"fantasy medieval" setting

No.

Dont call it "medieval fantasy" if it's just fantasy.
Most people lived in complete poverty and only the richest of the richest had any decency
That's what I meant
The problem is that most fantasy medieval games/media/campaigns start with you as a farmer/pleb when in actuality you'd get your ass beat for stopping your labor

No. If you want a different kind of setting then
RUN
IT
YOURSELF

It's a bait thread, it's okay to respond but don't forget to /sage

...

>complain about medieval fantasy
>use the pop culture definition of medieval

>when in actuality you'd get your ass beat for stopping your labor
So, you've concoted your own medieval fantasy where everyone who isn't nobility is a forced labor slave? Do you enjoy being so wrong, it physically hurts others?

Because it’s fantasy dork.
Also because that’s traditionally been the technological and social period of most DnD settings...undeniably the most content there is for tabletop is with medieval era stuff

Oh, you're one of those guys that got their idea of medieval realism from Game of Thrones.
I don't hate the franchise but it has had such a bad impact on fantasy.

>everyone who isn't nobility is a forced labor slave?
That is literally what used to fucking happen
You either have good genetics or get cucked
It ALWAYS has been like this
Your entire life is determined by your genetics
Be born with good genes in a good place or suffer.

Are you the same cuck that thinks having a single 13 stat makes you OP?

You're a fucking idiot. The belief that "everyone in the middle ages waddled in their shit apart from the 1% of nobles" is bullshit.

Except that's not true; there are plenty of recorded events of peasants, feeling their rights were not being respected using several methods to rectify the situation and most soldiers through the high and late medieval period were professional mercenaries.

Once again, get some books on medieval sociology and politics and pic related.

No it's not. Even in the high medieval period in North France, ie the epicentre of the classical view of feudalism there were huge swathes of free individuals both in rural and urban environments that were not servi/villeins/unfree/etc.

Jesus Christ you literally have read nothing on the period that was actually written by a historian, have you?

I'm pretty proud of Veeky Forums actually, I thought for sure more people would go along with the retarded OP but it's nice to know we're decently educated on the times framed in our hobby.

Work harder on your bait.

I'd love people to play and run a greater variation of things, too.
Then again, I'm very much locked into only one setting and am uninterested in running games for anything else, too. It's not fantasy, nor medieval though.

Even the Veeky Forums autists aren't this retarded. This is some really bad bait.

Taking baths was a very common form of recreation as soap was very abundant even for the poor, so nobles did not trust it though
Some
No really other than the higher ups
Not really

Run a game in a different setting. Be the change you want to see in the world.

You know many people even farmers could afford to keep a lawyer to prevent getting fuck by nobles and such.

>medieval fantasy setting
>there's nothing medieval in the setting

>/v/ style low effort shitpost
Please make it stop.

People stopped bathing in the early modern because societies became increasingly urbanized following the middle ages. It is much more harder to find clean water in a pre-modern city. Few people could afford to warm their water and thus bathing was genuinely dangerous.

Gay and lame

You should really develop your bait a bit better. Shouldn't have relied on easily disproven misconceptions, especially when trying to bait people on a board that actually knows a surprising amount of shit about history. You get shut down hard and don't really have any room to wiggle out or move goalposts.

Personally, I think you should have attacked the unoriginality of it. People LOVE to come to arms to shit on originality on Veeky Forums. Can't talk about originality on /wbg/ without getting tons of replies about how originality is overrated, and that execution matters more. I agree completely, of course, and if you had gone this route instead of flailing your arms and being wrong really loudly, you would have gotten me pretty good.

3.5/10 needs improvement but you still got the (You). Keep it, you crazy animal.

So, if you don’t mind my asking, how did sanitation work in medieval Europe? Particularly public sanitation. I have very little interest in human history— I find it incredibly depressing— but public health is sort of an exception.

>how originality is overrated, and that execution matters more
For the millionth time, what IS execution?

>what IS execution?
How you do it. Anybody can have ideas, but it takes skill and thought to be able to smoothly work them together into a story, to use the medium to communicate ideas to your audience (players, in this case) without just shouting them in their face. Execution can make even age-old ideas feel fresh and engaging. Or it can make good ideas fall flat.

To give a specific example, there's a superhero comic called Invincible, published by Image. The main character is the son of a Superman expy, something the story doesn't even try to hide. But the book was praised by industry professionals for how the writer managed to embrace the roots of a superhero story and put a spin on them, and have his characters and struggles be engaging and dimensional. Fun fact, the book was written by Robert Kirkman, the same guy who got his comic book about a standard zombie apocalypse adapted as one of the most popular and successful TV shows on air, because people loved the story and the characters. I'm not making comments on quality, I'm just saying that his success is owed to how he executed his ideas, how he told his stories.

Now I will make a comment on quality. Invincible went to shit after Kirkman made it about shitty family drama instead of being about classic superhero stuff.

When the out house holes fills up you cover it, move the building and dig a new one, or you know toss the chamber pot somewhere

Painting a very, VERY broad brush, by and large people tended to bath and wash their clothes relatively often; there were public baths and such in many towns and cities, and these would be social gathering spots; bathing would be seen as something generally weak and indulgent, which led to a trend of associating holiness with uncleanliness that crops up repeatedly over the medieval period (as it would be seen as holy to not indulge and to suffer the hardship of being unwashed, to the point of sores). However, this was not something done by much of the population who continued to bath, about once a week to once a month. Soaps, herbs, etc were used to cleanse the body and for smell.

People did empty out their waste into the streets and there were open sewers, but these were also a bit overstated and a lot of the time would be flushed due to streams or rain. There were local laws governing how they had to be cleared and ensure they were flushed and the waste within did not stay. Many also made use of private or public privies, again appearing quite early in the medieval period with people carting the waste out of the town. Cesspits were often buried and new ones dug out in order to prevent smell and waste from becoming uncontrollable. Medieval people connected bad scents with disease and such and even in the 1100s or so there were town ordinances about the disposal of waste; both human and from butchery, tannery, etc as early as the 12th century punishing people who failed to take it outside of the town or properly dispose of waste or who allowed their privies and cesspits to be unmaintained or too full. Complaints about neighbours or areas of town refusing to do anything about it could be elevated up to the King. Edward III passed a series of laws declaring that the waste has to properly disposed to prevent harmful miasmas. Urine also was a prized commodity used in industrial processes for textiles, etc and so was taken away in order to be used.

Essentially, though they weren't aware of germ theory, medieval people and town dwellers were well aware that human and animal waste and other waste could cause diseases; some towns even banned the disposal of waste openly or throwing it into the streets and maintained laws about how far cesspits and privies could be from market squares or main roads. Where open sewers were present, they were maintained and operated in order to properly take waste away and thus reduce the smell and failure to do so could result in punishment of fines, etc.

This is very broad and things varied a lot depending on the city in question, region, date, etc but the basic principles remain; people were aware that human waste was unpleasant to be around and unhealthy and thus throughout the medieval period, where towns grow massively in population, measures were taken to remove the waste or contain them, enforced by law and taken very seriously.

Fascinating. Would read again.

It is the actual medieval fantasy that enlightenment thinkers used to proclaim that progress was happening.
>Dark Ages

Oh my God I had no idea the world was so terrible before we had Social and Gender studies majors to keep the evil Christians in their place!

>The problem is that most fantasy medieval games/media/campaigns start with you as a farmer/pleb when in actuality you'd get your ass beat for stopping your labor

You're not a very intelligent man are you?
Even I, with my limited knowledge of agriculture, understand that farmers manly just work around the harvesting and sowing periods.

Its literally impossible for the peasants to have worked 100% of the day all year around. you'd run out of things to do fast.
I'm not going to waste the rest of my night educating you, but I will call you out on your idiocy.
You know, the most pathetic type of fool is an arrogant fool, and you've proven yourself to be just that.

Here have a Medieval Fantasy character art piece, I hope it triggers your PTSD

Actually thats too realistic here you go

Those pauldrons are starting the long march into WH40k.

Fun fact; I have an ancestor who was charged with an offence in the 15th century for diverting the stream that cleared a town's sewage channel into their own land for irrigation.

Before it hit town, not after, of course, thus depriving them of the water to clear away the refuse.

>Fun Fact
>Actually posts a fun fact

...

Sharks die if they stop swimming

Were high medieval mercenaries mostly just commoners (the blacksmith's son, etc) who bought a sword, volunteered for a merc company and got some basic training, or was it more complicated than that? Could anyone show up with a weapon and kit and expect to be hired, or did you need to be part of a guild of some kind?
Do you have any good books to recommend on the subject? I prefer pop history myself, but I'm not completely averse to good, solid academic texts as well.
Also, any fun examples of peasants asserting their rights? This is one of the stereotypes I find most annoying about the European middle ages. A knight needs food to live, and to feed his retainers. If you stab the shit out of your baker and rape his daughter every time he tells you he needs a day off, you're gonna starve to death.

Most mercs were vets or sometimes unlaned knights who didn't have much to go back to anymore, and were lucky enough to enlist with a different army in a new war, but if you need men you need men and take all sorts. Guys who liked each other would join a free company as sort of a union to bargain together and work with each other.

youtube.com/watch?v=qMrvE2CwRsQ

...

To add to everyone else: most of the Rennaissance took place in the early Modern era, rather than the Medieval era. The difference is Rome's fall in the east.

Oh and often a well off man or not as well off knight would be in charge off a free company and would take care of recruiting, arming, and training as an investment.

Based Terry Jones

Nah, fuck off OP. I like to play campaigns where I'm spreading not!Christianity to not!Saxons with fire, sword and dragons.

youtube.com/watch?v=cvKRbi2ovDY

Good job being a bigger retard than the faggot you are replying to.

...

How about paleo-fantasy?

The thing is, 90% of "fantasy medieval" is just present-day American suburbs with swords, kings, and monsters. The actual medieval era was a totally different world, far more foreign and alien to us than any present day "exotic" culture. A real medieval fantasy would feel very strange and fresh; you'd probably like it, OP.

I don't get it.
You say op is retard because of this "medieval period was grim" meme. Then to dispute it, you say that in SOME places, SOMETIMES it wasn't as grim. Indubitably, there were free common people and there were various restrains in place to keep nobility's abuse of power in check. But I'm yet to read an author who speaks about this epoch in lighter tones.
It was a time of great social discrepancy and cruel authority for most people - how is this a myth?

What kind of burger logic is this? Some of us still live and work in buildings and institutions from those times. Values and traditions have been passed down and still persist to to this day. Just because your country is younger than some corporations doesnt mean the rest of the world is so divorced from its history.

He's right. I don't think I have seen many systems where urbanized centers are uncommon, where hard cash is rarity, and there are serfs and feudal lords.

It really usually wasn't so grim. Popular history remembers remarkable events, but on the whole things were pretty mundane. It was shitty by our standard, but few cultures through history were inclined towards cruelty because it just wasn't very practical.
The thread is just dealing with medical European cultures and fact is that most people then and there spent most of their lives in peace without ever having to deal much with cruelty or dying from diseases.

I’m not sure I buy the “values” part in particular.

I’m slowly becoming aware of this work, but it looks as if the pre-industrial world really did operate under Malthusian constraints— with Europe being more strongly constrained than other places. With the advent of the industrial revolution, a few areas of Europe started to exhibit economic growth at a rate of about 2%, and the industrialized world hasn’t actually stopped since then; in this sense, progress is quite real. This growth was accompanied by a shift from traditional-survival values to secular-rational ones, another process that has never actually reversed for any significant length of time. I think it’s likely that the difference between contemporary values and medieval values is larger than you think it is.

Muh sibkin.

I vaguely remember some, but I'd need to look up the precise accounts and my books are in storage at the moment. It's basically mostly small level stuff; a knight gets too big for his boots, goes off and does something, blocks the unfree or free peasants from doing something, etc, they get pissed and go and petition another knight, or someone else, etc and tell them that the land owner is not respecting their rights; they can petition to the King and other cases; or largely just refuse labour, etc. A lot of the time, the land owner would just relent because of the trouble, even if there had been unrest, etc.

>please stop staple concept of this hobby, becauseI am unique snowflake.
There is more than one way to skin a cat. there is so much more that one way to make "medieval fantay" setting.

Also edieval times are one of most suitable timeframes to play a game. Less chaotic, primitive and sensless that dark ages, much les restricted that any other timeframe.Vague borders, uncertain laws, huges degrees of authonomy. From ancient era to modert times there is no better place for murderhobos to travel without being arrested or killed on sight.

You realize the point of that comic is not "Criticism is bad" or "Opinions are bad" right?

The point is that just because you do or don't like something doesn't mean the world needs to change or justify itself to you anymore than you to it. Turn it around on overly sensitive people: Shouting "I'm offended!" doesn't mean anyone has to do anything.

...

This is true. The time period lends itself well to adventures. Though I still wish we'd see more exploration of times "Around" it. Age of the sail, or even the world when the Mongol hordes were swarming the known planet.

It's good to know you are removing your stupid posts

Well, mongol hordes swarmed planet in medieval time, but then game should be moved to eastern europe and asia. Poland, russian princedoms, arabic and persian states.

Buddy, I got nothing against religion or jesus or whatever you want to believe in but the church in medieval times was not the best. They effectively ran a soul protection racket; terrifying the populace while keeping the only means of salvation hidden behind a latin translation and in their power.

Not to say that the continued work of monks transcribing written works wasn't a fundamental factor in the preservation of knowledge through those times, but you have to take the bad with the good.

That would be interesting.

It was also the prime source of charity on the continent.

Churches were much more important that that.
1) Most importan and actualy only lace of learning in medieval times. ALL important scientists, even those who were deemed heretics were members of clergy.
2) Main administrative tool of any feudal state. Most of docuentation was produced by church scribes. From census and registration of births and marriages to judicial cases.
3) One last way to climb a social ladder for people of common birth.
Many more actualy. But those are notable things

It also violently weeded out "Heretics" and competing christian sects. Which, I mean, isn't always bad. The Flagellants were basically a cult that press-ganged travelers into pilgrimages of self abuse but the Albigensian Crusade wasn't very nice. They eradicated the cathars for pointing out that a church might be getting away from its roots with its giant churches and super rich leaders and massive political power and such.

1. Yeah but you have to take some things into consideration. "Member of Clergy" doesn't carry the same connotations as it does now. Its like saying that anyone who goes to college is a professor.

2. As I said, they did good work with transcription, record keeping, and providing probably the most stable institution of power at the time.

3. Semi-true, though that became far less true as it went on.

Again, I'm never going to say the church was "Evil" or that it was the cause of everything bad or any stupid generalization like that. I'm simply saying that they're not some blameless, totally good entity. They're a mix, and you have to accept their good acts and their bad ones as you look at them.

Modern day Africa could be fun.

t. Paki

Or just tired of dumbasses derailing thread and contributing fuck all.

ITT: Stop having different fun than me

Why did OP write "fantasy medieval" rather than "medieval fantasy"?

Attached: nevermore.gif (250x251, 998K)

This picture makes me sad, is Europe really that bad?

parts of it, but no doubt they cause outrage in the general populace when bullshit like this happens.

No.

No.

Attached: 16 head crush.png (500x281, 68K)

I play RPGs because modern life is intolerable.

Attached: 1514061328213.jpg (753x707, 331K)

People seemed pretty content with the attacks last year and the year before.

>Not Liking Aquelarre, Mythic Britain/Constanstinople or Ars Magica.
Pleb.

Attached: Great Devil.png (1918x1311, 5.94M)

No. Europe is ok.

Providence state is dying. That sucks.
Materialism is on the rise. That sucks.
Political discontent with the ruling class only leads to the rise of uneducated extremists. That sucks.
Over reliance on American culture pisses me off. We'd rather import entertainment, art, esthetics,.. than build upon our own. That's fucking depressing.

All in all it's ok, you can pretty much live the life you want without fear or major annoyances.

>complains about importing American culture and products
>thinks it’s fine to import immigrants who actively destroy your culture and assault your people
Man, you yuros really have to get off the Murica hate boner for a change. You’re literally inviting your own problems.

But I like both Fantasy and Medieval environments, and frequently seek to combine them for my own amusement.

Attached: 1326506556063.jpg (1128x2100, 1.1M)

Nope. There's been a bit of a spike in crime since the Arab Spring and a shit load of refugees came over our way, but it hasn't been a dramatic spike and it's not entirely unexpected since a lot of these people have only what they could carry. Even white people resort to theft when they've got fuck all income.

The perception of the crime spike has been way off base in that regard; the Daily Mail and the Sun have done a good job of convincing people that every Arab is a terrorist in disguise and that they're raping their way across the country. No doubt there are some cunts that do that, but we have those already and we know how to deal with them.

I love Wild West/Colonial fantasy.

Attached: spanish town 1.jpg (1280x761, 625K)

Meh we have a 1.1 natality rate. We need massive immigration, no two way about it.
I don't hate America, I love the US, it feels like home. I hate our own laziness and reliance on cultural imports.

I know a bit about migrants, I live here. It's not nearly as bad as you think it is.