/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

>Obligatory: Jizz in them
>My Tremere had a gf 22 years ago, who was adamantly against being ghouled and considered them to be pathetic creatures, so he was all, "Surprise! potence 1!"
>I'm pretty sure it has to be blood, you creep.

Blood replaces most (or all) of a vampires bodily fluids. Including semen.

Thanks for the comments in the last thread.

Here are a pair of NPCs from my Geist game.

Michael Merrit runs a funeral parlor that doubles as a training camp for freshly minted Sin Eaters. He spends most of his time exploring the underworld. His Geist takes the form of a storm cloud that forms itself into human faces. (Yes, inspired by the example from the book)

Mr. Whitaker is a friendly southern gentleman who has transplanted himself to New York. He doesn't have a crew anymore, but teaches new sin eaters at Merritt's school. He's also one of the main 5 Sin Eaters who, while they don't run New York, are the ones who everyone looks up to. His Geist is a woman made of lightning who crawls all over his body.

Let me know if you want to hear more about any of my NPCs or the other fluff I've built for the game. I don't have any more art though.

How do you handle the underworld in your games?

Comparing Time 2's Acceleration v Celerity side by side.

If you ignore the blood costs then celerity gets +celerity to defense over acceleration. Making it marginally better but more costly. (obviously mages have mage armor to give bonuses to defense but this is pure accel vs celerity comparison)

Where acceleration comes out better is its cost (1 or 2 mana/duration instead of 1-3 blood/turn) and that it can have a higher than 5 potency.

Apart from that they are equal, in fact since acceleration requires the mage to delay its action, if a vampire wins the "who goes first" clash then the mage cant actually interrupt the vampire since he has not yet delayed his action.

Hopefully we can put to rest "Acceleration is betta" statements now. Its cheaper, probably lasts longer and can have a higher multiplier via potency but is worse if you arnt going first and it doesnt add to defense.

Ah yes, all vampires are wandering around with blood covered eyes.

Just here to send all the WoD circle-jerkers into hysterics by saying Princess is the best splat.

Probably worth a look, but Geist 2e has been described as the most heavily changed/updated game going from a 1st to 2nd edition book.

Geists completely lack any sort of mechanical presence in 1e, but have a presence in 2e.

Powers in 1e use a mix&match grid system which has been replaced completely in 2e.

There's some more stuff here and there, but the most to get out of reading 1e would probably be just to get a grasp of the ideas. Geist has always had interesting fluff but it came out in a bad time of White Wolf's history and suffered for it. The game came out released as a mechanical and often contradicting mess with no direction or end game which only ended up getting a bandaid update in a 1.1 patch. Instead of getting the 5 book minimum that the non-big 3 gamelines were to be outlined with, it got a psuedo supplement in the a Blue Book called Book of the Dead that just generally covered the Underworld and introduced an unlikely to get or use single new ability and key for Sin-Eaters.

Basically Geist used to be the unloved red headed stepchild of Chronicles of Darkness with a really neat concept until Beast came along and usurped its spot on the throne. The Devs have been working on 2e for years in secret and seem to genuinely want to fix everything wrong with 1e and addressing everyone's complaints with the gameline and much like the theme of the game itself, give it the second chance to do things right.

I don't have the main Underworld book, so I don't really know what it says. I've changed some things to make it I believe more interesting.

Each Avernian Gate takes you to the Autochthonous Depths, but a different region of it, that's inspired by the tropes and emotions of the area in the real world. So, going into the underworld from a gateway in a factory that burned down takes you to a landscape of smelting machines and molten metal pouring down rivers. Distance makes no sense in this place, and while the factory could have been quite small, it takes up several square miles.

Ghosts pulled into the upper reaches go to the one typically nearest where they died, but can sometimes be pulled into one that just is nearby and matches their personality (eg, a lifetime coal miner might get pulled into that endless furnace).

You can cross rivers in this place and go to other regions, which may take you miles away, or just next door. These rivers are just like the ones separating the Lower Mysteries in the book, but I count them as all being on the same "plane" and so you can traverse any number with a single point of Psyche. I also give each area one law.

Instead, the Lower Mysteries require you to take yet another Avernian Gate going down, this time requiring more Psyche. Each level is laid out like the first, (a specific themed area) but more weird. Distance continues to lose meaning, you get more laws. Continue to repeat as you go down.

My players have only gone down the the second level so far. There, they found a land of knee deep water, and a massive graveyard of ships of all kinds, from old time wooden galleons, to small fishing boats, to a full oil tanker. Aboard one ship was a Kerberoi who would allow you to use any ship to travel to where it wrecked instantly, but the two laws were: 1. You must sink a boat (any kind) within 24 hours of returning to the surface. and 2. Every time you come back, you must sink a ship larger than the last one.

The difference being that Geist for all it's flaws was a good game. Beast is cold diarrhea in a dixie cup.

Other notes:

Geography is a pain, since new regions open up semi-frequently, rerouting rivers and springing up in the space between two existing realms. You may try leaving the factory one day, thinking you know where you're going, and wind up in a massive lecture hall where a kerberoi shaped like a librarian with spider legs and no mouth enforces absolute silence, because a school shooting happened in the city.

Ghosts are mostly stuck in endless patterns by the time they end up in the underworld, but can be brought back to temporary sanity. Ghosts who are still well remembered and have a purpose can hang on longer before falling deeper, themselves becoming less and less human-like.

DESU like, two years ago I was thinking about submitting my name to be a writer for Onyx, and submitting Geist as my preference, but then I thought "Nah, Geist sold like shit. They'll never write another Geist book, there's no point"

Right on. I always thought Geist looked cool, but my ST refuses to run it, so I never looked too deep into it.

My favorite was actually changeling, so I know what it’s like to not be one of the big 3 lol

So does changeling still have the twisted fairy-tale thing in 2e? Or did Rose decide to go balls deep with the abuse survivor schtick?

Beast suffered for weirder and more confusing reasons than Geist. The team that wrote on it not communicating with each other and the lead developer on the book not giving an outline, commenting or suggesting changes to the writers, leading to entire sections of the book feeling completely different from each other and completely contradictory due to neglect caused by incompetency and dropping the ball. It all ends up feeling like personal agendas shoved into a hodgepodge of a book that supports none of its themes.

Admittedly the concept of Beast itself is neat, the idea of playing the stuff of nightmares and legends would be great to fill in the gaps by the previous 9 gamelines, but that initial thought is as far as it goes.

DESU what Beast should have been is playing the stuff of nightmares and embracing it. The whole game should be about leaving your legacy as a monster and your power growing and rising by becoming an urban legend. The more people believe your monster is real, the easier and longer your can bring your Beast/Horror out of its lair and into the real world. Have it so you can actually become your Horror in the real world but have it be temporary and dictated by your Lair stat, the higher it is, the more you can do and longer you can be out with it.

This in turn would give you an agenda to build your name to get power, fueled by belief and fear. This of course comes with the necessary downside of causing people to hunt you in varying levels. You get your mythbusters/scooby doo gang/ghost hunters to see if you are real at lower levels to those driven by revenge or purpose to strike you down for previous terrible things you may have done. Your influence should dictate your opposing force. The goal of course to become a culture icon monster as end game, essentially being able to be your horror whenever (but of course that's just asking for trouble if you run around like a dumb asshole in public).

I considered myself too, I'm pretty interested to see where this book goes, especially with supplement books being promised for it already. A lot of untapped potential.

I'm like on the opposite end of the spectrum. Had a DM that refused to run Changeling, but I've always been interested in trying it. I've got ideas for DMing it once second edition arrives for it.

I haven’t been able to look at 2e yet because my gf didn’t have a job until recently, so I’ve been paying 2 peoples worth of bills, but from what I’ve seen it looks really good.

>what is the pastebin for?

How is it that a single posts contains more good ideas than an entire book written by professionals?

I want to look at 2e super bad. They added a ton of aeemings and removed that seemin and Keith were locked.

It’s an amazing self-contained game. The themes and setting are great, contracts are powerful yet fun. Using the catch to predominately activate powers for free is a great way to help keep characters intriguing.

Plus I feel it’s the most free character creation splat of all. You can literally have any kind of character you want since it’s all based on fairy tales. Pirate? Sure. Knight? No problem.

except all changelings are rape victim faggots.

>professionals
Ha! Good one

I had a similar idea. My additional gimmick was that you and the Hero who was meant to slay you were stuck in a perpetual loop of reincarnation.

It was to emphasize the parable aspect of beast, as your story got told over and over again by new generations of humanity you and your lair would shift and twist subtlety in the Temenos but you would 'survive'.

Arbitrary shill post for Trinity.
Still kinda surprised how it's coming in at like half of scion. Always thought it was the more popular of the two.

Yeah there's definitely quite a lot of room to work with for Changelings. A blog post even went towards playable Goblins and Goblin Kings/Queens.

I do primarily want to run a Fae-Touched game which would potentially turn into a Changeling game since it could be a fun case of down the rabbit hole.

I mean hell if they paid me I'd write a Beast 2e and slap a badge on myself labelled professional.

I think that's a pretty good idea, an "Arch-Enemy" that is a step above standard Heroes. They should be stuck together in a cycle of endless reincarnation. I mean shit I can totally see people trying to pull off Ganondorf/Ganon & Link with that angle and it would be way better than what we've got currently going on.

Get rid of the Hero and Beast's Black & White representations and one can literally slap on a mechanic called "Destiny" that's an outside force that pushes them to collide, even of both of them don't want to. You can even make it a plot of how to break the cycle and overcome destiny.

Also get rid of Beast's aura of friendliness to other supernaturals. Let them consider Supernaturals "family" or a familiar feeling to them but mostly keep it surface level, with the ability to buff and enhance other splats that you've establish a meaningful bond with.

You can use it as a morality system or as a win condition.

You could indulge in being the Monster and speed up the birth of the 'Hero' who would slay you. Or you could string yourself along trying to get as much out of this life as you can before the inevitable.

For a 'win' condition. Maybe you could figure out someway to so radically change the narrative that your cycle is broken and you could be free. Maybe the princess you 'kidnapped' actually loves you and the knight slay her instead.

IDK, just spitballing.

I wanted to say one other thing Tito-guy, before I go to bed.

I actually based one of the NPC krewes in my game off of your characters. I'm not sorry.

I thought you might be amused.

Hunter best splat but the slowest updating. What I would give for the new book to be fucking out.

A fae-touched game would be super neat-o

And holy shit, that’s a million times better than the stupid ass shit beast has right now. Someone really should do a good un-official fan update to beast to make it a fun playable game.

>Hunter
>Deviant
>Geist
What else am I missing?

It's a shame since the Astral is an under explored space within the setting. I had hoped with beast there would be a splat that could claim it as their 'home' turf.

I know what you mean. I think beast will forever be their biggest disappointment.

Gimmie some scenarios, nerd.

Whats the dumbest NPC/NPCs you've ever put into a chronicle?

Mine is definitely adding Ugandan Knuckles to mine as joke Spirits.

A'ight I made a pdf for my homebrew/house rules for imbued items, artifacts, and potions.

I'll translate it into english tomorrow after class.

Spirits and Goetia of memes would be a thing though. Be careful with this knowledge user.

>Ah yes, all vampires are wandering around with blood covered eyes.
I guess it doesn't include eye fluid, but semen is definitely replaced with blood.

Nah, it does.

It's just vampire eyes are waxy and corpse-like, unless they spend vitae to simulate tears.

then put it in the bin.

>Arbitrary shill post for Trinity.
>Still kinda surprised how it's coming in at like half of scion. Always thought it was the more popular of the two.

Don't be discouraged, user.

Keep in mind that Scion didn't receive much attention in the /wodg/ thread either. Neither Trinity or Scion is a WOD/CofD book, but Scion is at last fantasy/myth-related, while Aeon is pure sci-fi. Neither had the decades worth of fan base as the main WW products.

Trinity/Aeon will get more attention after it's main release, but will only warrant significant and continued discussion if it is very well received (something that really didn't happen in the late 1990's). The release of the new editions of Aberrant and Adventure will certainly help. Further, since the Trinity IP is wholly-owned by OPP, hopefully Rich will do a better job at marketing, support and production scheduling than CofD.

Ad Astra.

I like Changeling the Dreaming, but that's mainly due to the campaign I played with some friends where we were basically Wolf Among Us. Playing as shit like Father Time's son, a hard-boiled redcap with a noble streak that helped him remain in Seelie court, and a former Valkyrie turned barmaid was fucking cash.

>Fae-Touched

>OK Timmy, I want you to show my on this doll just where than mean fae touched you...

>"Ah Superintendent Exarch, I hope you're prepared for an unforgettable Paradox"

I like changeling the dreaming

I never thought I’d see anyone say that. As I recall it was a massive bomb.

I need to look into trinity and scion joth

If I was in the Free-Council I sure as hell would set up multiple Mystery Cults to spam dank memes at the Seers and the Exarchs.

>As I recall it was a massive bomb
Yes, and probably for good reason. But it was still enjoyable in my group at least.

There are only 12 kith now, and locking seemings to kiths was suggested to just be ignored in Winter Masques and adapt the kiths accordingly for the new seeming.

>There are only 12 kith now

Yeah, it kinda sucks. However, it should be quickly fixed as one of the first supplements and Kickstarter rewards is an entre books of Kith and related material.

>Double Bonus: David Hill will not be writing it.

David Hill's kiths were way cooler, even if he was a dirty commie hes still better than rose.

Also that book will probably take 6 million years to come out.

>Also that book will probably take 6 million years to come out.

The kith book will probably be out shortly after the Changeling Companion. Kickstarter rewards generally see release faster than other products, and the kith material is a lot of cutting-room floor type material.

>TFW we can only dream of what would have been released if Mage had a Kickstater...

Hey man, if you have fun then that’s what counts.

hello my fellow poorfags, i notice you not have Dark Ages Darkering Sky in pasterbin...

fear no more here is
link-4share.com/download/GuRjMAmuce/dark_ages_darkening_sky_pdf.html
please put in the pasterbin, i not know how doit

What is this book? I've not heard of it.

>Someone really should do
Implying anyone here or over at OPP ever reads or uses good quality fan made material, instead: muh princess, muh genius

So is it necrophilia if a human has sex with a vampire?

yes

And fornication with woofs is also definitely bestiality.

Sex with Demons is basically the same as fucking a fleshlight/pocket vag/pocket ass

Are we talking DtF or DtD?

Descent obviously

Do you include Bygones in your games?

The wait for Deviant is literally killing me.

Toreadors are the worst clan. A bunch of superficial faggots with no redeeming qualities. These losers even lose the ability to create the art they love so much upon the embrace.

>This is what the brainwashed Tremere neonate believes.
Your sect only exist to unwittingly serve as pawns of the ancients. Saulot has already beat your founder into submission.

You are right, destroying a wraith's fetter, even a temporary one, sends them into a Harrowing.

Wraiths don't really affect the skinlands that easily; if a wraith wants to go on a killing spree Outrage won't cut it, they will want to use Puppetry or Embody, and serious Puppetry is always a major investment in the host.

However, this temp fetter creation stuff is really interesting, both for pro wraith stuff and anti wraith stuff. For example, if a necromancer hates or fears a wraith, or otherwise knows of them and wants it gone, he can simply make one fetter a day and break it until that wraith is Grade A Kaputz.

Harrowings are unlikely to stop wraiths for long, but yeah, with this a necromancer can inflict an infinite number of Harrowings on a wraith which WILL eventually destroy it. Like necromancer Correspondence cheese. Good catch.

Celerity's fuckin great in nwod. In owod its an I win combat power at high levels, but in nwod you go cel 1 + auspex 1 = dodge bullets, making it so vampires, which are already insanely durable, are effectively indestructible in combat.

Short ranged teleports, inits boosting and action interruptions. Is nice. However I don't see it as worthwhile to focus on it like in owod.

Praestitantia (sp) is the discipline you want in cofd for the feel of owod Celerity however. Only lets you get multiple attacks if one fails (or rather, you abort failed attack actions and can do something else) but its like Dexterity Potence.

The hatred aimed at Beast is mostly due to BHM's dickishness which was largely removed from the finished product.

Well yeah, Inheritance. You describe one possible win condition for a Beast.

My favorite win condition is by far the Retreat however.

>Also get rid of Beast's aura of friendliness to other supernaturals.

That's one of the best parts. All it means is they can TRY to use social maneuvering, and by default have average (human+) or good (monster) impressions. Nothing wrong with it at all.

What is really nice is they get their +Satiety to social rolls with "mindless predator"/feral type creatures, presumably like zombies, draugrs, etc., so beasts can have VERY unexpected friends. Them being able to peacefully interact with things that are normally KOS opens up a whole new area.

Hunter's pretty fucked up in a lot of ways, including making tons of books on crossover... with wildly unclear crossover mechanics, and unlike ohunter have no method of stopping them from being almost immediately enslaved by what they fight. Which isn't a bad thing.

Totally different fetishes. An owod werewolf is far more likely to be a bestiality enthusiast than to mate with one and either kind of vampire is more likely to be a necrophile than to mate with one (hypnosis/sleepysex is an adjacent fetish to necrophilia).

Also wolf fucking isn't really as relevant to owod werewolf as you might think. Breed works the opposite of the way people think, its based off the breed of the MOTHER not the father, and not off their form, so a homid werewolf fucked by wolves still gives birth to humans and homids and a lupus werewolf fucked by humans, in human form, still gives birth to wolves and lupuses.

Lupus werewolves are the best because they start with extra gnosis, mature super fast (2 years) and breed extra fast, so every litter, if they have high breed and do it with a kinfolk, probably has one future lupus werewolf in it. Whereas homids take unimaginably longer. Nothing about being a lupus requires that you hang out around wolves or avoid civilization other than chargen rules and that your brothers and sisters are ordinary dogs (well, wolves), which is freaky, but...

>Saulot has already beat your founder into submission.
A 10000 year old Antediluvian, who was the right hand of Caine at Enoch, had to mental battle Tremere, at the time less than ~111 years old as a vampire, for hundreds of years - nearly an entire millennium, just to get control over his body LUL

and after all that Tremere wasn't even destroyed, he took over Goratrix's body and anihilated the entire Tremere antitribu and still can tap into Antediluvian-level powers by using Path of Blood, ez for Tremere

These threads are turning me into an actual Tremere fanboy, even though they were my first love in general.

Do I need to learn fucking doublethink to cram Beckett's Diary into my head? New elements are one thing but I'm having serious trouble keeping track of all the retcons and events that happen later than before.
Writing it down doesn't help much because it's conflicting with what I remembered, the wiki hasn't updated most of its pages either.

Not anymore. Saulot has been in control of Tremere since the begining.
It was all part of his plan.

Beckett's diary is not necessarily cannon. You can just ignore parts of it if you want.

Frankly, the entire concept of Beast was kind of fucked. The idea I thought they were going for was "You're actually some horrible creature that's been forced by lack of belief into a human form. Find a way to return to your original shape."

The other idea was basically the Horrors that GARO (the toku) has to fight.

Nah. Saulot and Tremere's abilities diverge wildly.

I actually like much of the new stuff and the option to advance the metaplot beyond the previous Gehenna date, it's just that I have to catch myself. "Oh wait, this hasn't happened yet."

Its fairly similar to Vampire, including with how Beasts can (apparently) spread their state even though there are no mechanics, but with a tone of gleeful sadism instead of self pitying cuntishness. I'm especially glad they omit any Covenant analog.

They also remind me a lot of Qliphoths from their IM blurb.

>implying Beckett's Jyhad Diary isn't metaplot agnostic
>implying that the book itself doesn't acknowledge they just are potential plots, --if-- and only if "Saulot and his followers are truly the ultimate in Machiavellian masterminds" in your game; not established as canon in any case, as opposed to Saulot struggling for millennia to get control of Tremere

>but in nwod you go cel 1 + auspex 1 = dodge bullets,

Celerity still only allows you to apply Celerity Dots as defense against firearm attaches (unlike most Mage Armors and Time's Acceleration which permit full combined Arcanum + Defense against such attacks).

Celerity is also not particularly effective against Sensory or area of affect attacks, to say nothing of its uselessness against anything but fairly close range physical attacks.

Celerity is great against regular humans and third tier supernaturals or to try to run away against superior foes. I wouldn't rely on it to save your undead ass against woofs or changelings, no less top tier supes like mages, demons or mummies.

I'm running my first game and I totally stole the plot hook from the anime Dusk Maiden of Amnesia. Seven school mysteries lead to a friendly ghost that haunts the club building. She has no memories because a cult sacrificed her by sealing her in an underground shrine, and it tore her soul in half to create a creature of Darkness filled with her despair and her amnesiatic ghost that retained her personality. The cult is connected to the school of course and they are doing dark shenanigans through the city so the players investigate to help the ghost girl move on and uncover and fight the cult and their dark creatures. Not super original but I want this arc to just be the first 'season.'

Tremere are great but people usually like to hate on them because: 1. they make every other clan look dumb because of just how little they accomplished in comparison when they have had a much bigger time span

2. the Tremere has curbstomped the proud Order of Hermes twice, notably the strongest and most organized faction of Tradition mages

cel + aus 1 = Quicken Sight, devotion for full firearms to defenses (and more obscure stuff like inspecting the caliber of bullets in mid flight and where they're coming from etc). So with that, vampires are honestly pretty fucking hard to kill or deal with, and both Cel 1 and Auspex 1 are fuckin great, so its a pretty smart combo for all vampires.

>XDDD MAGES VS VAMPIRES REDUX

What does this have to do with me? Nothing in my post has anything to do with mages. Everyone, especially mages, has incredible difficulties with other mages and whether you can do anything to an enemy mage largely depends on right place, right time.

However Beast's Hackles is a great way of keeping yourself safe since unlike most forms of detection you can start from a totally agnostic, ignorant perspective.

You should have mentioned that you assumed an additional use of Devotion besides Celerity.

My references also included supernaturals besides mages. The mage power reference was simply one readily recognized by other Anons.

Celerity is good for fighting thugs and escaping, but not really that potent as a direct combat discipline against supernatural opponents like Strix or other vampire antagonists.

You'll probably get a lot more mileage (and avoid some fights entirely) with Disciplines like Dominate and Majesty. Among the three physical Disciplines (Celerity, Vigor and Resilience), particularly in light of vampires readily known weaknesses, I would always choose Resilience.

>Ventrue Supremacy!!!

In Requiem 1e, there was discussion of what happens when a vampire drinks the blood of other supernaturals. The effects were largely narrative, but still fun and interesting.

Has this topic ever come up since Blood and Smoke / Requiem 2e?

That apply to absolutely anything

>You should have mentioned that you assumed an additional use of Devotion besides Celerity.

"cel 1 + auspex 1" quite blatantly implies the one thing in the game that uses celerity 1, auspex 1, user.

>Celerity is good for fighting thugs and escaping

Its good for essentially everything as vampires are tanks and become moreso with immunity to firearms, especially because the simplest way to be deadly in combat is to pour more force into firearms. And Auspex 1, Celerity 1 is simply something vastly useful for all vampire PCs

>You'll probably get a lot more mileage (and avoid some fights entirely) with Disciplines like Dominate and Majesty.

Obviously, a vampire mainly centers around their choice of mental discipline, though those go from "not too helpful against mages and strix" to "flat out nonfunctional against mages and strix." Not a reason to avoid them of course.

>Among the three physical Disciplines (Celerity, Vigor and Resilience), particularly in light of vampires readily known weaknesses, I would always choose Resilience.

Sounds like a bad move, since Celerity 1 will be useful in every combat situation, vastly indispensible whenever guns are involved, allows some stealth/teleportation style chicanery, etc., whereas Resilience is just a speed bump. But YMMV.

I'm more of a Daeva fan myself.

Not really, earlier editions have indeed set certain things as canon, Beckett's Jyhad Diary, in antecipation for V5, has been purposefully made more in line with CofD, being intentionally "metaplot agnostict" was by design; that's why you'll always only seen potential plot scenarios instead of anything concrete - they're as canon as the Gehenna scenarios