He actually went to University and wasted his money getting an "elite education" when all the books are freely...

>he didn't join the army right out of highschool and get paid way more than any of his 18 year old peers to shoot muslims for three years then go to college for free
lmao

epic post, or should I say, reddit

>fighting for Jews

I went to community college for three semesters then dropped out.

MA fag here. Up to my old-ass balls in debt and well-aware that the "value" of my degree is exponentially decreasing in a world where the democratization of information has provided access to all the texts I levied my future in order to access.

But, then again, the value of my education was not in having access to it - it was in the conversations that occurred because of it. It was the context of having a space in which there was a guided and shared discussion of materials ranging from throughout all of human history, and sharing my perspective with others who likewise contributed to a collective labor of learning.

You're not paying for access to the information - you're renting the room in which you are invited to participate in a tradition that stretches back to the dawn of civilization; you're purchasing a ticket to join a sacred circle, and the "rights and privileges" conferred on those who complete a degree are exactly what you make of them. It's just as much bullshit as you believe it to be... and that goes both ways.

Is it elitist? Yeah, by definition. But is it without value? No. It may be the most powerful ritual remaining in our society, and a process by which you can understand your part in the whole of existence.

It should be free, and it should mean more than it does, and you're not wrong to scoff at what higher education has become in a post-consumer economy... but along with Pepe's laughter, you will note teardrops where, perhaps, he mourns.

>being this degenerate
Neck yourself , OP.

>he actually thinks people go to university to learn and not experience an essential part of their social rearing
Yes, the excluded and destitute have such an enlightened vantage point to offer. Spare me the wisdom of your poverity OP, college is extremely healthy for any individual, plus it's full of virile young women, you fag.

>dropping out of community college

whew lad

What are your plans now?

>acknowledges his degree is garbage
>he is still guzzling down the marketing

>implying anyone at university forms any genuine relationships

epic meme

>genuine relationships
nice spook

>I didn't ready Stirner

Epic

I met my girlfriend in college.

Enjoy your hand my dear dumb frogposter.

>it's full of virile young women, you fag.

>go to uni for sex

Are you an animal?

eyyy

*tsk*
*tsk*

now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out west side walk it out ey east side walk it out ey north side walk it out ey south side walk it out ey now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out now walk it out

>dating a dumb college broad

LMAO, and he thinks he's the smart one HAHAHAHAHHAA

Then why is it I can beat any self-educated stooge in an argument?

Yes. Human beings are animals. There's no shame in sex, college is some kind of godsend, you're in the prime of your life and there's an interminable vastness of perky titties you've ready-made pretexts to engage. I honestly pity those who don't have such an opportunity, it's one last liberated hurrah before committing to the drudgery of adulthood.

>He actually believes this lmao

Go on, post an argument and watch me beat you up.

define genuine relationships

I'm 'genuinely' curious

can you give any examples?

You are only an animal if you don't have the willpower to overwrite your base instincts, I honestly pity shallow idiots like you.

Life experience is arguably the most important thing for a writer. College offers that, if nothing else.

>Love is a base instinct

I fucked you're waifu.

A genuine relationship is one in which you are comfortable saying and doing anything with a friend, even things which offend them without hesitation.

In University, you can never do this, there is always a sort of invisible barrier, the undetermined distance and doing such a thing may poison the relationship.

Genuine friendships rebound against all odds, they are lifelong.

>experience meme

Tell that to the loads of shut-in writers in the canon who barely had any social contact.

>love is the same as sexual attraction and lust

Just because one can enjoy their base instincts doesn't mean they are governed by them. Anyone who so focuses on denying their own nature is the truest of debased wretches, a real pervert. Keep your pity, I've no use for it.

I've forged 3 such relationships with people I've met in college, and have known for years since. Don't project your own inability to be open with others and call it the norm. There's many opportunities in school for you to earnestly engage with people, more so than anywhere else in the world I think, as there's an innate camaraderie found in clubs and academia.

>A genuine relationship is one in which you are comfortable saying and doing anything with a friend, even things which offend them without hesitation.
Haha yeah the only genuine friendship is one in which I can act like a dick without consequences.

Pure autism.

>He's never had a lifelong friend whom he's known since birth

lmao, feel sorry for you buddy

Keep having those "friendships" which are entirely vacuous and where the conversation is boring trash 24/7

Did you even read it? This sounds like an puerile edgelord response instead of actual analysis.

>Don't project your own inability to be open with others and call it the norm.

Epic reddit post

This is exactly why masculinity is on the decline. Candor loses out to disaffected pretension. Well whatever, I gave my 2 cents. Maybe your currency has weight in Zimbabwe.

TFW you're conflicted because you like the sex-positivity of user's statement, but really find the rape-culture vibe distasteful...

>Keep having those "friendships" which are entirely vacuous and where the conversation is boring trash 24/7

you sound like fun

Masculinity is one the decline because of Redditards like yourself who use words like "projecting" which is a feminine conception used to detract discussion and make the opposition in a debate seem pathological as to disqualify their opinions.

Like I said, reddit post.

truly the reddit boogeyman is the way for enlightened discourse

tried and true whenever one lacks real refutation

idiot

>virile young women
>virile
>women

from where I come from, that makes absolutely no fucking sense

Epic post, redditor, keep them coming.

You sound like you are "projecting" :^)

Look, here's the thing:

If you're using a degree to bolster your ethos, then you deserve all the shit you get from people who can use their literacy to research and study on their own. It doesn't make you a better person to have a degree, and it doesn't confer upon you some special status above anybody else. Especially in this society (if American), because the for-profit virus has practically completely rent the body academic asunder, and the degree-mills are almost impossible to tell from those who maintain a gatekeeper system based on traditional expectations of scholarship.

But it also works both ways - not going to college doesn't make you some lone-wolf ronin of an academic who is better than a college cuck, either. You don't get to establish ethos by bragging about how you've "avoided the meme" of college, because it just means you've come to a lot of conclusions that you haven't been able to run by that many people with a lot of experience.

Let's just say fuck ethos altogether, and start looking at the ACTUAL LOGOS (MESSAGE) of things being claimed, especially on a MOTHERFUCKING ANONYMOUS CHINESE WATERBOARDING FORUM... (inb4 triggered).

tl;dr: ITT: Basically, almost everyone's wrong about this.

Where do you live?

>Rape-culture vibe
Please stop

i went to an alite university and got an 'elite' job coming out. its been four years and i wish more than anything i had never gone to college and had started a band with my friends from home, toured in a bus for a few years partying and then moved to the country somewhere cheap to live and worked on being a writer or being self sustaining or both.

But my university is free. Government actualy pays me 587euros a month for being there.

you're trying to hard
you're not from Reddit are you?

>interminable vastness of perky titties you've ready-made pretexts to engage
Tell me this doesn't sound like a guy who's three shots of whiskey away from getting pulled off of a passed-out chick by Canadian bikers. It's pretty fucking rapey.

He sounds like a guy who wants to have sex with girls. Only a person (woman) infected by present-day gender politics would find this rapey.

>you've ready-made pretexts to engage
Holy fuck, think this through:
>you go to college with me
>you have titties
>therefore I have a reason to expect getting those titties because we happen to be matriculated in the same uni
Calling that shit rapey isn't being "infected by present-day gender politics," it's just imagining what it sounds like to the people who have titties that this guy feels like he should take a go at when they're just trying to fucking read Schopenhauer. Don't be that guy, user.

These three posts are the only three posts ever written on Veeky Forums. All other posts are just variants.

How can someone finance themselves to do this though?

If a guy is obnoxious this might be annoying

When people start calling this rape culture I think these people are infected by gender politics.

to be in a band? you live on hot dogs and shit. i cared way too much about how i was going to make money. recently i broke up with a long term gf who was about three years older than me. she was from the south, so was approaching child rearing age. when we broke up i was so fucking relieved that i wouldnt need to have kids soon, be tied to a mortgage, etc. but then i realized, that going straight to college, then right into consulting or whatever, then right into business or whatever, is the same shit. i was worried about my future from the jump, and the safest way to temper my anxiety was to completely track my life; it is extremely hard to get out of, once you're in it - maybe not as hard as if you have kids, but mighty close. living as an absolutely destitute 18-23 yr old wouldnt have mattered at all to me then, and probably wouldn't now, if i was driving around the country drinking with my friends, playing shitty gigs, and pounding sluts. i fell for the rat race meme hard and it makes a guy like me want to fucking cry.

I can see how if you think it's literally *equating* it with rape, then yeah. "Rape-culture" is just that, though - the *culture* of ownership over women's bodies that *leads* to rape. It's a slippery slope, to be sure, but we can't pretend it's not there. user isn't drugging drinks, obviously, but he's assuming that going to college comes with some automatic expectation of getting laid. That's some Rodney Dangerfield shit, and it's the kind of fiction that leads to guys getting frustrated by "frigid bitches" and then escalating to the point where it gets ugly.

>Implying we live in a culture where men expect ownership over women's bodies

If you are a decent male human being you can expect to get laid at college. Not with every girl, but you're bound to find some girl who thinks you're attractive enough or at least grow into that version of yourself. You're attacking normal male sexuality.

Look on the bright side: if you had, you would have been just as fucked up about not having taken the "safe path" and getting a "real job" when you were sleeping in your own puke and popping syphilis pustules on your cock. What we want isn't just made stronger by the fact that we can't have it - it's literally *defined* by what we can't have. Now, you have the knowledge you woudn't have had and can properly enjoy your nomadic existence. You were Vincent Vega, and now you're Joules Winfield. /spoiler/And it's only Joules that gets to live through that film./spoiler/

>OMFG failing at doing spoiler that hard

Also
>Claims to not be infected by gender politics
>Writes a whole paragraph about how expecting to get laid at college is rape culture.

>decent male human being
>normal male sexuality
>2017
>still believing in gender binary
You do know that there's no such thing as "normal male sexuality," right? You ever seen apes? You know, those things from which we evolved? They fuck EVERYTHING. Get over yourself and stop trying to put your weird fetish for being "normal" on everyone with a dick. You don't have to prove anything to anyone; you are completely entitled to your sexuality.

>living in a society without free education
plebs

Yeah... a *whole paragraph* to explain how user was misunderstanding the use of a term that triggers people into getting mad at shit they probably actually agree with. Stop taking the easy way out and learn to fucking read, user.

>he actually thinks the point in going to an elite university is to read books

nytimes.com/2013/04/07/opinion/sunday/douthat-the-secrets-of-princeton.html

Also, free access to journal articles and magazines and newspapers at uni too

>free access to journal articles
What is scihub?

>magazines and newspapers
Okay, I'll give you those two

>He has above average intelligence
>He actually reads anything other than the Bible

Does scihub give you access to every relevant academic journal?

Jesus christ this amount of ideology

The west is truly fucked.

There is such a thing as normal human sexuality. It is that thing which most humans though. That is, by definition, the norm.

>LOL apes fuck everything
Indeed, Bonobo's do. Chimps, the species that are the closest related, don't. Seriously, attacking 'heteronormativity' on evolutionary grounds, how does that even work?

>the loads of shut-in writers in the canon who barely had any social contact.
Bullshit. Name several of them.

Damn. I was considering studying finance in university to do the whole Patrick Bateman gig after reading American Psycho. I just kind of ignored all the negative aspects of pursuing economic success that was mentioned throughout the book (such as that PB is miserable) and I just thought it would be cool to have money.

Is it that bad?

>What I would like to ask Mr. Douthat is, can you think of any other reason besides elitist snobbism, that a PhD in philosophy might not marry or be close friends with, an auto mechanic. Could it be that they wouldn't have anything to talk about? Or even a lowly English major trying to share his/her love of literature with an uneducated bank teller.

Wew lad. The comments on this article are rich.

Douthat could write a column about baseball and NYT commenters will still find a way to chastise his political views in the comments

Yes

I'v read more than enough drivel about rape culture. I don't think this type of feminism is in touch with reality. It is fuelled by resentment, it is destructive and destabilizing to the core. That's why it's such a tragedy that North-American universities are turning young and malleable people into SJW's by the masses.

You only think it's ideology because of *your* ideology, which is based on a really long tradition of believing that people are "supposed" to be a certain way.

Do you really think that your dick knows there's some baby that's going to be made by shooting your ball-sauce? No. Your dick knows it feels awesome. Why you might want to fuck chicks more than others has nothing to do with any biological predisposition and has everything to do with living in a culture that teaches you that there's something wrong with you if you don't.

Here's how the evolutionary example might work: Lamarck thought that the plants were "trying to reach the sun," and that's how he explained the evolution of some species growing larger leaves over time. Darwin took one look at that model and called bullshit, took out the teleological function of the plant "wanting" to do anything, and bam - evolution was understood as a process of adaptation, and massive advances came out of that shift in framework.

In 100 years, nobody is going to think that there's any "biological imperative" to have straight sex. They'll see reproduction as just the consequence of sex being awesome, and view those who still believe in heteronormativity as we would someone who thinks that plants want to reach the sun - charmingly misinformed. Of course, by then there won't be anymore biological reproduction by childbirth, because it's fucking gross and painful and unnecessary, but this is probably the point where you'll say I've gone too far and freak out, if you already haven't.

tl;dr: inb4 tl;dr to avoid the potentially worldview-changing shit going on here

Gee, if there were only some fine, upstanding group who was willing to restore some sense of order to our nation...
>STFU
>Not falling for it

Ironically enough the prevalence of the modern identity politics left causes the extreme right to grow, this occurs especially among young men. I don't want that to happen. It is, indeed, a counter-movement of (extreme) order against the postmodern blending of all categories we use to navigate through our lifes.

He does have a good point though. Education has become a bad joke because nowadays everything is designed to cater the lowest common denominator. Just take a glance at university programmes - even the slightly mentally deficient with average studying habits can pass without much trouble.

The average student is suffering from the "forever a teenager" syndrome. Normies ranting about partying, sports and hookups and speaking of university in terms of a hated obligation, as if it were high-school all over again.

The curriculum is more appropriate for high-school than university: all the group tasks, pre-exam obligations, mandatory lecture attendance... the treatment of 20+ year olds like children. Pathetic, but it suits them right.

The professors/their assistants are awful as well. They are usually entirely disconnected from lectures (Who can blame them?) or fit the archetype of the modern teacher - a person with an inflated ego, fake enthusiasm and miserably shallow knowledge.

I've based these conclusions on the despicable 4 years I've already spent (wasted?) in the academia. Just to think that when I was younger I had this illusion that after a terrible experience in high school everything would get better at uni makes me want to tie a noose around my neck and kick the stool without a single second-thought.

thats normal. almost all the kids i went to college with pretended to be bateman tongue-in-cheek. if that's what you want, that's what you want - but of course they don't show the work someone like bateman would actually need to do. or how terrible the people he'd actually be around would be. i think a lot of people took away from that book and movie that it was cool to be patrick bateman. it might be - but that's a fictional character in the 80s. if you are ready to tie your identity to your job or industry and put your head down, you can make a lot of money. and it's not like i have some other industry you should go into - i think 'liking your job' is just as big an illusion as any. but the danger of finance/consulting is the propriety of it. the steps will take you all the way to your first child if you don't come up for air, and then you might just wonder what the fuck you've been doing.

I wish I had other people to discuss with me that want to learn. That's why I want to uni. And also yo need certificate for being a lawyer

Indeed, a species adapts to survive and thus what a species wants is what is necessary to survive and reproduce. This is why men like women and vice versa. Fucking women wil help you reproduce. If men could just collectively devide to stop wanting to fuck women the species would die out pretty quickly.

Also, if men would have no biological preference of fucking women over fucking men, then men would mostly stick to fucking men. After all, men have lower standards than women. Dating site research showed that men rated about 50% as attractive, while women rated about 15% of men as attractive. This is why gay men are relatively promiscuis.

Yeah, but that doesn't justify bullies who try and persuade with fear. Even if there *are* SJWs, they're fighting for justice, FFS. I know justice is a relative term, and there's no objective way to describe it, but the thing is that nobody's saying the alt-right isn't entitled to believe in their own supremacy and the inferiority of those who don't accept their premises; they're just not allowed to force other people to believe it - which can only be evinced through some sort of Inquisition-like confession. It's bullshit. There *is* a difference between words and actions on a phenomenological level, and I agree that we shouldn't outlaw words to protect feelings... but when we turn a blind eye to the legislation of abortion restrictions or banning of same-sex marriage, then we're letting ourselves be duped by the fundamentalist religious movement that is co-opting the entire thing. I honestly believe we all just want the right to be ourselves... and nobody has the right to tell anyone who they are in any way, shape, or form - we can only legislate action, never intention.

Not the user you were talking to but I felt the urge to respond to your post: You are irredeemable. Talking to lunatics of your kind is pointless. Please leave this board, I'm tired of that bullshit being shoved down my throat every day at university, I don't need it here as well. Please. Leave.

Well, SJWs are authoritarian as fuck as well so I would not depend on their interpretation of justice if you want to govern society according to those principles. The far right and the far left are both shit, the difference is that the far left has a disproportionate influence, especially in universities, and is actually taken seriously.

>a species adapts to survive
Kind of; survival is *dependent* on its ability to adapt
>what a species wants is what is necessary to survive and reproduce
Nooooooo... you're putting the cart before the horse, my dood. A species doesn't "want" anything - remember that plant? It doesn't *want* to reach the sun, it just happens to be able to survive better because it has bigger leaves, and therefore will be more likely to spread seeds.

The sad fact is that we don't actually need the human reproductive organs at all anymore, and we haven't for a while. We could clone everyone. Evolution doesn't even fucking apply to our bodies anymore; the Earth has had to adapt to *us* for the past 150 years (arguably, depending on what benchmark you use, but it's called the "Anthropocene." Look it up.).

You're not going to like this, but I'm going to suggest a Richard Dawkins book (avoid the trigger, my guy - I believe in you) - it's called "The Selfish Gene." It basically explains this idea, that on an *individual* level, the concept of "evolution" is almost completely meaningless, because the species *doesn't know* what's going to be an evolutionary advantage. Think about it - if you didn't know that a giant comet was coming, would you have bet on the little motherfuckers running around at the feet of the dinosaurs being the inheritors of the planet? No - you'd look at that Godzilla-sized T. Rex and put all your money on it (I know, I'm participating in dino-meming, but just go with the metaphor).

So, really, the moment we became capable of cloning, we basically transcended all evolutionary constraints, and all that's stopping us is the nasty business of eugenics and the fact that we can't get along well enough to stop arguing over who deserves to exist. And that's the worst bullshit of all, because really *none* of us "deserve" to exist, because we're all sort of shitty in our own special way. Yet we're also magnificent as well, so you see - you're cool. I'm cool. We're all cool here, and we can all win. This is not a zero-sum game. Believe it, user. Belief is important. Even to science.

thanks for the good insight. i may consider other career choices if Elis is truly right as you explain. i hope you can break out of that lifestyle since you are just finishing up university.

Your claim is basically that evolution has created us the way we are but has no influence on our psychology. This is bullocks and you would realize it is bullocks if you would actually seriously think about it for two minutes.

>Talking to lunatics of your kind is pointless
>Talks to said lunatic
Seems legit.
> I'm tired of that bullshit being shoved down my throat every day at university, I don't need it here as well.
So, you're asking for a *space* where you can feel *safe*? [Dons Gene Wilder costume] Tell me about that...
Really, though, why do you feel threatened? It's a hypothesis. It has nothing to do you with you personally. Fuck who you want to fuck, as long as they want to fuck you too. Literally why would you care if there's no biological preference for what you do unless you either feel the need to be part of some divinely chosen group or you're legitimately fighting gay urges out of the need to "save your species"? Do you think we'll accidentally extinct ourselves because we forgot how to be straight? It's either astonishingly poor logic or you're being clouded by ideology. Seriously reflect on this.

>Claims the norm of straightness is just a social construct and that sexual attraction is 100% socially malleable. Says sexual attraction is just wanting to feel good because of fucking and disregards why we feel attracted to certain people and not to other people
>Calls other people clouded by ideology

If I lived in North-America I would seriously move somewhere else. I can only imagine the hellhole it will be if this goes on for 20 years.

Maybe. Probably not, though. I think you're misusing the word "authoritarian." I also suspect that you're probably treating a situation that is based around a really complex situation as some kind of monolithic "us vs. them" thing, which may be easier to process, but which is really intellectually dishonest.

Went to a state university that was very helpful and affordable, about to graduate with a 4.0 average and zero (0) debt. Feels great.

>he thinks there is such a thing as a free lunch

>evolution has created us the way we are
>influence on our psychology
Two problems, here: 1) Evolution didn't "create us." Evolution isn't the scientist's version of "sky-daddy," it's a process... which takes a long, long, long, way long amount of time compared to a single human life. Which you have. Which is why you can't understand it the same way you would understand other processes. It's not *my* claim, either. People study this stuff, and they store and share their findings and come up with surprisingly efficient models of things that, if everybody was limited to the amount of information they could gather in a single lifetime, we would never be able to figure out. It's bigger than me. It's bigger than you. It's bigger than everybody. 2) We can't really say we understand the genetic influences of psychology well enough to know almost anything useful. There could very well be epigenetic influences that transmit ancestral memories, but that still doesn't mean that they're "choosing" to do anything to "make" us survive as a species. Your genes don't care if they proliferate, per se. They have no opinion on the matter. They might be providing us with information, and we may in fact be dealing with thoughts, urges, even trauma from previous generations. But we *react* to that on our own conscience. 3) Bonus quibble: "Bullocks" is a now-defunct American department store from the 1970s-80s. You mean "bollocks."

>He doesn't live in Scandinavia and goes to gommie university with stipend :DDDDDDDDD