There's a law where i live that they have to put the calories on menus now

>i have nothing to say but am compelled to post

*anything* the government does is a costly process.

What the fuck? Are you retarded?

Medical student here, obesity is a huge concern. Measures like this to help keep the general public informed about how much they're eating is a great step in slowing down the obesity epidemic. It's not going to be a huge change, but education and information are more powerful than any medication.

Also, I've been on this site for 10 years, I don't think I've seen a post as stupid as yours. And I started on /b/. Good job man.

>but education and information are more powerful than any medication.

Agreed. So why don't we educate people so they can estimate and count calories on their own. That way they can apply it to any and all food that they see, rather than being limited to a fast food menu.

It's the old "teach a man to fish...." parable.

No it isnt

The fact they did something potentially useful is in fact not a waste of money

sounds a lot more expensive than putting numbers on a menu you fucking retard.

The only use I ever got out of it was when I was trying to gain weight. Even then I memorized the caloric content of the Egg White Delights (which were 2 for $3.33), so listing calories was a lost cause after all

>they can estimate and count calories on their own
don't kid yourself, most people wouldn't be able to estimate calories right

How so? Add it to the mandatory curriculum at school. Problem solved with one legal change.

Though even if it was more costly, at least the money would be well spent.

>Measures like this to help keep the general public informed about how much they're eating is a great step in slowing down the obesity epidemic

Lmao stay in school. I work in medicine and I can tell you that the only numbers that people care about are the prices. The "calories" are arbitrary numbers that people ignore because they fucking hate math and won't add it up unless someone does it for them.

Stop acting like a cock-gobbling thundercunt and go back to studying your anatomy book, bitch

Lol youre fucking retarded

>whine about money
>use this completely inefficient even costlier thing to solve the problem

Retard

Agreed, although to be fair, studies so far have found negligible effect; less than 10% of consumers alter ordering at all based on posted calories, and they don't alter by much.

What's interesting though is that the law seems to have a much larger effect on restaurants than on consumers, as restaurants become self-conscious about some high calorie offerings (e.g. fast food breakfast combos in the 1500-2000 calorie range). As a result, they reduce portions, recipes or offerings prior to the posting laws go into effect, and presumably that self-consciousness would last while the law lasts.

On the other hand, restaurants are also find sneaky ways around disclosing realistic calorie counts. For example, Subway posted calories prominently on their napkins years before New York's posting laws went into effect, but they made cheese and sauces "optional" on their sandwiches, listed 6" subs calorie counts instead of more commonly-ordered 12" subs, and used unrealistically small quantities of condiment portion sizes in their fine print, so a ham sandwich might be 1000 calories higher than what they list on the napkin, even if you don't buy extras like avacado, bacon, or extra cheese.

>Add it to the mandatory curriculum at school

Have you seen the filth that "graduates" from public high schools? I knew a kid who showed up 1/4th of the time and graduated with barely-adequate grades.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink, so stop trying to prove that we can solve the obesity problem with anything other than hazing and humiliation

>Lol youre fucking retarded
>>youre
>>retarded

Indeed.

I'll explain so perhaps you might understand. Placing calories on fast food signs doesn't "Solve" anything. It only provides a little information for one specific thing. OTOH teaching people to estimate this on their own now means they can apply that information to each and every meal they eat. All of them. Not just fast food. It's a far broader, more complete, solution. That justifies its higher cost.

Again, it's the "teach a man to fish....." parable.

>estimate calories on their own
How the fuck do you expect anyone to ascertain the ratios of fiber, sugar, protein, and fat in any food they don't make themselves?

>so stop trying to prove that we can solve the obesity problem

I don't think it can ever be solved.

But if we're going to make an attempt at it, we should make the best attempt possible.

Wish I had this law.
>Go to restaurant
>order food
>No idea how many calories I just consumed
>Either don't eat the rest of the day or eat risking gaining calories

It would involve a lot more time and effort for Joe Six Pack to estimate what exactly is in his McChicken than for McDonald's to post the information.

At home, this is incredibly valuable and I agree with you. But I'm not going to go up to the fry cook and about how lean the burger is. This is a much better idea.

Did I strike a nerve?

This is a step in the right direction as a whole. We need to educate the general populace if we want to ensure better health outcomes. From understanding how to manage diabetes to counting calories properly, education is always key.

I'm not going to say that this is the end all be all. But knowing your calorie intake is essential to managing your weight and therefore avoiding the health complications that accompany excess body habitus. This is a start.

I don't know what you do in medicine, but I pray that you have limited patient interaction. You sound like a right cunt and I'm betting that you're some faggot MA or EMT who thinks he knows everything while the scribes in the ED have surpassed your knowledge a long time ago.

Read a fucking book about public health once in a while, and for the love of Allah don't be such a jaded asshole.

Those are all fair points. Although, I've always felt that if you're walking into a fast food joint you probably don't pay too much mind to your calorie intake. At least in that particular instance in time. Having this information out there does no harm though, it informs the consumer and may make the producer more aware of how calorically dense their food is.

The effects on restaurants is interesting, I'll look more into that. Thank you.

By looking at it and using their brain. There are a few methods that are common:

1) Memorize the caloric value of certain things and then compare what you're ordering to that. That's what I used to do when I was watching my calories on a cut cycle. For example, a typical 1/4 lb hamburger patty is about 300 calories. A fried chicken thigh is 420 calories. Etc.

2) This one is harder, but more universal. Carbs and protein are 4 calories per gram. Fat is 9 cals/gram. Estimate the amount of each in the food and do math.

3) Smartphone app. Just look up the foods you're considering and it will tell you the calories. There's even apps to log your diet, etc. Those apps also have name-brand foods in there, so you could look up a "Big mac meal" or a "#7 from Taco Bell", etc.

Shut the fuck up dude do you actually think you're a rebel? You're fucking psychotic.

I do the third but when you go to a real restaurant you have no idea how many calories the garbage nachos have

Did you realize that the calorie counts on menus has actually induced people to buy HIGHER caloric foods? Peltzman Effect in full force.

>do you actually think you're a rebel?

The opposite, actually. I think this is basic shit that any adult should know. Knowing this isn't special or praiseworthy, it ought to be expected.

But you can estimate the volume of cheese, the amount of chips, etc. Or you can find something similar on your phone app and pick that. Close enough is good enough in this case.

>i didn't know that costco poutine had 1500 calories until a few days ago

It's a fuck hueg dish of french fries, cheese curds, and gravy, what did you think it was?

Holy fuck you're stupid even by Veeky Forums standards.

>he doesn't use a bomb calorimeter on all his food

care to explain your point or are you just going to shitpost?

Did you even read?
1. Memorizing foods is different than estimating, though it's useful in comparing similar foods the problem exists where some places use wildly different or unexpected ingredients or cooking methods.
2. This is exactly what I was asking and you answered by saying "Estimate calories by estimating calories" Thanks a lot, very helpful. I guess I must be the retard if I can't tell how many grams of each macronutrient something is.

3. If we're gonna just look up the fucking calories, why do we need to learn how to estimate shit? Also what good does that do at any non-chain restaurant?

>Close enough is good enough
No it's fucking not, people consistently underestimate the calories they eat

I hope you tip your local McBusiness workers

Only if you order nothing but plain chicken or beef can you just guess shit. Fast food places love to use 'special' sauces which can have huge amounts of calories, they also put sugar in fucking everything

>Memorizing foods is different than estimating

No, it's a tool you can use to estimate by comparing the unknown item to known similar things.

. This is exactly what I was asking and you answered by saying "Estimate calories by estimating calories"

You seem to have missed the point then. It's estimating calories by estimating mass or volume.

>>hanks a lot, very helpful. I guess I must be the retard if I can't tell how many grams of each macronutrient something is.

Not a retard, just ignorant. Read up. Look at some foods and read the labels. You'll figure it out pretty damn quick.

>3. If we're gonna just look up the fucking calories, why do we need to learn how to estimate shit?

I was listing a variety of methods you could use. Personally I think the estimating method is faster since you can do it in your head without needing to whip out your phone. But other people may not agree so the phone is another option.

>>Also what good does that do at any non-chain restaurant?
Refer back to what we discussed earlier. You find a similar food. For example, suppose you were at a mom-n-pop place and were considering a hamburger with fries. Well, Mom-and-pop isn't in the phone app, but a similar burger from McDonalds, Five Guys, etc, is. Pick what's the closest, use that. Sure it's not 100% accurate but it doesn't need to be. It's close enough to get the point across.

Then they can work to correct their estimation skills. My point was that the numbers don't need to be exact down to the last calorie, +/- 10% error would be negligible here.

How so? You break it down.
Estimate calories for the piece of chicken. Does it have a fatty sauce on it? Estimate calories for the sauce. Repeat.

Worst case just assume the sauces are 100% fat, that way you'll be erring on the safe side no matter what.

Christ, it's like I'm dealing with a pile of imbeciles here. This isn't hard.

>Erring on the safe side
>Just estimate everything with terrible accuracy instead of having them tell you what you are being sold

Sure. Better to know how to do that for every one of your meals rather than being spoon-fed the information every once in a while.

You don't know you are estimating you retard

Actually, I'm quite good at it. I worked in the seafood department of a grocery store for my first job. You learn pretty fucking quick when it's your job to deal with request like:

"I want dozen 4 oz pieces of salmon please"
"gimme 3/4 of a pound of shrimp",
etc, all day long.

The worst was our butcher station right next to where I worked. Fortunatley I didn't have to work it, but we had a repeat customer who came in four days a week. Every day he'd ask for a NY strip steak that weighed five-eights of a pound. And he was super autistic about it. If the scale came up 0.635 then that was too heavy, he didn't want it. 0.615? Nope. Too light. Cut another one. The butchers hated that guy, but they usually were able to eyeball the cut perfectly the first time.

Lol no you shut the fuck up. Because of people like you we have 100s of new regulations to tackle every new year. Nanny state pussy be a man and fight for freedom.

>dealing with imbeciles

So do I have to use a calculator? How do I do that? The layout just looks like numbers with strange looking symbols.

I just eat whatever
t. fat fuck

What the fuck do you think that society is a dough ball for people who are medical and policy experts to shape because they 'know ' better. Why on earth should it be illegal not to display caloric details. Do think humans should create laws to hold their hands through the theme park Of life. In Australia because of morons like you it's illegal not to wear a helmet when riding a bike. Who thinks they have the right to tell anyone if a helmet is mandatory or not.

You think yourself smarter than policy makers and individuals who throw their lives away to meticulously study medicine?

Do you want to be a fucking vegetable because your bike slipped in the rain and you weren't wearing a helmet?

Are you so selfish that you'd make your family suffer, and needlessly clog up the medical system because you couldn't be fucked to put on a helmet?

Are you so cavalier that your own health means nothing to you? Keep in mind, for those living in a single payer system, your fellow citizens are paying for YOUR healthcare.

There are people who just get cancer or other terminal illnesses out of pure bad luck. You're purposefully worsening your own health outcomes by not wearing a helmet.

That's what I think about when stupid fucks complain about having to wear a helmet.

Preventative medicine is best medicine. You may be young, stupid, and think you're invincible, but look at some poor fucking kid who has leukemia and could never enjoy that stupidity. Laws like these are in place because they're clinically proven to help you and keep you healthy so you can contribute to society.

And fuck off, the numbers don't fucking affect you one bit. You're probably too stupid to even read them.

>contribute to society

Do you really think someone stupid enough to not wear a helmet or seatbelt is going to contribute to society?

>tinfoil hat wearing neighbor pissed off because his riding lawnmower has a kill switch if he gets off the seat, jury rigs it to bypass. One day, steps off his mower to grab a stick and his mower runs into his pond. I had to bring my truck with a winch down to his place to retrieve it from the bottom of his pond. Smart.

Yes I do. There is an incredible demand for ditch diggers and human lab subjects.

I'm sorry about your neighbor, I hope he is okay.

Nah, man. You're retarded.

I bet you're fat.

Not even joking here, he was killed last year in a motorcycle wreck not wearing a helmet. He'd retired two years before and was set to enjoy himself. Sad really, because although he was a tinfoil wearing loonie, he was a really good neighbor who wouldn't hesitate to help people out.

Who gives a shit if they put calories or not on the thing. It's not like fatasses are going to care

This

>in my senior seminar class
>fat girl waddles in 5 minutes late drinking a large caramel frappe from McDonalds

YEAH OP BE A MAN , WHY HAVE YOU NOT KILLED ALL OF THE GOVERMENT JEWS YET ? HOW DARE THEY PUT USEFUL NUMBERS THAT ONLY AFFECT YOU IN A GOOD WAY ? , HAHA FUCK THEM

You are definitely not a doctor. I assume you push drugs so that obese people feel less sad

>gov't tries to do something small to influence peoples' healthy eating choices and hopefully reduce the healthcare spending with preventative steps
GOVWRNMENT OVEREEEEEHC

OBAMA GET OFF MY DOLLAR MENU

What the fuck is a biscuit because it means something else here.

a soda-y bread alternative to a bagel or english muffin

FUCK ROADS

Over here a biscuit is a sugar snank you dip in your Tea, about the size of a tea cup or mug.

>English muffin

We don't have them

Also what is gravy as over here it a thick meat stock poured over beef, lamb or chicken.

Browsing Veeky Forums has certainly opened my eyes to how the New World eat and i thought they were all just memes.

>Canada's national dish comes in packaging from America.

that's more of a meme national dish

and james lewis kraft was canadian

gravy is the same

usually stock and pan drippings with flour or cornstarch or roux

Australia

where we have a bs health star rating (nutrigrain, a sugar cereal is equal in "health starts" to canned veg and fish) and a fixation on calories instead of kicking sugar out of our diet.

im glad to see retards struggle dieting because its ever so easy especially with everything being taught in modern schools.

...

American biscuits are kind of like scones, I've been told though I don't really know what scones are. It's literally buttermilk pancake mix with much less water if you'd like to find out. Mix it to a dough-ish consistency then portion it into dollops on a baking sheet. Bake until fluffy and delicious.

Do brits have pancakes? Waffle mix, maybe?

>biscuits are literally buttermilk pancake mix with much less water

Lel, no. Not only no, but hell no, retard.

Australia is getting fat

You meme about Americans but your obesity rate is skyrocketing

Poutine, Donairs, and Nanaimo Bars come in packaging from america?

retard

nah i dont even meme about Americans. in fact i remind them that Australia has the same rates (im pretty sure higher than America now). honestly people here obsess over America as some super wierd place when were almost exactly alike due to being young british colonies consisting of outcasts as well as americas occupance (erong word i know) during ww2 influencing our culture significantly.

>It's literally buttermilk pancake mix with much less water if you'd like to find out
no

what the fuck? I was with you until you said we had to improve education. Individuals are responsible for themselves, no need to coddle them. If they don't understand eating makes them fat, they deserve to die.

>buy a small burrito today
>bean and cheese, 600kcal not too bad
>mfw every one of the 25 toppings had it's own kcal listing on the menu

>Potentially useful
Fries with cheese on top and drowned in gravy is fat, WHO WOULD'VE KNOWN ?!

You're part of the issue.

I know its a thing in NC and I love it. Cutting at 600 calories and eating mcdonalds is incompatible and I know that.

i make my own poutine that's close to the same size and it's closer to 500 calories

I didn't say we had to improve eductation. I said *IF* we were going to spend money on something then we might as well do so via the method that would deliver the best results.

My preference would be to not spend any money on it period.

>>Individuals are responsible for themselves, no need to coddle them

Agreed.

How do you figure that? Post your calculation.

>fudge with calories boiled out . jpg

>This kills the society

half a potato deep fried (best calculation i've found for deep frying non battered shit is to double the calories) ~ 325 calories
100 calories butter 25 calories flour (tablespoon of each)
half cup home made stock ~ 40 calories
40 grams of shredded cheese 120 calories

= 610, so i underestimated, but it's still far from 1500

You can make assumptions, but it's always helpful to know how much you're eating, even if you aren't rigidly counting your calories.

I don't understand why people have a problem with this, it's been on packages of food since forever.

Seems reasonable.

It's also a lot smaller of a serving.

.. donair is a Canadian national dish? The problem is more serious than I imagined.

yes, i know it's smaller and that home cooked food is generally healthier but that doesn't change the fact that 1500 calories is very excessive. i would have guessed maybe 1100-1200 which is still crazy

i'm not a fatass or a health nut, i just find the numbers interesting

We're living during strange times.

Calories posted, everything has to sign reading that it causes cancer, and plastic grocery store bags cost money now.

>half a potato
See, this kind of shit always jingles my jangles because who on earth wants to save half a potato. For WHAT?

If it were me, I'd make a double portion using all the ingredients (damn near whatever meal started this entire debacle and just have it count as two meals for that day.

chill dude

i made two servings for two people

and saving half a potato is really not a big deal

>because who on earth wants to save half a potato. For WHAT?

Making a small portion of fries. Making another (Fresh and therefore better) serving of poutine the next day.

Making a small hash brown. dicing it and adding to an omelete, frittata, or hash.

Dice it and add to a soup or stew.

Make a small side of potato chips.

....if you are cooking regularly you can easily find a way to use up half a potato.

Saving it is the inconvenience. You have to get a plastic bag out, contain it and store it in the fridge.

What if I want a whole potato next time I'm making potatoes? Now I have this worthless half potato molding in my fridge.

Maybe it's just my tendency to have one large meal a day but I would always use the entire potato.

>Saving it is the inconvenience.

Wow, so inconvenient. That takes, what, 5 seconds to bag or wrap the spud and stick it in the fridge?

>>What if I want a whole potato next time I'm making potatoes?

Then you grab yourself a whole potato and leave the half until you have a use for it.

>>Maybe it's just my tendency to have one large meal a day

Seems like that's the issue. If you're cooking multiple dishes a day it's easy as hell to find a use for a half a spud.

Now I have this worthless half potato molding in my fridge.

>Fight for freedom
>Not display nutritional information on a menu
da brice of freedumbs ids eternal hamboigahs :DDDDD

They do that in Mass. I fucking love it. We also have compulsory nutrition education and physical fitness in schools, and one of the lowest obesity rates in the country.

we also have a booming economy and plenty of public services and low rates of poverty, crime and blight and police violence is almost unheard of.

sure does suck living in this communist hellhole, I tell you what!

Fuck you asshat!

I put all my money into a carefully planned portfolio of stocks that are betting that fat asses will get diabetes, lose a foot to it, then need dialysis, yet still wash down dinner with a Diet Coke. I have my future mapped out, so do they...

kek

No, in Mississippi we'd rather live like third worlders than have that kind of quality of life.