Let's debunk this once and for all. Hard work and Success is there a direct correlation...

Let's debunk this once and for all. Hard work and Success is there a direct correlation? Let's say an average white cis male. To not have to many random variables.

What a stupid question, there are no two things that share a closer relation. The question is whether hard work is deterministic and resultant from biology or whether they is an individual and psychological role.

Im still saging your troll thread.

>no 2 things that share a closer relation
Aren't you forgetting IQ and success?

forgetting biological components such as IQ. Hard work does not equal success Smart work equals success. OFC you have to output some work in both cases.

And that's why I overpower all of you with my superior brain.
>mfw information just goes into my brain, I don't even touch my textbook.

le pen was a russian plant and i'm glad she lost

And Macron was a Merkel plant, no difference, the world's just this fucked up anyways, the act of cheating becomes an equalizer, the playing field has changed user, if you ask what's my stance, i don't have a stance in the French election, both candidates are fucking shit, I would've taken Melenchon though.

When I see, for example, that you're making millions by laundering drug-cartel money (HSBC), or pushing bad paper on mutual fund managers (AIG, Bear Stearns, Morgan Stanley, Citibank), or preying on low-income borrowers (Bank of America), or buying votes in Congress (all of the above) - just business as usual on Wall Street - while I'm barely making ends meet from the earnings of my full-time job, I realise that my participation in the labour market is irrational. I know that building my character through work is stupid because crime pays. I might as well become a gangster..

>And Macron was a Merkel plant
no
>I would've taken Melenchon though
confirmed retard

If you don't work, you are not successful. I think this is a given. So the difference between work and hard work needs to be better defined.

Success is completely explained by genetics and environment. We have to pretend there is an individual role in order to work.

There was that bit on Freakonomics on how gangsters have the same power structure as regular business - a few rich elite at the top and the unwashed masses at the bottom. So considering the risk involved in breaking the law, I'd say you're making a rational decision.

I feel like giving out advice on this, so take it outside of a scientific context for now. I've noticed that only the most stupid people I know talk about how hard they work. They don't even do that. They just play video games all day. And yes, they can't program their way out of a paper bag. Meanwhile, the smarter people I know avoid the subject. They work smart and hard when no one's looking, then they blow away the competition on exam day.

You really don't address working smart, although people often define working smart too narrowly. Studying in advance, choosing the easiest professors you can, dressing like a nerd and sitting at the front to win over the professor, going to office hours, being buddies with upperclassmen so you can look at old exams, playing stupid and poor so people like you, all that *helps*. I hate how people idolize hard work when it just makes them look like tools. Being clever and humble is far more important than pure effort.

wrong

The people getting "paid by crime" have spent decades working twenty times harder than you do and they're still doing so.
It might make you feel better to pretend that these fatass bankers are masturbating all day while you work your ass off but in reality the exact opposite is the truth.

Nope. Not even a little.

That's what a brainlet would say.

>mfw I work like a rice nigger at home while I tell everyone I play Dota and binge tv series all day
>user only did well because he has a photographic memory
Why does this feel so good yet so wrong? Humble bragging is an addiction man.
>mfw the average for the test was 60%, I got 90%

>Hard work and Success is there a direct correlation

no

at best there is some low correlation but not a causative relationship.

what you're looking for is the socioeconomic status of the parents of the individual if you are interested in a much stronger correlation.

My dad holds a masters degree in Banking and my mom a basic marketing degree, what does this make of me? My dad used to slave away in the finance market. I'm currently a pre-med, will I make it?

>what does this make of me
extremely likely not to live in poverty

hard work increases probability of success, but it also highly depends on the initial condition.

I don't agree at all. Working hard for the sake of working hard is for brainlets. Seriously. Look at how hard the person at the grocery store, or fast food chain, or any other shit job works.

It's simple:
You must have inborn talents to have a better starting point then most people.
But you also have to practice and work a lot to hone your skill because talent can only get you so far. If you stay at the same place people will get pass you in no time.

In conclusion:
Extraordinary inborn talent + lots of hard work = high chance of being successful. (Terrence Tao).
Decent inborn talent + lots of had work = decent chance of succeeding.
Extraordinary inborn talent + little to no hard work = decent chance of succeeding.
Decent inborn talent + little to no hard work = little to no chance of succeeding.

Obviously, this shit did not count other factors such as luck. But you kinda get the point.

Its all luck, we re just lemmings doing a random walk in the overwhelming complexity of our universe.

You can say "look, this guy worked hard and is succesful, therefore.." but you fail to see all the hard workers that failed, survivorship bias, because losers dont talk.

If you dont want to live miserably, embrace chaos and the fact that you may not succeed, just enjoy the journey and roll the dices the most you can.

>Look at how hard the person at the grocery store, or fast food chain, or any other shit job works.
they aren't working hard user

The nignogs on the corner in your city are selling crack and weed from early morning until late at night, working hard at a very dangerous job, so let's not forget to idolize their work ethic too.

>Hard work and Success is there a direct correlation

Depends entirely on the economic system/rewards system at play.

Currently I would say it's weakly correlated since we live in a economic society where debt and credit (both being non-tangible) are equally if not greater players in wealth/ success determination than even tangible money and work for that money.

But even without this, hard work is not necessary a highly correlating factor to success. Sociability, connections, patience all play a role. In certain circles factors like age, tenure in a organization and social rank can overshadow hard work, making any work you do something akin to paying your dues.

It maybe more accurate to say exposure and success is directly correlated since success is hard to obtain without exposure in some fashion.

>It might make you feel better to pretend that these fatass bankers are masturbating all day while you work your ass off
Funny thing is he didn't call them "fatasses" nor did he imply that money laundering, scamming, and other criminal thuggery isn't hard work. You dreamed that up all on your own.

>the exact opposite is the truth
It might make you feel better to rationalize it this way. The reality is they make their money by gaming the system built from the efforts of others.

>all that *helps*
In school, working "smart" is more about study habits than anything else. Brainlets try to memorize shit rote. Smarter students take time to actually understand the material, which might take a couple extra hours but yields far greater results.

>why does this feel so good yet so wrong?
It's not wrong, it gives you power over those who don't work hard. They assume "he has a natural talent we can't match"

Whereas if people know you work hard they think "he's not smart, he just works hard, I could do that if I worked that hard"

>it's all luck
>le nihilistic edgelord mentality
your brain is filled with shit

>you fail to see all the hard workers that failed, survivorship bias
failure of logic here. finding a bunch of broken eggs that didn't make omelets doesn't contradict the fact that you must break an egg to make an omelet

>roll the dices the most you can.
thus the one who works the most, rolls the most dice

just go back to plebbit young piggot

I agree with this. Most people in Veeky Forums are either unintelligent plebs who try too hard to do math or don't even try. That's why they don't think being successful is a thing that you can work toward.

No fags, luck = everything you need if you want to be successful.

No, they're inversely proportional. Both preclude each other.