TOM BOMBADIL

What was the fucking point?

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Welcome to my forest of faggotry

Whimsy, you tit.

twas a bedtime story that he told his kids and put in his book cause he liked it.

youtube.com/watch?v=CmEsCKAb7r0

this vid

Some things are beyond human or hobbit understanding

made me think

Worldbuilding and adding a hint of mystery

lol imagine how the tone of that first movie would have changed from they put this nigger in it. like fuck. if I was frodo I would have asked that cunt to come with me.

I assumed, once I read the Silmarillion, that Bombadil was a Maia who stayed in Middle-earth while tacitly agreeing not to take sides with either the wizards or Sauron. I have never liked his role in the book because he was too obviously a deus ex machina. Wikipedia claims he was a separate bedtime story that Tolkien included in "The Lord of the Rings" which does explain the incongruity of his existence in the longer work.

>deus ex machina
But he doesn't do anything

He does in the forest and Downs. The hobbits are totally useless in both situations where in their later scrapes, they at least play some role.

He was Sauron's unconscious alter ego

did either of the blues do anything significant ever?

>blues

The wizards? I don't recall without googling. Maybe one went to the dwarves? I really don't remember.

Aren't there huge chunks of Tolkien's notes and plans about Arda that his son is still organizing and releasing? Maybe the plans for the blues are in there.

In editing, the reason given to keep Tom in was to give an impression (as the Silmarillion does) that there are other stories going on during the years of the Ring War, and that while it looks like the end of days for all of Middle Earth, it's really just a local problem for three human kingdoms, one elven one, and two dwarf ones.
They go to fight Sauron's boss Morgath in the far east. The presence of east men in Sauron's armies suggests they failed.

Your first response is great your second response made me re-read your first just to make sure...

There's a theory that Tom Bombadil is actually Eru Ilúvatar sitting in the woods to watch his creation in secret.

That's a terrible theory. A better theory is that he is morgoth an even better theory is that he is the personification of the earth

But Morgoth is out in the Void by the time of LOTR...

>A better theory is that he is morgoth
No, because Tom Bombadil very obviously possesses some power that he chooses not to use. Morgoth wouldn't do such a thing, he would use all of his power to fuck up as much shit as possible, and he certainly wouldn't help the people who are trying to kill his servant Sauron.

>an even better theory is that he is the personification of the earth
That one doesn't make any sense at all.

...

It's funny, you'd expect a movie series to pump up the power levels of its protagonists, but compared to the books the movie versions of the characters are kind of nerfed. Elves are insanely powerful in the books, and even Aragorn is several times more impressive in the books than he is in the movies, though it's much more subtle. Don't even get me started on Gandalf.

Or is he. Where and what is/ are the doors of night? My theory is that it's a mental inhibitor that suppresses the mind and power of morgoth. He doesn't remember the past or who or what he is just that he is "tom"

A morgoth that doesn't know he's morgoth wouldn't do any such thing.

Why doesn't the incarnation of earth make sense? Inanimate objects have been known to become sentient or have projected themselves into reality, why not earth itself

Because in tolkien's universe the earth isn't really a thing, it's everything. If he's the incarnation of everything, then that's pretty much the same thing as him being Eru Ilúvatar.

I don't remember middle-earth being the be all and end all of everything.

Eru is outside the dimension of middle-earth as are the valar and valinor. Middle-earth was created using the flame imperishable but it was removed and hidden once it was completed, the main reason why morgoth could not find it

Are you talking about all of Arda, or just Middle-Earth specifically ?

Middle-earth as in landmass. I see where I fucked up, yes i meant a personification of Arda

>They go to fight Sauron's boss Morgath in the far east. The presence of east men in Sauron's armies suggests they failed.

Yeah, that does ring a bell. I don't remember there being much at all about them in the appendices or Silmarillion.

Well Arda and everything in it is a creation of Ilúvatar, so wouldn't Ilúvatar be the closest thing to a personification of it ? in the same way that God would be a personification of the universe.

No, God has existed before any and all creation so he isn't (cannot be) a personification of any one thing. Everything might stem from him but they are removed/detached from him, Arda is merely an object/model/tool that may have been created by eru but would possess a sentience of its own.

The sentience may come to existence by the will of God but it would still be detached from God and have free will (to a degree) to do as it pleases

>I might put it this way. The story is cast in terms of a good side, and a bad side, beauty against ruthless ugliness, tyranny against kingship, moderated freedom with consent against compulsion that has long lost any object save mere power, and so on; but both sides in some degree, conservative or destructive, want a measure of control. But if you have, as it were, taken 'a vow of poverty', renounced control, and take your delight in things for themselves without reference to yourself, watching, observing, and to some extent knowing, then the questions of the rights and wrongs of power and control might become utterly meaningless to you, and the means of power quite valueless...

>It is a natural pacifist view, which always arises in the mind when there is a war ... the view of Rivendell seems to be that it is an excellent thing to have represented, but that there are in fact things with which it cannot cope; and upon which its existence nonetheless depends. Ultimately only the victory of the West will allow Bombadil to continue, or even to survive. Nothing would be left for him in the world of Sauron.

He could be Tolkien's way of insinuating that God was distant and indifferent to the suffering of his creations, and wholly unwilling to lift a finger outside of his own realm, Heaven?

I mean... the dude fought in the Somme. That might have really introduced some doubts as to the existence of a loving deity.

That is a very interesting take user.

amazing character

Hmm. I like this a lot.

If I recall correctly, Tolkien was a Roman Catholic and a close friend of C.S. Lewis.

Right on both counts. He was actually instrumental in Lewis' conversion to Christianity.

Tolkien was absurdly devout, and his entire universe is only fully understood when you take his Catholicism into consideration.

Excellent thought.

In my interpretation, Tom Bombadil is the personification of nature, which exist indifferent of human endeavors or catastrophes. Tolkien always expressed in his letters his devotion to nature.
I like this character, anyone who misses the simplicity of the Bombadil persona, misses Tolkien's imaginative creation.

I've seen a theory that stated he was actually the Vala Aulë, the paralels being drawn out is that both possess huge power yet refuse to use it and the love for creation
In my view Tom is probably an entity deliberately made enigmatic by Tolkien, which clearly transcends the elves, hobbits, men and dwarfs, to reinforce the timelessness aspect of middle-earth as the war of the ring is not THE WAR but a war out of many that have taken place, that whether Sauron wins or not middle-earth will remain and this is purely a quest for the races which can be slain

tom bombadil's post modern analysis:
youtube.com/watch?v=7GpT6ycHoMA

I think he is a crippled morgath but I'll take this too.

Deep magic, probably. Or he just wanted to entertain his kids, I don't fucking know.

The Silmarilion is the best Tolkin work anyway.

In early drafts, they went to the east and turned bad; there was a Blue wizard cult started by them. In the later drafts, they were instrumental to the success of the Fellowship in some Just-As-Planned way which I can't remember.

What no it's a fucking shit interpretation.

What's wrong with you.

>not Children of Hurin

I think in a letter Tolkien characterized him as 'the spirit of the vanishing countryside of Oxfordshire and Berkshire' or some such. Presumably he sort retreat from the modern industrial world in Middle Earth much as Tolkien did.

>the spirit of the vanishing countryside of Oxfordshire and Berkshire
Well he's not wrong. There's fucking nothing here.

Tom Bombaddil explained by Chris Tolkein (son of jrr) in interview:
youtube.com/watch?v=7GpT6ycHoMA

Tolkien said about Bombadil that there are always supposed to be some mysteries.

Really, though, Tom was just a representation of the purity of nature and the whimsical forrests around the Shire.

user, we can see what you're posting. We don't need to click it.

THE CRINGIEST MANCHILD ON THIS ENTIRE WEBSITE GETS 0-100 MAD IN THE BUTT OVER A YOUTUBE VIDEO AND HAS MIDLIFE CRISIS BREAKDOWN ON THIS ENTIRE PLANET (THE ANONYMOUS RANT)

They're only mentionedioned in one or two of Tolkien's letters, and I think he changed his mind about what they did. I can't remember anything in the fiction itself.

Whoa

>My theory is that it's a mental inhibitor that suppresses the mind and power of morgoth
Where do you get that idea from?

'Beard of Legend' :(

I don't think there's meant to be an ultimate reason to Tom Bombadil, there are certainly elements and themes we can see in him and draw our own conclusions, but he doesn't represent something in particular. In that way he encompasses Tolkien's ideas about mythology and dislike of analogy in fiction (note I'm not saying he's meant to REPRESENT Tolkien's thoughts). Tom Bombadil is a fairy in the traditional sense, he's not of this reality and doesn't exist in the world in the same way other things do. While there's things we can find applicable to life in Tom, he's entirely his own thing. That's similar to Tolkien's stated view on myth: it doesn't represent something real one to one, but people can draw their own inspiration from it.

The most intriguing thing about Tom Bombadil for me doesn't occur when he's directly helping the hobbits. Its at the Council of Elrond,after all histories were laid out and present circumstances discussed,the question of What to Do with the One Ring comes at last to table. And Tom turns out to be in all the legends of the Elves,Dwarves and Men from time immemorial, and everyone is flabbergasted to learn the Hobbits stumbled across him. And not only that,the collected Wise of Middle Earth think first to let Tom guard the ring. But Gandalf dissuades them,knowing him best,and considering that Gandalf chooses to meet with him during Many Partings,so it seems they have met before. As to "what" he is,I am less acquainted with Tolkien mythology to properly classify him,but I seem to recall a relationship between the Maia of Earth and of Plants,or something. Considering Tom has an Elf hottie,both may be ishtari-like manifestations of these demigods and took up residence in the lands,kicking about and becoming legends in spite of themselves.

Tom = Tolkien

this will make u think

Tolkien = beren

Beren = bears

Bears = Beowulf

To show that powerful being did exist but it had to be left to the mortals.

He hangs out in the woods and eats psychedelic mushrooms all day. How is that "nothing"?

You can live a happy, idyllic life in the woods like your ancestors, but the great evil will have to be confronted by someone.

The point was there was no point. Bombadil is only there to be a mystery.

>point

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

Dat vid

Bears = beets

Daily reminder that Lord of the Rings is a cuck critique of Nietzsches philosoph. Morgoth represents the Will to Power in it's purest form.

HE DID NOTHING WRONG

Even as that is true, his actions in The Children of Hurin are just fetishistic spite.

I like your theory, but Tolkien explicitly said LOTR doesn't consist of allegories.

I like Tom because he's the only one who's still around today.

Goldberry was drained and they built as Asda over her. :(

contextualization of the inherent horror of the journey against a backdrop which is at once whimsical, benevolent, and suspicious-- in fact one of the more compelling sections of Fellowship because it's a place where the renowned, bepedestaled idealism of the Good shares a thin border with the dangerous, exploitative Bad. Bombadil's forest remains dangerous, it is not the pacified glades where the elves reside but a twisting place of horrors. And so Bombadil's generosity is, unlike similar scenes elsewhere, beset by the tension of their mission's reality in full force, and it is unclear what exactly you as the reader are supposed to feel about the section. This is what makes him unpopular; Bombadil is ambiguous where (we expect) Middle Earth is always overt and strictly idealist, and so the dissonance is not taken for its own sake but seen as something outside the nature of the story itself. This, if viewed in a different light, is also the strength of the Bombadil section.

nietzche's philosophy is a cuck critique of nietzche's philosophy, cuck

shitposting at its finest

if you take all the meme speak away is actually correct. Most of nietzche's philosophy is a critique of himself and his philosophy.

Bombadils my fav LotR character for sure because my fav thing in books is wit, whimsy, songs and frolicking behavior, and his character is full to the brim of it. Every passage is like one of those scenic forest hikes, you turn the page & POP you get a face woodland merry-making and you fall back cackling. The mad mind, the crack genius, to do it! and then you think hmmm whats he gonna do next, this trickster, and you pick the book back up and BZZZZZZZZZZ you get an amusing story about bees and Hahahahahah you've been pranked again by the old bombsmeister, that card. "Ringa-a-ding-dillo!” he says, laughing yukyukyukyuk. Watch him as he shoves a pair of yellow boots right up into his knees and displays em for you- left, right, center- "Hey, come derry doll! Hop along my hearties!” Pulls out a song. "Ho-ho!" Laughing merrily. And you're on your ass again laughing as he snaps his blue jacket, exits stage right, and appears again hauling a fair river-daughter of spring.

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