But why would my character want to go on this adventure or even join the other players?

>not asking people to mail you an outline so you can work them into your quest and if it is stupid tell them to rework it

And this is why stating the premise is so important. Make proper use of session zero to establish the setting, the tone and the pitch of the campaign so everyone can build characters with some investment in that central plot.

We're obviously talking about the stupid ones here

My players have gone on playing in similar situations, but they have complained about the lack of focus. On the other hand, when there is some kind of a plot or at least a central theme, they show plenty of agency and often take the plot somewhere completely different than I had planned. This is, of course, completely fine. Great, even. It wouldn't happen if there wasn't some kind of a story to begin with to get both the players and myself as the GM going.

While I get where you're coming from, the type of player we're dealing with won't engage your dynamic plot and setting even at it's most basic level because "muh character motivation". What would you do on such an instance?

Yes, the keyword here is preparation. Ask them to rework and if they dont tell them to invent a reason to join because until then you paly without them

As a DM, I just ignore these applications. Helps when you have a lot of people to choose from. What DOES get under my fucking skin is false advertising, as a player and as a DM. If you say your game is political but it doesn't involve any actual intrigue or debate, then what is the fucking point?

Attached: 1511550661979.png (459x591, 178K)

Yeah, "don't make lone wolves" is something every player should learn. In fact you can generally judge how worthwhile a player is by how quickly they figure it out once they try it. Best RPer I've ever GM'd for figured it out in one session. Most annoying player I ever GM'd for? Still hasn't figured it out years later.

Others have done very well making solid points expressing the, let's say, "inaccuracy" of your post.
I have one question to add:

How do you resolve the issue of one player being determined to ignore the other party and adventurer separately?
And why did you completely ignore that aspect in your "post"?

Obviously he allows every player to do their own thing without ever acting together, effectively running 4-6 games at the same time. And of course he pays as much attention to each if these indivudual players as the rest of us mere mortals do with their single narrative or objective focused game.

I run a separate session. In fact, I've started out several different parties in the same world and the games are running parallel to each other, although they don't all know it yet. My setting is not a "plot" or a story, it's a world to explore. Yes, there are hooks, people to save, enemies to fight, and mysteries to uncover, but which ones the players encounter depend on where they go and what they do.

Stop dodging the question.

If a player decides not to go along with the rest of the party, do you really run an entirely separate session for them? Not multiple pre-planned groups. One player deciding they want to go and do something else, mid session, while all your other players are still focused on the same goal.

>"don't make lone wolves"
>Most annoying player I ever GM'd for? Still hasn't figured it out years later.
Have pic related

>If you say your game is political but it doesn't involve any actual intrigue or debate, then what is the fucking point?
Literally the only reason I can imagine is that they honestly don't understand what is expected when they say "political".
Murderhoboing kibgs could technically count as "political".

>If a player decides not to go along with the rest of the party, do you really run an entirely separate session for them? Not multiple pre-planned groups. One player deciding they want to go and do something else, mid session, while all your other players are still focused on the same goal.
Yes, why not? I'm running a world for the players, not for them to act out my stories.

So you schedule another multi-hour timeslot during the week? Or do you just force the rest of your group to wait around doing nothing while you pander to the one person who doesn't want to play along?

I had a player do this and suggest I DM his adventure alone parallel to the main adventure with everyone else. Main character syndrome in full force.

>I'm running a world for the players, not for them to act out my stories.

You don't understand how plot focused campaigns work

>So you schedule another multi-hour timeslot during the week?
Yeah? Of course, his character is no longer in the game session we currently have.

...You have that much free time?

ITT """"DMs"""" who cannot comprehend narrative structure or plot hooks, and blame players for roleplaying, aka the entire point of playing a rpg.

seriously guys, its your job to think about how and why the players will band together. get your players' characters and backstories ahead of time and think about it, instead of just expecting every character to jump straight up out of their tavern barstool to kill the evil lich the guy who just walked into the bar is raving about.

>Why is my barbarian looking for a new home for his tribe gonna give a fuck about rescuing a princess from a dragon?
If you think about it, as DM you can come up with a reason. Maybe a noble suggests that the reward could include a fiefdom granted by the king.

I'll be the first to agree, that not every character can be shoehorned into every game, and that's when you talk to players before the game even gets to session 1.

>Why is my warlock, who is ordered by his patron to desecrate the shrine of an opposing demon going to partake in an expedition in the opposite direction to !NotChina to establish trading relations?
Idk, why did you make a character with a motivation in the exact opposite direction as I specified in session zero? Maybe he's gonna circumnavigate the world to get there, because a blockade or a war stops him from traveling there directily, and a merchant caravan is safer than going alone. If the player won't meet you at least halfway, then tell the player to find a new group.

It's a give and take, guys, but the storyteller is ultimately responsible for resolving these kinds of problems.

>Have pic related
Oye

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>Have pic related
Think you forgot something.

>Murderhoboing kibgs could technically count as "political".
Ah yes, the infamous Murderist party of the Soveriegn City of Hobotown.

Have you never had an edgy Sasuke loner fuck who wants to be a badass loner and is too cool for school? Because that shit is fucking awful.

Look at Samurai Champloo. Three characters, all very different who have no reason to travel together and yet it works.

Man, I’d kill for that. Instead, my group is saddled with a guy that straight-up doesn’t want to adventure. It’d be one thing if it was “hurr must pursue personal quest at all costs,” but it’s literally “I’m a blacksmith, I’m not leaving my smithy” and “I want to read every book in the famous library the GM mentioned for local color.”

The GM does a solid job dragging them along, but for fuck’s sake, if you’re going to spend the entire time looking for ways to get out if playing, STOP SHOWING UP TO PLAY.

>“I want to read every book in the famous library the GM mentioned for local color.”
what the actual fuck

No. I've never had that, because I play with reasonable friends.
Again no. I'm not a homosexual, so I don't read animes.

I work about 30 hours a week and I sleep for about 40-45. I have at least 80 hours every week for RPGs, and I only use about 24 of it actually playing sessions.

I mean, if you want to be charitable, you could interpret that as an IC desire that the player does not intend to actually have happen OOC. Hoping that's the case there.

>because I play with reasonable friends.

Then why are you weighing in on something you have no experience with?

lmao.
just have orcs burn down his smithy and his library. if that doesn't motivate his character, keep having orcs burn down things he loves until it does, and then make it a genocide all orcs game.

Because I'm bored at work.

Because he wants attention.

>GM: Hmm. Let's pour boiling Orcs on him.

I like it.

Oh. Carry on then.

Gr8 b8 m8 I r8 8/8

>I'm not a homosexual
but you're clearly a colossal faggot.

Gygax used run megadungeons with a shit ton of different players and parties all over it. I strive to bring his way of DM'ing to the modern standard of RPGs being set in cities, towns, villages instead of dungeons with monsters.

I guarantee that I could easily fuck your "dynamic, fully functioning setting" within a single session. I'd also do it entirely out of spite because of you making this faggy post. It doesn't matter how fleshed out a setting you have if a single player decides he isn't going to play with the group and refuses to take any plot hooks.

You're lying.

>The GM does a solid job dragging them along [...]
Reading comprehension friendo. I’m not the GM and tge GM doesn’t need half-assed “solutions.”

But really, you know what’s super nice? Not having to waste time draging Fuckwit McSnowflake on an adventure by their ears. If everyone else can make characters that can cooperate with each other and fit the GM’s plot, so the fuck can he. His antics waste time and put another thing on the GM’s plate for no goddamn reason beyond he wants to be different for difference’s sake.

Isn't something he should come up with?
Even if you are playing an edgy assassin, that doesn't mean he can't have a particular interest in sticking around with a party.
I have played murderous nutjobs before and I never had an issue when it came to giving them a reason to go on an adventure with the other characters.
He can always ask the GM to give him a hand. Like, if he doesn't think his edgy assassin would want to go to some dungeon to kill a monster, he can ask the GM to make it so that dungeon has X thing he might be interested in.

From the first line I assumed this was going to be a troll post. But it actually turned out to be the most reasonable and sensible post in the thread. So kudos where it’s do

Yep, but people can be really really stupid. When someone on Veeky Forums is bitching about X, 90% of the time the problem is with the idiot’s execution and not X itself.

Literally everything, he buys a lamb kebab an entire horde of orcs storm through the streets knocking it out of his hands and into a pile of dog shit

this would be pretty cool.
I would play a giant dungeon meshi game in a singe megadungeon with (seemingly) no end.
But my autism prevents me from asking the preliminary questions:
>how did they get into the megadungeon?
>why are they in the megadungeon?
>what prevents them from leaving the megadungeon?

so long as the DM can answer these questions in a way that satisfies my autism, I can have fun.

>get told by dm that most of the game will take place in starting city since most of the continent is at war so we, the players, should try and defend it
>we successfully defend it, now comes time to venture to other cities/towns
>my character had a business set up pre-game
>i am basically jessica jones but instead of fists i use magic since i am a sorceror
>dm pushes my character to travel but i refuse because my business just started booming after we saved it from an army
>end up going back to my office (which is also my apartment) after celebrating with other party members
>find on a nearby post that there is a sign saying for me to not follow a cult that was recently in the city that we defeated the local chapter from, which if i would follow would lead me to the next city in the dm's campaign story
>call dm out on his BS, get told by him and other players that i should just go along with the plot as my character
>my character just started making a name for himself, so why would he just leave?
>FOR ADVENTURE, DUH
>dont come to next 2 sessions because fuck it, i am pissed
>dm talks to me to join session again, tell him im gonna make a new character
>he agrees
>make a new character that has "legitimacy" for joining the party
>dm says i have to restat the character to lvl 1, instead if the lvl 7 we were at
>never come back to the game after that, leave right after he tells me that
im glad none of those cunts were my friends irl

Okay, have fun roaming the plains full of sheep, wolves, and rebels.

So what was your plan? To have the players sit there while they watched you run your business?

Would you have accepted a client hiring you to the cult thing the DM wanted?

>DM tries to meet you halfway to prevent a game based on your own personal TV show and prevent this:
>grogtard chimps out and leaves
>won't even take a plothook tailored specifically for his character
>DM and players laugh at how autistic that weird guy was being about the game.
>decide it would be funny to invite him back, but only if he rolls a new lvl 1
>laugh about how he chimps out all over again, when he gets the news.
>continue playing a fun game without the sperg, who smelled stinky.

I hope they conyinued to have fun since they apparently lost nothing of value in your departure.

I know but it baffles me that people have a hard time coming up with excuses for going on an adventure.
Even Sasuke was given a reason to go on adventures with the cast before he became an edgelord villain.

>>dm says i have to restat the character to lvl 1, instead if the lvl 7 we were at
Point you should have left
>>never come back to the game after that, leave right after he tells me that
Point you left
Good work!

>So what was your plan? To have the players sit there while they watched you run your business?
Fair questions.

Protip: If you have to defend disruptive actions with “IT’S WHAT MY CHARACTER WOULD DO,” then it’s up to you to create a not-shitty character that wouldn’t do disruptive things.

>Think you forgot something.
In case you.missed it.

This. Tabletop games ultimately rely on an agreement between the players. And if you find yourself violating it regularly, you should take a step back and figure out why. Either change your behavior so it stops happening or find a new group because you fundamentally disagree about what is fun in RPGs.

Why? My character would work at a local business of some town in your setting. I would never go to the plains because I would be too busy working my 9-5 mon-fri and spending weekends with my kids from a divorce my character just got out of.

>have fun roaming
Oh we're not going anywhere.

no, the dm sprung it on us to leave right after we made a name of ourselves, of our group. i felt like my character wouldnt just leave but would stay because my character just started getting a lot of business for lesser races. i was playing a yuan-ti PB, so i was living in a ghetto/poor community and was mostly working pro bono, and was basically scraping by as is before the campaign started. a failed alchemist (another player's intro) had accidentally blown up his workshop in my part of town, which he was in for being an alchemist, which at the time of the game was seen as being evil or whatever you want to flavor it as. i ended up saving his character myself as a part of my district's fire brigade, being the "hero" that i am for my monstrous race community. but he ended up betraying me, a few times, by stealing supplies i had collected for others to deliver in the morning
thanks for agreeing with me
fuck you, i wasnt a rogue stealing from other PC's "because im a rogue, it's what i do lol", i had an established local business. i was a monstrous character for other monsters that were trying to do good or at least be do "normal" and not seen as evil

pic semi-related

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Did your DM explain to you his plans for the campaign before?
Like, did he explain that you would eventually leave that city and go adventuring?

Okay? You can do that. In fact, that makes it easier for me. You can even just stay in the normal sessions and describe what you character is doing every so often. Of course, since it's your business, I'll allow you to choose the location, the shop design, the employees, etc. You'll pretty much get to DM your own micro-game abut office workers.

Seriously though, you underestimate my autism. I've got a 1sqmi City with every building, every road, every alley, every sector named, and 30 other towns, cities, and villages with just as much detail. All i really need to do is come up with random NPC names on the fly and then I'm set.

>I'm a shitty player and it's everyone else's fault but me.
Your group was probably glad to be rid of you.

What if I want to leave the continent?

In that case, your story is over and you should make a new character (starting at level 1 is stupid, but whatever). Your character clearly got what he wanted and if the rest of the party isn't interested in the business storyline then the onus is on you to move on somehow.

Good luck fighting your way through a stormy sea of kraken and killer sharks, although if you do get there you'll find a massive world war between 17 countries and hundreds of as-yet undesigned towns, but which I can readily whip up on the fly.

It's nice that you've got time to prep all that, but as someone who has maybe twenty something hours for RPGs in a GOOD week, expecting that of everyone makes you an asshole.

The GM's to blame for starting you at level 1, yep.

The guy DID attempt to create a new character that wouldn't do disruptive things, after his current PC intended to settle down in the city. The GM said he'd have to start again at level 1.

Look at it like this; if your hero got as a reward a giant castle and a knighthood, would you be happy if the GM goes "and now you need to go to the other side of the world where all of that stuff you did and got hold of means jack shit"?

i already responded to your post but forgot to answer. it would honestly depend on the client or people i could find. i did have a few important people in my backstory that went missing, they were family members. but perhaps. though, desu, at the time right before the group would leave the city after we had spent 20-25 sessions there i was really feeling like i was helping the city. being a monster for monsters and pushing forward monstrous race right, for at least the city we were in.
he did say that, but we had just spent so much time in the city and developing our characters with others in the city that i didnt feel it was right for mine to just leave it. i had on a few times to get an apprentice or assistant (whichever term you prefer) but neither had worked. every time (4 times) i had tried to get one the DM had made them either too weak or too stupid (i feel like in a sense, not to mess with me but to make it so i would stay as a solitary PI). but he had also built up my business clientele that i felt like every time i wen't on a side mission myself or with another PC i felt like i was really helping the city in a way the local guard would not because, like i said, i was mostly helping monstrous races because i myself am/was.
how did you even quote that from my text, i hadnt even typed that, you typed that yourself you cunt
there were 4 of us in that group and it dropped down to 3, a fighter, a warlock, and a mystic. the group ended 3 sessions later because i wasnt there and me and the fighter were the only people that knew each other outside of the group. he was the one that came out on side quests with me. im gonna call you a cunt again because you deserve it, you cunt
i did. i met a new group and started playing a new game as a new character. which is better overall since most of us already know each other from either work or from previous games. but none of these people are from the shit game i described earlier

>attempt to create a new character that wouldn't do disruptive things
Only after being heckled to do so and while it was kind of a dick move to make him start at 1, I'd assume it was more of the DM trying to convince him to bring his old character over. You know, try to actually play with the group instead of grabbing his ball and going home because things weren't going his way?

If you already knew the DM would make you leave then why did you set up a business pre-game? Didn't your forsee that you would have to pretty much abandon that business eventually?

>>how did you even quote that from my text, i hadnt even typed that, you typed that yourself you cunt
>newfag detected
>there were 4 of us in that group and it dropped down to 3, a fighter, a warlock, and a mystic. the group ended 3 sessions later because i wasnt there and me and the fighter were the only people that knew each other outside of the group. he was the one that came out on side quests with me. im gonna call you a cunt again because you deserve it, you cunt
There is a cunt here, and it's you, you little whiny bitch.

Well, nothing wrong with finding a new group when shit isn't working out.

To me it sounds like the DM didn't make a lot of effort to integrate you, but also like you didn't really make much effort to feed him info on how that might be accomplished (unless you did explicitly suggest missing family members and the like). Roleplaying is a cooperative effort and all. Sounds like it ended alright so whatever.

>I'd assume it was more of the DM trying to convince him to bring his old character over. You know, try to actually play with the group instead of grabbing his ball and going home because things weren't going his way?

Why would you force someone to play a character they don't want to play by making them start other characters at level one? If you had to have your character die instead of retiring, it just makes the player want to suicide their character. Which is infinitely more annoying for everyone involved, really breaks immersion of character.

GM should have let him play from level 7, or not been a passive aggressive prick and tried starting him at level 1. That's just a punishment plain and simple.

>if your hero got as a reward a giant castle and a knighthood, would you be happy if the GM goes "and now you need to go to the other side of the world where all of that stuff you did and got hold of means jack shit"?
The fact that I'm not using it at the moment doesn't mean it didn't happen. Can still roleplay out managing the castle by post or whatever.

>Did your DM explain to you his plans for the campaign before?
>Like, did he explain that you would eventually leave that city and go adventuring?
It would seem so:
>>get told by dm that most of the game will take place in starting city since most of the continent is at war so we, the players, should try and defend it
>most

I get your position, but seriously, what was your plan when the rest of the PCs were leaving and it no longer made sense for your character?

>That's just a punishment plain and simple.
Yes it is, fitting for the cunt.

>The fact that I'm not using it at the moment doesn't mean it didn't happen. Can still roleplay out managing the castle by post or whatever.

No, stop trying to manage the castle. Cultists invade, smash the whole castle into pieces and you have to go chase them. Why aren't you following the plot?

That's not what you said and does not follow logically from what I said - you're just strawmanning now. I am following the plot and doing some token RPing to reflect the character's changed position. Don't move the goalposts just because you're salty.

Not so fast, you've agreed to be every player's personal bitch.
Roleplay every single customer with unique names, personalities, and backstories.
Micromanage the shop's effect on the local economy, worked up from scratch out of From Grain to Gold.
Create interesting and dynamic conversations with the customers, suppliers, delivery men, and family members.
Now.

Fine, you are told by the GM that you need to go leave your castle and investigate something half the world away, and you aren't given an in character reason. Doesn't that stretch your patience and belief? At least slightly?

>you aren't given an in character reason
Except that faggot clearly was given a reason.

fpbp

But I already did, it's your real life, welcome to the matrix

yes, but i didnt think we would spend so much time investing in the city and the NPCs in it. i knew we were going to leave, but we had spent so much time helping the city, that idk, i guess we may have stayed or something. even some of the other characters had reason to stay
the fighter was learning to become a blacksmith with a love interest
the warlock was learning about the great old one(s) from a rogue band of wizards (necromancers)
the mystic was learning about how he had descended from the gith from a hidden area in the town that seemed like an empty plaza except to him since he had "the sight" that allowed him to traverse it
he was the one that helped me with my backstory. it was originally that i was orphaned and wanted to be a cop because i wanted to eventually become a detective to find my family, but he instead suggested i was already a detective and my family went missing so it came in conflict with my work and i was let go and after many false leads i just decided to become a PI
well i didnt think that my character after all this time, nor did i think i would spend all this time in the city, would have as much investment with others (monstrous races) nor have such an increased reputation with them either. but it happened, so i had made a decision.

does it really seem odd for a character to have made this decision? not a player but a character. im not trying to say i am only playing my character, but i had so much built up for him via the dm,

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Cultists burnt down your castle, then. That's the reason you need to go do something else half a world away.

That's not the point user. The point is this fuck wants not needlessly split the party and have solo time and that's not fun for anyone but him. Fuck this player.

meant this image

Attached: sponebob hot chocolate.gif (1275x916, 1.28M)

Do you get mad when it's not your round in combat?

>does it really seem odd for a character to have made this decision?
Honestly, no. But since your autism apparently doesn't let you appreciate that it's a group game and not just your adventure time, I guess you couldn't see that.

Are you even trying any more? You lost already.