Planning on making a Modern Urban setting game. One of the guys said to take cues from the Dresden Files. Problem is...

She's about to shoot straight up and start killing bats. She's looking away to disguise her intentions.

I know the artist intended it as an upgrade, but I honestly prefer the older version

Which is it

Dresden Files is a book series about a man named Harry Dresden, a professional wizards in Chicago. He fights supernatural threats and is a detective of supernatural cases (and the only wizard in the phone book). It's a good series that spawned a FATE based game of the same name that is ok (Wizards are OP, duh) but it's cool. There is a second edition coming out and a FATE Accelerated version that's ok. It's a bit like a lighter hearted World of Darkness kind of world where supernaturals aren't out in the open but do exist and some people know about them.

It's a series of books.

It's pulp trash, and that's coming from somebody who actually really likes the books. They have their moments, but it's the poster child for shallow 'style over substance' style writing. That doesn't mean it isn't fun to read, it just means that if you're expecting depth and nuance rather than wizards riding sidecar to vampires on motorcycles, you're gonna be dissapointed.

It's a book series that includes crazy scenes like a badass wizard riding a t-rex, that he necromanced to unlife, through Chicago to stop necromancers, while a skinny Jewish dude in a one-man-band-rig rides next to him.

Yet still makes you cry when an evil demon sacrifices herself with brain damage.

It's hard to describe the books without lots of bad out of context stuff. It's a good series, & every character is great.

pirate the full audio-book series, including all the short-stories. set the shorts where they go in the series then listen to all of it in order book 2 and 3 are a little iffy. but its reasonably good, and once he hits his stride Marsters and his buttery rumble of a voice will be a source of some good listening...

You could tell he’d hit his stride when he performed Harry going apeshit at Bianca’s masquerade.
Especially Pyrofuego

author or narrator or both?

The setting lends itself really well to urban fantasy, I'd use it as a foundation for any rpg. If you want a general overview, read the comics.

Short description, it's basically Hellblazer Lite.

I've not tried the comic...but that dresden-face doesn't look quite right...

Both.
The prior two books had character struggles, and the third went ways to fixing them.
Marsters also had issues in the first two when it came to loud emoting, which made the climactic scenes feel a bit anaemic, as well as the poor editing creating weird pauses in the narration.
The masquerade was a time when both of them showed they’d made strides.
Or, in the case of Marsters, had a much better voice Director and/or editor

and now he's done the books enough he has become the Voice of the Dresden.

someone suggested I watch Buffy recently, I did, and because of the dresden files I couldn't finish the show because of spikes awful voice

I think there are different artists depending on the issue, Welcome to the Jungle and Storm front have a pretty good Harry depiction.

The dresden files is kind of like you're own personal asshole in book form. A very special asshole too.

Imagine you like folklore. Then a guy comes up and says "Hey, you know [something]? Ha, you don't know ANYTHING about it! It's actually like this!"

And you're reading and are all like "No, that's dumb, please don't do that."
And he's all "What's the matter? Too ORIGINAL and CREATIVE for you?!"

And you want to tell him he's subverting things in the worst way possible, but he's too busy trying to impress you and just keeps doing his best to ruin everything, and at some point you have to throw the books away because children might find them and get infected by the stupid.

Fuck, this. The series always put a bad taste in my mouth, and I didn't know how to word it. It really is just like some asshole is trying to constantly impress you, except it's like he's trying to impress you by telling you about his dreams or some shit.

I was going to say that it was because it was a younger Dresden, but then realised this one is set two years before and nails it, so it's probably an artist thing

Gay

There are more creative ways of bumping a thread, m8

Can you share with the class a few of these terrible "creative" changes

First book. Chairs don't break as easily as in the Movies.

That's not at all what they felt like to me.

Most of the time the tropes are actually played in a pretty straight way. There's very little subversion, What the series usually does though is take fantasy tropes and fit them in the noir-ish, pulp fiction detective theme that runs through most novels.

It's trashy, but it's not trying to be anything other than that. The characters are fun and consistently written, and they flow well.

They're not high literature, but they're as fun a series as any other. If you like fantasy action with a dose of humor, it's a good series. If you want brainy, complex deconstructions of the fantasy genre, then they're not for you.

Seriously? That's the kind of shit you're talking about? I can think of like, two instances of that in all of the 7 books I've read so far. Once, with the chair thing in book 1, and then the "bullets don't really make big entry holes" thing in book, 4 I think?

They stand out a bit in a book that constantly goes over the top in its action sequences, but they didn't feel like the author trying to be clever or impressive, but just as a way for him to describe the scene as he visually envisioned instead of how you'd usually picture it, with pre-conceived ideas about how things work in movies.

I actually think he says that quote later in the series.

and it was book one man.

The humor is miss, miss, and miss for me.

Because the Author tries to hard

>dresden files
>sounds like an occult detective, but the books are not even close to what an occult detective should look like.
Have you tried to consider looking at other examples of Urban Fantasy like Hellblazer/Constantine or Rental Magica?

Meh, might be an age/interest difference. His humor is definitely snarky spiderman, with nostalgia from the 80's 90's fantasy & sci-fi.

His humor is a guy confusing being unpleasant and demeaning with being witty. He's missing the key component of being actually snarky, and that's being able to say something clever or well-timed. It's like there's a vehicle for humor, and plenty of it, but it's missing the engine.

"Holy shit, Hellhounds"
"Watch your language"
"Sorry, Holy shit, heckhounds"
Will never not be funny. (Not verbatim, joke in the third book)

That reads so unnaturally. It's like they're colluding together to reach that punchline, and the payoff is still underwhelming.

The problem is that he Snarks all the time.

>YOU DIED

A lot of the dialogue reads like it's from medium-quality comic books; that's probably what Butcher was inspired by/going for. Characters set themselves and each other up for cheesy one-liners, it's part of the charm of the series.

So does spiderman.

& no, it's only about 2/3 snark & 1/3 philosophic waxing poetic about life & virtue & pain

DIdn't Spiderman snark due to him being scared?

>that's probably what Butcher was inspired by/going for.

Go to sleep, Butcher, and quit trying to excuse your inability to write as you being deliberately bad at it.

>It's another episode of "I hate Dresden Files, but can't adequately explain why so I'll just call it shit"

Have you read Codex Alera or Aeronaut's Windlass? Both are great. Is it epic, classical writing? No. It's it great storytelling & memorable characters? Yes. It's like the Belgariad or such. Or comparing Marvel's MCU with Sound of Music.

This. People on this board are weird. They hate Butcher & Sanderson & such but have no reason to except that it's newer than the classics.

The problem is, of course, is that Harry is doing the talking isn’t actually nice.

>it's another "if I call it "great," that counts as an adequate explanation, but if I call it shit, that triggers the dresdenfans" reeee fest
Dresdenfans are the worst because you need to be a little dumb in order to be one, but that doesn't stop some of them from going full blown retarded.

People are going in depth to explain why they think it's shit though, calm your tits.
Also, it generally understood to be shit, it's just that some people are willing to put up with that shit because they think some power fantasy is enough of a pay off.

Image being this autistic to where you can't have varied taste or like things for different reasons. Like sure I think Citizen Kane is a masterpiece but you know what, that Die Hard was pretty fun too.

Harry gets a great deal of mileage out of how people don’t understand what it means when he calls himself a wizard. He knows people don’t know what wizards are, says there is, for whatever reason, absolutely no other wizard who’s got a phone number to call, yet insists on identifying himself as one then saying it’s mockery when they misunderstand.

He will just keep doing this. He’s an enormous guy flinging around an enormous power, who doggedly refuses to explain anything while smugging it up about how no one else knows, and this makes him the greatest victim of it all.

One person stated they hate it for a chair breaking easily & one guy said he didn't like the humor. As far as I've read in this thread those were the only stated reason. Everything else has just been people saying it's shit.

Power fantasy my ass. Dresden's life is shit. No one wants to be Dresden. It's just entertaining to watch

Die Hard had a charismatic lead and dialogue that didn't take you back to Intro to Creative Writing.

Soooo every comic book hero ever...

& he changes his mind about explaining things to people sometimes. At first he was a guy, largely on his own, with a draconian secret society waiting to kill him if he fucked up. To being a pillar of support to those who are weaker/don't have the advances he does. People got hurt from him sharing things they were better off not knowing, & for trying to take on things without all the info. He had reasons for keeping some things secret. People can have flaws.

I don't think it's worth arguing with dresdenfans.

There's always one or two guys who get super defensive, to the point where they make ludicrous statements and then expect you to just accept them.

Like trying to deny that it's a power fantasy. What the fuck.
Dredenfans, you need to get your rabid members leashed already.

Same level of dialogue mate.

"Hahaha now I have Demonreach"

Fights barefoot on glass vs fights naked against a demon

I can continue to compare if you'd like

Compared to what other fantasy/sci-fi story? Cause it's all at some level a power fantasy you chucklefuck. The sin is on making it blatant. Like in a shifty YA novel.

It really isn't a power fantasy. Dresden's life fucking sucks. Yeah, he gets to bone a couple hot women, but in exchange, he's getting beat to shit on a regular basis, has a terrible car that is broken more than it works, and lives in a really shitty little basement apartment with no modern amenities and has seen some serious shit that will never be forgotten.

Fuck, I wouldn't want to be him, I wouldn't want to be NEAR the dude.

But it's entertaining to watch.

It's not highbrow by any means, it's deliberately cliche.

Yet you and others come on here, call it shit and anyone who likes it even just a little bit "Dresdenfans" (hint, the way you combine those words makes you very recognizable) and call everyone who likes them dumb.

Other stories have other things to offer though.

Dresden Files are a series of urban fantasy/pulp detective novels with a sense of humor taken entirely from comic book one-liners. They're decent books, completely in the urban fantasy genre and don't do much new.

Seriously, 'wizard detective' seems to be the stock setup for urban fantasy that isn't "secret vampires.' Hellblazer, Dresden, Skulduggery Pleasant, basically any CoC campaign where magic is involved, Night Watch, and that's just off the top of my head.

So let's do something constructive with this thread.
>How would I do urban fantasy?
Define a central element of 'magic' that your fantasy bases around, rathe than just "magic is secretly real" like WoD or Dresden. Bartimeus books do this ok for kids' fiction: the premise is "sorcerers make pacts with/issue orders to extradimensional 'demons' that grant them powers. The sorcerer caste use their powers to rule the world and anyone who wants to be successful must make demon pacts and risk being destroyed."

So then your PCs are all about rules lawyering 'demons' or djinn into obeying you, and using prep time & investigation to trap djinn inside objects to create 'magic items.' Run the campaign like a series of heists.

Or go with AtLA/Korra. Portions of the population manifest elemental powers. Set it in that setting, after the death of Korra's successor (70-120 years later). Martial arts high action in a setting w/ drones & assault rifles, and the magic is 90% fireball/lightning bolts and doesn't create the d&d dilemma of 'why do people farm instead of casting create food & water?'

>Dresden's life fucking sucks.
Which again is due to his own damn fault. He enjoys behaving this way, even if – especially if – the “people” do not like being treated like this. But the fact they don’t appreciate what he does for his own enjoyment is proof that he’s unfairly persecuted by the world because he’s being so nice to them.

Pretty much this, you couldn't give me anything to step into Harry's shoes, that's a fucked bet since jump-street.

If I was gonna go into a Power Fantasy gimme that Anita Blake shit, I'll sexy vampire Lesbian any day.

>Seriously, 'wizard detective' seems to be the stock setup for urban fantasy that isn't "secret vampires.' Hellblazer, Dresden, Skulduggery Pleasant, basically any CoC campaign where magic is involved, Night Watch, and that's just off the top of my head.

99% of the time it's 'Wizard Private Detective'. I can't remember too many where it's an actual cop, which is a bit sad. Actual cop + magic stuff would be fun.

So does Dresden. In spades.

I love the humor
I love the characters
I love the cliche but meaningful messages
I love the little pop culture references (I don't believe in fairies)
I love Mouse
I love the grander story that develops as the books go on
These is a LOT to love about the Dresden Files.

>I'm a wizard who's power dramatically escalates throughout the series
>but my car sucks T_T

You're right, it's not a power fantasy. Who could ever suggest something like that. Glad we've got you here to act like a watchdog in case anyone tries to criticize the series in any manner whatsoever.

Great barking.

all of them and none of them.

Hope that helps.

Police work has too much red tape, your protagonist has to be a maverick & just a little bit shady in urban fantasy.

If I ever write my urban fantasy story it'll be about a dude who has no connection to law enforcement, lawyer friends who are secretly werewolves/vampires, or perky journalists. They also won't work as a bartender, mechanic, or bounty hunter/detective. It just been done to death

So you're just ignore all the physical, mental, and emotional abuse Dresden goes through then?

You could do a wizard cop but i think it would require magic to be fully incorporated into the setting.

I was tempted a while ago to write urban fantasy about a cop (And one that tries to work with legitimate channels rather than going dirty harry) in such a setting but it ended up a bit stillborn because I'm not confident enough in my writing abilities to manage it.

>Actual cop + magic stuff would be fun
So the X-Files?

Honestly I wish more Urban Fantasy took leafs out of that show's book. I wanna fight weird shit like brain worms or fluke men or insane inbred hillbillies.

Feels like Urban Fantasy as a genre is basically just X-Men with Vampires nowadays.

>Yet still makes you cry when an evil demon sacrifices herself with brain damage.
Lash was, is, and always will be best girl

Hey this dramatic increase in power is actually just you without inhibitors so it can kill you if you go too far & also makes you a psycho fae queen's bitch.

This other increase in power comes from a demon that is slowly killing you & telling you to do evilbadthings

The only legitimate increase in power that isn't him just slowly being a better wizard though study & practice is Soulfire. & that burns away is soul & was given to him after he really put his shit on the line to help people out.

It's not like he unlocked his super sayian form

Well he's got demonreach but that only helps when he's actually on the island plus he now has to be warden to an eldritch monster supermax.

Dresden Files is almost a harem anime of best girls.
Molly
Murph
Susan
Lucio
Andi
Justine
Lara & more.
It's actually a big reason I like Dresden, he isn't a slut & just wants one good girl

Exactly. The series goes out of its way for the theme that power has a price

And that Harry's decision making process is bad.

That's more of it being a case of contrived conflict, because if Harry wasn't conveniently retarded and forced by the plot into making certain decisions, there wouldn't be a plot.

>So then your PCs are all about rules lawyering 'demons' or djinn into obeying you, and using prep time & investigation to trap djinn inside objects to create 'magic items.' Run the campaign like a series of heists.
you're basically making magical shit less valuable since it's just another mundane job
>Or go with AtLA/Korra
>implying bending mastery grows on trees
watch the fucking show again

>putting Hellblazer and Dresden on the same level

> "sorcerers make pacts with/issue orders to extradimensional 'demons' that grant them powers. The sorcerer caste use their powers to rule the world and anyone who wants to be successful must make demon pacts and risk being destroyed."
that's fucking hellblazer in a nutshell

I'd do urban fantasy pretty standard where the Spanish inquisition & other factors killed of large populations of magical critters & those that exist now exist in hiding because sure one wizard or werewolf could wreak a human but militaries & police & modern things like cameras & social security cards make it hard. So whatever happened a couple hundred years ago also went out of its way to cover it up but governments & other powerful groups know about the supernatural to one extent or the other. Even if they don't see the whole picture. Like the mob might know about curses & stuff & the president has a wizard secret service, but maybe everyone thinks werewolves are fake.

Have a branch of the government go all men in black against magic threats where if you are a witch who gets on their radar they show up at your house & either arrest you on trumped up charges or make you sign forms restricting your use of magic & putting you on probation

>make you sign forms restricting your use of magic & putting you on probation

The problem with this is the fact they're a secret organization on one knows about means they have no reason to not just kill people indiscriminately. They're already accountable to no one, so not summarily executing/imprisoning witches is a liability.

YEAH

HELLA F*CKIN EPIC

The first book, let alone first chapter of said book. He tells us that business is not booming, because apparently refusing to explain anything about yourself and hope people guess what your job actually involves doesn’t work as well as you’d think, and smugs more about how last week some guy hired him about a supposedly haunted house and he just told the guy to stop using drugs and being an idiot.

Never read Hellblazer my dude, just drawing the 'magical detective' comparison. The second line is from a different series altogether, a bunch of kids books I read in my teens.

not an argument

No you fucking retard. People Genuinely ask what he means by Wizard, and everytime he gets uppity about like some Autistic retard.

Rivers of London’s series did this.
Sadly, the last two main books sucked, and then he tried charging 12 bongbucks for a 6 fucking chapter novella, at which point I dropped the series and never looked back.

The fact that her pistol has a grip angle of about 20 degrees doesn't bother you?

Only set your game in that shit setting if you want to get brain cancer

Don't really remember that outside Storm Front or Fool Moon, which pretty much everyone agrees is mediocre at best

That's not Murphy, that's Corpsetaker.

For the love of fuck, don't give Jim ideas.

That's probably jim

I'm curious, how should you integrate mythology and the modern world.
Should you go with like a secret hidden world where things are still trapped in the past... Or a more integrated one?

>how should you integrate mythology and the modern world
Don't, it's more fun to make up your own stuff. Mythology is just people trying to explain weird bullshit that happens.

Don't do kitchen sink shit where everything is real and you have a cyclops and dragon and medusa around every corner. It's deeply unsatisfying and ruins any mystique a series might have.

Only add new things in when it's relevant. Maybe the domovoi is real, but there's no reason to confirm everything else exists when you introduce one.