Sup, Veeky Forums

>high end
>Japanese
Ignore this retard and find a good custom maker.

>good custom maker.

Aren't those all in Japan?

99% of the ones I see in the US make pretty jewellery rather than something functional. (Or maybe that's what OP wants)

This, but buy forty knife sets and send them all out to be professionally sharpened and oiled. Use each knife for six months, honing it as necessary. You now have twenty years of super-sharp knives

Knives that cheap get dull after just a couple days.

>I don't know how to hone a blade

More like: use it to cut three veggies. Hone it. Cut three more veggies. Hone it again. Cut a steak. Hone it. After 2-3 days of this, then you need to sharpen it.

Damascus can simply be a prettier form of San Mai. It serves both form and function.

Just like traditional mud based differential tempering which is Japan's greatest claim to fame.

You know jack shit about custom knife making.
It's one area that the USA and Western Europe have actually got right.

>It serves both form and function.

I disagree. It's pretty much function only.

In the old days the Damascus pattern developed because their knowledge of metallurgy was limited. Because they did not have pure materials the folding technique was used to remove impurities from the steel. The pattern resulted from the primitive method used to remove impurities and people liked it because it looks cool. It still looks cool today.

But from a performance perspective nothing beats modern steels. An electric vacuum furnace produces far better steel than a blacksmith with a forge folding steel over and over again. The best steels come from modern technology. The high-end Japanese makers aren't folding their steel 1000 times or some such bullshit unless you request a pattern welded blade because you like its appearance. They use modern steel from Hitachi (and sometimes Sweden or elsewhere). Some makers (including Japan) do make pattern-welded blades using modern steels. But that's purely for looks.

If you ask me, Japan's claim to fame is the attention to detail. Compare a high-end Japanese knife to a similarly priced western one. The Japanese one will usually look very plain, whereas with the Western one clearly has a lot of "bling".

I'd rather not spend the money on the fancypants handle & silly details when instead that effort could go into the quality of the blade instead.

Get a swiss white whale, best knife I've ever had hands down. Retails for 150-250 dollars.

I admit I'm no expert in Western custom knives, but I do see a lot of them because I deal in knives as a part-time job. Not kitchen knives, but old collectible knives--pocketknives and bowies--mainly from Sheffield. I subscribe to knife publications (in print and online). I travel to knife shows. I seek out knives in antique stores.

That said, I see custom western-made knives often. The one thing that stands out is the "bling" factor. They're nearly always very flashy--colorful and exotic materials in the handle. Fancy pattern-welding in the blade, etc. Yet many times those same knives have a very impractical blade shape. The handle isn't comfortable. The balance is all wrong. When you pick one up (and have some cooking experience) it becomes obvious that the maker knows little if anything about the practical aspects of a kitchen knife. They are making works of art, not functional knives.

Talking with a few of the makers makes this even more clear. I've talked to a few at knife shows and when I talk about custom kitchen knives the first thing they start talking about is what kind of damascus they want to use, or that they found some really cool walrus tusk to use in the handle.

OTOH when I talk to Japanese makers the first things they do is start asking what my height is. How high my cutting board sits above the floor. Exactly what kind of fish I want to fillet. Those things are all practical details that affect the length, weight, balance, etc, of the blade. While they're happy to supply damascus, custom carving, if someone wants it, the primary concern is function, not how cool it's going to look.

Now I do agree that's a generalization, and I am sure there must be some makers who focus on the practical aspects too. But I'm at a loss to name one. Have any suggestions I might check out?

Most of the good ones are
You can find a few in the USA but clappyfats are obsessed with war so it's usually some paracord wrapped abomination that the maker promotes as good for cooking, stabbing wild animals, SERE operator operator, chopping firewood, etc

You want an actual food knife for cooking, Japan's got your back

Go buy a Dexter Russel Chinese style chef's knife and call it a day. They are versatile, sharp and easy to care for. Plus you can use the $1470 left over to buy good food.

The steel sides in San Mai aren't critical. Only the core needs to be meme steel. The sides mostly just need to harden less and be flexible. Ton of steels will suffice for this, including pattern welded.

> The Japanese one will usually look very plain, whereas with the Western one clearly has a lot of "bling".

Just because hammer patterns and mud based differential patterning are traditional doesn't make them any less bling. They aren't necessary for the function, there are different less ostentatious and more cost efficient way of accomplishing the desired function.

...

>The steel sides in San Mai aren't critical.

That's my point. Pattern welded cladding certainly suffices, but it offers no advantage over other choices. And if you're talking a traditional Japanese type of knife it's actually a functional disadvantage, because most pattern-welded steels are more difficult to sharpen than using softer materials.

>>Just because hammer patterns and mud based differential patterning are traditional doesn't make them any less bling

Agreed 100%. But those features aren't typical of Japanese knives at OP's price point. Some have them, but most do not.

I know people who get their panties in a twist over honyaki knives with the mud-based heat treat, but personally, I prefer a kasumi type knife (soft cladding, with a modern steel for the cutting edge). Ideally the cladding will be old wrought iron. Since it's soft it makes sharpening the knife that much easier. And that can easily cost around a grand from a good quality maker. That's no carving, no custom fancy handle, no pattern welding, no mirror polish. All that just adds to the price.

Lel

japanesenaturalstones.com/toyama-noborikoi-kasumi-gyuto-270mm/

The Chinese manufacturer who makes those knives is called "Twin Towers trading" so presumably it's sharp enough to cut through steel beams.

> Now I do agree that's a generalization, and I am sure there must be some makers who focus on the practical aspects too. But I'm at a loss to name one. Have any suggestions I might check out?

There's Ken Onion of course, who designed the Shun knife with the angled/tapered bolster which he was already using on his own knives. Not a fan of his desire to patent everything though.

In my opinion this is the future of western style bolsters (although I'm not sure about the rest of the handle, fucking ugly). Zwilling Pro uses it too and it's very close to the shape of the molded on handles for kitchen supply store knives (Victorinox & Co).

I must admit I've never handled a Ken Onion knife, but the handle looks impractical to me.

The bolster I don't have a problem with. I have a Zwilling Pro paring knife and the angled bolster on that is quite nice.

>>close to the shape of the molded on handle
That worries me. I have a couple Victorinox beaters floating around: an 11" chef's and a flexible boning knife. In my opinion those handles are asking for a "fist grip", not the grip that most cooks use. You can hold them in a pinch grip but I don't think the handle really has the best shape for that.

lel and I thought my budget for a scale was too much.

Ken Onion knives arent bad, the handle shape is a little strange if you are a man with larger hands. It fits my wifes hands very well though so she uses it exclusively.

>the handle shape is a little strange if you are a man with larger hands

Yeah, I don't think that would work for me. I'm 6' 3", and I can easily palm a basketball.

...though they are available custom, right? So if someone wanted they could request a larger handle?

>...though they are available custom, right? So if someone wanted they could request a larger handle?
Dont know, I am fine with a Wa handle so I never bothered to look if they would make a larger handle for the Ken Onion for me.

Shitty Shun

just buy a small chinese boy that can chop up everything for you

>Cut my meat

Try the Sklar Mogen Clamp.

>and have a budget of around $1500 for it
why not buy a used VW golf AND a $10 knife

I would buy more than one.

I could sharpen and do what I need even with a cheap knife, one might dull faster than the other or take me longer to sharpen and hone is all. But you can't know this until you experiment. Get different types, once you get a preference, get a high end one of that type.

/k/ here

get an Al Mar and be happy.

because he's trolling on Veeky Forums

Why are cagers always trying to shove their alternative lifestyle down everyone's throat?

>cagers

Stop smoking crack and get a cheaper knife.

>Or just spend the money you would have on the knife on more crack instead.