/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

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Previous thread.

what kind of attainments should a technomagic/magic through the internet legacy have?

Forces and Space
Probably allow them to find sympathetic connections differently like the Data sphere or something from Ascension.

I've considered the concept greatly, and come to the conclusion that really the only viable way to tie the Legacy to the concept effectively has already been dome with the Transhuman Engineers.

If you start trying to build actual 'Magic devices' then really assuming you're not deluding yourself, then you're essentially playing with fake toys for mystic power (yantras). Which both defeats the purpose, and sounds kinda silly.

>Favorite character you ever played?

First Vampire the Masquerade campaign. I never liked Masquerade, it just doesnt resonated with me in any way or form but my usual DM was pestering me to join his campaign.

So I told him that "The only way I would play masquerade would be if I can make a caitiff and pick all the weird ass disciplines I can find like temporis, spiritus, Mytherceria, Oghram." and the DM said "Sure, you can" and as he call my bluff and that would probably my only chance to play such character I went along.

One of the best Campaigns I played.

>what kind of attainments should a technomagic/magic through the internet legacy have?

Shitposting arcanum

Storytime?

Hey, remember when three guys from here got together to play a game of Awakening 2e?

Well it's still happening, only we started over. Now we have Legacyfag STing for us so now it's four guys, all from here. Naturally that means we're using his Legacy updates. It was a fun first session, and we'll be doing more games in the future.

...

Is there anything a vampire can do that can't be replicated by the arcana?

>Storytime?

Sure the DM base his game in part of Dark Colony. The character was a Ventrue whose player is kind of an ass, he takes every offense to his PC as personal and is serial metagamer. The other was a Toreador and then it was me the "Beckhett if he had taken occultism instead of archeology.

So my character wanted to exchange his weird ass disciplines for favor to get Thaumaturge. So we went to find John Reiss the head of the local Tremere and found out that he was fighting a giant werewolf-like monster. Reiss was disemboweled and we needed bait and funny thing was that I had missed when the DM had said who Reiss was so I used him as bait and threw him into a bonfire.....the Tremere whose help I was supposed to get. Nobody saw how that went down to my PC official history was that Reiss had died in the monster attack. Eventually, we found who made the monster and gave Reiss childe the opportunity to off the "offender" and even my PC got it on with her.

Eventually, Skelton (one of the NPC from Dark colony) beat up one of the Ghouls of the Ventrue so he decided to gather us (the party) and go kill that fucker that dare beat his ghouls. After some stupidly lucky rolls (Skelton had a werewolf in his sabbat pack) we kill his pack and topor Skelton, we bring him up to the Prince saying "this guy beat some of the Ventrue´s ghouls and we stake him and kill his pack.....is he worth anything to you?" The prince almost had a mixture between an orgasm and a panic attack as it happens Skelton was the regional leader of the Sabbat.

So the official word was that it was sanctioned mission of the Camarilla and we all got a Favor from the Triad. I ask for territory, I don't remember what the Ventrue ask and the Toreador ask to be allowed to diablerie Skelton. Which he did publically and eventually he became the master of Elysium and nobody NOBODY started shit because nobody wanted to mess up with the confirmed diablerist.

Then IRL I had to move for 3 months to work oversee so we said that my character received the call of to visit Mukhtar Bey. He was friendly with the local Caitiff which were allowed to live because they serve as the muscle of the Camarilla in the city. And when I went to Cairo I left the city defenseless....oops.

In Cairo stuff happened mostly, my PC found out he was a the grand-child of Mukhtar Bey and he tried to diablerize my PC when after killing all Caitiff but I was forced to diablerize him. For my come back to the game we had an issue, my character could really show his face in the city but I couldnt pretend to be another OOC because of the serial metagamer Ventrue player.

So we come up with this idea with the DM to make a fake PC sheet which was for a Tzimice who was pretending to be a Gangrel (by that point the Ventrue dragged the Toreador to become Cuadruple agents of someone, they usually lost count who exactly they were spying against and for because the Ventrue keeps saying "c´mon Vauldiere is 1/10 chances to get a serious blood bound, how unlucky we can be? The answer was very unlucky).

Then the Ventrue player looks at my sheet that said "Tzimice" and when my PC said he was a Gangrel, his first dialogue to my character was to kick my coffee table and scream "I KNOW YOU ARE DIRTY TZIMICE!!!! ADMIT IT!!!". My character in the meantime had used his XP to get Thaumaturge, specifically the Faux path, so he used temporis 2 "Internal Recursion" to paralyze him with a dose of the faux path for him to think it was domination and to make him feel like I was using Auspex 5 to read his mind" as way for my character to justify knowing all the meta-knowledge of the game thus far without revealing he was my previous PC.

I and the DM had a whole series of code and signs of what disciplines I was using instead of the ones I said. I would roll the fake roll and he would roll the true rolls to see how it went.

The Ventrue tried to scam the Tremere from some mystical notes Reiss had that he adquired by buying his building. Notes he didn't need, couldn't read and the Tremere had paid him for by placing protections in the building. And he decided to photocopy them in the same building as his master plan.

Then befriend and seduce a local Tzimice leader who a sadistic loli. And set a meeting with the New local leader of the Tremere and Tzimice to encounter with the hopes that they both kill each other. Which didn't happen as the Tremere leader kill her off which sparked a massive Sabbat retaliation.

Then the Prince went crazy (as apparently he loved the Caitiff and wanted to create a utopia for them and me taking them all away made him go cuckoo) and the Ventrue send a hit man to kill the second in command of the Tremere who was an absent-minded goofball which we all love IC and OCC and he had been a longtime ally. All of that to weaken the local leader of the Tremere because the Ventrue player had a beef with him for finding out and taken umbrage at the Ventrue´s attempt to scam him.

Finally, the city was fractured with many important Kindred claiming the title of prince and the Sabbat was at the gates. Maybe we could have stopped them if the Toreador didn't decide to grab all the Tremere with him into a helicopter and flee the city (among those Tremere was my character waifu) so my character rushed to there and had to convince them that yes "Otari the Russian racial stereotype who started half his phrases with "in Soviet Russia" was, in fact, the Caitiff.....and how the fuck didn't you guys saw that? Seriously he was so silly he had to be a fabrication!"

By the end, my character had learned tons of thaumaturge rituals, the Faux path, Spiritus 5 (Crinos form) and kuldonic with the way of spirit and left the city to burn for a "better" tomorrow in New York (which he probably wouldnt get because he was a walking offense to the Tremere).

Is it worth it to use maps in a WoD game, why or why not?

i use a map of my city to keep track of where my characters are, its pretty cool desu but i wouldnt say its necessary unless time is an important mechanic for you

Where are you frog boi

Anyone want me to share some absurd vtm thing I thought up?

Here's my obligatory request for Half-Damned and the Changeling Fiction Anthology.

Thanks in advance.

No, not really

It's an abuse of merits, not homebrew. I'm not imaginative enough to think of the later.

Go on...

Can vampires suck blood through someone's penis?

Theoretically, but basic anatomy would tell you it's a shitty way to go about it.

Besides, the victim already feels intense pleasure from the bite.

Dang dro you bust me a madass chad

Im playing a masquerade game where Tremere diablerized Haqim instead of Saulot, and as as a result, the entire history of the sects changed:

THE SABBAT are now led by the Tremere, who are joined by the Gangrel, Nosferatu and the Ravnos who all destroyed their Antediluvians or so they think . They are commited to hunting down and destroying the antediluvians, supposedly to protect the world, but in reality so [Tremere] might gain more power.

THE CAMARILLA is composed of the Lasombra, Brujah, Malkavians, Toreador. This Camarilla is quite different from the original, with it being much more a loose confederation of clans rather than a hierarchical sect. The Brujah are the leaders of the Camarilla, because in this world, they are still a clan of warrior scholars, however, they often struggle for dominance with the Lasombra

THE ORDO DRACUL is composed of the Tzimisce, Salubri, and the Cappadocians, and together they seek to discover the secrets of the curse of Caine and eventually transcend it.

There are also two independent clans

The VENTRUE are an independent clan, who believe themselves to transcend any single sect, and instead focus on manipulating human society. Even though they exist apart from the rest of vampiredom, the power they wield over human institutions puts them on level with any other sect.

The ASSAMITES don't exist anymore save for a few survivors, who found refuge within the Brujah clan.

The followers of set don't exist cause they suck and are boring

It's a really interesting game, and it's fun to play a game where you don't know the history of everything that happened, and discover the truth as you play.
Anyone else have any interesting games where you mixed up canon?

correction, the assamites aren't independent, and they're not a clan, they're part of the camarilla

Bumping.

So white wolf claims to have published a book called Dark Ages: Brujah Chronicles. I can't seem to find the book anywhere. seems to not exist. wtf?

How many dots in what Spheres does a mage need to halt aging for at least a century?

I'm a bit rusty on my oMage but I think you could do that with Life or Time 4. Immortality in Ascension was cheep as long as you didn't flaunt it and get Paradoxed out the ass. Half the Union bigwigs were 200+
Hell there was a baseline Merit that made you immune to aging.

There's a rote in Masters of the Art that lets you do precisely that. Iirc, it required archmastery of life and high levels of Time, with some Prime thrown in, and was Paradoxical as fuck if someone realised you were older than you looked

Not quite what you were looking for, but

Serenity of the Stone (••••• Prime, ••••• Time,
•••• Entropy, ••• Life, ••• Mind)
This rote, a favorite of the Akashic Brotherhood, slows the aging process so drastically that the mage doesn’t seem to age at all. Once performed, the mystic need not recast the rote time and again

How do you deal with a Grimoire which Rotes keep on changing every time?

youtube.com/watch?time_continue=116&v=FrF5qt_LBlc

Learn Prime 1, Scribe Grimoire, and copy them every time they change, becoming a world famous Mage with an impossibly varied set of Rotes.

any other awesome and horrible ways to introduce the ritual of sacred rebirth

can my paradigm just be "im psychic lol"

Yes.

If I go into a horizon realm, turn into a cat, and come back, do I accrue any paradox?

Still requesting it.

what's wrong with his face

>pdf is a whopping three bucks
Are you serious?

I'm broke bro I can barely pay my ridiculous broadband bill.

True Fae: "Kidnapping is such an ugly, inelegant word. I prefer.."

Hiring.

Enhanced dating.

>Go on...

It is basically a build that makes it almost impossible to suffer humanity loss.

It eats a lot of points though, so it's probably not good in a combat heavy game.
You are also going to need to take flaws.

This involves the v20 ruleset, but there are probably ways to do it in earlier editions.

At character creation each virtue starts off with 1 dot, and you get 7 more to assign to each.
You want to assign 4 to conscience and 3 to self-control. So concsience 5 and self control 4.
This gives us a starting humanity of 9.
The virtue you roll for morality checks is conscience.

You start off with 15 freebie points, and can take flaws to get 7 more.
Humanity/path costs 2 freebie points per dot. We spend 2 points to increase humanity to 10.

That leaves us with 13 points.

We spend 7 points on true faith (you get 1 bonus die on virtue rolls for each dot of true faith).

That leaves us with 6 bonus points (or 5 if you have to purchase the background dot of true faith, instead of getting it for free from the merit)


We have 3 more merits we are going to get.

2 from lore of the clans:
King or Queen of Shadow (4 point merit), slowed degeneration (5 point merit)

1 merit from lore of the bloodlines:
Fatalist (3 point merit).

The first merit reduces the diifculty of conscience rolls by 2.
The second adds 2 bonus dice to consicence rolls.
The third also reduces the difficulty of conscience rules by 2.

The base difficulty of degeneration roles is 8.

Now with all that we are rolling 8 dice against difficulty 4, and only need 1 success to avoid degeneration of the humanity score.
That's like a 98+% chance of avoiding degeneration on any action.

Surprise Marriage!

suprise butsecks

Enhanced or Enchanted?
Trick question! True Fae can't tell the difference.

I still struggle to see how Forsaken tribes operate. It seems to me that they have no structure outside of packs, how do they recruit werewolves?

>Tremere
>leading Gangrel and Nosferatu
have they Gargoyles in this setting?

Why are the Tzimisce so much better than other clans?

Wtf, Followers of Seth are the best clan ever

...

Funny you mention that because one of the first mysteries we encountered were that gargoyles still existed, except in this universe they're the result of a failed ordo dracul experiment

our ST actually does have a plot for the serpents, but its never come up because we've expressed disinterest in it

Where does True Brujah and Old Clan Tzimisce fall into that? Also what about Gio.. oh wait, never mind.

>Old Clan Tzimisce
They haven't really popped up yet
>True Brujah
Because the Brujah never became the rabble that they are, relations are much more amicable, if still a little frigid.
>Giovanni
They don't exist as a bloodline, but Augustus was embraced as a Ventrue this world

How easily would it be to include Gentry, Wyrd, and Hedge into Old WoD? Would it be easier for them to replace Dreaming or function alongside?

it's pretty much the same as apocalypse except with less variety, it being: WHICH KIND OF THING DO YOU WANT TO GIVE THE BIG DOG BONE NOW THAT YOU HAVE ACCESS TO BIG DOG POWERS?

>Why are the Tzimisce so much better than other clans?

Because they made "father trusting cock" popular before Brucatto did

Skinwalker (Eshmaki)
Sometimes the monster is not lurking beneath your bed or in a fancy castle filled with stolen gold. Sometimes it is right beside you, wearing a normal facade and you would never know any better until it is too late.

Dice Pool: None for Normal Satiety and Low Satiety, Manipulation + Subterfuge - Composure for Satiety Expenditure

Normal Satiety: You can alter your form into that of anyone you have seen directly within the past [Lair] days as an instant action. You gain a bonus to Social and Perception rolls equal to your Lair for impersonating others this way. Lastly, you gain the Untouchable and Closed Book Merits, the latter with a rating equal to Lair/2 round up. These Merits are for free and ignore prerequisites.

Low Satiety: You may shapeshift into anyone you have seen within the last [Lair] weeks reflexively. You gain the Rote Quality on all Social and Perception rolls for impersonating others, and any supernatural attempt at piercing your disguise or detecting your lies provokes a Clash Of Wills.

Satiety Expenditure: Roll the aforementioned dice pool. On a Success, you gain a Perfect Impression for Social Maneuvering using your stolen identity and all of its memories, going back [10 - Current Satiety] in days. On an Exceptional Success, memories go back [10 - Current Satiety] in weeks, any Failure suffered when trying to investigate you is downgraded to a Dramatic Failure and Exceptional Successes cannot be achieved (this includes supernatural attempts if Low Satiety). These effects last for one scene, but may be extended for subsequent scenes with further Satiety Expenditure. You lose the memories even if you have Eidetic Memory/Mimir's Wisdom.

How would the covenants react if there is suddenly no masquerade?

badly.

To specify this question: Would existence of Wyrd, Gentry and Hedge alter the existing status quo and/or cosmology of WoD in significant way?
If no, then would there be any interesting plausible interactions between them and the rest of the setting?

Ofc it would. But since its your stupid fucking head canon, you work out what it'd mean you lazy fuck. Or reconsider what exactly you are trying to achieve and find another way.

1. Immediately start pointing fingers at each other and trying to present themselves as the good guy vampires that are fighting all dese bad guy vampires.

2. Almost certainly out the other supernatural creatures they know of, to take some of the heat off themselves. Werewolves, mages and changelings would be revealed to the world within days of an unsalvageable masquerade break, maybe not even that.

I feel like Gentry are perfect type of over the top magic addicted villains that Technocracy would be perfectly justified to label 'Reality Deviants' and try to exterminate.

Werewolves and mages are kinda protected against revelation.

So are Changelings, if I'm not mistaken.

Mages, yes, sort of. Quiescence makes Sleepers sleepers push instances of magic out of their minds, but it wouldn't stop people from knowing mages exist if a plausible source tells them about it. People would still sort of forget seeing magic but they could know mages exist nonetheless.

Werewolves, no. Lunacy doesn't always work and definitely wouldn't work as well if vampires admitted that werewolves also exist. The primary mechanism of lunacy as a cloak if is 1. that people are willing to rationalize things like werewolves and 2. that people are willing to write off the babbling of insane or traumatized people as part of their mental state. If werewolves become plausible, it's nowhere near as effective.

Assuming there could be a plausible source that could catch on with Quiescence, Seers, and Guardians working to keep Mages and magic a secret.

The Mask is just an illusory effect that makes fae shit seem mundane, and it tends to slip aside when certain effects are invoked. Mortals can see what changelings really look like when they use their powers, for example.

Quiescence is the only masquerade-forcing effect that's truly infallible. It kinda has to be, since the point of Mage is that everyone else is still plugged into The Matrix essentially.

I feel like the "it literally always works" side of Quiescence should mostly be ignored. It doesn't really make sense.

The entire Malleus Maleficarum, Ashwood Abbey, most of the Union, Network Zero, VALKYRIE, Knights of St. George, Long Night, etc etc etc know about mages. It doesn't make sense that these organizations without fail manage to solely recruit people with the unknown qualities necessary to be Sleepwalkers.

I always felt like that if you are a hunter, and you know that supernatural exists, you become a sleepwalker de facto

Knowing about mages and remembering obviously Supernal shit aren't mutually inclusive. You can believe in magic and Mages 100% and still get hit with Quiescence. Plus, taking any kind of Supernatural Merit or having any kind of supernatural powers makes you a Sleepwalker anyway.

But, like, why does this seem to work for every single person these conspiracies/compacts bring in? If anyone can become a hunter and hunters become Sleepwalkers automatically, then how they hell does Quiescence ever work? The way Quiescence is, the vast majority of these people should react to magic but forgetting about.

It's super unbelievable that organizations like the Malleus and the Aegis Kai Doru could exist if you take Quiescence as it is.

What do you think Quiescence is?

A side effect of most of mankind's souls being too close to the abyss that makes them unable to remember instances of awakened magic properly.

Close enough. Why does that make those groups unbelievable though?

It just seems very strange that they seem to without fail manage to recruit Sleepwalkers, since they're rammed full of people who can remember awakened magic just fine.

Having any kind of supernatural merit means you're a sleepwalker. If Hunter is letting non-Sleepwalkers get off without Quiescence, then it's ignoring Mage rules or there's another explanation for it.

The vast majority of hunters have no supernatural merits. It's less that it's ignoring Mage rules, though, and more that the new Mage was written without thought for how weird it makes Hunter.

>Here's my obligatory request for Half-Damned and the Changeling Fiction Anthology.

>+1, with a side of begging!

>new Mage was written without thought
You could probably just leave it there.

>Hunter doesn't have to accommodate Mage
>but Mage should accommodate Hunter
What do you want, exactly?

Anyone have Half-Dammed or the Pentex Indoctrination Manual.

Hunter wants to remember magic was done in front of them.
Mage wants all splat to bow down and suck their dick.

>Hunter wants to remember magic was done in front of them.
Then Hunter should have written in a reason why Hunters don't suffer Quiescence instead of glossing over it.
>Mage wants all splat to bow down and suck their dick.
How much of a baby are you?

Mage doesn't have to accommodate Hunter as a game. None of the splats have to accommodate one another. If you play Vampire or Mage or Changeling you're in no way compelled to include anything else from the World of Darkness. Mage in particular assumes that you pretty much won't.

If you're going to talk about the setting as a whole you should probably just ignore anything that makes one splat no longer make sense, though. This isn't about Hunter versus Mage, this is about keeping the setting consistent.

Quiescence was different when Hunter was written. It didn't ALWAYS 100% work.

Mage is intentionally a higher power level game than other, similar to Mummy and Demon.

It's hard to conceive a scenario where the major antagonists for Mage are demigods, anti-reality horrors, monsters from Beyond, etc., and that same splat being somehow vulnerable to largely basic humans with more bravado than good sense.

The CofD as a whole permits a wide variety and style of play among the various gamelines. Balancing the splats in any measure both ruins this and is largely a fools errand, as OPP learned with the first editions of the games.

If you want to house rule a Hunter game to weaken mages or make all hunter sleepwalkers, go right ahead, bu the former is a major deviation from the setting, and the latter will not substantively help the hunters against the Awakened, as sleepwalkers don't benefit from inducing Paradox or Dissonance. In many ways, sleepwalkers are more vulnerable to mages than regular sleeping humans.

When didn't the Sleeping Curse work in Mage 1e when Hunter was released against basic humans?

>and that same splat being somehow vulnerable to largely basic humans with more bravado than good sense

This retarded shit. It's already been explained how mages are vulnerable to hunters in a previous thread. Anyone can be ambushed and shot in the back of the head. Not every mage is a PC character that tactically covers all their bases with Time and Space.

In canon, mages get killed off by fucking Ashwood Abbey hooligans.

>magefags immediately think this is about powerwanking and balance shit

It's not, it's just internal consistency for the setting as whole.

Here's how it is: either I completely change everything in Hunter, remove more than half the options, and basically gut the game to make it consistent with Mage... or I change one relatively unimportant thing in Mage.

The logical solution is pretty obvious. I mean, shit, Quiescence doesn't even have to go, it just has to have a chance of not working.

I wouldn't really trust Hunter material to be unbiased and accurate about the power difference between Hunters and Mages. Even back in 1e, the Mage book said a lot of Mages made it a part of their morning routine to put up a day long lasting Mage Armor. Now in 2e, all you have to do is spend a Mana to reflexively raise it for a scene, or in "real" time, one hour. A lot of Mage Armors both add to Defense, then allow Defense to be applied to firearms, and ones like Death or Spirit downgrade lethal damage to bashing damage, and so on. I also remember that thing that was posted that was used to back up the Ashwood Abbey thing, where a "witch" was poisoned after being captured... somehow. A piece of vague fiction isn't all that compelling.

"Not all Mages are that paranoid" isn't a good argument either, since if a Mage is being hunted and has absolutely no fucking clue about it or even a reason to think he might have ruffled some feathers, then he probably hasn't done anything to warrant being hunted. A single Divination, "Am I going to be attacked in the coming day?" isn't wildly out of the question either if they even think someone MIGHT be after them.

CAN Hunters be dangerous to Mages? Absolutely. Everything can. But it's hardly like you're presenting it.

>, it's just internal consistency for the setting as whole.

No, it's your desire for some sort of "splat balance" which is something entirely different than internal setting consistency, as well as something that rarely exists in either related horror or urban fantasy fiction.

Lack of internal setting consistency is, however, demonstrated by certain Tactics that are supposed to work against certain splats but are entirely inconsistent with that splat's rules, such as the lobotomy Tactic against mages.

>it would completely gut Hunter to write in a reason why Hunters don't suffer Quiescence
>even though Hunters not suffering Quiescence anyway is how it is already
>instead Mage should change something that wouldn't even solve the problem since then the issue becomes 'why do Hunters NEVER suffer Quiescence out of all the times they see magic?'

the world (singular) of darkness was a mistake. each splat should have it's own seperate setting which share some basic elements and maybe hint at some vague connection but where the unique cosmology and themes of each splat can be developed independently without conflicting with another, instead of everything just being "supernal reams lmao". mechanics would still be compatible if an ST wants to crossover anyway but without assuming a kitchen sink by default.

>internal consistency
Your explanation shits on any kind of internal consistency.

>Anyone can be ambushed and shot in the back of the head.
Nope, there is plenty of ways for mages to avoid mundane ambushes altogether.

>Death, Spirit, Space
>Move through Twilight or teleport

>Fate, Time
>know about ambush before it happens

>Forces, Matter
>constant armor

>Life, Mind
>catch the intentions of killer before he stirkes

Mages have a lot of enemies: Seers, Banishers, Tremere, hostile supernatural beings. Naturally, even if they don't go full paranoia mode (many will), every mage will be on guard, all the time - because enemies out there, looking for the chance to get you. Shielding spells are the least things mages can do to prevent attacks.

That's all even before getting to the topic of retribution. Yes, single young and stupid mage can be ambushed. But she isn't alone. She is part of cabal, and her buddies will look for her. Even if she is single apostate, sooner or later local Consilium will notice that mages are disappearing and send a Lictor or Interfector to understand that is happening. After that, Hunters are screwed. Single cabal can wipe out a whole compact or conspiracy without too much trouble, and they will, because generally Mages don't give a shit about Sleepers, and Sleepers who try to harm them? Fair game.

In my Mage game, hunters exist. They can even manage to kill stupid and careless mage. But every single compact or conspiracy exist only because Guardians or Seers use them against each other as pawns and feint attackers. Otherwise they just don't have a chance.