Politics aside, is there ANY agreed upon science when it comes to transgender issues?

...

that's what worries me. It's clearly a "mental illness", even if that makes people uncomfortable. I have to wonder if some solutions aren't being explored because they might be uncomfortable too.

The new DSM really disappoints me.

Legit question where do people who think they have gender dysphoria go for treatment? Is the average family doctor equipped/willing to treat it?

On the other hand, the stigma of the idea if mental illness creates an enormous distortion in society that does often translate into ableism. I don't mean to be an SJW but it's not like transgender people are an absolute treat to the human being of others, like severely autistic people or schizophrenics. Though I agree there could be more space for treatment.

>If you have XX, you're a male. If you have XY, you're a female.
>science and math

also if the sry gene translocated onto X you can still be male, it's mostly the sry gene that confers benis and balls. Secondary male physical traits will be fucked up without the rest of the Y chromosome though

To a trained psychologist with experience in gender issues.

They'll be able to help the person sort through their feelings and figure out if it's real dysphoria or just passing interest and can prescribe medications and bloodwork.

Family doctors don't have the training or experience for it.

To the being* autocorrect

>and treatments for so called sex dysphoria
Transition is the only treatment that has ever been shown to have any long-term efficacy for alleviating dysphoria.

What science are you looking for? Its glaringly obvious that some people feel more comfortable dressing as the opposite gender. All it comes down to is if you are comfortable allowing them to do that.

No, trannies still kill themselves.

If you want to be gay, be gay. If you want to be straight, be straight.

You can't be a girl when you're born as a man. You have to learn how to deal with it.

I don't really care about the societal aspects of this issue. I guess talking about the causes is interesting, but I want to know about the treatment options. National Geographic is encouraging hormone treatments for transgender children in their issue to block puberty

wew lad

there is a massive difference between trannys and guys playing dress up

Dysphoria is never 100% alleviated, and while they do still kill themselves, they do so less frequently and less quickly if they've started to transition.

XY = Male
XX = female

if shota cant consent to sex why can he consent to radically altering his body with hormones

They don't "transition" into anything, they just mutilate their bodies to look like females.

Why do trans people bother you so much, Veeky Forums? They literally have zero influence on your daily lives and I doubt any of you even know trans people

XXX=Sexy times ;D

Transsexual here,

The claim that there's some lobby pushing kids into transition couldn't be further from the truth, in fact it's the total opposite, the medical establishment tries their hardest to prevent people changing their gender. If any of you actually read about the process we have to go through then you wouldn't think it's something done on a whim. For instance the NHS refuses any treatment until yoou complete some process called "Real life experience". In a nutshell you have to go outside dressed as a woman for a year, they require this knowing full well that you're likely to be abused or beaten up. Also when it comes to children any surgery and HRT is outright banned by most medical establishments all they may get is puberty blockers the effects of which are reversible.

At the end of the day even if you think the whole thing is a fashion trend, nobody is being hurt by transsexuals so leave us alone. I feel that conservatives have lost the argument against adult transsexuals because they're you know adults so they latch on to the child issue making up stories of "evil fags trying to turn kids" in another attempt to discredit us.

I don't know any cartel hitmen and I probably never will but their existence is certainly a cause for concern.

/pol/ comes here to validate their beliefs with "science". That's why we get all the racebait threads as well.

...

bullshit. I even started the thread by saying that they advocate just as much as LGBT activists.

This is true but lets not forget that trans activists are actively trying to pass legilation that makes it illegal for you to misgender them.

ILLEGAL I repeat. Fucking illegal. You call them a boy out of spite and they happen to identify as a demigirl and you go right into prison.

So right now they have no effect, but because of having this mentality of "they affect nothing" we are litting them go wild in political and social spaces and soon they will be able to affect everything.

>Why do nazis bother you so much Veeky Forums? They literally have zero influence on your daily lives and I doubt any of you even know a nazi. That Hitler guy even got sent to jail last week. What is he going to do while in jail lol. Write a book that inspires the masses of the next generation into becoming rampant bigots? Naah. That is ridiculous ;^)

If someone feels like their gender isn't right, who am I to say that isn't true? There's obviously something going on in their brain that affects their self perception. I think there will be a lot more research on this stuff in the coming years, but I imagine it's sorta similar to being gay. I've seen some studies on twins, and when one is gay, the other is significantly more likely to be gay, and when one is straight... etc. I'm sure it's genetic, though, is what I'm saying.

Honestly, I just want people to be happy, so I'm all for people being trans, non binary, whatever.

you need to stop paying attention to deliberately misinterpreted /pol/ stories

>comparing transsexuals to Nazis
This is what happens when maths students start thinking they are good at rhetoric because they are good at maths
Anyway as for the rest of your post think about it this way; the state diagnosed the person with a mental illness, gave them treatment (a sex change) This is public money spent in the hope that this person can become a functioning meber of society and then some bigoted asshole fucks it up by bullying the patient. This is why they are enacting these laws.

Do you think all trans people want this legislation passed or something? I imagine that the amount of people who do want it passed are something like .01% of the trans population. It's not like that will ever get passed anyways, so don't get too worked up.

The only trans people I've ever met were treated horribly by every one around them, and they were incredibly nice whenever I spoke to them. Maybe if we just showed them more love and stopped comparing them to nazis, we'd all be friendlier and happier.

>deliberately misinterpreted /pol/ stories

There was an interview between a trans activist and a university professor who opposed the SJW movement in general.

The trans activist explicitly said their end goal is to make it illegal to misgender people because misgendering is a form of violence, according to them.

I don't have the source but if you want it I can dig through Sargon of Akkad's videos because he has commentary of it on his channel.

I am not comparing them to nazis. I am showing why your argument of "they affect nothing" is fallacious.

I even thought of using something else because I predicted your low ass IQ thinking that I was calling you a nazi but then said "No, this is Veeky Forums. You need a 3 digit IQ to come here. This guy will get it"

But nope.

Anyways, the essence of the argument is here: Changes in power occur.

Right now trans have no power. Soon they could have it... or not. It all depends. Someone who is a leader today is dead tomorrow and someone else takes place.

If Hillary had won to please her SJW crowd she probably would have pushed some SJW legislation, giving their power. And she was close to winning.

Never forget that. Shifts in power happen literally every day. Every day some people become weaker and others become stronger.

I use to hold my pee really long I order to kill myself long term.

EVERYBODY WATCH OUT. THE TRANS PEOPLE ARE GOING TO TAKE OVER AMERICA AND KICK OUT ALL THE STRAIGHT PEOPLE.

Stop falling for fear mongering tactics. Trans people aren't going to hurt you.

>If Hillary had won to please her SJW crowd she probably would have pushed some SJW legislation, giving their power.
hmm yeah sure

one person with a stick up their ass does not represent the whole community

>Do you think all trans people want this legislation passed or something?

I can't prove that so no.

But some do want that, and I can prove that. And if they ever get that then even those transexual people who did not want the law will benefit for it.

Angry at someone? Cry they misgendered you and get them into prison.

Personally I don't care about transitions. I am not like most people here. I am a hardcore liberal and couldn't give a shit. I just do not want them to also have political privileges and every single time a single trans activist pushes for political privileges I care even less about trans people's issues because if a trans person is so privileged that he has time to even ask for political privileges then obviously trans people can't be having it that bad.

I mean, if trans people were being fucking murdered left and right do you think they would complain about "misgendering". They wouldn't. They would complain about the fucking killers who are genociding them.

Obviously trans people now have exclusively first world problems and are not worth caring about anymore. The 90s and early 2000s are gone. Your movement already won, stop.

Interesting. Now post pics.

when i was younger, i was pretty much into becoming transgender because i felt that i didn't look right or that i didn't look like my born gender. i really did hate myself and im still trying to love myself again.

what im saying is that when you have gender dystopia, transitioning will not help. maybe for some, but for me, what helped me get better was self-love, not change.
although, i did change what was changeable, i came to terms with the fact that im not perfect and im not beautiful. i was born with brown eyes as in that i was born with my natural genitals.

if i became the opposite gender, i would still be ugly. it won't help... only temporarily give you peace because you are confused. love what you were born with and change what you can. i changed my style and how i did my hair, but i couldn't change my nose because i was born with it (another aspect of myself that i didn't really like.)

the idea of transgenderism though is 100% nurture. i was put down and called ugly, even by the people who were most close to me. i wasn't born transgender because i was able to change my attitude instead of my gender. transgenderism is the most unnatural thing a human can do and that could be what is interesting to us because when we crave change, anything works.

but im not a scientist so idk

/pol/ get out
gender is fake

I sure the first indians said exactly that about the first white people in america and obviously, some cucks like you said "Nooo, obviously no."

I am so glad we still live in the indian colonies. I am personally from the Xjahaha tribe. So fun. There are 0 white people here lol. Those people were right! White people didn't take over america by gaining political power!

White settlers gained political power... and then did nothing with it and went back to europe! SO FUN RIGHT.

HISTORY

LETS FORGET HISTORY.

Tell that to the media and to universities.

Case in point: micro aggressions.

Also, you definitely did compare trans people to Nazis. Did you read what you wrote? You were comparing the dangers of trans people to that of Nazis. Maybe you just don't read a lot, though, and if that's not what you meant, then fine, but that is 100% how your message comes across.

Just read it again if you don't believe me.

Nazis are a counter example for your argument.

You claimed that because trans people have no power now, we don't have to worry about them.

I showed you the example of nazis, who at one point had 0 power and were even oppressed by the government... and then became the leading party of the country, controlling every branch of it and the military.

That is how power shifts kid. Saying that "they affect nothing" is not an argument.

>what im saying is that when you have gender dystopia, transitioning will not help. maybe for some
on how many levels of denial are you

go transition, jesus

Do you seriously think a trans person would get elected into power if that was their platform? You do realize it's not that easy to pass a law(checks and balances) and also that trans people represent less than 1 percent of the population, right?

Your arguments are so stupid that even Veeky Forums which is usually a pretty right wing place is telling you that you're an idiot, think about that.

Can someone answer this.

Interesting, interesting.
What do you think should be done about stormfront, 4pol, 8pol and the like?

They have more power than the trannies currently.

Agreed. Mones should only be allowed at 15-16 years of age - a balance between starting early and consent age.

nobody replies because the answer is obviously that they shouldn't be allowed.

>Your arguments are so stupid that even Veeky Forums which is usually a pretty right wing place is telling you that you're an idiot, think about that.

Fun comment. What I take out of it is that you assume right wing people and opinions are dumb and because I am being scolded by them I am even dumber.

Well, isn't that a nice way to NOT do politics. You just assume your opposition is retarded.

Why do you think right wing people are dumber? Why can you just assume that?

Those people are equivalent to trans activists. A bunch of supremacists trying to get power to enact their power fantasies.

What should we do about them? Call them out. Every single time they say something ridiculous, call them out. Just like I call out the bullshit trans activists say.

A supremacist is a supremacist, no matter what brand they are.

the only argument these parents have for starting an "early transition" is to make them look more like the opposite sex. By 15-16 that would be too late according to their reasoning.

But isn't the idea catching and starting to be considered the only way to "truly" transition?

I mean the kid in the op picture seems pre pubesecent

Do you really think your 16 year old self was mature enough to make this kind of decision?
At 16 my mother had convinced me to take anti-depressants, but thankfully the therapist never prescribed them (despite her pushing for it). Now looking back I know they'd fuck me up. I'm so glad things turned out the way they did.

Parents and children are not to be entrusted with these kinds of decisions.

not science

I'm not trying to bash on right wing people, but haven't there been some studies to confirm that left wing people are (on average) more intelligent and better educated. Again, not trying to shit on your beliefs.

Also, I really think you're overly concerned with this 1 trans person who said something ridiculous. They won't overthrow our government. Stop worrying.

But they're not, again this whole furore is borne out of gross oversimplification. The kid has to go through a shitload of psychiatric assesments before even being allowed to see blockers. They then only get hormones once they're a consenting adult and finally even adults aren't allowed surgery untill they've been living as a woman for three years. So the claim of parents deciding to take their kid to a surgeon to have his dick chopped off after just a bedside chat is bullshit.

>By 15-16 that would be too late according to their reasoning.
>according to their own reasoning.
Not really, honestly, I guess you could lower it to 14 at the earliest. Humans are sexually mature by that age anyway, at least human females.
Starting at 14 or 15 or 16 will make them feminine enough, the best trannies started then, it's early enough.
Agreed, let the doctor be involved in the decision whether to prescribe hormones.

I'm a med student, I honestly would've handed you anti-depressants and anyone who wants hormones hormones, though I'm not sure the legality of that in my country. It's such a huge waste of time to worry about psychology and feelings and bla bla bla bla, you won't die from it stop wasting my time, here's your pills, now let me take care of the guy who's really ill.

based on left wing """research""" ?

if they can consent to blockers why can't they consent to sex

I mean, probably. Feel free to find the study and critique it for me, but it kinda makes sense when you look at how liberal most university campuses are, right? Again, I'm really not trying to call right wing people stupid.

>when you look at how liberal most university campuses are, right?
Argument from personal anecdotes ?

oh come on, obviously he's correct on that one

The problem is that many young psychologists aren't real people, they're literally living memes. They probably waited for 5-10 years to finally shove hormones down someone's throats, ever since that "selecting a gender identity" class in college.

Majority of the students and educated people don't shift to a side, they stay centrists.
Although I saw lots of unemployed, no education SJWtards shitting all around the streets and becoming laughing stocks, I rarely see any skinheads or alt-right activists.

Yeah, obviously that's a personal anecdote. I'm not trying to shit on right wing people or make a serious argument that they're less intelligent or anything. Go find some studies and come back to me b/c I'm curious about this all anyways.

Are there any colleges that are known for being much more right-wing? I'm genuinely curious.

If the transitions are so beneficial when successful, what's the massive suicide rate about?

I dunno. Here in the South, I saw lots of trump rallies with dudes driving big trucks with confederate flags that would shit up the place. I'd hear them loudly complaining about n-word music(while blasting their own shit) and being generally obnoxious. Probably depends on where you live, but I have never seen any activism/protesting/whatever done by the left.

We're talking about medical treatment here, please stop with these shitty analogies.
>Hurr parents are turning their kids into fags for fun!
>Ok let's have a trained professional psychiatrist make that decision
>Hurr the psychiatrist is a Jew tool!
And if you read this you'd see that psychiatrists are actually biased against transition

do they still kill themselves at the same rates if they feel sex dysphoria but decide not to "transition"? This info needs to be more widely available, especially for parents

If you live in the south you probably won't. Come to Cali and see the libtard cancer with your own eyes.

so you can't answer why a 9 year old can't consent to sex but can consent to hormone blockers.

okay.

the suicide rate is still very high, but not as high as it was before

strong dysphoria in someone who doesn't transition is a near-guarantee of suicide. strong dysphoria in someone who transitions ends up being something like a 10% bump to the usual probability of suicide

I think that people should be allowed to generally do what they want with their own bodies.
However
>surgery/hormones at a very young age is hypocritical (see: age of consent) and indicative of shitty parenting
>surgery/hormones should be the last option explored after thoroughly examining other possible causes of the patient's beliefs

Also, if this is a "natural" human conceit then why is it only recently becoming a serious issue? Increased prevalence in media/society causing backlash from people unused to transsexuals? For such a small percentage of the population, why do we hear so much about them? Why are people lobbying for "transsexual rights" when the same basic human rights that everyone enjoys apply to them?
i just don't get it desu

Obnoxious trump supporters vs obnoxious libtards. Round 1. Fight!

Yeah, I don't get it either. Maybe it's a way to misdirect young people's interest in social equality away from real problems, like poverty, nepotism and wealth concentration.

I think the attutudes in this thread answer your question.

>shitty analogies
I'm sure you understand yet choose to ignore the age of consent issue. Aside from the desperate attempt to pave the way for legitimizing pedophilia, there's a reason why underage teens don't get driving licenses, don't get served alcohol and consent to having sex.

>special issue
that it is. special ed. loooooooooool

it's not even teenagers. teenagers can consent. 14 year old girls can carry pregnancies to term.

these jerkoffs want to give hormone blockers to 10 year old boys because they put on a dress on once.

>Also, if this is a "natural" human conceit then why is it only recently becoming a serious issue?
I've wondered the same, it could be it's always been there as an issue, but only recently starting to come up - there's been gays, crossdressers historically - so they came up with the idea of calling it a disorder, gender dysphoria etc.

But yeah, certainly what is considered female - big boobs, nice ass, heels, as feminine as possible is amplified by culture. Literally all crossdressers(admittedly not trannies) dress like total whores - you get what I mean?

>underages can consent to sex
Where do you live? I wanna check the laws of the state you live in and how they approach to having underage sex.

Man for a board supposedly full of geniuses the ignorance in this thread is astounding
>I think that people should be allowed to generally do what they want with their own bodies.
Good at least you're not a /pol/ asshole
>surgery/hormones at a very young age is hypocritical (see: age of consent) and indicative of shitty parenting
But this never happens, I said it like five times already
>surgery/hormones should be the last option explored after thoroughly examining other possible causes of the patient's beliefs
Why? In fact I'd argue that it should be the first option. Hurts nobody, proven success rate, low cost. What are the negatives?
>Also, if this is a "natural" human conceit then why is it only recently becoming a serious issue?
C'mon you're a STEM student you should be smarter than this, increased media exposure =/= increased prevalence
>Why are people lobbying for "transsexual rights" when the same basic human rights that everyone enjoys apply to them?
I mean this entire thread has been full of people calling them "sick freaks" and you wonder why they need activism?

If gender is a social construct why do you need hormones and surgery in the first place?

Why do you need to wear a dress and take estrogen to become a "real" woman?

>In every argument about LGBT paedophiles will be mentioned
Is this some kind of new Godwin's law?

>pedophile apologist in closet
How do I report people on this board for being a possible child molester ?

But it's not that's why feminists hate transsexuals because they debunk the social construct theory.

i said teenagers not "underages"

At what age do you think these kids should be allowed to take any sort of meds?

but I said underages and you quoted me. Anyway it's all about the age of consent, which should also apply to unconsentual hormonal abuse of the children.

>I mean this entire thread has been full of people calling them "sick freaks" and you wonder why they need activism?
I wouldn't call them sick freaks but they're literally (LITERALLY) not normal functioning humans.
And I don't mean they're like people who go on Veeky Forums. People who undergo sex-change surgery cannot produce offspring. When technology improves so that they're able to do so, will they be more or less maligned? I dunno. But I think the backlash against them is completely understandable.