Koan #2

Sen no Rikyu, a tea-master, wished to hang a flower basket on a column. he asked a carpenter to help him, directing the man to place it a little higher or lower, to the right or left, until he had found exactly the right spot. "That's the place," said Sen no Rikyu finally.

The carpenter, to test the master, marked the spot and then pretended he had forgotten. Was this the place? "Was this the place, perhaps?" the carpenter kept asking, pointing to various places on the column.

But so accurate was the tea-master's sense of proportion that it was not until the carpenter reached the identical spot again that its location was approved.

>What is your interpretation of this koan?
>What can you learn from it?

Post more wankels

A master of himself cannot be fooled by an average person wanking about, and wankers more often than not lose themselves in their wanking.

what if the master just saw the marking

to analyse koans logically is to take steps away from enlightenment

the whole point is to devoid yourself of human thoughts, and cynical reasoning is quintessentially human

Is this an awkward attempt to concede he made a pertinent point?

It didnt say how he marked the spot so the idea of the master even seeing the mark is questionable. He could've easily just taken a mental note.

>interpreting koans
>learning things from koans
That's a beating.

He remembered the exact spot on a wood board? Mentally? I know these Chings are upper-level but come on.

Its possible, the carpenter would surely be well-learned in measurements an proportion of things just as much as the Master who has a refined awareness by virtue of his practice.

This doesn't have the structure of a typical Zen koan. Zen Koans more usually appear like a joke whose punchline you don't understand. There is usually a moment where conventional language and logic are disturbed.

This is just a story of someone with a good memory.

It is from
>Zen Flesh, Zen Bones: A Collection Of Zen And Pre-Zen Writings
>These stories were transcribed into English from a book called the Shaseki-shu, written late in the thirteenth century... and from anecdotes of Zen monks taken from various books published in Japan around the turn of the present century

>These stories are from one book... and also from various other books that I will not name
Great attribution bro.

And why do they call it "transcribed" rather than "translated"? Are they trying to deny that translation is a thing?

Then there's nothing remarkable in having the sushi master knowing where the spot was, too.

Exactly. Hence the 'point' of the koan.

The Simpsons seems to have done a lot of shit to make people not get this.

Making up a shit story with no point doesn't make one bright or philosophical. It's like you expect people to be trained to maieutic.

>doesn't make one bright or philosophical
It's not either, koans should have a very specific effect on your mental state when you read them, if you are sensitive to what they offer.

master wants to hang flower basket on column
master needs help of carpenter

it seems the spot was both marked by carpenter and master

carpenter needed help with marking the spot though

Meet a tea-master - kill a tea-master.

That gif is missing one stage, the apex seals out stage.

Is the point that the tea master knows where the mark should be regardless of the carpenter's influence? Like there is only one place it could be. So there is only one right path in life?

No. There is no 'meaning' to the koan beyond filling your sense of metaphor with emptiness.

That is an excellent lesson to learn from this koan, yes.