolt to >penetrate most armour before detonation.
Main Explosive Charge
Depleted uranium core. This is a very dense material, adding weight and thus momentum to the round when in flight. This aids in the bolt's penetration of the target.
It's not a full on anti tank round like the rockets in game, but bolter rounds are pretty much just a step short of that. If we want to stretch it out and say his shields are good enough to withstand a burst of those, what exactly is he going to fire back with? Assuming he's carrying the standard MA5B rifle, it only fires 7.62NATO or .308 iirc, which is barely even autogun or lasgun levels of firepower, and lasguns aren't exactly spess muhreen killers
True in one of the books the chief deflects a missile with his hand and survives.
Could Master Chief beat a level 20 PF Fighter?
It seems like two universes that can't really be compared, because at least to some extent the humans in Halo are restrained by reality.
In 40k you have all sorts of reality breaking things being done in all sorts of ways by the characters and races, including humans.
It's kinda like comparing a Hollywood movie (Halo) to Naruto (40k) or something. Not the best comparison but it's what came to mind first.
if it's an optimized fighter it might be closer than you think
They're two universes full of power-wank. Stop arguing with your idiot brother and find something more productive to do with your time.
How close are we talking here? I've never actually looked into what L20 pathfinder characters are really capable of.
This is literally the best place in the entire history of the universe for autistic nerd fights.
Hell, a basic Infantry Squad could possibly defeat Chief, as long as it had a few special weapons.
The lasgun itself is similar in power to Chief's MA5. The armor of the Guardsmen will be well prepared for stopping autogun bullets, and the lasguns are not only nearly perfectly accurate (as long as there's not dust or other shit in the way) but instantly-hitting and quite powerful (7.62x51 style, but causing a miniature explosion on impact with flesh; if they managed to blow through Chief's armor or bring a chunk off, he could potentially lose an arm to a lasgun blast). Combine that with a fairly rapid rate of fire and high power cell capacity, and Chief will be facing pretty tough opposition.
Furthermore, said Infantry Squad would have special weapons. The grenade launcher is somewhat like a Milkor MGL (with multiple chambers in a cylinder) and could knock Chief down, or else greviously wound him. A plasma gun will cut through his armor outright, but how it would behave against his shields is less of my forte. The flamer would be the least effective tool against him. If I'm not mistaken, Sergeants can also get human-sized (.50) bolters, so that's going to be another very hard pill to swallow for Chief.
It's clear he can't target multiple enemies at once the way some kind of Naruto character could, because otherwise any engagement with him would end in two milliseconds flat. If the squad started firing and didn't expose themselves Chief would be face a brutally difficult fight.
Sure, when he was out of horcruxes, he was effectively just a regular mortal, and when he had his horcruxes, a shotgun blast would have put him out of commission for years, but it's kind of disingenuous to compare Voldemort's killing power with a random guy with a shotgun. Yes, the latter could theoretically win, but they're still nowhere near the same power level.
MC has SM captain stats and plot armor, so he would shit on anything in 40k that isn't a named character.
Sounds like a Cuseress to me
Magic must defeat magic.
Halo can be compared, just not so much anything the UNSC has. Forerunners could easily play with the big boys. Flood could range from local disaster to galaxy wide threat depending on how they interact with the warp. Covenant at its height would be more or less in the same league as the Tau, maybe a little stronger.
and the lasguns are not only nearly perfectly accurate (as long as there's not dust or other shit in the way) but instantly-hitting and quite powerful (7.62x51 style, but causing a miniature explosion on impact with flesh; if they managed to blow through Chief's armor or bring a chunk off, he could potentially lose an arm to a lasgun blast).
Lasguns are...not exactly the most accurate in IG hands. They also tend to fail pretty hard against power armour.
Check again, I remember direct hits killing your shit every time
Not even close to a step below a rocket launcher. What you are describing is simply an armor piercing 12 gauge slug. An anti tank rocket is a 120 mm tandem HEAT warhead. There's a reason we don't have shotguners being used as anti tank or anti vehicle teams. Much like the bane blade this is another case of 40k making everything big and dumb but not actually anymore effective than modern technology
There is a case in the games that Chief is able to barely divert a missile that was locked on to him. I'd say thats a 6+ invuln.
Aren't flood just straight up nurgle worshippers ?
40k tech is roughly the equivalent to ww1 era weapons and space marines are manlets. Master Chief is primarch level at minimum.
They have the recoil of a .22 LR rifle (ionization of air due to the passage of the lasbolt pushes the gun back a bit). I'd say that a Guardsman can usually hit his shots, especially when you consider they're supposed to be the top ~20% of the PDF of a world mobilized as regiments.
Given that Chief's armor is vulnerable to 7.62x51mm bullets without its shield, and even then said shield can be overwhelmed and Chief killed within a single magazine of MA5 fire, I'll safely say that seven or so lasguns (plus a plasma gun and a grenade launcher, and then a laspistol or a mini-bolter) would do a good job of disassembling him.
Nice bait, have a (You)
You're absolutely correct
Not really, they both want to spread an infection but the similarity pretty much ends there. None of the gods would be particularly happy about the flood endgame. It just wants to torture everything out of spite.
There would only be one experience left for Slaanesh to enjoy, no fighting for Khorne, no room for plots or change of any kind for Tzeentch, and while Nurgle might enjoy the idea of everyone being diseased he would hate the part where no one can die and suffers forever.
Thats simple game balance though, Chief slapped a rocket out of the air in like first gen armor with no shield.
Marines die to make believe bullets and big monsters.
I don't think hes on par science wise at all, but it wouldn't be a simple win. Specially if the marine is a rookie. Rookie would be dead af just on experience alone.
In order to figure this out, we'd need some hard numbers. Chief can lift 390 kg out of armor, and at the very least 780 in Mjolnir. It's stated that at a baseline, he's got a reaction speed at least 300% better than an average human's, which increases under duress and in combat when adrenaline is pumping. His armor Increases that by a factor of 5. He was able to punch through concrete, jump easily 3 meters vertically. There's probably moreor better physical feats recorded, but I couldn't really be assed to dig out my other books from storage, and I don't feel like consulting halopedia. If we could get hard, established facts on a space marine's capabilites, we could figure out who'd be better.
Unfortunately, as powerful SPARTANs are, marines are so much more. They can heal from powerful wounds in seconds or minutes, and if an attack doesn't kill them outright, they'll usually be back to mission capable in a few hours to a day or so. Not only that, but they can tank so much more damage before dropping than a SPARTAN
He did it in mk5 armor, the first of it's iterations to feature an energy field. However, the missile in question was fired from a gunship, and was designed to take out a heavy tank in a single shot. On the flip side, 117 did suffer during the attempt, getting a massive concussion, internal bleeding, and no doubt some very bruised organs, among other wounds i cant remember of the top of my head.
It sounds a lot more like a standard APFSDS round in principle, but limited by it's caliber and bullet weight to actually perform real penetration.
What you are describing is simply an armor piercing 12 gauge slug.
this is another case of 40k making everything big and dumb but not actually anymore effective than modern technology
It's not a rocket launcher no, but you are vastly underestimating how deadly a 20mm armour piercing RPG round would be. The middle bullet in this picture with the yellow tip is an 8mm mauser explosive/incendiary bullet, less than half of it's internal volume is filled with phosphorus. It doesn't look all that dangerous on paper until you learn that a single hit from one of these can blow your head clean off. Now imagine scaling that effect up to the size of a shotgun slug. Except bolt rounds are much bigger, made out of materials heavier than lead and have a much higher muzzle velocity than a simple slug. A single hit to centre mass would blow an unarmoured human in half or easily penetrate any vehicle short of a proper tank.
We have weapons like that today but they tend to be anti-material rifles or vehicle mounted cannons. Space marines on the other hand are strong enough to fire them out of a weapon the size of an assault rifle (to them). This kind of miniaturization is well beyond the "modern" technology we have now.
Anyhow getting back to the original point, if you can kill a Spartan with regular old bullets or a grenade launcher like the brute shot, a 30 round magazine of bolter shells would do the job just fine.
What us the actual muzzle velocity at various ranges? Because A) gyrojetd have lower velocity at short range and B) the Chief can survive AP explosive rounds from the halo 1 magnum, as well as 50 cal and even 50 cal SLAP
Either way an autocannon is still not as deadly as an anti tank round, and I see plenty of sped marines not wearing helmets
It's not exclusively gyrojet. It starts with a standard chemical propellant and the rocket kicks in after exiting the barrel.
I thought gyrojets had significantly better muzzle velocities because they're not reliant on barrel pressure and the round gets lighter as it's propellant is consumed. 13mm gyrojets have comparable muzzle velocity to the more sluggish 10mm rounds, and I'd assume with space magic technology and the fact that bolters have sealed barrels without vent holes the increase in barrel pressure should give them quite a mean muzzle velocity assuming similar propellant/projectile volume or superior propellant, or both.
I'd call it 1500-2000ft/s
Well, MC is a hero character, not a normal soldier. Versus any normal marine, he would definitely win, probably against a small team as well, because he would use their weapons against them or just play it very smart. Really, he faced worse.
The things go diferent once you face MC against a terminator or another so called hero. Some notable Marines would shred MC without blinking, just one terminator is like a full boss encounter.
Oh look, it's this thread again. Generally speaking, any given spartan would lose to any given space marine, though there are a few points to be made:
Master chief has cuserical plot armor
There's a thing about how he was essentially Dr. Halsey's chosen one not because of him being better than other spartans in most of the basic ways (stronger, a natural leader, etc) but because he was lucky. Just straight up, luck is one of his defining traits and given everything that he's survived while other spartans die around him it's hard to refute.
Mark 6 is the only power armor the UNSC has
This is a pretty minor thing which actually applies more for out of combat, but there are specialized suits and helmets for a variety of tasks and environments, such as a hazmat variant that may put them on par with the space marine's anti-poison augmentations.
The space marine probably has way better anti-stealth, but if stealth itself was the goal then I'd very solidly give the win to spartans. Granted, there's pretty much no chapter of space marine that would ever even consider stealth (it's not what they're there for), but in a situation where avoiding detection was necessary, it would be a lot harder for the much bulkier space marines, meanwhile stealth is actually something spartans are shown to do relatively regularly, even without active camo (though there were the secret spartan 3s that got Semi-Powered Infiltration armor which did have some form of active camo, they're from one of the novels and may or may not be counted)
Again, space marines are way more ridiculously op than spartans in nearly every way, I just felt like bringing up a few points
Depends you want to compare a spartan from the video games or a spartan from the lore
Might want to check out Raven Guard
Well it depends entirely on how strong the rocket is plus the initial muzzle velocity.
1125fp/s 343m/s - speed of sound
1800fp/s 548m/s - speed of typical shotgun slug
2600fp/s 792m/s - speed of 30.06 bullet
WW2 rifle calibre bullets and 20mm cannon shells are typically in the 750-850m/s speed range. Bullets haven't changed much but modern 20mm aircraft cannons typically shoot at 1000m/s or higher.
Bolters don't have any concrete stats but we can make a few educated guesses. Bolt shells are very heavy for their size and bolter recoil is described as "extreme" for regular humans. So the initial muzzle velocity would be considerable, lets say 500-600m/s, or 1640 to 1960ft/s. This is already ridiculously lethal, just imagine getting hit by a 10 gauge shotgun slug, only it's 2-4 times heavier than normal. Now bolt shells ALSO have rockets, so clearly they are designed to go faster than this. Question is how much faster and how long it takes the bolt shell to reach it's maximum speed.
I would guess that a bolt shell's maximum speed would be in the 800-1000m/s range, specialist rounds like kraken bolts might go even faster. The faster the shell goes the easier it is to hit a moving target and the more armour piercing power it delivers, both ideal properties for a space marine weapon.
Bolter combat typically takes place at short-medium range so you would want the bolt to accelerate to it's maximum speed over a short distance. It's implied that a bolt rocket igniting inside the gun would make it explode from the internal pressure, so the rocket engine is powerful for it's size. It would make the most sense for the rocket to burn as hot and fast as possible to get the bolt shell quickly up to speed. After which it could simply burn out, or continue with a slower burn to keep it at that designed speed for as long as possible.
If that's the case, 12g frag slug vs 20 mm auticannon is the details of velocity and mass.
IIRC its velocity was okay past about 20 feet, but it starts off slow enough to be a problem if you wanted to use it at extremely close range for some reason.
Ah yes, Rational Man with a Shotgun - Bane of a surprisingly large number of horrifying entities.
Why would she say that if it's a muggle (and gu rights) affirming statement?
Most of the time in 40k lasguns are used against Space Marine power armor, which has been specifically built to disperse heat easily through the ceramite it was made with.
I feel like Chief's power armor wouldn't have the same heat-dispersion effect. At least not as effectively since it's also several inches thick.
Rowling explicitly said a single muggle with a shotgun could have taken out Voldemort.
stop spreading this lie, any attempt at finding this statement only results in finding other people unable to find this statement
When has Rowling ever been against muggles?
Also, RMWAS isn't really part of the gun debate argument since he is apolitical and only ever brought up with regards to killing monsters or superhuman entities (such as the ninja's from Naruto, for example.)
The thing about potter wizards is that their world is shuttered out from reality. Voldemort certainly killed a ton of brits...after he created an army of Death Eaters. Random shotgun dude banishing Voldemort is a perfectly acceptable win, seeing as after a hundred or so years, the only thing he'll be able to harm in his ascent back to power would be the Wizarding world.
Also, a firearm is much faster than a death spell, not to mention, most of the Potter spells that aren't the seven forbidden ones require either quick thinking or foresight to use against an armed opponent to put him out of commission. WWII Brit Vet may be thrown into the air, but by God, he would still snap a few shots off.
Depends: are we talking games Chief or books Chief, because there's a pretty big difference.
Games Chief can barely dodge a rocket launcher, while book chief can grab the rocket and throw it back.
I'd say book chief is probably around an okay Space Marine but games Chief is a slightly more badass imperial guardsmen with better armor.
Game Chief can barely dodge a rocket launcher
Not playing the best Halo
Not deflecting their gay-ass rockets back at them with the BANHAMMER
Fucking yes. Chiefs AC would be ridiculous, his Will Fort and Reflex would be just as inflated, and he took a fall from orbit and stood up a little bit after to keep fighting.
No, but at least he comes from a better setting.
Doesn't that make it just a pretty quick RPG but miniaturized?
But who would win out of Bungie Chief and the Marathon Security Officer?
The answer is "first reconcile the SO's ability to abandon a timeline early with your ability to get him killed".
Master Chief is pretty close being a child super soldier in power armor that's pretty close to astartes tier, and his higher end weaponry like the Spartan Laser is basically a las cannon.
He lacks some of the curayzee-er Space Marine augments, and their basic weapons outclass his basic weapons even if his high tier weapons outclass their high tier weapons. I'd say it's fairly even and he could take a scout marine or a newly minted marine, but a sergeant or experienced marine could handle him.
yeah or this
Honestly, i'd say that the quality of the two settings is about on par
they both suffer from a lot of the same problems, and if given the time to develop more it'd probably be easier to see in the Halo universe but since 40k has been out so long and has gone through so many changes it seems more apparent to those that have continued to follow it
She never said it so it doesn't matter.
Cheifs armor is specifically described as heat dispensing ceramic titanium plates and an energy dispensing gel layer meant to counter plasma energy weapons
fall from orbit from an exploding shit and be fine
he can take a super nuke to the face and be fine
i think he'll be fine
I'd say Spartan has the advantage, as they are made to play dirtier, and to hell with honor. Whatever wins is fair game for Spartans, often through the use of unorthodox tactics and dispensing with experimental weaponry with reckless abandon.
I'd say they're more fairly matched against a Deathwatch Marine, one who's taught to fight in unorthodox manners by playing smart, and not exactly using their strength or weight of numbers to their advantage.
the real question is how many spartan III companies does it take to make a difference?
I feel like Chief's power armor wouldn't have the same heat-dispersion effect. At least not as effectively since it's also several inches thick.
Isn't it designed to try and stop covenant plasma weapons? That seems like it would work with heat dispersion.
The original power armours predate first contact with the covenant. Not sure about later marks.
Jackie grandpa would had defeated Voldemort in a single episode of the show
The 'original' mk 5 mjolnir armor that was made to co-inside with the SPARTAN II project had the heat dispersion titanium/ceramic heat dispersion ablative armor come standard.What happened was Halsey and her team made the basic suit before and while the spartans were adjusting to their augmentations, then the covies showed up and glassed Harvest, so the threw the extra armor on before giving them to the spartans.
I think MkV was the standard Spartan armor, but I can't remember if it was MkIV that was unpowered, or if it was a second-run MkV that had shields basically stolen from Elites incorporated into it.
MkVI and later started diverging from stolen Covenant designs and advancing in their own way. As the customization in Reach and Halo 3 demonstrated, some third-party manufacturers got into the game as well, designing modular MJOLNIR bits to help supplement Spartan demand and different tactical niches.
I think the real problem is Voldy getting popped back to ghost form by a shotgun and coming back with a "fuck your guns" spell he made.
MkIV was what was issued at the start of the Human-Covenant War, in 2525. It had no shields, but was still power armor. It amplified the wearer's speed, strength, and reaction time by a lot. Mk V was issued in 2552, and had shields and the ability to house an onboard A.I. Interestingly enough, it wasn't quoted to have copied the tech from Elite battle harnesses, but in fact the shielding tech was stolen from recovered Jackal point defense shield guantlets. Old lore had it so that Elites weren't even seen for most of the war, only really making an appearance late in 2552, shortly before/during the battle of Reach.
What's powerful enough to beat Master Chief from one of the dullest franchises in history? Seriously each episode following the boy wizard and his pals from Hogwarts Academy as they fight assorted villains has been indistinguishable from the others. Aside from the gloomy imagery, the series’ only consistency has been its lack of excitement and ineffective use of special effects, all to make magic unmagical, to make action seem inert.
Perhaps the die was cast when Rowling vetoed the idea of Spielberg directing the series; she made sure the series would never be mistaken for a work of art that meant anything to anybody?just ridiculously profitable cross-promotion for her books. The Harry Potter series might be anti-Christian (or not), but it’s certainly the anti-James Bond series in its refusal of wonder, beauty and excitement. No one wants to face that fact. Now, thankfully, they no longer have to.
a-at least the books were good though
The writing is dreadful; the book was terrible. As I read, I noticed that every time a character went for a walk, the author wrote instead that the character "stretched his legs."
I began marking on the back of an envelope every time that phrase was repeated. I stopped only after I had marked the envelope several dozen times. I was incredulous. Rowling's mind is so governed by cliches and dead metaphors that she has no other style of writing. Later I read a lavish, loving review of Harry Potter by the same Stephen King. He wrote something to the effect of, "If these kids are reading Harry Potter at 11 or 12, then when they get older they will go on to read Stephen King." And he was quite right. He was not being ironic. When you read "Harry Potter" you are, in fact, trained to read Stephen King.
Essentially yes, but totally unlike anything that exists today because it uses kinetic force to pierce armour and detonate inside of it.
Are there any boards that you don't lurk for posts about Harry Potter?
Orbit is a bit further out than 2km. By the factor hundred at least.
Nah, I think he is more on a Karskin Level. Still better than any regular human, pretty gud soldier with high tech shit, but not a marine. To the fight between Chief & Marine, I think its a lot depending on what weapons they use. I am not an Halo Expert, but this Giant Laser they have reminds me strongly of a Lascannon, so propably he could kill him with a headshot. With regular arms, its far more difficult for the Chief. In general, I think any Marine would butcher him in Melee, but he could stand a chance in distance, for example if he sneaks and acts smart.
Chief was already injured before he did it. That's why he tried something that fucking stupid, he couldn't dodge or outrun or do anything that'd have been stupid but more conventional. He was basically tapped the fuck out
The Spartans in general seem to be closer to kasarkins then space marines, or perhaps the gland war veterans
Fuck you catch 22 was a good book
Once you strip away the plot armor "muh fall from orbit and live" bullshit even a rookie Marine is pretty much an auto-lose for Chief.
Pretty sure the general consensus from here a while back was that the best SPARTAN II's were roughly on par with Space Marine Scouts.
Physicically around a bout.
Marine without armor = chief in armor more or less.
Now argue about Supreme Commander and the Culture, please