A : Consciousness is a byproduct of the electrical feedback in a neural net and completely a materialistic concept ; Which means an AI when gets sophisticated enough, is conscious.
B : Consciousness is a spiritual concept and exclusively found in humans / animals ; Therefore an AI or anything synthetic will never have consciousness
C : Consciousness is an illusion as in the viewer (you) are the god, the observer and everything there is and everything else is (you)r imagination : Means that no consciousness is truly real.
It's time to make a decision Veeky Forums. Right now more than half of Veeky Forums is in favor of the materialistic interpretation of consciousness.
Honestly, we only have indications. A is the closest we have.
But that's just what we think. We could be doing post hoc ergo propter hoc all the time with the brain, as it is the only thing we cannot really take apart to study the same way we can with a lot of other things. We need to see the reactions while they happen which we can't because they're in our heads.
B and C are nonsense until proven otherwise, I don't really believe in B but I believe consciousness and the soul are separate entities that don't interact at all - so I'm sort of a materialist.
Christian Roberts
>I believe consciousness and the soul are separate entities that don't interact at all >soul
nigga, wat?
Michael Rodriguez
>as it is the only thing we cannot really take apart to study the same way
Lol.
Nathaniel Lopez
Yeah? Well, it's true. Almost all other things we can dissect and study and get all the info we need even though it's taken apart. But in the brain we need to see the specific interactions while it's still functional.
Isaiah James
>What is FMRI?
Sebastian Murphy
You think FMRIs are enough to actually study the brain thoroughly?
James Ward
you know that feeeling when they can resample voice... know splinter or ludwig?
Austin Harris
yeah, I believe in a soul and in god
Dylan Cox
>confocal laser scanning microscopy >beam scanning electron microscopy
Justin Baker
Why?
Asher Howard
Thought experiment for everyone : If you could exactly replicate someones braincells to the atom along with their memory, would you also be replicating their consciousness ?
Carter Flores
It would diverge from the original immediately.
However, it would appear to be identical to us.
Evan Garcia
No reasons that you would respect or consider.
Leo James
Make D) Consciousness is natural occurrence in all systems (biological or artificial) once they pass a certain level of complexity.
Kevin Rogers
That's already covered by A, you pleb.
Anthony Murphy
It's definitely C. I know it's subjective but thats the only option I know for a fact that it's real.
Levi Nguyen
C is literally solipsism, you fucktard.
Robert Bell
A states in in terms of a 'feedback', whatever the fuck that actually means
There exists a D, that which is probably materialistic, but is not a feedback, and one we cannot speculate on further
Jaxon Mitchell
how is that contradict to what I said fucktard
Josiah Barnes
A and C, B will likely also be correct because the nukes are overdue
Gavin Lee
If you think consciousness has anything to do with magic spooky skeleton voodoo mysticism, you need to leave Veeky Forums right now and never come back.
t. AI researcher
David Gray
I really dig the way you presented Data to back that up.
Christopher Hughes
...
Brandon Long
Watcha working on?
Josiah Parker
Vector spaces. Lots of vector spaces.
Bentley Ross
>t. AI researcher you and every other cs undergrad looking for internet cred
Henry Wright
It's okay user, let the butthurt flow through you. It's okay to make things up and call names as long as it makes you feel better.
Nathan Morgan
>It's okay to make things up [...] as long as it makes you feel better. practicing what you preach i see
Brody Bell
Your definition of materialism is too restrictive. For example, John Searle would fully disagree with A, yet he is a materialist.
I would instead define materialism (or physicalism) as "All mental states are contingent upon physical states. All causal mechanisms of mental states can be reduced to physics"
Lucas Clark
Any other baseless, angry accusations you would like to make kiddo?
Asher Allen
Conciousness is created by the feedback loop. By our ability to think about our thoughts. Without this loop we would simply be zombies.
Gabriel Nelson
This precisely. Fucking finally somebody else get it.
This is why recurrent neural networks, with their internal state, give rise to consciousness. This is also why thought vectors represent internal state.
Lincoln Russell
World is fundamentally ideas - consciousness although supported by neurons and their feedback seems to be a field. Or rather it seems to be suggested by nature itself that we are a simulation - possible computer one.
Blake Perry
lol
Jace Gutierrez
>he doesn't read the papers coming out of Google Deepmind get a load of this pleb
Wyatt Torres
show me the deepmind paper that says RNNs give rise to consciousness
Christopher Bennett
What we need is a pill that turns the person unconscious for one hour after each use - then take it when in severe pain or when close to death to not be aware of disappearing.
Luke Russell
They're not the ones who discovered it. They're just using it to do stuff.
They allow networks to think about thinking, by responding to patterns in their own state.
Brody Jackson
these have nothing to do with what i asked for
Samuel Williams
and now i know why; you literally linked the first two results on google for "recurrent neural network consciousness"
arguing on Veeky Forums in a nutshell holy fuck
Brody Evans
There were some specific papers, but I can't be assed to find them at the moment since I'm busy. :^)
Justin Green
yeah i'm sure that intro to java assignment is keeping you real occupied
god damn consciousness threads are pathetic
David Clark
Even though Kurzweil is a crank, he gave some talks that offered some insight into what Deepmind was working on and how they were making use of recurrent neural networks to emulate conscious behavior. Maybe start by looking there.
Cooper Miller
Both A and C are correct, it's a property so it doesn't matter if you think it's there or not, it's defined based on it's effects. This is how properties of a system work.
Asher Perry
you are one dense mother fucker
just do me a favor and stop calling yourself an AI researcher on the internet
Gavin Mitchell
I haven't seen one instance of NNs producing conscious behavior. Very good behavior in very limited situations that they are pre-configured for, yes, but not general conscious behavior. Best I have seen is by symbolic AI projects like Cog, Watson and Cyc. This statistics approach is good for problems where you know what the solution is and want to make a system that can reproduce it, but when you don't know what the solution is, or there is a possibility that there is no best solution or the solution is ambiguous, symbolic logic is what is used, which is why symbolic systems are what is actually getting somewhere in regards to knowledge bases, and statistical systems are stuck automating engineering work
Daniel Cox
That's pretty basic. Kalman filters?
Henry Brooks
Has the consciousness been measured as quantized bits ever? Has this been proven somehow?
Nolan Robinson
not yet
Hudson Jenkins
We have no proof of 'spiritual' concepts and gods. We do have proof (as much as it can exist) of material phenomena. Therefore it is more likely to be the latter. That's all that can really be said. You can't currently prove that anything is conscious, except yourself, to yourself. So who fucking knows.
Evan Green
>studying dead, freeze-dried, metal-sprinkled brain tissue not good enough
why do you think there's an arbitrary threshold? that doesn't make any sense. According to your theory, almost anything has consciousness (a single neuron, anything that could act as a neuron etc)
Jordan Perry
are you people joking? HOW THE FUCK IS THAT EVEN POSSIBLE?
You need to define consciousness.
Sebastian Hernandez
>implying my SQL database hasn't achieved hard consciousness Do you even read popsci weekly bro
Nolan Perry
>172 total votes so far so good ;)
Nathaniel Williams
how do you measure an immaterial concept ?
consciousness will never be able to get proven by science due to its nature
Ethan King
fake screenshot
Jack Nguyen
If you believe in unique human perspectives you LITERALLY believe in a soul and shouldn't be on Veeky Forums. It's amazing how many people delude themselves into thinking they follow logic, but then throw it all out when asked a question like You aren't unique. You aren't special. Your life isn't the beginning of anything, and your death isn't the end of anything.
Jacob Flores
Surprisingly Omnipotence is in the first place with 55% on 308 votes
