How do I get better at debate?

how do I get better at debate?

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read cicero

I just have extreme confidence in what I say, even if it's all wrong
it's called lying to yourself

is there any work of his I should focus on/start with?

Against average people, all you have to do is methodically pick apart their arguments. You don't even really have to explain your own beliefs because they'll be so exhausted by defending their views that they give up or forget about yours. More and more of their retorts will be fixated on attacking you personally. They no longer see the argument. It's only you that they wish to destroy. More capable opponents will mostly ignore any attempt at a debate. They don't even want to enlighten you, who they will likely consider beneath themselves, but will simply laugh you off. these mediocre types will only engage an opponent who doesn't have the mental faculties to win. They rely on their friends to validate their claims and badger the opponent. Only truly intelligent people seek a worthy opponent and there are very few of those indeed.

Read Stirner.

You can defend any position if you follow his word.

this seems like the case sadly

>opponent
lul
intelligent people seek to learn

>actually debating in today's cultural climate

unless you're an academic, arguing with someone will not change their opinion, even if they lose. You may feel satisfaction from winning, but it will be fleeting when you realize nothing tangible has been gained from it

A battle between opposing ideas is one of the best ways to find the truth. It's basic reasoning that traces back to Socrates.
I've managed to convince some people to change their thinking when it comes to politics. Not very many, sure, but enough that I think it's worth improving the skill.

as someone who is pretty good at convincing people I'd say the key is not to actually overtly disagree with them as they will just put up a mental wall (this is especially true for young leftists who will immediately dismiss you as a naughty thinker), especially if your plan is just to blast them with facts and statistics
instead look for the very basic core of their argument and focus on that, but frame it as a discussion and slowly introduce your point of view

This, to be honest. It took me long, but eventually I realized it's really not worth debating most people.
Now I just debate myself.

Familiarise yourself with you-know-who.

*tips fedora*

actually winning debates (in the eye of the audience) is all about establishing yourself as a cool, well-meaning, virtuous person and your opponent as misguided or malignant

this has always been true, much to the sadness of autistic rationalists who actually believes the average person cares about minute details of complex studies

Read The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument by Schopenhauer.

coolhaus.de/art-of-controversy/

Example: Stratagem XV
>If you have advanced a paradoxical proposition and find a difficulty in proving it, you may submit for your opponent's acceptance or rejection some true proposition, the truth of which, however, is not quite palpable, as though you wished to draw your proof from it. Should he reject it because he suspects a trick, you can obtain your triumph by showing how absurd he is; should he accept it, you have got reason on your side for the moment, and must now look about you; or else you can employ the previous trick as well, and maintain that your paradox is proved by the proposition which he has accepted. For this an extreme degree of impudence is required; but experience shows cases of it, and there are people who practise it by instinct.

devilish tactic

>A battle between opposing ideas is one of the best ways to find the truth. It's basic reasoning that traces back to Socrates.
what a misunderstanding
the battle is between the idea and doubt. an alternative idea is actually completely extraneous.

>real time debates
Absolute, complete 100% trash. The only time you should EVER do them is if you are at a meme school like Harvard to pad your resume. Otherwise just lurk peer review journals like all other adults.

yes, if you're arguing with an intelligent person

having tried this a bit myself with some success, it's even better when you pretend not to be very informed on the subject, at least in the beginning. Treat it as if they are teaching you there perspective while waiting for a weak point to expose itself. If they're wrong, it WILL expose itself eventually.

Become ENTJ

What kind of?

If you mean like, real life debates with normal people, you need to debate in real life. You need to be able to sound convincing and pleasant enough and say things right the first time (preferably). You can't annoy people, if you do, they will stop caring about the argument itself.

Basically though, I have two "strategies" that I might use when I encounter a need to debate with someone:

1. Present my own stance well, thus making them accept it at least as an option, if not the absolute right. Works for easy or technical subjects, the kind of stuff where they can't really argue your facts.

2. Focus on their stance and rather than really argue it, ask more about it, doubt it a bit, but don't offer any "clear" counterarguments. Make them realize their error or develop their view. When doing this, use a lot of "one might say", "it could be said" and such, to not create a "me vs him" situation for them.

The second option is usually better. People tend to like it when you're interested in what they have to say.

>obtaining your victory by proving how absurd he is

Not anymore

This, but as an intelligent person I really don't like to "argue"; I prefer to discuss.

There are no intelligent people.

good man

>politics

if a debate has an audience, the outcome has already been decided

Start carrying a crossbow on your back when you're about to debate someone. They'll agree with you as you start to become visibly unhinged. It's literally the only way to win an argument.

present, refute, rebuild


practice as much as possible, watch debates on youtube

Does he ever mention accusing your opponent of being ironic as a tactic?

And suck. Ah, the tasty bait

Don't get hung up on facts and numbers; they're meaningless to most people. Speak from personal, anecdotal experience, and try to strike a balance between being confident and humble.

>how do I get better at debate?

Move to Canada.