Chef's Knives

The higher end Mac are ridiculously good. The cheapest ones are nothing to get excited about. Under $150 there are much better brands than Mac.

Global GF-33

This. The high end Mac knives are stellar, best mass produced knives out there.

I could sharpen a spoon and it would hold it's edge after being used only twice

its a good idea to go with german steel if its your first. You're likely to damage it less and it requires less maintenance.

pic related it my first and most used. Wusthof Ikon.

Anyone know how to remedy light pitting in carbon steel knives? I don't really want to sand away any metal, is there something I could fill the pits in with to prevent further damage?

Smear on some naval jelly (gelled phosphoric and sulfuric acid), let it dry for an hour, rinse, repeat. Note, when they say wear eye and hand protection, they mean it - it's not good for you.

It will smell funny and it will wreck your patina, but that's the price to pay for letting pitting form.

I use these, you should consider them! Misono UX10, Sugimoto, Takeda AS, Takeda NAS, Victorinox Heritage, Sabatier, Konosuke HD.
Most knives are will be sharp, it comes down to how it feels in your hands, no one can determine that. This said I would avoid most western brands, Shun, Mac, and Global, as they aren't very reasonable in their cost to performance.

You should also consider looking into HRS hardness ratings if you plan to sharpen your own knives.

Thanks, I'll give it a shot. Btw I'm not neglectful of my knives at all, I'm asking because I just managed to find an old sabatier at a garage sale for $8. It's in pretty good condition considering its age, the pitting looks very minor but I don't want it to get worse.

Won't fill the pitx, will just dissolve the rust.

After cleaning you could try adding a patterned patina to hide them a bit like this guy did :

tvwbb.com/showthread.php?54214-Old-Kitchen-Knife-Restoration-Project

yeah I forgot to mention that part. it will also be very reactive as soon as you clean it off, so a forced patina would be a good plan ASAP.

Talking of avoiding Zwilling knives would you then suggest to ignore Miyabi knives as well.

>it's not good for you.
should read 'this WILL fuck you up if you don't handle it properly'

also
expensive but worth

Not the same guy but once you reach certain price points the differences are far and few between. As long as you sharpen the knife, all the ones he listed will work fine. I'd pay more for certain knives just because of their aesthetics, but if that doesn't matter to you then just find something that fits your budget

To carbon steel knife owners here, how do you guys keep it sharp? Do you guys use an electric sharpener or do you use a stone?

chromium-molybdenum-vanadium steel.

just make sure you've got a diamond stone for that shit

Don't own a carbon steel knife, I own a cheap set that was brought for me that are Jamie Oliver branded.

I use a king double sided synthetic whetstone as I need to practice sharpening and I don't mind fucking up the cheap knives before I buy a decent set.

I use 2 natural stones. medium and fine. No honing steel. The fine one every night after my shift. The medium every few weeks.

I have not used or know of anyone who uses Miyabi knives so I have no opinion. I base my suggestions off of using a huge number of knives in my career and working in 20+ restaurants(stages, double jobs, contract etc.). I can see what others are using, and most let me try their knives. Right now by far the most popular knife is Shun, followed by Global(Global chef knife was the second knife I purchased), Although I am starting to notice a lot of Japanese and high-carbon(all steel contains carbon) knives. Unfortunately, maintenance levels vary wildly.

With the Zwilling-Kramer collaboration knives, I've actually seen a couple in action. and inspected some in store and discussed with the clerk. The advice from the clerk was that most blacksmiths who came in and looked at were extremely unimpressed with the finishing. Using this advice I looked closer and found exactly what they meant as far as the joins and balance goes. From actual use, the people who owned them, didn't treat them well, so I can't judge the steel, but at 500$(local price), I'd assume it was acceptable.

Which brings up the question, why do some idiots buy an expensive knife just to fuck it up on stones? My first global was destroyed and scratched to shit on the sides. The edge was fine though. Once I learned how to sharpen, I started to throw down money on expensive knives. My current daily driver was $200 overseas, 400 is the cheapest I've seen locally, and it's scratch free after 2 years. Blowing a weeks work on a knife then ruining the finish is stupid.

Second for Takeda.

Although you should definitely perfect your sharpening technique before buying. Respect your tools.

Okay thanks for the reply.

I will admit if I were to buy a knife it would be the second one I've ever actually looked after myself so getting a expensive one might not be a good idea if I end up messing it up trying to sharpen it. Just want to make sure I have decent knives to use for when I'm preparing food. Because from experience with cheap £5 knives they tend to just die within a year.

A scratched finish can be fixed. With the exception of most Damascus patterns. Most people won't notice or care about damaged finishes. But now you will, and a lot of chefs who put time and care into their work will also care.

I was given that same blade for Christmas and I fucking love it.

I use Japanese waterstones (1000x and 6000x) and a leather bench strop with 16 micron CBN emulsion to create a convex microbevel.

Using the strop I can keep the knife touched up for an extended period between sharpenings.

>chromium-molybdenum-vanadium steel.

Why would you want those alloying elements in a steel for a kitchen knife?

There are very good reasons that fairly chemically pure carbon steel is frequently used for kitchen knives.

>just make sure you've got a diamond stone for that shit

You don't need diamond stones for high carbide steels. Silicon carbide oilstones and waterstones will work just fine, and will be much faster than diamond plates.

>Zwilling Kramer

To me, besides the astronomical prices, the main problem with Zwilling Kramers is that Kramer's patterns are different enough from typical chef's knives that it is very likely to be a love it or hate it affair.

I have the 8" chef's knife and I love it, but that is primarily because I live the tall heel, full distal taper, and I find the handle very comfortable. I despise French pattern chef's knives, incidentally.

I also got it when they were $300, not $500. Also the 52100 is very good, comparable to Aogami Super in its properties.

>Which brings up the question, why do some idiots buy an expensive knife just to fuck it up on stones?

Honestly, I've never worried about accidental scratches on knives from sharpening. It's a tool, not an art piece.

> Blowing a weeks work on a knife then ruining the finish is stupid.

You're going to have to thin it eventually, unless it's a boat anchor with a large primary bevel you are almost certainly going to scratch the finish doing that by hand on a large stone.

>full bolster
When will this meme end?

Unless you're a professional chef, any dollar stor knife is good.

>unless you're a professional clothes designer a cut-out plastic bag is all the clothing you need

>Buying designer clothes when off-brand clothes look just as good for a fraction of the price
They're both made by children in Bangladeshi sweatshops too, so the only thing you're paying for is the brand.

Sure thing. How's your pot-metal chef knife holding up?

i'd buy a cleaver like link related
they're cheaper and better for most tasks

amazon.com/Vegetable-Cleaver-Chinese-cleaver-Butcher/dp/B01295MDDA/ref=sr_1_16?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1462821621&sr=1-16

I have wusthoff classics and can only tell you to go with your first instinct.

If you wanted to go cheaper you could go victorinox solingen or dexter russell...

I bought myself one as well, it's awesome. It's still pretty sharp after 6 months and my dad using it a few times on a plate.

I need to pick up some whetstones though, even after honing it can't cut a tomato with just the weight (which it could do for a few months).

also the surface of the blade scratches easily but it's just cosmetic and to be expected from any knife you use every day

>It's a tool not an art piece

i>scratches should be expected on a tool you use every day.

I understand where you're coming from. However, I respectfully disagree. For myself, it's a point of pride that my knives are in pristine condition, patina notwithstanding. I use my knives heavily everyday depending which of my jobs I'm at. My sushi combo is my chefs knife and yanagiba, My Italian combo is chef's knife and cleaver. I play around with a few others, but those 3 are the ones i use nearly every day of the week. They are all in excellent condition, even after years of use and sharpening.

Do I do anything special? Not really. I take care of my equipment, because it takes care of me. It's a relationship built on respect for my tools, I want them to look as good as they perform.

Unfortunately, that causes me to view people who mistreat their tools as careless. Maybe they're great people, but if their knives are scuffed, dull, chipped, rusted etc, I feel that reflects on them and their work.

I should add, it doesn't really matter which knife you buy, if you take good care of it, it will last you almost forever. It's one thing to walk into a new workplace with a 5000$ million times folded super weeb knife and look cool. And quite another to walk in with 20$ cleaver that you can shave with.

Why are these threads always filled with fedoras?

That's a meat cleaver mate. It's not really suitable for every task, but it can probably do them.

well I was trying to keep it really nice at first, but my dad tried to clean it and used the scrubbing part of one of those green sponges and scratched the whole thing up. I was really disappointed but it hasn't damaged the knife's function at all. The thing that ticks me off the most though is that he always uses it to slice his pizza (even when we have a pizza cutter) and leaves it out so the cheese hardens on the blade.

I'm speaking more on a professional level. What happens in your house is more unpredictable.

I'm not going to suggest that owning an expensive knife gives me any authority on the subject, but merely that I have something to compare to.

I have three main chef knifes, the pic related, a victorianox, and a miyabi. I also have a 5.5 inch miyabi utility knife.

I think they get a lot of hate merely for being associated with zwilling, but I've had no problems with them.

For perspective, the miyabi knife is generally my #2, and if the restaurant is very busy, I'll use the miyabi over the high carbon knife, since I won't have time to properly maintain it.

The two miyabi knives.

Ah okay thanks for the reply. All of the knives look very nice.

One reason I was looking at getting a decent Kitchen Knife (although I'm mainly wanting a Paring one at the moment) - is that I have this Victorinox one.

amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000IAZC32/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s03?ie=UTF8&psc=1

And while I admit I haven't sharpened it for just over the year I've owned it it didn't keep its sharpness for very long. Perhaps 3 months before it started whittling down.

have you ever seen a Chinese chef use one of those knifes? Would certainly change your point of view.They do precision work with that shit

kiwi brand knives are a gem. I picked this up for like $7.50 and its been one of the better knives I used when I started cooking

I have a Wusthof as my main chef's knife, I use it daily and I can't complain. The only time I use a Japanese knife is when I need to slice sashimi or very thin slices of tomato.

Yes I have. I own and use a chinese cleaver myself. The one you linked is the heavier version. The chinese chef knife that's more daily use is a no. 3 or 4. Thats a 7 and used mostly by chinese butchers.

I am buying a new house and have about 150 dollars budgeted for knives (actually, 200 overall for kitchenware, not counting cookware like pots and pans, which I already have a nice set of)...

What should I get? I'm looking for a good chef's knife, a couple of paring knives, and table/steak knives too. Maybe a bread knife and a meat cleaver if the budget allows.

At that price range.
Victorinox 8" or Tojiro DP 8" 50$
Henckels paring knife, plastic handle 5$
Henckels steak knives 60$
Victorinox Off-set bread knife 40$

I'd recommend getting the cheapest usable kitchen knife you can find. Hence Victorinox or Tojiro. Get nice steak knives. When you have company over, they don't really care if you have a fancy knife, but a great steak knife will stand out.

You don't need a meat cleaver. Not in this budget anyway. Find a local butcher, they'll custom cut anything, often without extra charge if you visit regularly and are friendly.

If you're feeling like you're high level though and really want the meat cleaver. Replace above selections with this
chefknivestogo.com/cckcleaver2.html

It'll do everything but bones. Use the tip or heel for fine work, the central area for chopping and slicing. The tip for breaking down chicken and fish. The length of the blade for slicing meats. I use mine for slicing bread when I need to, but it's not something I do often.

>Hence Victorinox

There's tons of decent stamped and drop forged knives out there. You can get a Kom Kom 8" Taiwanese Chef's knife for 12.5$. Or this 250mm Arcos Knife for 9.5$ (mispriced, all the other ones are 30+) :

www.amazon.com/Arcos-10-Inch-Range-Blade-Chefs/dp/B007TS6BH2

Victorinox really is a meme knife.

Has anyone been to Shigeharu in Kyoto? I hear the prices are cheaper than Aritsugu and the quality is about the same or better since the knives at Shigeharu are made in house. To boot, apparently store as been around since the 1100's. Anyone have experience going there?

I haven't been there myself. I know a few friends who have, most shops in Kyoto are pretty pricey.

However, I recommend visiting Kappabashi street in Tokyo. It's the restaurant supply area. There's about 10 dedicated knife shops, representing about 140 different japanese brands and a handful of western brands. There is also at least 2 shops that sell natural whetstones, one of which only sells stones. Huge varieties of knife cases and bags, soba making equipment, sushi equipment, and all kinds of bladed tools, specialty knives.

Also, I bought an Aritsugu A-type for about 180$ with a higher grade handle and saya included. The normal handle one with a saya go for about 140. They also put the edge on it when you buy it, so budget some time, this is only true for a select few high end knives. The thinking is, if you are buying such an expensive tool, you know how you will use it, and what kind of grind you need. I highly highly recommend Aritsugu.

It's ok to be a meme knife. Brand recognition is what a lot of companies strive for.

Awesome man! My price range is around 150 so I'll definitely check those shops out. From what I've heard Shigeharu also used AS on their blades and apparently the store owner is pretty nice even though he doesn't speak a lick of English.

To add I'm specifically looking for a gyuto or a santoku... Do you think they carry hybrids too?

Most shop owners don't. The JDM is massive and tourists don't make up a large amount of business. 10-15% is a pretty generous estimate.

Just learn the names of the steel you like. Aogami super, aogami ichi, aogami ni for blue steel. Shirogami for white. Steel is Hagane. They're the basics. And know the name of the knife type you want or just point.

My own experience was fun. I didn't realize I had bought an aritsugu until a couple days later when my ex translated for me. But purchasing was a tangled mess of pointing and making drawings of knife edges and cases. Then wandering around Tsukiji eating chirashi don and chatting with the few english speakers about natural stones.

Speaking of steel grades... Which grade would be better for a workhorse knife? I hear that white is great of beginners but doesn't hold the edge as long. In terms of wear resistance and edge retention should I go with a blue 1 or 2. Or just go white?

Bonus: Are powder steels any good?

zknives.com/knives/kitchen/misc/articles/kkchoser/westvsjapnp2.shtml

Here, do some reading. I keep writing essays. So I'll pass along one of the knowledge bases I found.

For me, I really love white #1. Overall, it stays very sharp, reactivity is lowish. If you often chop and scrape your knife, every edge will wear fast. If you use slicing motions and use the back of your knife for scraping or just don't use knives for scraping, your edge will last a long time. White #1 lasts a few months between major sharpening. I sharpen every night with 12,000 grit stones. 5-10 passes per side.

With that being said, my best knife is blue super, it's a 500$ nakiri, not very big, about 6". The rare times I let someone use it, they make a mistake and cut themselves. It's actually never failed to draw blood from an inexperienced cook, sharp knives are the best teacher. The edge is incomparable. I don't use it often because it's very reactive. It's the first backup out of my bag though, and during tomato season, I use nothing else. It has never needed a full resharpening. It's never even seen a stone under 6000 grit since I bought it 5 years ago. It gets my regular maintenance of 12,000 after every shift, when I use it for more than 15 minutes.

Powdered steels are great, generally stainless but with a lot of the benefits of the blue and white steels.

I really appreciate the knowledge bro. One of the only times Veeky Forums anons havent shit posted

Btw... In terms of reactivity, isn't having a patina a good thing (when wiping every few cuts)?

Patina is good. I don't wipe every few cuts but after every task. Basically, any time I'd put my knife down it gets wiped. I'm referring to reactivity to the food. It's no good for me if my onions and garlic have turned black.

Got that one in six inches. It's BASES/GOAT/COW

> zknives.com/knives/kitchen/misc/articles/kkchoser/westvsjapnp2.shtml

> I've used Wusthofs and Henckels sharpened to 15° per side, and I can say, nothing went wrong while I was cutting food with it.

They've come that way out of the box for a while now.

They can probably be good, that said here's a someone abusing knives made with S30V powder steel and even more high tech 10V vs one made from good old 12C27 ... they got torn to pieces.

youtube.com/watch?v=QaPwKEPg-XQ

True. So in terms of less reactivity, white steel is best?

In my opinion yes, the white steel is what I use most often day to day. The blue super is unmatched for me for edges and retention based on what I've used. If there's something where I need the edge to be perfect all day, ie my sashimi knives, its going to be blue super, otherwise it's white #1 for cost to performance.

It's up to you which way you want to go. If you're touching up daily on polishing stones, the white is going to be able to do the whole day at perfect sharpness. If you slack on sharpening, the blue will be superior, but you may want to look into clad knives.

Important to note, if the edge is left wet, without being used, then the first cut will almost always be reactive regardless of type if it's high carbon, and return to normal after the first few cuts.

Full disclosure, this guy hasn't updated his site since 2010. A lot of the general information is still relevant. Specifics may have changed. As far as gaining a base of information so you can make better knife related choices, this is a great starting point. As you've noticed with his blurb about steel types and edge retention.

As always, it's best to gain a wide range of information so you can temper any biased opinions you receive.

thesweethome.com/reviews/the-best-chefs-knife-for-most-cooks/

I bought the recommended knife but even if you don't, the article is good for developing how you think about this purchase.

I appreciate it again man... You seem like a knife expert or hobbyist... Would it be cool if I could find some one to contact you to learn more?

*someway

Bamp

I'll make a throwaway tomorrow, I needed to light some fires this evening

For sure bro! Keep me posted