>How do you feel about Modern as a Pro-Tour format? Modern is my favorite format so naturally I want to see it played at the highest level, but I also understand the POV that people like Eric Froehlich have where it opens to the format up to have bans be more like they are with Standard, which worries me. I just hope that we'll get through this PT without a bunch of cards being banned and potentially fucking up my favorite decks.
Jaxon Foster
>banning and not unbannings
one can only hope that it wont happen
Nolan Jenkins
Unless something really messed up happens, I seriously doubt it.
Justin Foster
>unbanning Why would WotC in their right mind ever unban ANYTHING for a Pro Tour when the point of a Pro Tour is to promote the new cards and let the new cards shine? Unbannings run contrary to this endeavor by letting an old bogeyman a chance to shine again in the spotlight.
Alexander Foster
B&R announcement is after the Pro Tour.
John Martin
I'm looking at going in for my first modern deck. I found this solid blue control budget netdeck and it's been pretty solid on xmage against cpu opponents.
3 Cryptic Serpent 4 Curious Homunculus 4 Spreading Seas 1 Rise from the Tides 1 Engulf the Shore 3 Essence Scatter 4 Mana Leak 3 Negate 4 Telling Time 3 Vapor Snag 4 Serum Visions 3 Think Twice 2 Ghost Quarter 2 Tectonic Edge 19 Island
Any suggestions? I had a thought to replace the Cryptic Serpents with something that might have islandwalk, or perhaps include something to give my creatures islandwalk. I could use Spreading Seas to turn one of my opponent's lands into an island, pump up my Homonculi and hit unblocked.
Thoughts?
Jackson Gray
It could be worth it just to play the format, but this list probably isn't going to do well. Control has a hard time in Modern in general, and mono-blue in particular just doesn't have the tools to handle what the format is going to throw at it.
Hudson Bennett
Well it's my first modern deck, it's only about $40, and it's only going to be for FNM and casual play. I'm not exactly expecting to go to a tournament with it.
Gabriel Diaz
>How do you feel about Modern as a Pro-Tour format i feel like efro should be put into the trash where he belongs
>playing savannah lions tribal >hating fat, weepy magic """""pros""""" >brewing this coffee my dude
Xavier Davis
>savannah lions tribal Does Skymarcher Aspirant make the cut?
Brayden Howard
sadly no. kytheon and dryad militant do though.
Sebastian Martinez
Yo who was the nigga with the modern MUD list. I need that shit in my life.
Anthony Turner
This?
Benjamin Robinson
I want to play Bluestaff!
Austin Watson
Mark my words, after the modern pro tour has happened, everyone will wish it hadn't.
Either: >pros find the best deck (probably GDS desu) and top 8 will be 50% that deck >bans follow and make modern worse
OR >top 8 miraculously ends up quite diverse >but one must win so all idiots jump on the bandwagon >that deck becomes overly representative >ends up with a ban regardless of how good it actually is
Modern basically thrives on everyone holding onto their pet deck, it's what makes the format so diverse. Once the big boys tell everyone what's ACTUALLY playable we will enter a new twin-like era eventually ending in a ban.
Cooper Wright
Can someone explain what midrange and tempo decks are? Aggro and control are pretty self-explanatory but I don't understand these two
It seems like midrange is sort of a compromise between the extremes (aggro and control) whereas tempo is closer to aggro in that it dictates the pace of the game...am I on the right track?
Dominic Wright
Tempo is aggro with control elements. Midrange is proactive control that tries to stop your opponents plan then put down a fast clock
Jayden Hall
Tempo is about using your resources more efficiently than the opponent. You win because your opponent's gameplan gets disrupted and they fall too far behind to catch up
Midrange is about having more individually powerful cards than your opponent. You win because at the end of a lot of 1 for 1 trades, your opponent's cards are worse than yours.
Juan Wilson
Midrange and Tempo sit in between Aggro and Control, but are on opposite sides.
Tempo decks want an efficient threat on turn 1/2 (Delver of Secrets, Nimble Mongoose, etc.) And protects that threat through cheap counterspells and cheap removal. Tempo also favors card advantage to keep the tools in hand to win the game. The deck wants to control the midgame while getting damage in early and often.
Midrange wants to control the early game with cheap removal and slam a threat in the midgame (Tarmogoyf, Tasigur, Huntmaster of the Falls, etc.). It favors 1-for-1 cards like targeted discard spells and Terminates. It can also play a long attrition game: slowly whittling away at your resources and playing a great topdeck game (because every card of theirs is going to answer one of yours in some way).
Theu each can switchup between Aggro and Control. Both of them have to know the metagame well enough to know where they have to be on the Aggro-Control axis in a given matchup. For example, Midrange pilots will lose if they choose to play a control game when they should be the aggressor and vice versa.
Ryan Richardson
>4 of inventor's fair
Kevin Cox
Who's excited for tron to finally get banned?
Connor Brown
it won't though. it's not even close to banworthy.
Wyatt Price
What would be the decks that sit at Agro/Combo and Combo/Control?
>Agro/Combo infect; affinity; any deck with become immense and temur battle rage
>Combo/Control kiki flash
Nolan Ross
Any ideas on the sideboard. How to get ride of Stony silence and layline of the void?
Zachary Ramirez
I was just wondering if there was a catchall name like Midrange or Tempo.
Jose Rogers
Adopt the same strategy as affinity?
Throw down an aether grid and hope for the best.
Jack Bailey
>How do you feel about Modern as a Pro-Tour format? I'm glad to see my favorite competitive format played at such a high level. I have 0 interest in watching Standard/Draft/Sealed. I've been away from Modern for like 6 months or so now but a few of my friends are building Modern decks and the Pro-Tour right around the corner has peaked my interest. Is there anything new and exciting I outta worry about? I'm on G/B Tron if that makes a difference.
Eli Adams
HOT TAKE IMCOMING: AMULET TITAN WILL TOP 8 AT THE PRO TOUR
Joseph Lewis
modern more like gaydern
Samuel Sanders
Just had a turn 2 win in modern, why aren't you playing zombie hunt?
Mason Morris
I've actually considered some sort of treasure hunt variant for the kitchen table because I'm starting to get sick of always beating my friends with UB Delver. Any more sick land tech I should use?
Wyatt Lewis
Why play a janky mess like that when I can also get turn 2 wins with affinity.
Camden Cooper
Obviously whatever dual lands, creature lands sometimes help, Bosejiu is great to counter all those fucking counterspells, Mikokoro, Center of the Sea as a single is alright too, Bokuja bog too
Samuel Nelson
Combo generally tries to be as fast as possible ("""aggro""") or control until it can combo off, so it's pointless to classify combo on the aggro/tempo/midrange/control spectrum.
Bentley Walker
BAN INFECT
Ayden Peterson
Are there many decks that simply defy the classic Aggro/Control/Combo triangle? Burn, for example, sits pretty close to the middle of the triangle. Are there any others?
Joseph Taylor
Burn is like the most aggro deck in existence wtf
Nolan Brown
Combo is like trying to win a game of solitaire before your opponent can interrupt.
Control/combo is the same as combo except you actually acknowledge that your opponent exists.
Aggro/combo is a glass cannon build that is more about synergy than any specific instant-win combo.
Henry Kelly
Said like someone whos never played Burn. It can play Aggro with creature heavy hands, Combo with spell heavy hands, and can control creatures on the field with Bolt/Rift Bolt/Searing Blaze/Lavamancer plus sideboard removal if needed.
Hunter Edwards
Burn is an aggro deck that only plays control against faster aggro decks. Burn is not a combo deck.
Caleb Price
>faster aggro decks I thought the point of burn was to be the fastest aggro deck
Benjamin Gomez
decks like affinity or infect can out run it, in those match ups its better for burn to take a control role.
Brayden Sanchez
>Burn is an aggro deck that only plays control against faster aggro decks Yes, you just reiterated what I said. Burn plays Aggro or Control depending on the specific matchup. Similar to Midrange or Tempo decks
>Burn is not a combo deck. I think that's debatable. Not a traditional 2 card combo deck, sure, but it certainly plays similar to a goldfishing combo deck when you have 7 one mana->3 damage spells and the other player can't interact with that.
Not exactly. Lots of decks can play an aggro game faster than Burn, but Burn is resilient and consistent. Some matchups are "count to 18 as quickly as possible", but others are not. It polices the format because of the consistency, not it's sheer speed.
Brody Martinez
>bolt your face 7 times in a row is a """combo""" The absolute state of this general.
Oliver Murphy
Just because burn takes the control role when deciding who is the beatdown in an aggro match does not make it a control deck.
Jonathan Phillips
>t1 >play sacred foundry >play goblin guide >opponent scoops "I HATE COMBO" god I love burn
Kayden Young
Tron can't really be classified as any of those either
Aaron James
Tron should be banned.
Jackson Diaz
Why ban tron when it folds to the premiere combo deck in the format, burn?
Ryan Gonzalez
>t1 on the draw >Opponent goes fetch->overgrown tomb, Thoughtsieze >Reveal hand >2 lands, 2 swiftspear, 3 Bolts >Op start a shaking >"I....I-I can't win against C-C-Control" Burn truly is the best deck.
Dylan Sanders
Why?
Ryder Clark
Tron is combo/prison, though nobody seems to want to admit it's combo, and most modern players have trouble thinking of prison as being anything other than >lol bloodmoon. But it is. Tron locks people out of the game with effects that once resolved stop anything the opponent does from mattering, rather than outright winning once it's combo is assembled, and that's prison.
The reason that people get so butt hurt about it is because, like bloodmoon, there's barely any interaction that's useful, because landhate and counters aren't allowed to be useful in modern.
Tyler Peterson
>landhate and counters aren't allowed to be useful in modern. >repeatedly mentions bloodmoon ayy
Aiden Kelly
>Implying any deck can just jam bloodmoon in their sideboard to deal with problematic lands
Wow so handy and ubiquitous
Carter King
Hint: The inability of decks in Modern to have answers for everything is what makes the format good.
Josiah Parker
Blood Moon doesn't really work against Tron, but aside from that it is fine land hate
Benjamin Bennett
It doesn't work on its own. Just windmill slamming down Blood Moon won't stop them. Combine it with pressure to close out the game and it works fine.
Connor Adams
Tron isn't really prison, It's more of a combo/Midrange deck that seeks to have efficient trades. Karn/Ugin/Ulamogg are the ultimate X for 1s. E-Tron can be considered prison, if only for chalice.
>burn >combo >control Typical 14 year old burn player Burn is all about direct conversion of cards to damage. Each card in a burn player's hand represents about 2.5 damage. That's the gameplan.
With each combination, there's usually one side "enabling" the other one. So you have to split it up into that.
Control/Combo is usually Control enabling the Combo side. Think UR Kiki, a control deck that seeks to stall the opponent for long enough to assemble their "I Win" combo. On the other hand, a Combo Enabling Control would be something like Lantern, where a rapidly assembled combo of Lantern, Shredder, and Bridge allows the player to safely enact a control plan.
Aggro/Combo is usually Combo enabling Aggro. A powerful synergy of cards that let you kill really fast. Think Affinity. I can't imagine some sort of Aggro Enabling Combo. It would have to be a deck that somehow requires a lot of small creatures attacking or your opponent being at a low health to win the game. Maybe some sort of Bonfire of the Damned deck, or Infect?
Levi Taylor
Ponza is fine against tron for that reason, as is UW control. You don't necessarily need to drop an aggressive threat super early, but you do need to enact some sort of gameplan while disrupting their mana base.
Owen Peterson
>I can't imagine some sort of Aggro Enabling Combo
Death's Shadow decks, though its a bit twisted as you aggro yourself to enable your combo.
Zachary Hughes
Modern's too much of a matchup lottery shitshow for there to be a best deck other than in a singular tournament. Thought Scour and Serum Visions are not Brainstorm and Ponder, so you don't even get that "muh consistency" that Legacy has when compared to something like playing a 52 card deck with Tron and having access to Ancient Stirrings and turn 3 Karns over 50% of the time or playing Burn where everything is just deal 3.
Joshua Gutierrez
Kiki/twin was/is a tempo deck.
Lantern is a control deck, nothing special about it.
Affinity is just an aggro deck.
You're making this way more complicated then it has to be.
Colton Evans
Tron is tapout (board) control, basically monoB standard decks but on steroids, the fact that you trade interacting on 1-3 for better lategame doesn't change that.
Jose Miller
Best decks (Tier 0) can definitely appear in Modern, they just get banned, because Modern is intended to not have one.
Joshua Davis
Besides Eldrazi Winter, only tier S deck so far was Pod and arguably maybe GGT Dredge with Cathartic Reunion. Eggs was banned for tournament logistics, Amulet Bloom and Shoal Infect for speed despite not having an excessive metashare or being too consistent for the format to handle, and Twin to sell Oath packs. We're nowhere near those atm.
Asher Jones
Delver during treasure cruise.
Benjamin Powell
>We're nowhere near those atm. I agree, though I'd say Twin is arguable as well.
Becoming Tier 0 isn't the only reason a deck can get a banning, it's just one of them.
Jason Robinson
Not even close, even though the power level was high.
Leo Morgan
i swapped a map for a ballista recently, the deck's fine without walking burrito but the more funofs the better imho The sideboard doesn't really exist yet in truth (aside from extra welding jars being the dopest), but Stony is a nasty thing which can probably only be solved through wild transformative sideboarding, or Grid like suggested. Who knows man, it'll be a tough nut to crack. Warping Wail/Spatial/Surgical seem like they could be of use in the sb too, idk. for now the muddy mainboard is all i could muster
Brayden Thomas
Is it a good idea to have a fair "backup" deck if your primary deck is easily hated out, or is it better to just stick it out and get more reps in?
Isaac Murphy
>sideboard options the only solutuon i can think of is to add in lands for artifact and enchant removal, or at least a profetic prisim
Luis Rodriguez
>playan Grixis shadow, deck is hard man. Was playing ad naus before this and I could usually go 3-1 or better at modern night, now I haven't done better than 2-2. Lots of decisions and sideboarding is tough. Been playing young pyros in the board, and they have been great. >hating The humans player at my shop has sb mirran crusaders so that sucks >brewing Blue moon but you splash green for goyf and huntmaster. Not sure why you would want then but I saw boohoogland playing a deck like this a long time ago and huntmaster is sweet so I wanna try it.
Alexander Gutierrez
>huntmaster >werewolf explicitly doesn't transform when the Moon comes online fucken dropped holy shit
I'm running Bolt instead of Fatal Push in the mainboard now though if that counts as brewing. Half the time I end up Bolting myself but that's more than Fatal Push would've done.
Chase Lewis
Is UR Kiki Moon worth building over the Madcap or Breach variant? I like tempo, Kiki, and snappy, but don't want to waste money on something unplayable
Jonathan Roberts
How the fuck should we know? My local weekly Modern event was won by Martyr Proc in a field full of tier 1 decks so just build and play whatever man.
Joseph Butler
This is for mtgo, so local meta is less important. I think I'll go for it
Luke Sullivan
GRIXIS EVERYTHING PILE >As Foretold >Living End >Kiki Exarch IT ONLY DOES EVERYTHING
Brody Martin
Sign me up. List? This sounds hilarious
Matthew Jones
Anyone bummed that Blooicide aka KilnFiend.dec fell off after everyone was [[[netdecking]]] at the Team Unified Modern? What a meta, too. >become immense with infect >battlerage with kilnfiend >become immense+battlerage with 5c Death's Zoo
Hunter Lee
Silly things happen in Team Unified.
Thomas Sullivan
right? And Affinity/Lantern too (your choice of Opal deck) I think the Efro article can be summed up by looking at the past ban-event due to the Pro Modern Tourney, the Team Unified that killed Probe (rip in peace jeskass bros, you didn't deserve this). It's already happened, and it will happen again. Were there a Team Unified with all pros, the meta would be a imo a continuation of Worlds; Shadow (grixis instead of zoo), Infect (still good not ded, Blossoming is a dope new card and shaper's is also really strong tech), and Opal deck (Lantern everywhere!!!). Infect isn't a given, could be Burn or Storm (or Valakut even), anything sortof in the same vein archtypically, aka far right (aggro unfair). Basically far right deck, Opal deck, Shadow deck.
Caleb Powell
oh fuck and how could I forget Eldrazi deck (either Bant, using Nobles in place of infect, or the best Eldrazi Temple deck in the game, ETron)
>day 1 is always drafting i just cant get into drafting.
Easton Moore
Then don't. Just wait for the constructed rounds.
Noah Moore
You're missing what I meant when I said tron is prison. Tron isn't winning because it has favourable trades, it wins because it stops your opponent from playing that matters. There's next to nothing you can play that stops you from being locked out once a Karn, a ugin, or ulamog resolves, and THAT is what makes it prison , not the fact that it then make favourable trades.
Ugin locks the board from playing any more creatures when he comes down. If you don't have around 5 power to spare just to get rid of Karn, he eats whatever you most don't want to lose. The vast majority of decks CANNOT get out of two resolved lock pieces from tron.
Cameron Reyes
Modern in the most boring format.
Elijah Cooper
Bought 9 packs for €90.
No Lili or Snappy ;_; Wonder if the box was mapped.
Grayson Gray
Pretty weak troll.
Andrew Martin
I'm going to do a Sealed night with a box of the last 24 sets. I wish I could quit crack.
Angel Allen
>with a box of the last 24 sets You're gonna open 24 boxes in one night?
Lincoln Rivera
I translated that as meaning he bought one pack from each of the last 24 sets.
Aaron Flores
I've got €1800 in the bank, I guess I'll buy a couple of boxes of MM25 and Dominaria if they're not shit, and a couple of Unstable. If MM25 is shit I'mma buy another MM17 box.
Oh, yeah.
Logan Fisher
EFro pls go and stay go.
Liam Clark
There are several creatures like this one in ixalan block that produce treasure tokens when made in exchange for higher cmc. Are they any good? Do you think you could use them to store up Mana for blowout turns?
Anthony Campbell
No, it's too slow, and a shell that could work with something slow has better options.