Sperg rant about Warhammer

WH40K is supposed to be set in the far future of our universe, right? So how come there just randomly happened to be alien species many light years away who resemble our world's cultural concepts in fiction of elves and orcs? The latter even shares the same name. Is it one of those things like in zombie media that it's set in an alternate reality where the creatures in question were never a cultural phenomena? Is it a pure (unlikely) coincidence in-universe but humans just chose to apply those terms to the aliens since that's what they looked like to them? Or are you just not supposed to take the setting seriously? Nobody ever even acknowledges this lore hole, neither in canon nor real life.
>inb4 why do you care
'Cause I'm a nitpicking mega-autismo

Star Wars is set in the far past.

Warhammer came before 40k and was basically Tolkien fantasy with just enough changes to avoid copyright.

40k is in turn a futuristic adaptation of warhammer fantasy. Orcs in space, elves in space. There even used to be dwarves in space that got removed.

Of all the things in WH40k that are unrealistic this is the hill you want to die on? They resemble fantasy races on Earth because it's literally just Warhammer Fantasy... IN SPACE. If they did it another way it wouldn't be the same game.

A wizard did it.

I'm aware, I just don't get how you're supposed to take the world seriously when it doesn't care about immersion/logic. WH Fantasy is a world with only some correlations to ours as far as I'm aware, the difference is WH40K IS our universe. You can explain a lot of things vaguely with space magic and hyper technology, but that an entire civilization's existence mirroring a mythical pop culture race on Earth isn't one of them. No matter how you look at it or how much you try to suspend disbelief, it makes no sense. Unless there's some explanation for it, but there's not. Nobody ever even mentions it.

Orcs and elves ended up in Terran mythology because of ancient visitations and/or warp-sensitive humans having psychic visions. The Assyrians even worshiped Nurgle.

See, that would be a satisfactory explanation. An obviously asspulled one, but still enough to suspend disbelief. Is this actual canon though or just something you made up right now?

>fantasy worlds have orcish humanoids
>that's okay
>sci-fi worlds have orcish humanoids
>THAT'S IMMERSION BREAKING

You're a retard.

>thinking Games Workshop cares about anything other than profit from selling miniatures and rulebooks
Fluff sadly isn't worth much to producers.

>I just don't get how you're supposed to take the world seriously when it doesn't care about immersion/logic

You're not. In the same way you're not supposed to take the world of Requiem Chevalier Vampire or Judge Dredd seriously.

>I just don't get how you're supposed to take the world seriously

You are not supposed to. It is a setting where footbal hooligan aliens fight cybernetic knight templars with swords on top of a burning space ship.

Did you ever read heavy metal magazine?

I still don't like "standardized" fantasy races, but at least they don't take place in our world where they're already established in fiction. It's a paradox.

Why do the writers (and fans) care so much about portraying it as super grimdark and serious business then, even emotional at times, rather than going full over the top action-comedy?

Actual cannons.


Stop pretending to be retarded. You're too lame to pull it off properly.

Any writer who ignores fun for angst is a dipshit ruining the universe.

Are you a 90s kid? The reason i am asking is that you do not seem to be at all aware of 80s pop culture.

>Why do the writers (and fans) care so much about portraying it as super grimdark and serious business then, even emotional at times, rather than going full over the top action-comedy?

Because they're not mutually exclusive. It's not serious fiction. It's not high art. It's not always trying to be.

40k is literally fantasy tropes and races in a space opera. Orcs and elves and magic are just part of the initial assumptions you suspend your disbelief for. I mean fantasy shit in space is the whole point of the setting.

And by the way, 40k is NOT our universe any more than Star Trek is. Every speculative setting has some "what if" concept at its base that you have to accept as a given; for 40k that's fantasy races.

>Why do the writers (and fans) care so much about portraying it as super grimdark and serious business then, even emotional at times, rather than going full over the top action-comedy?
Because they are stupid? Seriously. If I try to take Hello Kitty seriously that doesn't make the source material flawed because it's "not realistic". It just means I'm stupid for reading too deeply into a canon that never intended or even tried to be deep.

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand 40k. The humor is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of theoretical philosophy most of the jokes will go over a typical player's head. There's also the settings nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into the stories - all background draws heavily from Narodnaya Volya literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of these jokes, to realize that they're not just funny- they say something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike 40k truly ARE idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in the tagline "There is only war," which itself is a cryptic reference to Turgenev's Russian epic Fathers and Sons I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Games Workshops genius unfolds itself to them. What fools... how I pity them. XD And yes by the way, I DO have a Khorne tattoo. And no, you cannot see it. It's for the ladies' eyes only- And even they have to demonstrate that they're within 5 IQ points of my own (preferably lower) beforehand.

>but at least they don't take place in our world where they're already established in fiction
If we go off the idea that only Tolkien exists in the 40k universe than the orks are nothing like his orcs so there isn't really a problem.

Aren't orks and elves the only distinctly "fantasy" elements? Most other things seem to be typical sci-fi. "Magic" is never described as such, and is explained as a combination of psychic powers and another dimension spilling over, not really your typical flashy fireballs and polymorphosis. Psykers aren't really uncommon in science fiction, far from it. Star Wars or Warframe have things closer to traditional "magic".

The pop culture concept of an orc, not just Tolkien. Green or brown, brutish, big teeth, named an "orc", etc.

>WH40K is supposed to be set in the far future of our universe, right? So how come there just randomly happened to be alien species many light years away who resemble our world's cultural concepts in fiction of elves and orcs?

Orks and Eldar were created by the Old Ones, and it's hinted humans were too, or at least uplifted to some degree by them. Furthermore Eldar existed for millennia before man evolved, so it's possible there was some level of contact.

Easily explained.

>The pop culture concept of an orc, not just Tolkien. Green or brown, brutish, big teeth, named an "orc", etc.
Depending on whether or not you attribute the green orc design to Warhammer(not saying it is but I have no clue who did it first) than without it all pop culture orcs would be purely tolkien styled.

This is top tier bait.

Hell just say the emperor did it he would have knowledge of them and could put them into human pop culture if he wanted.

It's the Rick and Morty copypasta you dweeb

>"Magic" is never described as such, and is explained as a combination of psychic powers and another dimension spilling over, not really your typical flashy fireballs and polymorphosis. Psykers aren't really uncommon in science fiction, far from it. Star Wars or Warframe have things closer to traditional "magic"

Are you fucking joking right now? Weirdos and cultists secluee themselves in towers studying arcane tomes by candlelight and then conduct dark rituals to make pacts with forces beyond our world. That is MUCH more traditional magic than DnD or Star Wars. Expand your horizons, you'll be glad you did.

Traditional magic in terms of how it is actually purported to work IRL hence that's how the cultists try to go about it. In technical terms it's just warp spill caused by psyking, the abracadabra of it is unnecessary. Orks are literally just orcs with guns, not a misinterpretation by other races.

>expand your horizons to dumb moeshit!

Smelly weeb poster.

It's a fucking game you retard.

Also, you mean we called them Orcs from our own mythology. The Old Ones never called them Orcs.

Nearly everything in 40K is from a human perspective.

>it's just a game/movie/comic/series lol xD
Like clockwork.
The rest of your post is agreeable though.

The Orks in particular adopted human culture after Humanity all but destroyed their civilization during big E's crusade against The Beast. Once upon a time, the Orks were sophisticated enough to have diplomats for other races and interact in ways that didn't involve violence, but the Imperium butt-fugged their civilization after they got cocky from successfully landing on Terra and modern Orks are cargo cults working on vague memories since few actual recordings of their history remain, to the point that humanity probably knows more about their past than they do. In other words, the Imperium of Man gave them their equivalent of the DAoT.

It's the truth though, arguing shit like 'why are all the books in English, God this is so fucking unbelievable my suspension of disbelief has been broken' is just pedantic as fuck.

>it’s not bait, it’s a stale pasta

Dude how can we take warhammer seriously if their entire universe is based off a board game from 38 thousand years in the past? DId the emperor play 40k in the 2000s and base his life off it? Woah dude

idiot

You're fucked in the head mate.
I hope you enjoy the reaction you got you stupid cunt

The funny thing is that OP pic is based off of WHFB orcs. Your argument is invalid, pop culture orcs are rooted in GW's orcs.

You do realize Tolkien also posits that LotR takes place in our universe race?

>So how come there just randomly happened to be alien species many light years away who resemble our world's cultural concepts in fiction of elves and orcs?
40K is based on Warhammer Fantasy.
>Is it one of those things like in zombie media that it's set in an alternate reality where the creatures in question were never a cultural phenomena?
Not really. GW decided to branch out their fantasy range because sci-fi is a fantasy sub-genre. Sci-fi in the 90s just got more popular through movies, series, pc games etc.
>s it a pure (unlikely) coincidence in-universe but humans just chose to apply those terms to the aliens since that's what they looked like to them?
GW's lines had names for races, they applied the same race name for the same race regardless of the setting they where in. In the first edition (much more RPG styled) Khorne warriors of both Fantasy and 40K could swing Bolters and Plasmaguns like there was no tomorrow. Khorne back then wasn't just rage-god but also war-tech god.
>Or are you just not supposed to take the setting seriously?
It's narrative for a game. So you are never supposed to thake anything too seriously. Warhammer/GW isn't trying to produce a great story, it's trying to be a great miniatures game.
>Nobody ever even acknowledges this lore hole, neither in canon nor real life.
How is it a lore hole? Just look into the past of Warhammer, don't think this game just came out of thin air with everything being seperate from the start.

Requiem Chevalier Vampire is literally hell, I've no problem with taking that place seriously.

Since 40k is supposed to be our universe then you could also say that 38 thousand years before 40k, the entirety of 40k was prophesied by a company called GW.

Tzeentch did it.

Po faced grimdark is arguably what killed 40k, but this:
>rather than going full over the top action-comedy?
is not a great idea either. It's like when Schumacher took over from Burton on Batman. If your entire premise is slightly silly or tongue in cheek, then you need to treat it with just the right amount of seriousness, otherwise you end up with nipples on your suit, a bat credit card and people walking out of your premiere.

/thread

>I just don't get how you're supposed to take the world seriously

you're not you sperglord

arcane rituals, chanting, sacrifices, all that actually does work and often is necessary especially if the sorcerers aren't active psykers, and the "another dimension spilling over" is EXACTLY the thing that magic is in WHFB. Does Warhammer fantasy not have magic either now?

The warhammer fantasy and 40k universes are confirmed to be part of the same multiverse. I think there was one piece of fluff that said the whf universe existed as a backwater planet in the 40k universe.

So your argument that fantasy isn't our universe and 40k is doesn't quite work.

There are all sorts of ways you can explain what you're asking - just choose one that you like and carry on with your life bro

You were correct in assuming your post is spergy. How exactly do you suppose would a human think of anything 'nonhuman' to base cultures off?

Everything you ever think or thought of is a product of your environment. Is it ACTUALLY possible to even fathom a nonhuman culture? Past that, a culture that isn't based off an organism/structure/mineral/ANYTHING that could be observed on earth?

Also Convergent Evolution.

Orks and Eldar are older than humanity, so it was humans who used the likeness, names and cultures of those races in their fiction.

>Nobody ever even acknowledges this lore hole, neither in canon nor real life.

No one acknowledges it because no one cares. The lore isn't supposed to be breaking new ground or some shit, the lore is supposed to sell models and more books, that's all.

>sperg rant


Gotta give you credit, at least you're self-aware enough to call things by their real names. No sarcasm.

>Is it one of those things like in zombie media that it's set in an alternate reality where the creatures in question were never a cultural phenomena?
Yes.
/thread

Except the reason they are called Eldar and Orks in the first place is an in-universe reference to them reselmbeling Elves and Orcs
They call themselves other shit with the Eldar being the Aeldari and the Orcs not having a local species name, other than just being a pile of boyz and ladz

>how you're supposed to take the world seriously
40k literally started as a joke. You're not supposed to take it seriously.

I find 40k to be more immersible than Shadowrun. And I still don't take it seriously

The lore only works when you look at small portions of the setting at a time, that's where there's immense depth. It's when you zoom out and ask big questions that it becomes stupid. I find it funny that you'd get hung up on there being orcs and space elves instead of it being set 40k years in the future yet humanity is riding around in massive cathedrals in space, fighting with swords and axes in a world that also possesses orbital bombardment, massive laser weapons and other ballistic weapons where every shot from the weapon is as powerful as a rocket launcher.

>I just don't get how you're supposed to take the world seriously

Don't.

When did I ever say to watch moeshit? I used a reaction image to convey my tone. God, the state of imageboards is depressing.

You're being autistic, stop being autistic.

You know all life in the galaxy originated from the Old Ones, so all cultural references stem from them originally. You should probably ask one of them.

...oh wait, they're all dead.

All of that can be explained by advances in armor and materials science making it so that those swords and axes are better at cutting through than piercing or concussive forces. The ships are getting into broadside range with each other because one of the main means of attack is boarding parties since, again, tech is super durable in 40k and it's easier to kill the crew than disable the ship via cannon fire. Also, orbital bombardment only works if you don't want the planet afterwords. We still send people to fight in the dirt even though we have nukes today.

He wasn't calling the linked post bait, he was calling the post he was making bait.

And you fell for it.