How do you create your own ideals? If you accept current society, then you're just being a sheep...

How do you create your own ideals? If you accept current society, then you're just being a sheep. If you reject current society's ideals, then you're just being an lonely edgelord. How can you become the Übermensch?

You need to absorb a lot of radiation from a yellow sun.

he didn't get that far is the problem.

you have to wing it from here

QED Carcinoma is ideal

You don't because you are not smart enough. Mainstream societies ideals are thousands of years old and worked on collectively so what makes you think you can come up with anything better?

>How do you create your own ideals?

All ideals were at one point created. Every ideal and idea was at one point original.

Nietzsche doesn't tell you how to do it, merely that it can and, if you are not of the rabble, should be done.

Every post in this thread is shit.

Why don't you ask the fellow in your image yourself and read Zarathustra? And if you already have then stop being an idiot and read it again

True ideals come from the soul, to "create" them just bee yourself.

Do I have to start somewhere before I get to Zarathustra or can I just start reading it?

Read Untimely Meditations before. It is often overlooked but Nietzsche saw it as the essential introductory book, in which the reader would see if his sensibilities lined up with Nietzsches (don't know how to say it better, english isn't even my second language) and i agree with Nietzsche.

Outside of that not much is needed, the rest his work can be read after Zarathustra, including The Birth of Tragedy

Isnt thus spoke full of references to folklore/german mythology? I remember reading the first few pages, something about a hermit leaving a cave? I've always wanted to read it but figured it would be impossible to catch all the allegory details

The folklore is created by Nietzsche. The cave thing is not a reference to an analogy but the creation of an analogy by Nietzsche, and it is quite clear. It really just means seeking isolation for a long time as to find answers, reflect and so on. You can read it without any problems, the points are made very clear throughout the book, nothing is obscure. I still encourage you to start with Untimely Meditations.

You neither accept society's ideals nor do you reject them or do the opposite (aka ressentiment, slave morality, etc.) you create your own set of ideals and live that way.

The impression I got from Zarathustra was that one can never actually become the Übermensch, but instead it is an ideal to strive after. The whole book is about overcoming yourself.

t. first-year philosophy student

Eh, not quite this. Though you can look to those you admire from past and future to give you at least a sense of what direction to go. Trying to go fully alone just ends in you blocking out knowledge because you don't feel you came up with it. Retarded tactic

The Übermensch by definition is someone who disregards the sentiments of being both a "sheep" or an "edgelord".

They are labels of particular strains of thought such as the left or right, the anarchist or the democratic.

Being the Übermensch means to surpass those ideals and create your own definition and virtues of life that you construct from your own intelligence, context, and beliefs.

Pretty much just bbeeeeee yourself, but don't be a pussy and investigate **why** you believe what you believe.

As Nieztche himself states there are three forms you need to take before becoming the Übermensch. First deal with all the hard shit in life, then deny all the beliefs youve come to know and become a blank slate. Finally begin to construct yourself back up to something better.

Nietzsche fucking sucked

>For every man there exists bait which he cannot resist swallowing

>It really just means seeking isolation for a long time as to find answers, reflect and so on.
>You can read it without any problems
>the points are made very clear throughout the book
>nothing is obscure.
This kind of idiot again.

Your own ideals are simply what you like. You may like one kind of society over another, and it should be the only, yet sufficient, distinction between them to hold the first one as your ideal. Also, this

I knew we'd get pleb Nietzsche opinions from that Nietzsche AMA shit.

This is close.

Just do whatever, until someone try's to pin you down, then just deny you were ever that and redefine yourself. Just be utterly impossible with every person you meet. It's the only way to 'win.'

Have you played Dragon Quest 3? You know how you have to play a Jester in order to become a Sage. The Sage represents the enlightened individual. I think of Nietzsche's übermensch as another term for enlightened individual. His original concept for the übermensch is actually a personality archetype that he realized was so free that they could make a new world. How they make a new world is really explained by the fact that it is not really a new world but a harmonious one. It would be a world that works with infinite systems instead of finite systems. An infinite system is something irrepressible like an archetype. He noticed this concept in the story of Bacchus. What was a revelation to him was the fact that such a personality could in fact belong to a real human being. He liked real possibilities. You have probably heard of the four temperaments. One of them is very misunderstood. The sanguine temperament is often misused to describe any happy social person. Really the sanguine temperament should only apply to this rare almost unseen archetype which is not always smiling but is actually both happy and social and somber and serious and incredibly reserved and secretive but also an open book. A paradoxical personality which cannot apply to a large number of people. In conclusion, I think the term übermensch applies to two different things.

>Your own ideals are simply what you like
Zuckerberg is that you?

Unless you are in the category of the higher type of man, which comes once or twice per generation at most, you don't. You just kind of hope that the prevailing herd values are good and provide some meaning for you, oh little plebby soul.

Too bad, they aren't.

Being edgy or a hipster or a romanticist seems like a step in the right direction. That attitude is the need to explore further than before. To search for something you can feel but not see. Someone once said if you want to be a better person stop being so self satisfied.

Is it even worth it to learn Latin or Greek?

Those languages are dead, in the sense that they will be unnatural and wholly unrelated to life for a contemporary person. Translations at least attempt to bring the best of each source back into our living languages. It even seems like the prestige of these languages died out exactly at the same time Christianity (a death-glorifying system itself) died out in the West. Another analogy would be found in the more intuitive medium of music: "historically-informed practice" is rightfully considered an aesthetic choice there, not some kind of "true" or "authentic" authority; in music you have the honesty to admit that the musical languages of the past are dead, and the philologist-equivalents are merely digging up those graves in order to enhance the music of the present, not to pay tribute to our incomplete picture of that inaccessible past.

>We honor the great artists of the past less by the barren awe that leaves every word, every note lying where it was placed than by active efforts at helping them come back to life again and again. — To be sure: if we were to imagine Beethoven suddenly coming back to life and being confronted by one of his works resounding with the most modern animation and the refinement of nerves that serve the fame of our masters of execution: he would probably remain for a long time silent, uncertain whether he should raise his hand to curse or to praise, but perhaps finally say: "Well, well! That is neither I nor not-I, but some third thing — yet it seems to me right enough, even if it is not exactly right. But you might want to watch what you are doing, because you are in any case the ones who have to listen to it — and the living are right, as our Schiller says. So be right, then, and let me descend once again."

Ever since I adopted my perception of a will-to-power mentality my life has dramatically changed for the better. I went from NEET to 180k starting as a corporate attorney in 5 years.

>Ever since I adopted my perception of a
it's okay to be an asshole and fuck people out of what is theirs because things like cooperative action don't make a difference if you can just steal the results of their cooperative action with words

> mentality my life has dramatically changed for the better. I went from NEET to 180k starting as a corporate attorney in 5 years.

I've read close to nothing on Nietzsche just blurps here and there.
But I think he's correct about the main part of the answer is through isolation.
But I would NOT recommend someone isolating themselves ever.
It just comes down to circumstances. Some of us didn't chose to be isolated but it became whats comfortable.
E D G E L O R D
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There are only three paths in life that approach life's true meaning.

The way of charity.
The way of service.
The way of suffering.

>implying being an edgelord isn't a good thing
When normies call you a crazy asshole/retard/douche or accuse you of being a schizo it's a compliment Tbh

Actually you need to dull the brain stem to disconnect the halves of the brain, only then can you truly "bee" yourself

humans were made to obey not to think

>How can you become the Übermensch?
You can only become what one is.

Which means, you need to have been an Overman since birth. Destined to be one. Genetically ready for it in the modern world, raised in the highest cultural environment, nurtured to be a god.

Just look at old Greek myths. They have this in a ton of their stories. The gods in Greek mythology are a metaphor for something very real.

No, you should ask why? If you find something useful in 'mainstream' society use it, things you don't you should disregard.

Then explain what it is instead of being a cunt and simply calling someone an idiot.
Make a good post or don't post at all

without feeling need to accept them or to reject them you ignore them and get on with your life

haven't read nietzsche but that seems like the answer you're looking for

Sure is spooky in here

>How can you become the Übermensch?
YOU can't

someone with the inborn psychological traits necessary to become an ubermensch who gets lucky can

Personally, I think the answer is in your prospective choices. Ideals are a codification of right behavior: thus if you can live as an example of right behavior, you don't need the ideals.

In simpler language, don't be a dick, and do well by yourself and others as an instinct, rather than as a conscious thought. After that, the rest is just schematics.

>In simpler language, don't be a dick
Ironically, following the good conscience of your times (like you advocate) can look like a mindless 'dick' in hindsight. I would rather be a dick and actually read the works of the author each thread concerns.

The only Nietzschean point you make is the importance of intuition and instincts. And that looks accidental.

Find something to believe in, and find it for yourself.

Pragmatism. Find what works in the real world (not just in your mind) and discard the rest. Challenge your beliefs. What

What happens to the people who aren't ubermensch?

>>How do you create your own ideals
>>"you"
>>faulty understanding of the nietzschean critique of the subject
>>ib4 stupid nazi-inspired appropriation of fritz bc the meaningless belief in one's own futile existence

go fuck yourself

"spook" is a code word for "LALALA I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER SO I'M GONNA PRETEND THE QUESTION ITSELF IS STUPID"

Don't be a faggot.

>The gods in Greek mythology are a metaphor for something very real.

yes of course they are, but actual persons? don't be stupid

what do you mean? Nothing happens to them. They're either content and blink or despair in nihilism, or something inbetween. Nothing special happens to them.

Nothing special happens to the Übermensch either. It all just happens along a bit, and the Übermensch is kinda intense while at it.

>become Unermench
If you want to become it,than you are just a scum under his legs

this desu senpai, but existentialism is still open to you.

They can't continue to exist in a world that has the ubermensch.

where does he say that?

Read Stirner, but Epicurus too. Be irrepressible and enjoy.

>Be irrepressible and enjoy.
you forgot to add "or not"

It's a shortcut and rings with much resonance for anyone who has read the book.

Cynicism is for losers.

There are many layers of happiness, ranging from being calm as a stoic, to sexual gratification, to hyperactive bliss.

Everything in Greek mythology can be found in real life if you know where and how to look.

God, fuck off already.

So basically no one knows what Nietzsche meant about anything right? That's what I seem to be getting from threads like these.

>He called me God

M'lady.

Those are some shit facial aesthetics on that girl desu.

>I are teh expert here, and I can condemn all of you as wrong without engaging with a response on what is right.

Granted, I'm sure plenty is wrong, but this is a very common troll ploy, user.

Because the cave very obviously is an analogy. Nietzsche just sat down and thought to himself "hmmm... I need some kind of metaphor or imagery for solitude... CAVE!" That it is specifically a cave is important. It isn't necessarily Plato's cave, or at least it isn't only Plato's cave, but to deny the really very obvious reference is stoopidity.

You really need to be spoonfed like this tho? If you're interested in philosophy why not put a little effort in bro.

Did Nietzsche mean anything? By which I mean did he mean to mean?

Hi Victor, love your work even if I don't fully agree with it.

>If you accept current society, then you're just being a sheep.
It depends on why you accept it. If your reason is someone else's reason, then yes, you're a sheep.

>If you reject current society's ideals, then you're just being an lonely edgelord
Same as above. It depends on why you reject it.

You create your own ideals by becoming yourself and aiming to fulfill your own desires. You are your own ideals.

This guy gets it.

When you think ubermensch think impossible goal then think of how pathetic you are because Goethe actually achieved that goal.
Without even fucking trying

Its worth it if you have a use for the language. Also Greek is not dead? People speak that shit everyday.

In regards to the "honesty to admit that the musical languages of the past are dead", I couldn't agree less. Truly beautiful music touches upon ubiquitous and perennial ideas and emotions that do not cease with the transformation of societies. To segregate music that harnesses powerful sounds and compositions based on date is nonsense, just as striking poetry is equally impressive wether classic or modern.

Cynicism is as much for losers as Hedonism. You advocate Stirner with one hand, a spook with the other, all the while trying to tell somebody who asks how to make their own post-nihilistic ideals that something that's not geared towards happiness is somehow a less valid self made ideal.

Keep pushing your own agenda, but any time you try and pass it off as relevant to someone else's work you'll have to deal with it being wrong.

and yet, it's a guaranteed way to lose

>Keep pushing your own agenda

Said the high schooler who likes Nietzsche

If you can't tell that I find Nietzsche as well as Stirner ridiculous then I guess that's fine, no obligation to pick up on everything.

but your friends could be keeping you down and you could be completely blind to this.
Through isolation you can examine your relationships from afar.

To address the original question of the thread, one becomes the ubermensch (in my view), by holding whatever the good and necessary view points are and working effortlessly within a rigid system to mold it to them. The ubermensch may be alone often, but not a lonely peasant.

Just in case I want to say this isn't me. I don't know if that's what you were trying to do or maybe I'm paranoid.
And I also disagree with it.
This thread is about becoming "Übermensch"
I've read about it and I don't think Übermensch would shy away from relationships.
Because from what I understand they excel in almost everything.
I would include mastering being social one of them right?

Or maybe not mastering but at least TRYING to have them lol.
Don't stop trying guys.