What does seekay think of pic related?

amazon is superior, especially if you can return

Indeed, as I saying.

I'll tell you something else, the overall quality of things has deteriorated at most other chains. You could pick up a lot of items at Macys, BedBathBeyond, all the way to KMart and Target and see some quality items in between them both. But, you can walk into a Target or something now and see utter crap with names like KitchenAid on them, as if the amazing motor on a top end machine and top priced machine should be trust, when there's a dangerous grater with flimsy plastic handle and some piece of shit pan with paper thin bottom. Who is curating those stores now? They're not anymore. It's contracts and the suppliers themselves are churning out crap. Sur La Table and WS always had a collection kind of atmosphere, not just brand loyalty. If I suddenly need a new wooden spoon I might find one made out of enjoyable-to-look-at olive wood, some hardwood, not some porous bamboo dollar store item that is "cool" just because it's asian so must be attractive to kids making their first sushi! I'm not going to fall in love with a can opener that might give me carpal tunnel from the effort of moving its aluminum blade with a plastic handle. I think Oxo is the one remaining mass available brand that might not be crap, but I haven't looked recently, I must admit.

>They are also willing to reward WS for that curation and inventory work
This is exactly it. If access to things like:
>a zeroll ice cream scoop, a vitamix, la creuset, a boska petit paris cheese board, the cellars at jasper hill cheese collection, Nielsen Massey Madagascar vanilla paste, and an all natural rattan banneton
all under one roof is something you're happy to pay for WS is the place for you. Perfect for someone with a big kitchen looking for pretty stuff to fill it up with.

I don't give a shit about the aesthetics of my kitchen. I'd rather spend my disposable income on the best food I can get. Much more concerned with the quality of the cheese and wine I'm serving than the pedigree of the glasses or the cheese board.

But if you want your kitchen to project the kind of upper middle class vibe Martha Stewart has made a career of selling a dumbed down version of you can get most of the iconic objects that go along with that at WS.

Utalitarian? Sure. And I'll grant you that WS sells much better knives than any restaurant supply that I've ever seen. But beyond that, I disagree.

I'll take a commercial mixer, food processor, or blender like a hobart, robot-coupe, or blendtec over anything WS sells, any day.

Likewise, an Eagleware or Tramontina nonstick pan from the restaurant supply will outlast any fancypants WS brand despite being a fraction of the price.

WS does carry some good cookware. That's what I meant in when I said they carried some products which are legit. (For example, all-clad, demeyere, etc.) But even then you can find an equally performing pot or pan. The Alegacy "two point five" line of pans and pots doesn't look as pretty as all-clad does, but it has even better heat distribution and is easily as durable.

>>Name another store
The internet. I don't need physical stores, I can google who has the best prices on each of those and buy accordingly. And if you want to be "one and done", there's always Amazon.

YUP. Stores are not curated at all these days. It's fucking awful.

I meant to mention WS and their lifetime warranty on a lot of products. Thats another reason to shop there. They make sure their products are top tier so that they don't have to deal with returns and defective products - because their warranty would bankrupt them in 3 days if people didn't like what they were buying or if it was constantly breaking. WS would be up to their eyeballs in returns and defects if they were to stock tarket brands.

>I think Oxo is the one remaining mass available brand that might not be crap

Maybe. I have been really happy with OXO for the most part.. and zyliss. other than that you need to look at boutique brands that specialize in a certain item to get top tier.

But, correct me if I am wrong, I think OXO has different levels of product that they make - or perhaps they are just changing the designs so quickly that I think they have a larger product offering than they do...

I have seen some cheap OXO stuff out there that I wouldn't touch.

For instance, pic related, I own the one on the far right and won't peel anything without it now.. it has an amazing ergonomic to it and a really nice balance and weight, but i wouldn't touch whatever that is on the left.

>The internet. I don't need physical stores, I can google who has the best prices on each of those and buy accordingly. And if you want to be "one and done", there's always Amazon.

Yeah but I can go to the WS that is 15 minutes from here and be back at my house with all those items (plus lifetime warranty) in under an hour.

Your restaurant supply won't do the warranty, nor will most of the internet, and you can't get things quick from the net.

>I meant to mention WS and their lifetime warranty on a lot of product

You know that has nothing to do with WS and instead has to do with their specific brands, right? You could pay $400 for an all-clad saucepan at WS or you could pay $200 for it somewhere else and in either case the warranty is exactly the same.

except that you can walk into a WS with a 5 year old set of tires and say you aren't happy with them - so long as you have receipt or are part of their customer loyalty programs and they have a record of selling you those worn out tires they will take them off your hands and refund your money no questions asked.

Good luck even finding your amazon seller 2 years from now. And enjoy the shipping costs sending stand mixers through the postal service.

Like has been said before - WS is about quality gurantee, and convenience for people that don't want to be bothered with the trifling shit of living a basic bitch existence.

>They make sure their products are top tier
They actually go a step beyond that. Their stuff is luxury tier. You can find top tier stuff in a good restaurant supply store, but it looks utilitarian. It won't have the wow factor in the carefully remodeled "chef's kitchen" of your McMansion.

You're not just paying for quality - you are paying for luxury - you're paying for stylish things with brand names people recognize that also happen to be quality. There is absolutely nothing wrong with doing this. We all decide how we want to spend our disposable income, choosing our own luxuries. But if kitchen gear is not where you want to spend your luxury dollars WS is not the place for you.

disagree with what? that WS isn't *overall* higher quality regardless of the diminishing returns?
That's wrong, at least compared to the restaurant supply I go to. those commercial mixers are rightfully way more expensive than kitchen aid.

Retardedly expensive.

>and refund your money no questions asked.

I find that highly unlikely, though if true it's certainly impressive. Citation please?

>>Good luck even finding your amazon seller 2 years from now
I don't need to. The lifetime warranty is through the manufacturer. I don't care who sold it.

>>And enjoy the shipping costs sending stand mixers through the postal service.
Any stand mixer that's worth a damn is too heavy to ship via anything other than motor freight.

>>convenience for people that don't want to be bothered with the trifling shit of living a basic bitch existence.

Agreed. They just charge a pretty penny for that convenience.

>WS isn't *overall* higher quality

Correct.

>
Name another store that you could buy a zeroll ice cream scoop, a vitamix, la creuset, a boska petit paris cheese board, the cellars at jasper hill cheese collection, Nielsen Massey Madagascar vanilla paste, and an all natural rattan banneton?

I've cooked for 14 years, 9 in fine dining, and I know what 3 of those things are.

Shockingly informative

That's because they're luxury products aimed at the upscale homeowner, not really so much things a chef or serious home cook would bother with.

Yeah that's wrong, majority of the stuff at the restaurant supply's I've been to are overall lower quality.
thinking you need a $2000+ mixer for anything but commercial use is pretty much Williams-Sonoma customer tier logic. If I had the money though I'd still buy one for home use.

It's a great source of good stuff at fair prices

Paupers who get triggered by "status" are afraid of it, and special snowflakes who get off on >muh restaurant supply industrial chic are too special to admit it's nice, so aftermarket prices are lower than they ought to be

I picked up a huge ass W-S branded 2.7mm copper sauce pan for $100 that should have been like $300 because dumbass hipsters are too smart for their own good and will only consider mauviel and bourgeat, W-S insignia is just too embarrassing to be seen with

>thinking you need a $2000+ mixer for anything but commercial use

I didn't say it was needed. I said it was better quality than what WS sells.

>> If I had the money though I'd still buy one for home use.
Same here!

IMHO, WS sells things which are "fancy" in appearance. It's about appearance and image, not actual funcionality.

I agree that most of what WS sells looks a lot better than what you'd get at a restaurant supply. It's certainly pretty (as are their shops). But when it comes to functionality and durability it's not all that great (with a few exceptions as I keep mentioning).

We don't shop at the restaurant supply because it's chic. We do so because it's more cost effective.

For example, an Alegacy "two point five" line saucepan is even better than 2.7mm copper but costs less than even your $100 price for that copper one. It requires no polishing either.

...unless you just wanted that copper because of its looks.

>I agree that most of what WS sells looks a lot better than what you'd get at a restaurant supply. It's certainly pretty (as are their shops). But when it comes to functionality and durability it's not all that great (with a few exceptions as I keep mentioning).
Categorically untrue. You must be thinking of Target.

>You could pay $400 for an all-clad saucepan at WS or you could pay $200 for it somewhere else and in either case the warranty is exactly the same.
Oh please, they don't mark up their items double, ROFL. Those are manufacturer set prices, such as with All-clad. The only time you see a sale on All-Clad is a store doing their own closeout clearance on discontinued things, or manufacturer value priced box sets (which are never really complete anyway). What you don't get at Macys, is a complete supply of all of the possible line if you wished to complete your set with something rarer but suits your family uses: paella pan, crepe pan or some butter warmer for your lobster endeavors.
The only times I see what feels like a markup is when certain stores contract with a manufacturer for something cultural added to the set, which they exclusively sell, or some new color, such as with the Le Crueset stove to table soup terrines in holiday colors, where WS will be the only one selling it. But, all the stores do exclusives now.

Here's an example. Nordicware beehive pan for cakes.

>admit it's nice
That's exactly the aesthetic they sell: nice. Nice works for a lot of people, but not everyone is a fan. Not all of us give a shit whether the things in our kitchens evoke an Italian or French country house or the latest issue of Saveur.And if you don't care about that you're not going to be willing to pay a premium for it.

>even better than
Yeah, no
Perfectly functional? Sure

Sur La Table.

Neither store is a kitchen store - they sell status items for people that need to spend a lot of money on things they are assured are "the best" to feel a certain way about themselves.

Look at the W-S investor relations stuff:
ir.williams-sonomainc.com/sites/williams-sonomainc.investorhq.businesswire.com/files/event/additional/2016_InvestorDeck_060216_v17.pdf
"“Our vision from the beginning has been to
enhance our customers’ lives at home.
Our customers love their homes, and we have
a singular focus on helping them make
their homes a reflection of who they are.”

>a reflection of who they are
>a reflection of who they are
>a reflection of who they are

It's a store for wealthy people who have a personality disorder.

A chef wouldn't bother with an ice cream scoop, Le Creuset, vanilla, or a banneton?

Hipster rationalizations

You aren't willing to admit even to yourself that you prefer the aesthetic of kitchen supply store goods

It's industrial chic, just accept it

Oh, come on. It's not a personality disorder. It's status display. Most people engage in it to one degree or another. It's just that the particular kind of status display WS caters to is that of the McMansion crowd, so if that's not your thing it might strike you as garish instead of "nice".

>Oh please, they don't mark up their items double

Double? No. That was hyperbole. But it's certainly a lot more expensive than other alternatives.

I bought an all-clad copper core 3 qt saucepan three weeks ago. List price was $199. WS wanted to charge me roughly $40 on top of that (tax plus shipping at roughly $20 each). I bought mine from Sur la Table. Shipping was free, and they had a 30% off sale. All said and done it was roughly $100 cheaper than WS.

Last week I bought two Demeyere Atlantis sauciers. Similar situation. WS charges tax and shipping. Instead I bought from Everything Kitchens. No tax, free shipping, a slightly lower list price. Also had 20% off for spending more than a certain amount, plus a free Demeyere sauce pot (admittedly, from a cheaper line than Atlantis, but still not a bad freebie)

>>see a sale on all clad
Actually, I see them often. There's often deals where you "Spend X and get Y % off". Free shipping and no tax are common with many vendors (but not WS). And there's plenty of great deals on all-clad to be found on Ebay, etc, when people re-sell stuff they got as gifts.

>you prefer the aesthetic of kitchen supply store goods
You bet I do, as well as the price. I don't think finding the icons of American upper middle class taste a little tacky makes you a hipster, though.
>It's industrial chic
I think of it as utilitarian, because I'm really not concerned with the aesthetics of my kitchen. To me it's not a room to show off with, but a place to cook meals. If I want to show off I'll let the food I cook there do it.

>I bought an all clad copper core
Your opinion is invalid

>Yeah but I can go to the WS that is 15 minutes

Fair enough. If you need it fast and are willing to pay for that convenience, I can see that. I'm not in that boat though. I don't mind waiting a few days in order to save a lot of cash.

Sorry but aren't you the guy who fucking polishes his cookware? You don't have any ground to stand on here, mr. Instagram. My copper is the color of a 40 year old penny while you stand there sperging over the streaks on your "utilitarian" brushed steel and aluminum and worrying that your Instagram followers might think less of you

I was wondering how long it was going to take before the shitposting started.

>Yeah, no

Actually, yeah. It's a fairly simple calculation. Copper is about twice as effective at heat spreading as aluminum is. So 2.7mm of copper is equal to about 5.4mm of aluminum. The brand I suggested is 6.4mm thick, thus it is about 20% better at heating evenly. Pretty basic math bro.

I'll freely admit doesn't look as fancy though.

I like them because the age better visually. I'm rough on stuff. This is also my first post in the thread so I haven't expressed a dislike for WS stuff. It's out of my tax bracket and I don't like to comment on things I have little experience with even if I did just do so at the beginning of this post.

I just looked it up. It's more expensive, and it isn't lined. Looks nice for some nice uses but it's not really a valid comparison.

Meant to quote

cookware, bakeware, tools/utensils, cutlery, ingredients - aka the majority of WS is on average higher quality, even if the difference in performance is small. the exceptions I can think of are larger electronics like commercial espresso machines and mixers/processors.

>fancy in appearance, lesser is functionality
This is just a dumb generalization poorfags often use because they do not understand diminishing returns, just because it costs more and looks better does not mean it is any less functional. the extra performance does not always correlate with the price difference and that's fine if you can afford it.

There are pros/cons to both but WS IS on average higher quality then the restaurant supply stores I go to.

t. former poorfag

The biggest ripoff in the world are $250 cast iron pans & dutch ovens.

A $25 lodge does the EXACT same thing. Literally no performance differences.

*having said that, I own a shit load of le crueset, cuz its fucking pretty & I get to look down on my neighbors at potlucks*

It's not out of anyone's tax bracket to like quality things. Right now there is about 1000 items on their website under $20. So, though WS has been pretty good with the image projection because they carry high price items, you're just plain ignorant to act like it doesn't have a lot of items for everyone.

Once upon a time, Chuck Williams was a pretty decent James Beard counterpoint type. His niche was more about entertaining in the land of vineyards and San Francisco society, lots of farm to table goodness, and I think his best feature wasn't so different than everyone's (stupid) idol who does Americas Test Kitchen a throw together show when print media died in the dawn of the internet, only Chuck was classy, as James Beard. He wasn't born to riches, in fact, he had a really sucky childhood and slow avenue to success through hard work. It was pre-retirement age that he started his store, and worked til he was 100. Like a lot of successful people ambition and finding the right business idea at the right time, gold!

To this day, if you go out and invest in something you wish to use more, Chuck has a cookbook for that. One pot meals that uses your second pan lidded lecrueset skillet? Pressure cooker meals? For weird items too. Recipes that catered to wine and cheese loving peoples who, yes, could afford some imports too He's not alive anymore though. It's not him on the new stuff. RIP Chuck Williams

It doesn't need to be lined because it's not copper. Copper is toxic so you can't cook most foods in it directly. Thus a copper pot requires a liner. Traditionally that was tin, which has the best cooking performance but it has a couple shortcomings--it will melt if heated above about 430F, and it also wears out which means the pot needs to be re-tinned during its life. A more modern solution is an inner layer of stainless steel. That doesn't wear out or risk melting, but it has worse cooking performance because stainless is a lousy conductor of heat. The thermal conductivity is also hampered by the bonding process between the stainless and the copper, whereas the old-fashioned tin method bonds on a chemical level. Other metals don't have that problem and don't require a liner.

That said, it's hard to beat the durability and convenience of stainless cladding.

Yeah the fry pans are a joke, just sand the cooking surface of a cheaper one before seasoning. target has nice enameled exterior cast iron fry pans with longer handles than Lodge for only $5 more.

I do like the enameled interior of my le creuset Dutch oven though, it was a gift, probably wouldn't buy my own.

You don't need to explain cookware to me, I probably have quite a bit more than you. Cast iron, enameled iron, stainless alu, bare alu, hand tinned cu, electro tinned cu, Teflon alu. Disc, full sidewall, I've got almost everything.

Bare aluminum sucks for acidic foods, meaning it's niche. Don't be so defensive, i said it's nice. But it is niche

How much you own has nothing to do with one's understanding of it.

For example, if you understand cookware I'm questioning why you'd ever buy electroplate copper rather than hand tinned given how fast the former wears out.

Curiosity, it was $15 and much thicker than anything I'd seen. Turns out it's a pretty good pan even without taking the price into account

You sound like a real sperg, t b h

>I've cooked for 14 years, 9 in fine dining, and I know what 3 of those things are.

You should consider a new industry. I can tell your heart isn't in cooking.

>It's a store for wealthy people who have a personality disorder.

Poor people will tell themselves this in a jealous rage, but it shouldn't be listened to.

>The biggest ripoff in the world are $250 cast iron pans & dutch ovens.

Implying that all cast iron cookware isn't a rip off at any price.

Overrated and for middle aged housewives.

I buy most of my kitchen supplies from the local restaurant supply. If I need something very particular, I'll go search it out somewhere else. But, Williams Sonoma and Sur La Table are both overpriced, overrated store for people who watch the Food Network and find recipes on Foodgawker and Pinterest.

least hes honest

>I usually hit restaurant supply shops instead

*tips fedora*

I bet you recommend Victorinox knives to every person, you pretentious faggot

>I buy most of my kitchen supplies from the local restaurant supply

Much wow, such luxury.

What's wrong with Victrinox knives?

Not him but you come the fuck on, you can't tell me that buying a Staub dutch oven is just a status display, it's a straight-up better product. I don't know where else I would buy Staub than WS or amazon. (fuck sur la table)

Staub cast iron has a deeper fit on the lid. also, the lid has little nipples to channel braising condensation.

Its a nice place to get presents for my mom. I get my kitchen stuff from bed bath and beyond and this cooking specialty shop nearby

etc.

I don't know what restaurant supply stores you guys shop at but I haven't exactly found them to be bastions of economy. Brand new kitchen gear is not cheap and I usually leave the restaurant supply having spent $200 or so. Have you ever bought Cambros?

The other thing is that the cheap restaurant gear is expendable *on purpose*. You can of course buy cheap-ass stamped stock pots for your house, but the fact of the matter is that these are made for restaurants to get banged up and replaced. Not to mention that when it comes to conducting and retaining heat, my heavy-bottomed All-clad stuff is better, full stop.

The guy who mentioned hipsterism and restaurant supply is on to something. Especially restaurant supplies open to the public... there is something fishy about shopping there as a non-restaurant owner. You just know that owners are getting much better prices on stuff.

>You just know that owners are getting much better prices on stuff.

Wait, you mean the retailer that's arranging to have the items by you for easy consumption might be paying less for them than he charges you, and isn't just doing it because you're such a wonderful person?

That BASTARD.

Costco used to sell Staub dutch ovens rebranded as Kirkland

Why should I buy a beat em up pan with a stick handle because the line cook is going to use a towel as a handle anyway, and no lining because the restaurant has dedicated tomato pots for that, when I can get a lined pan on Amazon for ten bucks more with a stay-cool handle? The answer is the amazon pan looks "domesticated" and that's totally out of character for my pro-aesthetic no-nonsense kitchen. Only pro stuff for me, you poseur bon appetit housewives! Muh fibrox!
t. Hipster

Honest about cooking on unlined aluminum, yeah

Enjoy your metallic tasting food, I guess

I only know of WS from a reference in Rick and Morty about an apron, and I think a scrapey wooden spoon that Kenji on seriouseats is a big fan of.

I like their Very Best of Europe thing where it showcases all the highend cookware they have that originates from Italy and shit, but its a reminder of how I cant really afford nice things. More of a dedicated purchase than anything, and I'd probably end up buying something from All-Clad or Fissler anyway.

Never seen a brick and mortar store, I imagine it'd be like Sharper Image or something, but for kitchen goodies. And not at all like a restaurant supply store.

Ive been in one
Its pretty homey actually, the one I went to had free samples and I would assume this kinda place would, not like sharper image at all, they feel like an original store. Tho I was kinda overwhelmed at the selection

Wait let me get this straight. You have an autistically cataloged knowledge of "rick and morty" whatever that is, and some youtube channel. You've never seen a Williams Sonoma store in real life. You think Sharper Image is still around even though they vanished from the face of the earth 8 years ago.

What is the size and composition of the rock you live under? Because it must be the size of Cheyenne Mountain.

>What does seekay think of pic related?
deadspin.com/5959212/the-haters-guide-to-the-williams-sonoma-catalog
deadspin.com/the-2013-haters-guide-to-the-williams-sonoma-catalog-1481230580
theconcourse.deadspin.com/the-2014-haters-guide-to-the-williams-sonoma-catalog-1667452305
adequateman.deadspin.com/the-2015-hater-s-guide-to-the-williams-sonoma-catalog-1746862116
It makes me feel great about voting against Mitt Rmoney in 2012.

>And where do everyone buy their kitchen supplies from?
Amazon Warehouse Deals like sane poor people.

Wouldn't a chef be more likely to have a plastic banneton for food safety?

People who don't cook or don't think it's fun have a very short sighted view of cooking
They'll think nothing of spending $80 on scotch twice a month and they think this makes them "classy", but a $150 tool that gives decades of service is for poseur suburban richfags