Anyone else think something similar to Hollow Knight would make a great PnP? Different bug races giving different stats...

Anyone else think something similar to Hollow Knight would make a great PnP? Different bug races giving different stats, lightweight mechanics ala Mouseguard, whimsical but also a bit sinister? I'm in love.

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>something similar to Hollow Knight would make a great PnP
HURR DURR go to contanman bord plerb

We literally had a fucking days long thread about DESTINY 2 LORE this week. Fuck off.

Something like Hollow Knight's universe would make a GREAT Pen and Paper. Light magic, lots of bug races to work with, some barely discernible as real species from earth, but who cares. Unique and cute weapons like the nail and needle w/ thread.

I thought the same thing OP.

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Seems like it could be cool, but I honestly don't see why you couldn't just refluff mouseguard to use it.

Good point! thats a great idea friend.

it sounds like you need arthropocalypse

check the suptg archive or 1d4chan...

Hollow Knight was a great game and hit all the right notes for me with worldbuilding.
has the right idea, hell if you don't want to use Mouseguard you could probably refluff just about any rules light or even OSR game for it.

I think a better question is what aspects of the game wouldn't work. You can reflect a setting and races easily in pen and paper format. An example of an element that wouldn't work would be the death mechanic. It justifies increasing difficulty for encounters in a video game, but when combats take 40 minutes in a pen and paper game, no one is going to want to make repeated attempts at a boss fight.

If you are fluent in French, there is a game called Insectopia. I played it at a convention it was quite fun
There are a lot of insects to choose from and the setting is incredibly extensive .
The system is diceless however and uses color coded beads

Checking!

Yeah, I think obviously it wouldn't be EXACTLY hollow knight, but something as a spiritual love letter to it.

Definitely the death mechanic would be removed.

>color coded beads

Very intrigued. Mon francais es... mal...

Can you explain?

What you're describing is literally just chitin exoskeleton Engineheart.

bug settings are great. I want to see more of
>pic related

No cost too great
No dice to roll
No board to move
No tendies to stop the rumbling
Born of GM and Basement

Gold.

As for weapons, what do you think about different varieties of nails?

>What you're describing is literally just chitin exoskeleton Engineheart.
Explain

Nails are basically just swords in Hollow Knight lore.

The biggest problem with Mouseguard I think is that it's kind of limited in terms of character creation, albeit deliberately so. We might need to open up the character creation system to more of what Burning Wheel has as the base system for Mouse Guard.

>Engineheart
Just no.

Yeah, it would be really neat.
Unfortunately, mouseguard already exists, and nobody understands why I prefer bugs to mice.

Decking screw could be a sick flamberge if you filed it flat

Welcome to the daily
>We should make a rpg out of "movie/videogame/cartoon" that came out a day ago
We hope you enjoy your stay

HK came out almost half a year ago tho.

Aw crap, I'm in the wrong thread then.

Actually around 9 months ago so 3/4 of a year.

Happens to us all.
You could use some basic OSR like LL/ACKS/LotFP and just use race-as-class, but I guess that wouldn't do scale so well.

The beads are called "blatte" in the game rules, you blindly pick a bead when you make a Roll(such as an attack Roll) the color determin the outcomes, Red is a Critical success, black is a Critical failure ect...
The setting takes places thousands of years After humans disapeared due to a ressources War, the insect evolved but are still tiny and a majority worship the remains of human artifacts

Whats your beef with Engineheart?

I got a sort of Rats of NIMH feel from the setting, like there was some sort of artifact in the distant past that was giving bugs intelligence within a specific area. I also I like that it's completely irrelevant, because it's much more important that you pay attention to that slime mold. There's a history to the world that you aren't part of.

>like there was some sort of artifact in the distant past that was giving bugs intelligence within a specific area
The bugs gained intelligence because of the pale king, they were mindless animals because of the original god, the Radiance.

so take a look at Torchbearer's character creation since it's a more advanced mouse guard

Is there like, so replacement shenanigans with the beads, or...?

I've been playing it for several weeks and the whole time I've been thinking the same thing. I want to run a game in that setting.

What I've read is the agree upon lore is that the pale king and radiance were both the same creatures, born from when the intelligent Wyrms die, like a reincarnation, and they give the bugs intelligence. Radiance was the god to the moths.

Radiance was there to begin with, but the pale king wanted to rule alone as the only god, with no competition, so he made a deal to have the moths lock radiance away, and then he took one of the moths as his queen.

Radiance's power leaked through her prison though in a corrupted form, and so different plans were made to keep the corruption at bay and further lock her up, none of them perfect.

Tie in the king's attempts and experiments to make his kingdom last forever. You're left with a decaying kingdom that fell apart, containing a locked away threat that would corrupt it all over time.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong in any of this.

I think the queen was always a divine being. She has to restrain herself in order to not give in to her instinct to created life. I think she has something to do with the creation of the vessels, because of the colours.
Also, the Hollow knight was created as a reaction to the plague. So the Radiance was causing havoc before she was sealed.

It could be that her power was given to her by radiance, or she was created by radiance herself. Her power uses soul, and the vessels are made as a combination of soul and the void powers. They're void creatures encased in husks with the soul energy.

The hollow knight was created much later than radiance was initially locked away if I remember right. Hollow Knight was created in order to contain her and the plague, which is why he was made "hollow". I know that much was explicitly said. He wasn't perfect though so it didn't work and over time the plague leaked again. I don't know if the dreamers were then added as a second attempt at sealing away the corruption, or if they were enacted at the same time as the hollow knight.

I think a lot of this implies there are other creatures born from a Wyrm dying that give intelligence to nearby bugs and create cities or tribes of which they're the ruler and/or god.

It could by some of the groups like the mantis and bee tribes were the remnants of some past "god" just as the moths were with Radiance. So they stayed apart from hollow nest, while the moths joined because their queen married the king.

The main question that the game is too vague about is whether the Husks (the types of bugs that made up Hollownest under the rule of the pale king) are brainless without the king, or if he just made them less savage with his influence.

It seems there are a lot of older greater beings in the game, some long gone, some lingering, and all like a kind of god to certain bugs. There are also tribes and groups that are intelligent regardless of the influence of radiance or the pale king.

There are different factions under different rulers:
The creatures of the deepnest who are constantly fighting and supposedly will have more lore added in the next update, the mantis tribe who seem to have no god and stood apart from hollownest, the hive with the queen bee ruler, and a few other misc. groups with some higher being they worship or is still around.

I think the husks are just easily influenced. So they were better influenced by the king, but are more easily enthralled by the plague while others easily resist.

The moths were pacifists and radiance doesn't seem to have been that bad before they turned on her to join the pale king. Once they did though she became a source of only corruption.

The thing about this game is that is has a lot of potential in the lore, lots of room for interpretation and to expand on it, but enough substance to feel right. So as a PnP it wouldn't be hard to have your own game, with maybe a different location or timeline or history. Maybe a game set before hollownest fell, maybe one set far away in another kingdom with other gods and factions of your own invention.

It's all a simple design with simple mechanics, but a lot of depth and further potential for depth in its story. That seems like the perfect combination for a PnP to me.

Fucking hell I should stop playing tf2 so much and finish this game, sounds like a fun time.

There are some alright videos that do a thorough job of assembling all the miscellaneous lore and history in the game and putting it in order. This one does an ok job.

Spoilers obviously,
youtu.be/P_77BtGR6kk

The only issue with this video though is where the guy tries to be a youtube funnyman and make dumb gaming youtuber jokes at all the wrong points. If you put up with that though you end up with a sense for the history and lore in the game.

skip the beginning where he tries to start off just making dumb jokes.

Yes, yes you should.

Nearing endgame (I think) but the biggest thing is that the game is arranged horizontally. I think a rpg where you can only walk in 2 directions would be kind of boring.

but muh contracts

I don't see how that would be a problem. The few times where there are cutscenes or views from a different angle I ended up wishing the game were an animated series so I could see the depth of the setting.

Like when you're up in the tower where that one dreamer lived and there's a telescope that they used to look down on the city, and you look down on a dark but enchanting green lit insect cityscape with flying shadows darting across the screen and rain constantly falling.

The game is set in an underground world. It's natural for a pnp game in that you're always in a dungeon with a GM controlled layout and series of paths, but you can still open up to vast caverns with lakes and cities.

And the game has an ending and a "true" ending so if you didn't already know this, don't worry, it just means you'll have more you can do after you beat the final boss before fighting the real final boss.

Under the radiance all of bug kind were mindless beings driven purely by instinct alone, much like the plague infested husks that we fight throughout the game. This is because the plague actually is the Radiance trying to reduce bugs to their original form.
The Pale King is the reason bugs went from animals to a kingdom.

I don't think that's accurate because we know there have been older civilizations in the area, and because other groups like the mantis tribe and the hive, the weavers, the creatures in the deepnest, and even the mushrooms creatures, were all around before the pale king arrived and they weren't as simple minded.

It seems apparent that the more godlike beings in their world are able to influence the minds of creatures around them. More often they create some form of hive mind, but in the case of the pale king the opposite happens, and that puts him into conflict with radiance.

It also seem radiance was not a threat to other creatures and only influenced the moths she created until the king brought them to his own side and locked radiance away.

He also sought to take over other groups but he never got through to the hive, a treaty had to be made with the mantis clan to let them do their own thing if they continued to fight deepnest, and he didn't get through to the weavers or the deepnest until he made a deal with the queen of deepnest (the beast) to become a dreamer, and gave her Hornet in exchange. Even after that they fought and kept his kingdom from expanding into their territory.

Maybe the husks (the regular bug types of hollownest) are nothing more than animals without the king, maybe he only gifted them with minds. But then maybe he only made them more than they were while radiance made them less.

...

We also know that there are other forces of power besides the white essence the king queen and radiance use.
Grimm uses red nightmare energy and hints to be older than or equal in age to the radiance as he came from a time before the moths separated dream and nightmare.
Then there is the "black wyrm" mentioned in the white defender text that some people think may be the Colosseum of fools/ fool king that doesn't seem to make them more or less intelligent just makes them fight for amusement.

Is Hollow Knight more like DaS 1 or DaS 3?

Ok NOW you can go to
Just you though.

God, i forgot how great this game was
>Decent gameplay and difficulty
>lots of secrets to uncover
>great lore
>great soundtrack

Particularly, I like that there is no clear structure to the story, no handholding "this happened, you have to do this", just you finding out on your own

Something I think is important that nobody ever mentions:

There are hot springs and relaxation facilities FUCKING EVERYWHERE in hollow nest, even the most extremely dangerous places.

This implies that bathing and relaxation are actually required for bug people.

I suggest that even with the king making people intelligent, they were still mad unstable bugs, and without their breads and circuses they collapse.

I evoke the 4th subsection of the Commander Keen Clause

To everyone talking Hollow Knight Lore, or if you're new and wanna catch up, I suggest these two videos
youtu.be/P_77BtGR6kk
youtu.be/1VvJse8B4BQ

Brainstorm on character creation, some if these thoughts might lack a proper flavor.

Depending on how crunchy you want to go, I could see covering the basic gameplay with just 4 skills.

Lifeblood(L) is your HP and overall stamina.
Might(M) is your physical ability.
Essence(E) is your magical might.
Soul(S) is your MP.

Characters start with a Carapace which grant the initial stat blocks and define body size and shape. A beetle is high Lifeblood, mid Might and Soul, low Essence and large. A moth would be Soul, mis Essence, low Lifeblood and Might with some starting jump or glide skill.

Your hard stats also affect the amount and types of Charms you can wear. For example, a pin that grants you two blue lifeblood(temp hp) could sit in an L or M notch while something that allows fast healing is L and E. Something that lets you jump again is M and something that lets you fly is M and S.

Charms can be equipped and changed during short rests, purchased at level up with EXP at a Hot spring, and some can be granted only through storybeats.

Cribbing from Mouseguard, the dangers of the world are equally other creatures and also the environment itself. Platforming might be hard to get 1 for 1, but players and GMs should imagine 3d space.

I don't think the setting of Hollow Knight, at least as of the time the game takes place, is appropriate for an RPG. However, there is an alternative

Seriously spoiling the game so don't read this if you haven't beaten Hollow Knight
Although I find it a very thematic setting, the truth is that Hollow Knight is essentially set in a post-apocalypse world, blasted and barren, its once great civilization not just gone but destroyed, defiled and populated by what are essentially undead.

Most of the NPCs are mad, already dead, or fall to the same corruption. Even the PC is a dead spirit inhabiting a shell. And outside of that "chosen one" PC, no one is capable of meaningfully changing the fate of the world.

Therefore, I don't see a design space for fun player involvement in the world of Hollow Knight AT THE TIME OF THE GAME.

My suggestion would be to go way back in time to the time of the Hollow Knight world's heyday, where it is established that there were many heroes and conflict and heresy and failed rebellions and stuff that isn't fleshed out leaving plenty of room for adventure.

That does sound pretty cool.
Plus, you could hang out and bro it up with Ogrim back in his prime

>tfw every fucking game gets compared to Dark Souls these days
>tfw you've actually seen people compare fucking Cuphead to Dark Souls
Cease this faggotry at once!

It's a Metroidvania you dumb nigger. Its meant to be like Castlevania SotN, Metroid Fusion, or Momodoro. Not Dark Souls.

Could be worse. Remember when everyone was comparing games to Skyrim for a while there?

>Even the PC is a dead spirit inhabiting a shell
Void is dead spirits, it's some sort of primordial ooze

normalfags were a mistake

There is also a massive creature responsible for the blue stuff and a lot of weird subtle things going on with the mushrooms. You can barely see it in the background in one place.

Also I forgot, creatures like Unn, who has a cult of followers and a temple by the like they live in.

You don't even need to be limited to the same area. You could have the story take place in a different nest, or cluster of nests, as the result of competing or cooperating wyrms or other gods.

You could have it take place in the future. Some other powers have shown up, some of the older ones have risen up more, and without Radiance there are more bugs coming in, recovering, and making the city less ruined. Maybe the pale king's power still exists in some form, maybe you say the bugs weren't given sentience by the power, just made more intelligent, so they can still function as a society without it.

Maybe Hornet took over and was made queen, maybe the previous queen's power will have influence similar to the pale king's, and with her help Hornet does what the pale king failed and merges hollow nest and deep nest.

A more likely setting: The old queen rules all the green and spread her influence there and further west. Hornet rules deepnest and turned it into a more industrialized society, a subtle glow of the pale king's power continue to influence hollownest, and it draws in bugs who form a more parliamentary society with a cult based around the king and both knights.

Without Radiance or the pale king around the other factions grow a little more in power, the Hive expanding into a larger kingdom, the mantis tribe aligning with Hornet's kingdom. Throw in enough time for all of this to grow and build up and you have a well drawn out setting with multiple important locations and factions to use.

What game did the "when you die you lose money instead of lives" idea first? Hollow Knight could have taken that from Shovel Knight but I though Shovel Knight took it from Dark Souls?

the corpse run is old, man.
it was in fucking everquest, and even that stole it.

It's fair for hollow knight at least. The "shape" of the story is very similar to DS1, but it manages to be its own extremely unique story while following pattern very closely.

Considering the hot springs glow, give you soul, and have a certain design that seems more ancient, I think they're related to the soul totems that a few characters mention are from a much earlier civilization that existed long before the Wyrm.

Sonic is the first I know of. :3

Well first of all, Demon Souls came before Dark Souls and did that you mong.
Secondly, that mechanic has been around since Zelda 4swords and Castlevania 2. Also, I think MMOs do it too.

Corpserunning has been a thing since forever. All Souls did was bring it back to a wider modern audience

Depending on when and where the game is set you can have creatures like the night or hornet, who are made from the void. They are able to self heal, use basic spells for combat, and are more agile but not as durable.

"husks" would be the vanilla race as the more standard bugs, with more neutral stats.

You could add bugs that aren't in the game as more interesting races, or make something similar to what's in the game, like a bee.

Perhaps we could have Grimmkin as a class or template you could apply after you pick your race?

All the ghosts in the glade of hope could make some good inspirations, I think.

They fit because they're all kickstarter donator OCs but they're made so that they're conon to the different races but they've got the originality and detail you get from a customized player character.

I think everyone is under the impression that the PnP setting would be BEFORE the actual video game, and possibly not even in the same world, just very much inspired by.