‘Today is a historic moment,’ said Mephiston.‘The next time the lords of our Chapter gather so...

Devastation of Baal. Really good book. Tells the tyranid attack on Baal.

Guy Haley is really solid. Annandale too, and I've like a lot of Wraight's stuff. Makes me wish the current batch has been responsible for the HH over Goulding and ADB.
Hoping Abnett gets back to form with the Ghosts.

Completely agree with you.

I have some good news for you then. Apparently the Siege of Terra will be handled by Haley, Wraight and Annandale in the vast majority. Abnett is said to be the one that would finish it, which I really hope he doesn't, he's fucked up enough fluff as is. Wraight on the other hand would be the perfect choice, he fixed several HH plot points already, even fellow authors mistakes.

Annandale's a rough one for me. I prefer his human characters to any of his astartes characters. Haley and Wraight I'm super happy about. Especially because they both write fast and so are likely to have multiple stories for the Siege.

I'd put Annandale sliiightly under Wraight and Haley, but that's mainly because the first HH novel I ever read was Damnation of Pythos. Not exactly the best first taste.

I'm definitely waitng on Castellan though, his portraying of Crowe was really good in pdf related.

What's funny is I actually liked Damnation of Pythos more than Annandale's other stuff. I just think it should've been a stand-alone space marine book rather than part of the Horus Heresy.

His Mephiston novella was definitely top tier though, and the reason O found him a bit underwhelming in DoB. Granted, it wasn't in First Person, which takes away a lot of the character. Glad he's writing another novel for him.

As someone who stopped reading the HH series a long time ago, my first was his Yarrick series, and I love his Yarrick, I'm still wishing for a third book. I'd put him above Wraight because outside of the HH, Wraight mostly writes for the SW, and while I don't particularly like them, I liked Wraight's books about them which does count for something.

I hate the primaris. I would have preferred if they just said oh hey these are the new Marines models. They basically stuff up the fluff. I am interested to see what the new BA book contains

Wraight Scars books are top tier for the HH.

His recent Watchers of the Throne was very good as well, giving some really nice insight on Terran, the High Lords and the Talons of the Emperor.

It also gave us the cutest and purest couple in 40k.I want more of Valerian and Aleya.

Cant wait for the chapter war thats gonna break out when the Primaris dark angels start figuring out the secret

Why would there be a war though? Why wouldn't they be introduced gradually to the Inner Circle like all the others marines before them?

I don't like any of the Primaris vehicles so far, but they have grown on me. Though I do think the "lol Cawl fixed everything lmfao," ends up being untrue because Seth is right, at that point you might as well have painted them all blue.
I will also admit in the M42 books I'm a sucker for the scenes where people meet a Primarch returned for the first time.

I also read Watchers and thought it was really good. The throneroom scene in particular I found memorable. I've read all of Wraight's stuff save the HH.

Because they arent like all the other marines before them. They arent taken off of feral worlds and the like and made into marines at a young age. The Dark Angels didnt train these marines, they dont know these marines. Primaris are Guilliman's watchdogs, made to watch and take over all the chapters and bring them in line

I've only read Dark Imperium of the new lore, but the Primaris Dark Angel that was there was extremely critical of of Guilliman and the way he was giving orders to even non-Ultramarine Primaris. He essentially pulled out a #notmyprimarch line. So I don't think Primaris Dark Angels would have any problem opposing Guilliman.

Funny thing is, I read it on my phone and actuay skipped that Chapter unwillingly. Only after finishing the book did I think it over and decided that it was really weird to hear about this "failure" to get into the higher ranks and not actually know wha happened. Silly me.

My favorite scene is the final ship battle, but basically all the Valerian/Aleya interactions are golden.

>I hope they keep the "minute to midnight" feeling, with Chapters being made of some Primaris, but not yet devoid of normal ones.
What I have to wonder is how they hope to contrive a scenario where the marines who are the original breeds "die out", since they still produce two progenoids every couple of years. They might not actually do that, and instead keep creating squatmarines for Horus Heresy, and when that wears off, the great crusade and/or events that took place before the "minute to midnight" setting of 40,000, but after the Emperor was on the throne and entombed, like the first black crusade, where the surviving primarchs were still around.

I'm sympathetic, but how would Guilliman have saved the Imperium inb4 >implying without a huge force of tens if not hundreds of thousands of super-space marines wielded at legion strength?

>"lol Cawl fixed everything lmfao,"
Also made more obnoxious because, lest we forget, Cawl is the innovative super-genius who appears out of nowhere one day because it turns out he was in Mar's basement for 10000 years and the Mechanicus forgot to knock on his door every now and then.

The recruitment of non-feral aspirants wouldn't impact the Chapter in slightest. Plus we have no evidence Primaris obey Guilliman after leaving him, on the contrary.

Yea but why aren't primaris a separate faction. I find it hard to believe that BA and space wolves would just turn around and go. Oh new Marines yea let's just stop operating the way we have since the heresy

Apparently he'll be featured in a HH novel. If the author is half decent he'll explain why we didn't hear more of him.

You really think Guilliman would hand out his secret weapon, his ace in the hole, to all of these thousands of podump chapters that each have their own ideas about how to do things?

Dont kid yourself, Guilliman is pulling the strings

Insufficient models probably.

Enjoy being Ultramarines in red armor, BA. You've been soft-squatted.

>Why wouldn't they be introduced gradually to the Inner Circle like all the others marines before them?
They can't be trusted. The DA even avoid techmarines because they are trained in Mars

Being nearly exterminated during the 13th Black Crusade, the return of Magnus and the three dozen other apocalyptic events we haven't heard of yet because they happened during the Indomitus Crusade is likely to have changed some minds in those chapters.

That's precisely what he did. Chapters were given the means to create their own Primaris, as stated by Robbie Macniven on how the Carcharodons got Primaris.

Then theyve got a killswitch in them. Some kind of genetic marker that forces them to obey orders from Guilliman. I guarantee they have an Order 66 built into them for when its time for the space marines to go the way of the thunder warriors

>I'm sympathetic, but how would Guilliman have saved the Imperium inb4 >implying without a huge force of tens if not hundreds of thousands of super-space marines wielded at legion strength?
With normal marines. You see, despite being better than normal marines, the primaris didn't had any experience.
Guilliman basically just threw a bunch of novices into the meatgrinder.

Where has it been said that they stopped operating like the way they used to? They welcomed the reinforcements because they were severely depleted but that's it.

I've noticed in novels, this one and Crisis of Faith, codex relics are being name dropped in the books. What are the odds that came from on high more than the minds of the authors.

Would explain why Guilliman called them "Cawl's blasphemous hordes", and Cawl himself said that Guilliman ordered him to do things forbidden by the Emperor.

Guilliman is suspicious as fuck. It seems that he got corrupted somehow

No the old ones will just die out naturally. It's been said several times already. They'll be gradually replaced as cimnat takes it toll, since every new marine will theoretically be a Primaris. The only "problem" there can be could come from the original ones, those we were made by Cawl, originating from M30, but even then there has been (as of yet) no problem whatsoever. They're loyal and that's it.

I wrote a few short stories freelance for GW and they give you strict guidelines about how you have to basically describe characters with what they come with on a sprue. I tried to write a Captain with an archeotech pistol and got told to change it to a Master Crafted Plasma Pistol

More likely it's Cawl that put in the killswitch. Guilliman's flaw seems to be more that he puts his trust in others. Even when he's pretty suspicious of them, he's generally just too trusting of a primarch.

One day in a few editions everyone will be Primaris and the scale upgrade will be complete, and no more fluff needs focus on it.

>Guilliman basically just threw a bunch of novices into the meatgrinder.
Some of them were from the Horus Heresy though? Am I mistaken or is it possible to alter space marine normals into primaris after they've been converted, or were these people only boys at the time of the horus heresy who would have seen Dorn and the other primarchs (as fluff stated) not as primarch to them beforehand, but as spectators during parades and the like?

Thunder Warriors would have just died out natrually, that didnt stop emps from massacring them with his new space marines. Space marines are dangerous, they have a will of their own and they can fall. Primaris are genetically engineered to be the perfect, obedient warrior

Notice that in the 100 years of the Indomitus crusade, not a single Primaris has been tainted by chaos or turned away from the imperium

None of them fought in the Heresy, though they might've lived through it as children.

Haley said for Dark Imperium his only guideline was "include Primaris Marines!" and that he was given free reign over everything from feature characters to characterizations.
So either the big time authors get a lot more freedom (read: near infinite), or Haley's interview was written by the PR department special for Warhammer Community. From what I've seen, it could be either really.

Speaking of Warhammer Community
warhammer-community.com/2017/11/15/space-marine-conquests-explained/
Is it just me, or is the tl;dr "We're renaming Space Marine Battles and putting the shitty HH CG guy on it."

>So either the big time authors get a lot more freedom (read: near infinite)
The precedent for this is very strong. With Haley it's also a much safer approach because he's so much less of a wild card writer than Abnett, who's arguably had unlimited editorial freedom in 40k longer than any other BL author.

>Some of them were from the Horus Heresy though?
Yes, but Cawl didn't made them in two days. They went in and out of stasis.

I think normal marines can be turned into primaris, but in the Dark Imperium it's stated that they didn't had experience.

That was a whole other scale and setting altogether. Thunder Warriors couldn't be controlled as were degenerating very fast. That and the slight issue of having to conquer a whole fucking galaxy.

>Primaris are genetically engineered to be the perfect, obedient warrior
No they're not. It's litteraly 3 more organs and they're all physically impacting, not mentally.
The only ones that could be mentally impacted are the original Unnumbered Sons, but the Primaris created by the chapters after getting the recipe wouldn't have any problems.

In the very first PR for Primaris it was said that normal marines can become Primaris, but we have yet to see it mentioned ever again. I don't think it's a thing anymore.

Yeah, they probably said it, but then realized they'd have to update every character or explain why all these characters aren't being upgraded and decided it wasn't worth the headache.

2 things: The Primaris project started during the Scouring, so the children barely knew the Heresy.

And no, normal marines CANNOT be made into Primaris. There is litteraly zero written evidence. It was one dude, saying it one time during a stream, which was then repeated ad nauseam by people on interneg but it has been scraped.
We wouldn't get all these "Primaris are going to replace us" moments otherwise.

Oh yeah definitely. I think it's also a way to separate 40k from 41k.

>but the Primaris created by the chapters after getting the recipe wouldn't have any problems.
Unless some of these organs are corrupted.

Guilliman doesn't seen to be very respectful towards the primaris.

You're really pulling stuff from your ass here.

Guilliman is wary of Primaris because, like everyone else, seeing Cawl, aka not the Emperor, meddling with stuff like that is really fucking dangerous. Yet for now we haven't gotten any bad stuff. Does it mean Primaris can't be corupted? No. It doesn't happen quickly. But trying to say that Primaris were made to kill off te old ones in the fluff is plain wrong.

>>Ruining best chapter with shitty primaris
flesh tearers are find though

>But trying to say that Primaris were made to kill off te old ones in the fluff is plain wrong.
I think it's more likely that Guilliman pretend to kill only the ones that don't want him rulling over them.
Like what he did with the loyal worlds that didn't wanted to be part of Ultramar

>Primaris were made to kill off te old ones in the fluff is plain wrong
You're right, they were mnade to kill off the old marines on the tabletop so GW could force long time players to buy a completely new army.

They're going to replace regular marines fullstop so they can line their pockets.

He didn't show even the slightest sign of doing that. Hus menaced the lords of Ultramar (not the SM) when those tried to play solo to keep their worlds and not to keep with the war effort.

On the contrary, when he met Dante, he gave him a nice pat on the back, ordered him to treat him as an equal and not a superior, dropped thousands of Primaris in his lap to replenish the chapters of the Blood, named him Warden of Imperium Nihilus, Commander of ALL THE IMPERIAL FORCES NORTH OF THE GREAT RIFT (that's a solid third of the galaxy), and told him to keep going but that he couldn't stay with him to babysit him. You could hardly make it less menacing and helpful towards a non Primaris.

We're talking fluff here, who cares?

>Hus menaced the lords of Ultramar (not the SM) when those tried to play solo to keep their worlds and not to keep with the war effort.
They did contributed to the war effort. Their only crime was not wanting to be part of Ultramar.
Actualy, the only reason Guilliman gave to rebuild the 500 worlds of Ultramar is that he wanted to make it a example to the larger Imperium, whatever it means.

About Dante, he clearly needs the support of the normal chapter masters. I mean, someone like Dante could cause a lot of trouble if he didn't submitted.

>how would Guilliman have saved the Imperium inb4 >implying without a huge force of tens if not hundreds of thousands of super-space marines wielded at legion strength?
General upgrade to the Imperial Guard?

The Space Marines are a strike force, they can't be everywhere at once and they're already competent at what they do. If we gave the IG some proper weapons and vehicles who knows what they could achieve.

No they did not. They were refusing to help and submit to his orders, which were very legitimate. To which he responded that the bushit right there were given wefe by the High Lords, and that he had better things to do than spend some time politicking with tyrants, especially since he was speakingas the direct Son of the Emperor whereas they had heir rights through the High Lords, a lower authority. It was even noted that the ones that weren't cooperating were the ones that were basically tyrants to their worlds.

And you can try to twist stuff but it's not that. Had you read the book, you'd know Guilliman asks Dante to keep fighting because he's just that damn good. Were talking about a living legend who's been fighting for 1500 years. He says so himself, Dante is that much of a goddamn hero.

Remember that the Great Crusade wasn't even that long. Dante has been fighting for the Imperium longer than the Primarchs did during the Great Crusade, even longer than some of them walked among mortals.

Right now you're trying to argue for a point where everything points towards the exact opposite, just because you don't like Primaris. It's silly.

Does anyone have the book that I can download?

>They were refusing to help and submit to his orders, which were very legitimate.
Why? Because he wanted Ultramar for no reason? Attacking and murdering innocents because they don't want to be part of his small blue sub-empire is legitimate?
>. It was even noted that the ones that weren't cooperating were the ones that were basically tyrants to their worlds.
No, Guilliman said that only a tyrant wouldn't want to become part of Ultramar. Which is stupid, they're already part of the Imperium and have been loyal.
>Right now you're trying to argue for a point where everything points towards the exact opposite, just because you don't like Primaris. It's silly.
It was a hypothesis really. But when a man, even a primarch, start breaking the Emperor's orders I can only expect the worse. It's even more suspicious when most Primaris are from his own gene-line.

Annandale writes the worst battle scenes and the weakest characters, judging from what I read of his Yarrick novels and novellas, as well as Warlord.

Aren't they the chapter with the most archeotech though? Who fixes their fancy bikes?

They don't trust them to all the secrets. No techmarine inner circle

They have techmarines. However no techmarines are allowed part of the Inner Circle.

>I am disappointed with those commanders that pay lip service to my command yet continue to put their own interests above those of greater humanity. Ultramar appears to be coming back into its original form, but it is a sham.’

He never attacked them. Now you are definitely talking out of your ass. He told them to rejoin Ultramar, a realm he built, because that's how Ultramar is strong, by being the 500 worlds.

>No, Guilliman said that only a tyrant wouldn't want to become part of Ultramar. Which is stupid, they're already part of the Imperium and have been loyal.

Where does he say that? On the contrary, the only moment he talks about tyrants is when he argues he doesn't want to be one, nor have Astartes become that

And when a Primarch comes back from the dead, you obey. And you sure as hell don't open your mouth when the main reason you don't obey is because you want to stay in power.

But when a man, even a primarch, start breaking the Emperor's orders I can only expect the worse.
Which orders?
It's even more suspicious when most Primaris are from his own gene-line.

But that's not true. We don't know exactly how many Primaris are from Guilliman geneseed. We do know that he made plenty from other than his own.

Anyone got the books that introduced the primaris and girlyman on PDF? I've been waiting for a glorious bastard to post it but I've gotten nothing.
I don't trust the MEGAs in the general for personal reasons.

I think "disillusioned" is more accurate.

>We're now in the period where we get to see the old Space Marine characters become obsolete and secondhand to the new Primaris boys
Man I wish they could just skip a few thousand years so we can just start fresh and every Space Marines is Primaris so I don't need to see the old guard slowly replaced. Right now it's just so awkward and sort of sad.

>He never attacked them. Now you are definitely talking out of your ass. He told them to rejoin Ultramar, a realm he built, because that's how Ultramar is strong, by being the 500 worlds.
He said that force should be used if they refuse to be part of Ultramar.
>Where does he say that? On the contrary, the only moment he talks about tyrants is when he argues he doesn't want to be one, nor have Astartes become that
Are you not following your own line of reason? We're talking about the "tyrants" that didn't wanted become part of Ultramar, not of what Guilliman though about himself.
>And when a Primarch comes back from the dead, you obey. And you sure as hell don't open your mouth when the main reason you don't obey is because you want to stay in power.
That's a dangerous thing. It borders religious zealotry.
Why should they became part of Ultramar? It's a irrelevant sub-empire now, mankind benefits from nothing with that.
The only reason I see for it is that Guilliman is building a base of power for obscure reasons.
>But that's not true. We don't know exactly how many Primaris are from Guilliman geneseed.
See >The gene-lines of the other primarchs are in the minority. There are enough Primaris Adeptus Astartes to replenish the Ultramarines ten times over.’ Kalael picked up a chainsword tooth and scrutinised it carefully. ‘Perhaps he does not wish to disband his power base, but moves to openly proclaim a new Legion. Ten new Chapters of his own gene-line – I wonder where they might possibly be stationed?’

This. Sad as fuck knowing that my favourite chapters are going to be replaced by the giant retards.

>I find it hard to believe that BA and space wolves would just turn around and go. Oh new Marines yea let's just stop operating the way we have since the heresy

Why? Guilliman is giving them reinforcements, and the reinforcements are trained in their own style of war.

>a superhuman politician from a bygone age that views the current state of things as deplorable and intends to change it all as fast as politically possible, including the entire posthuman military forces, whilst also fighting a galactic level war, complements and honors a notable member of the warrior-caste he's already scheduled to be replaced, and tells him exactly what he needs to hear to shore up his morale and ensure the replacement process goes smoothly.

Look up what a judas goat is.

It feels like GW is setting up another imperium civil war. Girlyman and primaris against chapters that don't want to be thunder warriored.

This. They could bring The Lion (who missed the bedt command post. Again!) back and set up schism that way.
Primaris vs Legion building

Here. The megas of the general are completely legit though.

...

ゴミ漁りのカラスには負けん

>but how would Guilliman have saved the Imperium
with superhuman strategic leadership?

"and then he deploys his supermarines and kills everyone" isn't really very interesting or impressive

Oh, what book is this? Been trying to read as much as I can on the Space Sharks

It's not out yet but will be the second in their trilogy. Robbie's already said it will include Primaris and when questioned how, that was the answer he gave.

The only reason that hasn't happened with 40k ous because the setting is already geographically huge and vague. Even then, they've started fucking with it and boiling it down to 'key' regions so that the newbies don't get confused / have to think too hard.

"SPESS MEHREENS! Todeh is an historic moment,’ said Boreale. ‘The next time the BATTLE BROTHERS of our Chapter gather so, our numbers will be swollen with new blood, waiting in SPESS. We are the last BATTLE BROTHERS of Blud Rehvens SPESS MEHREENS ever to be. From THIS DAY, the Primaris will begin to replace us until IT IS THE ENEMY WHO KNOW DEATH, AND DEFEAT.’
‘Southern Quadrant’ said the Scout. He welcomed it. Let Sindri rage.

Thanks dude. I tried downloading something from a mega on a different place and nearly lost a laptop to a virus.

>he's fucked up enough fluff
AKA using his fucking imagination and writing an actual sci-fi story, instead of another boring episode of 'dudes fight other dudes, entirely in line with GW imagery'. Just read the flavor text in the codexes if that's all you want.

Why does he need to? The whole point of 40k is that it's a bleak setting, where humanity is perpetually under threat from within and without - hence there is only war, hence its original appeal as a limitless setting where you can tell your story, invent your dudes and your dudes can fight any other dudes without really needing a fluff reason. All this narrative shit is just a way to simplify the setting, produce children's playsets and ensure GW has an easier time controlling and policing its IP. Basing any argument on the 'logic' of what was a purely business orientated artificial alteration is beyond absurd.

6e babby spotted.

> unironically citing nuGW marketing 'fluff'
> ignoring that 100 yrs in 40k isn't even a blink
> implying primaris won't start to 'fall' as soon as GW wants to boost sales.
The absolute fucking state of this hobby

I wish they'd either abandon Parimaris or replace every unit with a Primaris equivalent.

This is a retarded argument, absolute executive authority resides with the Emperor, as Imperial Regent appointed by the Emperor himself, Papa Smurf wields the same authority. Any reorganization of the sectors or segmentums is within his authority, just as the abolishment of any rights and privileges of self-governance previously given by the High Lords who rule while Emperor remained silent as stewards. There is no legal grounds to resist his authority.

>as Imperial Regent appointed by the Emperor himself
Really doubtfull.
>There is no legal grounds to resist his authority.
I can agree with it, my problem is the reasons Guilliman is doing it. There's absolutely no reason to rebuild Ultramar, unless he's less loyal than he seens

>There's absolutely no reason to rebuild Ultramar

He explains it, to make an exemplar realm for the Imperium to follow.

>unless he's less loyal than he seens

He's already the Emperor in all but name, increasing Ultramar does not increase his personal power, as he already commands all the constituent parts and much more.