Can we talk about the semi-colon? It has had a falling out with the public. It used to be popular - before, say...

Can we talk about the semi-colon? It has had a falling out with the public. It used to be popular - before, say, the mid-20th century - but presently there seems to be a stigma attached to the mark, which connotes snobbery or pretentiousness. Why do you think that is, and how do you personally feel about semi-colons?

I think the reason has to do with the nature of the mark itself, as well as individual laziness and idiocy, combined with poor public education and anti-intellectual sentiment in the U.S. in general. Compared to other marks of punctuation, the semi-colon is intimidating - trickier, less common, and implicitly more superfluous than the basics like periods and commas. That relative complexity plus failing education systems are why a lot of people never learn how to properly use it in K-12 school, and then, for whatever reason, they can't be bothered to look it up on their own as adults. People don't understand it, so their natural reaction is to get mad at it, and that is why it has become trendy to look down on and avoid its use.

But I like the semi-colon; he is my friend. My only one...

I can't remember who said it but there's a quote I read once that described "a nice little feeling of expectancy" when seeing a semi-colon in a sentence. It's a good quote because it's true. I definitely know that feel - it's an abstract one that I'd never have thought of articulating on my own.

How does one use semicolons, then? Is it just a comma, but with the pause being longer?

I mostly use it for lists.

it connects two independant clauses that are related to each other. The question of when to use a semi colon isn't about when not to use a comma; the question of when to use a semi colon is about when not to use a period.

pretty sure Virginia Woolf made up her own semi-colon rules because she used them more than commas

Lists in which the material needs commas? Like listing cities? (Sacramento, CA; Tallahassee, FL; Houston, TX; etc...)

That's pretty much the best explanation I've ever received for its intended use.

It's usually where you would bullet point, but also where it's hard to properly separate what you're listing with commas (usually because they're little phrases or lists themselves). For example: some day mother will die, and I'll get the money; along with Jason and countless screaming Argonauts; put your hand inside the puppet head; I don't want the world, I just want your half; philosopher dirt bike, brainwashing dirt bike, ground shaking dirt bike. That sort of thing.

>The apples had four different colours; Red, white, black and green.

The relatedness, or not, of ideas can get pretty subjective. Depending on the context, it might be clear that there is or isn't one to the author, but not to the reader. Also, there's nothing that can be written with a semi-colon that can't also be written without; the use of semi-colons is never mandatory. So, using them is inherently risky. Incorrect usage can distract readers and distort meanings, and controversial usage - even if it is correct - also has that potential. To be on the safe side, it is best to use semi-colons conservatively, or only where it is clearly appropriate; the danger of misuse, whether actual or perceived, increases in proportion to the liberalness with which they are applied.

> Also, there's nothing that can be written with a semi-colon that can't also be written without;
Except that isn't true, you'd be changing the entire tone of a sentence by using a period instead of a semicolon

Yeah... that's objectively wrong.

This is incorrect. A colon belongs there

I suppose... good point.

Fitting that it takes an esoteric punctuation mark to convey such nuance as tone in a sentence.

That's another reason I like semi-colons.

They enrich writing as a whole and make possible more precise meaningfulness.

Yet writers are actively discouraged from using them because reasons. It's too bad, really.

This is probably how I would use it, may someone correct me?

I was walking down 'Albert Lane' and along came a cheery older gentlemen with his head in a twist. Out he cried a long bellow and told me that I was sweet. I was sure he was a goner; surer than anything and surer than God.

I was taught what is probably pretty asinine but it seems to apply in most literature I read: a semi-colon can take the place of an "and".

Two independent clauses seems a solid explanation but in your example a colon would be perfectly appropriate too.

>I was sure he was a goner; surer than anything; surer than God.
I guess would be my suggestion. That's a tough one.

Maybe this instead:
>I was sure he was a goner: surer than anything; surer than God.

Or this:
>I was sure he was a goner; surer than anything, surer than God.

Or perhaps this?
>I was sure he was a goner - surer than anything; surer than God.

In conclusion, IDFK. IMO, revise the sentence for brevity and clarity. So it's something like:

>I was so sure he was a goner, I was surer than anything; surer than God himself.

Or:
>I was surer than God and anything he was a goner.

This is incorrect, the part after the semicolon is not an independent clause. A comma would be the correct punctuations.

I mainly use for stuff like this:

>I like to eat fruits like apples, bananas, pineapples; vegetables like brocolli and carrots; grains like rice, beans and oats.

Try to use comma and the sentence is confuse, try to use a period and you break the sentence.

This is what I call a shitpost

The house is on fire; it is sure to collapse.

Give an example then, I'd like to learn.

This sounds reasonable and succinct. But guys, what about that stinking colon?

A better question is:

Who gives a shit?

fucking this

I use them to link two sentences which are related, usually to clarify meaning.

So Russell admits he is a fool?

I was walking down Albert Lane and along came a cheery older gentlemen with his head in a twist. Out he cried a long bellow and told me that I was sweet. I was sure he was a goner; I was surer than anything and surer than God.

-Don't use quotation marks around street names unless it is a euphemism. This is also an instance where I would just use a comma or a dash. The clauses are related more than a semicolon implies and two independent clauses are not needed.

I rode my bike down the trail; the trees had turned crimson and the leaves fluttered down like snowflakes in the crisp autumn air. Ever since October began all the trees...

-This is the opposite of your example. The two clauses are not so related that they need to be joined by a semicolon. A period would be more appropriate.

I rode my bike down the trail to view the woods; the trees had just turned crimson and the leaves were floating around lucky sightseers.
When I got back I noticed my chain had began to rust...

-This is correct.

Sheila came for dinner. I made the chicken; and Michael made the potatoes.

-Not only by adding 'and' did I make the second part a dependent clause, using a conjunction with a semicolon is redundant. They both join clauses so choose whichever one is appropriate.

Sheila came for dinner. I made the chicken; Michael made the potatoes.

OR

Sheila came for dinner. I made the chicken and Michael made the potatoes.

-In lists where items contain a comma, semicolons are used to avoid confusion.

She used the green wool; the blue satin, which was a gift from Mary; and the gray taffeta.

-The are being used with the comma like brackets are used parentheses and not as a clause joiner, which is why the use of 'and' with the last list item is not incorrect.

>plebs can't into linguistics
In my estimate, anyone who has an interest in writing but not grammar and punctuation, doesn't have an interest in writing.

>mfw niggas don't know about the semi colon en dash combo

Thanks a lot.

How can I learn about this in more detail?

Is there a book which details all of this for beginners?

it's basically a period, but weaker. Use it to denote a stronger connection between two independent clauses!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>doesn't know I study linguistics
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I will use Perdue OWL for basic grammar refrence, but I haven't read any books for beginners. There are a lot out there and some are written for a general audience like Eat, Shoots and Leaves.