Will the success of Vermintide 2 make GW bring Warhammer Fantasy back?

>> This but GW video game fans are still GW fans even if they never touch a min. GW makes tons in games.

Oh god I wish

No, it won't, they're too infatuated with their dinosaurs

I think one thing people fail to realise is that What is good for a Video Game may not be good for a Wargame.

AoS is pretty open ended but interesting as a Wargame, allowing plenty of "Your dudes"

GW prefers their wargame to very much be "Your dudes"

Which Admittedly, the Setting of WHFB was pretty hard to do for outside of "Merc group for X faction or Warband of X faction"

>> Go back to your containment thread. AoS is way better. Give it a decade if mini’s and lore and we’ll start seeing some meaty games.

So hyped to see Kharadron Overlords

The only reason they haven't made a video game that plays like the TT game is because it could fucking kill the plastic crack market as a whole. Blood Bowel is a great game as an example of it but they will never do it

Total War Warhammer has a higher chance and did it?

Dinosaurs you say?

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BB game pretty much revived a part of the BB tabletop, GW even admit it.

But WHFB was rather clunky, and it was far less popular than people realize.

Most people who still complain about AoS are lorefags.

I said MOST people so dont kill me.

True, they're also people who would prove GW right when if they DID revive a WHFB game, nobody would buy the minis.

People forget Mantic literally started up as a Proxy company.

I've only ever been tangentially into WHFB, so I might be misunderstanding, but it seems like Age of Sigmar mostly does away with the whole world in favor of a bunch of quasi-dimensional "realms" that are all vaguely in combat one with one another. It feels like a wargame equivalent of Mortal Kombat, with not much real "lore" to be interested in. Which isn't good for getting people into your setting.

Sort of.

But GW don't want to attract people like you to the Wargame, they don't want "Tangent" people interested in "Lore"

They want people to buy minis and play a hobbyist game.

The Lore is secondary and any diamonds you get are carved entirely by people who want to carve them, not by the behest of GW.

Ironically, this is exactly how GW have ALWAYS worked with their background resources, which shit like the RPG and Inferno providing much of the groundwork with the stuff GW printed mostly regurgitation.

The Irony here is GW is bringing back small published works like their new Inferno series and the new Written RPGS for both WHF and AoS.

So we'll have to sit and wait to see what happens in AoS. Right now it's very much in the "Heroquest" stage

Frankly does GW give a shit? People interested in the lore does not = model sales. Poster on Veeky Forums themselves are guilty of this.

We had this thread yesterday.
The answer is still no.

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/whfb/ was guilty of this, in one hand crying why Brets don't have an army book while in the other hand handing out PDF's and links to Chinese recellers and perry minis.

You can't complain a company isn't supporting your Hobby when you actively tell said company to fuck off at every turn, I understand GW completely here.

Can we not just talk about how cool Vermintide is?

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As has been proven with streaming services, providing a better service can massively lower piracy.

Blaming the fanbase is just pathetic. It's GW's job, as a company, to figure out how to pitch a product and make it work. The continued success of the IP clearly shows it has value, which means the failure to capitalise on it is on them.

Everyone is at fault hows that?

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>But GW don't want to attract people like you to the Wargame, they don't want "Tangent" people interested in "Lore"
I get where you're coming from, but it seems like getting people invested in your setting in the first place is a big step in getting them to buy your shit. Especially for a game where building and painting armies and throwing them at each other is the majority of the hobby rather than the actual intricacies of gameplay.

People being interested in the lore but not making the jump to actually playing the game is a huge problem for a games company, of course, but I can't see how "well just throw the lore in the garbage then" is a reasonable solution to that problem. A lot of folks might like the lore but not be buying models, but it doesn't work in reverse. Making people less invested in your setting is not going to get them to start spending money on it.

So how exactly could have GW provided a better service to a community obsessed with getting everything for so much cheaper to the point of Proxy-madness?

Make their Minis cheaper and try to compete with much smaller companies with worse quality minis or materials?

I have been on Veeky Forums a fairly long time, among the WHFB community for a very long time.

GW have not thrown the lore into the garbage ( Calling it Lore itself pisses me off ) they have simply kept the setting how it always was specifically for Games and PnP stuff.

I mean I know this is hard for Tetriary faggots like you to understand, but the "Lore" is not neglected and it's not being unused by anything but the Wargame side of GW. Which simply does not bother making WHFB rules or Minis anymore.

Which if you understood beyond the fucking Video Games, doesn't fucking matter for the setting to begin with.

>dude grind lmao

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How exactly could GW have given a better service?

>Dude just make your models 60% cheaper dude
>Dude just make models and rulebooks with zero market supply dude

Well duh, he isn't the chose one so of course his helm doesn't have the biggest horns.

>Veeky Forums
>making up any significant portion of GW's fanbase
You seriously overestimate the influence that Veeky Forums has over tabletop.

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I don't hate Age of Sigmar, I find it neat in its own way, I just hate how normal WHF had to die for it

You're getting the causality of the situation all wrong.

The community became focused on proxies because GW gave Bretonnia fuck all support, reselling old kits with the same high prices over and over to the point people had no reason to keep buying the same stuff. Abandoning that community because of the problems they created is just GW doubling down on its own failure.

As for how to fix the problem, fuck if I know, I'm not being paid by GW. They have huge teams of incredibly smart people, they should be able to figure out how to leverage their IP's better.

And being fair, just farming out the old Warhammer Fantasy license for videogames is going pretty well, but it does strongly imply that they could have made the tabletop work if they'd handled it better.

They already give the rules and points for AoS for free.

The Warhammer threads are a great Microcosm of the Warhammer Community.

Especially in the EU, Proxy and the usage of cheaper minis basically became the standard unless you played at a GW store.

And Nobody played WHFB at a GW store.

I don't want them to even make new models, just release the rules for Fantasy 9th edition.
Or Black Fire pass, please just Black Fire pass.

Probably, using the same ruleset as AoS. Square bases are deader than Nagash, however.

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>It's GW fault Bretonnia died
>Except they were Unpopular as fuck and nobody bought the book when it was brand spanking new and the entire range was redone, even being pretty fucking strong in the Metagame.

As a Former Bret Player, I'd like you point out your fucking victim status is fucking Hypocrisy.

We were a cheap as fuck army to play EVEN UP TO 8TH EDITION.

Yet people still used Perry Minis because they were cheaper.

I'm not sure what you're so riled up over. I don't get why having a solid lore and setting base to go with your wargame is such a foreign concept, especially when it works fine for 40k. Why would people drop a ton of money building an army they're not invested in from a setting they don't care about?

Yeah, but Army books cost money and the Minis are harder to Proxy.

Because the Lore and setting came after the Wargame, and that is how Warhammer has always worked.

People buy minis that look cool, or they like the theme of the army. This has been the case since forever.

Look at the Space Wolves as a perfect example.

Literally started up due to "Let's have one character for the chapter have wolves"

Is the AoS playerbase like its Veeky Forums general? Probably not

But minis are more costly to produce. Just use existing stock and give them rules.

Depends if they constantly get assaulted by a crazed Slavic Autist every time they leave the house.

I quite like the AoS generals when they're not polluted by a butthurt Romanian.

And yet the faction is still popular in Total Warhammer, and there are still people who miss and inquire about it.

GW put themselves in a situation where they had to compete with cheaper historicals, and they weren't able to figure out a decent solution. That's GW's problem, not the fanbases.

.... Which GW did do.

And in case you forgot, 40k has not had new models besides 1 or 2 in the entire year.

>Will the success of Vermintide 2 make GW bring Warhammer Fantasy back?
It never left. As you can see, it's still receiving content. Age of Sigmar is just further down the timeline in the same setting- there's nothing stopping devs from putting things further back, as Vermintide did.

>Dude, this game that came out almost a decade after the Bretonnian full release is proof Brets are popular.

Some inbred retard going "Le Lady of the lade deus vult" shit on /v/ didn't help the fact that Years before the Warhammer Community let Bretonnia die because they simply were not Popular enough.

GW did not fashion their demise, they didn't somehow plan for them to be unpopular. the Community decided what books were popular.

Or are you actually this fucking stupid in thinking the WHFB community wouldn't have bitched up a storm if the Brets got a new book in a new edition over say, Skaven or Vampire Counts.

Because Boy, you have no idea what the Warhammer Community is like.

To be honest, I've not seen a single new GW mini I've liked since Nagash, so I'd not be overly surprised.

>Ubersreik five (or four, doesn't matter) cancel the end times
Stat the ABSOLUTE MAD-INSANE MAN-THINGS.

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In polls and play statistics from Total Warhammer II, Bretonnia is pretty popular. People like playing an army focused on knights and chivalry.

I am not implying that GW intentionally killed them off or planned to make them unpopular. I am saying that GW had a strong IP, with a lot of really strong elements, that they bungled the handling of repeatedly.

>bring back a massively unprofitable product that nobody played

New rules for fantasy, not 40k.

Which GW do, it's called a general's handbook. Literally every fantasy army has current rules.

>Because the Lore and setting came after the Wargame, and that is how Warhammer has always worked.
But what sense is there in separating them? The idea that "lore fans" and "wargame fans" are somehow mutually exclusive is silly. The players in a game that just buy models they think are neat and have no interest in the setting are a minority; why would you try to make them your whole market? The lore and side materials like video games are gateways for new tabletop players.

Of course there are plenty of people who are interested in the setting but not the wargame, that's how it's always going to work with any expensive niche hobby, and exactly how it works with 40k. Warhammer Fantasy's problem was that it wasn't popular enough overall for the minority who would be actually be getting into the tabletop aspect wasn't enough. And the irony is that as soon as they canned it, decent video games in the WHFB setting started building interest for a game that no longer exists.

And Again, you tetrairy faggot.

Your game has literally no bearing on the Wargames.

Like GW did do.

But when all you produce is Rules for the new games. But then the models which are your real resource are in turn just proxies away, you make no fucking money.

Did you play any GW game before a Video game?

Do you play any GW game now?

Man you video game faggots have a massive sense of self worth.

Warhammer Age of Reckoning didn't make the WHFB game move a single inch in sales and that sold millions.

So your argument is basically 'Nuh uh'?

Why are you so obsessed with defending GW?

For the longest time, GW policy was fucking awful. They've been getting better recently, but while 40k was able to weather the storm those bad GW policies were what killed Fantasy, not its own unpopularity. They're currently making the best of it with AoS, but I do not think there is any untruth in saying that, had GW handled it better, Fantasy could have been a successful game in its own right, with every army still on the roster.

No. GW never turns back on a decision no matter how obvious it us they fucked up.

Of course they weren't popular, they had an extremely limited army roster and a rulebook that was a decade old by the time the setting was ended.

Orcs and Goblins genunely were close to having more Core choices than Bretonnia had in an entire army book. GW had barely mentioned them in lore, they didn't even have the best cavalry in the game as *the* cavalry army. Because of army book creep, there was quite literally nothing Bretonnia could do that the High Elves or Empire didn't do with a cheaper points efficiency.

The only thing Bretonnia had was that its plastic models were exceptionally well-sculpted, but more than half of their model range was metal and showing its age.

Do you remember how few Dark Eldar players there used to be back when they suffered from this exact same problem? They remade them, expanded their range, redid the funky old models and suddenly the DE were the hot shit of 40k.

You know DE are still literally one of the least played armies in 40k right?

>Implying Grind is bad
Fucken' casual.

I heard rumors that GW is bringing back Inferno magazine and including two 'Warhammer Chronicles' short stories in it. They may be just reprinting popular old WFB stories, but it still shows that they recognize the interest there, alongside reincluding Gotrek (and hopefully Felix at some point).

But will they go back? No. They're a big company that can't admit to making a mistake, and has also gone too far with AoS to just roll things back to WFB. Eventually AoS will go so far with being its own thing that it won't even use old WFB models anymore - why else do you think they so rarely include them in the newer art?

All we can do is hold on to the old setting as long as we can - the community has some weight, even without official recognition or care. That's why NV and the old Fallout games still have a strong following even with Fallout 4 being so popular, or Morrowind with Skyrim and ESO.

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>GW does all you said they should do
>Didn't work
>WHY ARE YOU DEFENDING GW

Because it's hard to hate a purely business standpoint GW thought of.

Roundtree even did an interview that said yeah, killing off the whole of AoS was a little too steep and if he had power he would not have done that.

But he said that many of the AoS design prospects would have been limited by the Old World and they'd still have had to "Break" the Old world to fit the new design ethos they have.

And as a rather long standing member of this community, I know for a fact it would have gone into an autistic rampage with half the shit AoS has if it was in the Old world.

I mean fuck, they get angry when people try to make their own alt ideas in 9th age to fit AoS themes.

Personally I wish for the WHFB community to die a complete and painful death for the horrible shit they have done to the WHFRPG community.

GW are updating xenos codexes in order of popularity (based on sales) which currently puts DE above orks, harlequins and genestealer cults. Making them the 4th most popular xenos army.

So they're pretty unpopular, but not right at the bottom.

That's not Fantasy and you know it.

But that's absolutely false. If they were updated based on popuarlity we'd have seen Eldar, Tau and Space Wolves above literally any other codecies.

Hell, we'd have seen TWO space Wolf books.

>Xenos books updated at order of popuarlity.
>Necrons

Necrons are actually a very low playerbase army. Codexes are updated based on DEVELOPER popularity.

>you video game faggots
I haven't played a single WHFB vidya, so I think you're projecting shit a bit. "Make your setting more popular and your product will get more popular" is just basic common sense. Most people aren't walking into the LGS and saying "wow, that 'Warhammer' business sure does look nifty, think I'll try it out" and dropping the amount of cash to build an army without any prior knowledge, because it's too much an investment in money and time to draw lots of people in with just some neat models. Not everybody interested in the setting is playing the wargame, and perhaps not everyone playing the wargame is interested in the lore, but separating the two does absolutely no one any good.

Oweeee i hope so!

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Nigga, children nagging for their parents to buy Warhammer shit is like the biggest fucking chunk of the Model buying playerbase.

Just like MTG cards.

Geedubs know they can't go back because they burnt that bridge to the ground and shat on its remains.

>children nagging for their parents to buy Warhammer shit is like the biggest fucking chunk of the Model buying playerbase
So wouldn't a series of quite popular tie-in video games be a big boost to that?

>Personally I wish for the WHFB community to die a complete and painful death for the horrible shit they have done to the WHFRPG community.

What have they done?

In which system?

Damn, He-Man and Battle-Cat really put on the edge these days.

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Stole the resources of the RPG generals and put it in theirs, renamed themselves to "Warhammer Fantasy general" then claimed hegemony of the series.

The Irony is WHFRPG is getting a new Edition, and WHFB is not.

Suck it you fucking Parasites.

There are official rules for every Fantasy army available for free online directly from GW including for the totally discontinued model ranges. Ranges that are actually still sold have their rules and points values updated regularly.

What the actual fuck are you even talking about at this point? Beyond literally making new rules for models and giving them to you for nothing, what were they supposed to do in the "making new rules and giving them to you for free" department?

They're supposed to support model lines that literally never sold Apparently.

People forget Tomb Kings had a full 8th edition release and STILL were unpopular as fuck.

Me on the left

Move - 6"
Wounds - 6
Nerve - 9
Save - 2+
Ranged attacks - 4 attacks/24" range/to hit 3+/to wound 4+/rending -3/ damage 3
Melee attacks - 4 attacks/1" range/to hit 3+/to wound 3+/rending -3/ damage 4

>tfw no Bretonnian peasant char

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And yet Rise of the Tomb Kings was a best selling DLC

Maybe GW just suck at marketing their IP

>I with no current data whatsoever, know GW miniatures sales figures better than GW does

>There are official rules for every Fantasy army available for free online directly from GW
For the last fucking time, Age of Sigmar is not warhammer fantasy.

>Trying this hard.

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That would imply GW admitting they fucked up in some way- something that they still have not done despite all the big friendly smiles they tack on now.

>a bloo bloo bloo

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No but it does mean they'll sell fantasy licenses to every game developer who wants it.

Would love to see Betrand the Brigand of Bergarac appear as a peasant-focussed Bretonnian horde army and a couple of unique variants of peasant infantry.

Gee, DLC for a game sells better than an entire model range.

How utterly surprising.

>The /whg/ retards get angry at the truth.

>it's just Kruber but incoherensible

>it's impossible to talk about the rpg in the fantasy general even though that's what is happening right now over there
You are a special kind of retard.

Cathay game when?

>Kruber
>Brets

Video game faggots everybody

And you just straight up ignore my point?

If the concept was inherently unpopular, Rise of the Tomb Kings wouldn't have done as fantastically as it did. If the idea of commanding an army of badass egyptian constructs and undead didn't appeal to people, they wouldn't have made it in the first place.

But it came out, and it was a smash hit.

If another company can take a concept GW completely failed to make work and turn it into an amazing success, it seems pretty fair to say that the failure of the Tomb Kings wasn't the fault of the concept of the army, it was a failure of GW not finding a way of properly supporting and marketing it.

And the Video games are also talked about in the general.

Because the General absorbed all WHF talk.