Tfw black but have the PHENOTYPE

>Variation in population is of course a factor, but with the arguments I've heard genetically there is literally NO reason I or any other intelligent black person will exist.

Then you're arguing against a moronic straw man.

The evidence shows that blacks in America have a mean IQ of 80-85 with a normal-ish distribution.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence#United_States_test_scores
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Transracial_Adoption_Study

IQ in humans has a standard deviation of 15
this would make a black person with an IQ of 140 or greater 3.7 standard deviations above the mean of their population.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/68–95–99.7_rule

This would make a between 1 in 2000 and 1 in 15000 black people have an IQ of 140 or greater.

Since there are at least 30 million black people in the USA alone, we would of course expect there to be some black people with a mean IQ of 140 or greater. infact we would expect at least 2000 blacks in america alone to have IQs of 140 or higher.

However the point is that white people have a mean IQ of 100 in the USA and western europe, so having an IQ of 140 is only 2.7 standard deviations above the mean and thus between 1 in 81 to 1 in 370 white people have a mean IQ of 140 or higher.

making the fraction of whites with an IQ above 140 about 100 times higher than the fraction of blacks with an IQ of 140

So no, not all back people are low IQ , but high IQ black people are much rarer than high IQ white people and most blacks have an IQ lower than most whites, and only about 16% of blacks in america are smarter than the bottom half of whites.

>I base my feelings on race from one flawed study from the 70s that had no basis or evidence in genetics

you don't need evidence from genetics to say taht the mean IQ of black americans is around 85 you dumbass.

You just need IQ test result studies.

You'd only need evidence from genetics if you wanted to show that their mean IQ was 85 due to their genes which is a totally different question to what the mean IQ of black people is and whether it is possible for black people to have an IQ of 140 or greater.

almost every thing you have said has been shown to be wrong or employing dumbass reasoning.

every post you make makes you look stupid.
you're probably trolling. I don't mind because I like having the opportunity to set the record straight and remind people about the low IQ of blacks

Filename?

Follow blackanon here let's chat?

(Mixed) black person here. Unknown IQ, but I have always gradually found myself drifting to the fuzzy "top 1%" range among my peers (high school valedictorian, nearly perfect standardized test scores without much effort, two STEM degrees from a prestigious school, published peer-reviewed work solving open problems in my field, ...).

I'm personally not interested in population genetics when applied in broad strokes; I think it's only useful when reduced to the points applicable to the consideration of individuals: anything else reduces to social science.

This is more of a general note, but it's also disheartening to see the lack of understanding most people have of elementary statistics. Very few, for example, are able to grasp the fact that the Normal curves depicted so often on this topic are nothing more than educated guesses at distributions fitting a sample of the population. Among these, even fewer can grasp the nuances that (1) the law of large numbers hasn't even come into scope at the scale of these studies and (2) it's possible that another distribution is a better fit at either tail.

>Is race really what determines IQ?
No, not remotely. I'm not saying you're wrong either though, that is the promoted ideology here and has been in the First World to discourage black people since IQ tests were pretty much first developed.
It's culture. Culture determines IQ. Most African Americans are raised in homes and Neighborhoods where "street smarts" and whatever urban dictionary hullshit someone wants to throw at me is valued over mathematical understanding and intelligence. It's why both stereotypically and historical African americans have struggled in school. It's due to the culture they're raised in. A black person isn't inherently retarded. African American culture promotes it though.

Are there any sources that back up your claim? I imagine something like an IQ test chart for seperated twins, or a comparison with adopted blacks.

No data, only statistics that prove the opposite. However, white people that grow up under similar cultures prove to be equally if not even more stupid, and there are examples of individuals like Neil Degrasse Tyson who one could attribute to being as smart and successful as he is to the fact that he didn't grow up under that culture. And if he isn't a valid example, quite literally any black intellectual will suffice, as they either were never brought up under that cultural influence to begin with or shut it out from their lives.

>white people that grow up under similar cultures
Example? This is meant as a genuine, non-/pol/, non-meme, question. I'm not a burger or anglo, so maybe it's different over there.

I'm still confused why the black culture in the US did somehow get even worse over time, afaik the murder/rape/crime in general rate was far less worse 40y ago. Again, not memeing. I'm really baffled by this since every (rare) black guy I met was really friendly independent of social standing and line of work. What's happening in the US just seems like a massive waste of human potential.

Your genes determine your potential not where you're actually going to end up. It's pretty rare anyone actually achieves their full potential anyway. Nature vs. nuture and whatnot.

>I want Veeky Forums to very honestly discuss race and genetics
I'm of the opinion that if you aren't 3 st. devs above your race's mean that you shouldn't be allowed to talk about IQ at all
It would improve the quality of IQ threads drastically

depends on the gene really, certain things like height are fully expressed in most first world countries or places without malnutrition.

I doubt that, I feel like I could've grown taller if I ate more. My cousins are tall as fuck. Still not a manlet tho.

well on an individual level maybe, but i mean collectively we have never been taller or more athletic than now because nutritional requirements are generally more than met in first world countries.
people are often dealt random hands in gene distribution for height though. I think grandparent's height is a pretty good indicator of potential, cousins isn't really since that's only 50% relation at most, assuming no consanguinity

Race, heredity, and gender determine IQ, but it all falls on a bell curve and there's always people on both ends.

Well my grandad was a big guy and my grandma is a little old lady and that's how most of my family is (on my mom's side). My dad's side is shorterish so maybe you're right.

If race is a factor, it is a small one. Parental socioeconomic status and early child education are the biggest predictors of IQ. Racists like to post images of "black IQ" vs "white IQ" curves because on a surface level the image confirms what they want to believe, but the underlying implication of such images is that no other factors affecting the distribution.

In general, any sort of "biological determinism" argument falls apart for the same reason. Differences between populations separated by race, culture, wealth, etc, tend to be caused by factors related to upbringing and experience rather than some innate biological characteristic. That hasn't stopped people from using flawed biological determinism arguments when it fits their biases.

all dat style even google recognize

It is not as simple as race, it is more like a slot machine. A few genes are correlated with intelligence, however on their own they often have little effect, often 2 or more genes are needed that interact in certain ways to yield a positive effect. Not going to lie, some of these genes are more prevalent in some races than others, though in your case, if you're not lying, you won the jackpot and probably have a bunch of these genes. In the modern world you don't need to judge by race when you can judge by a mouth swab.

theguardian.com/science/2017/may/22/scientists-uncover-40-genes-iq-einstein-genius

I think it's fairly obvious intelligence is hereditary. However, whether it is stratified across racial lines is not clear.

146 iq nog here. 100% of my immediate family and the majority of my extended family going back two generations (over 85%) have Masters or better. About 70% are actively working as professors, engineers, lawyers, or doctors, and we have a couple multimillionaire business owners as well. If there was some "crippling" genetic factor due to being Black, we shouldn't have been able to achieve such a high rate of success in fields highly correlated with intelligence. You can mutter "outliers", but doesn't it seem a stretch that hundreds of freak Black outliers are concentrated in a single family, given that they are racially determined to have a 50% chance of being below 85 IQ?

The current studies that show racial divisions are inconclusive. It's been shown in thread after thread that Lynn's 69 IQ figure, upon which The Bell Curve's 85 Black IQ figure was derived, is mistaken. Weicherts et. al. showed Lynn's results are dubious at best
>Jelte M. Wicherts, Conor V. Dolan, Han L.J. van der Maas, The dangers of unsystematic selection methods and the representativeness of 46 samples of African test-takers, Intelligence, Volume 38, Issue 1, 2010, Pages 30-37, ISSN 0160-2896, dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.intell.2009.11.003
They estimate subsaharan IQ at 80 which, by Murray's methodology in The Bell Curve, would place Black IQ between 95-100.

Also, the minnesota transracial adoption actually makes a strong case for environmental effects since all the black babies were adopted from the same area of Midwest USA, while the white children were pulled from many areas around the globe. Jensen admits this in a subsequent interview about the study.

Basically, it isn't morally right to shape political/social policies given the inconclusiveness of the current set of studies. I remain open to further information of course.

Exactly. It's the whole "Correlation is not causation" issue with those images.
You'll always get some morons trying to cite how other factors have been eliminated through selection but further reading usually proves their citations saying the exact opposite.

Remember to subtract 15 to obtain your ASHKENAZI adjusted iq score.

Surprisingly enough there has been some quality discussion.
I think this is my new favourite board.

What makes you think violent crime was worse 40 years ago than it is today?

As a matter of fact, violent crime in America dropped in the 90s and, while it has gone up a bit since the recession, isn't nearly as high as it was in the 60s and 70s.

Also the guy you're talking to is mostly talking out of his ass. Arguing that someone is smarter if you put them in a vacuum or in some other society that their race didn't produce is not a good argument concerning real world intelligence.

Also, to name the example always brought up in these discussions, West Virginia is filled with white people who kill each other all the time. Exactly why it's the exception to the rule is unknown.

> West Virginia is filled with white people who kill each other all the time.

They dont. below average crime rate

White people don't live in concentrated poverty. There's not a single example.

Romania, Russia, Canada

I don't think it's quite the same. Plus I want to keep the argument American because it's what I'm familiar with. Just gonna say that the results for white people in those places can be pretty bad.

Crimes rates across the country have been steadily falling for decades, even among minorities.

I've hung out with a lot of black people and I seriously doubt they're all that dumb per se. To be smart is nearly synonymous with being feminine these days. I don't want to sound like an alt-right guy but to do well in school one must often be quite submissive. This just isn't how guys learn. White males are on average closer to bitches so they can endure it but black males need a more real world approach. And even then black males aren't necessarily going to do as well. But that doesn't necessarily mean they're stupid. If one were to have as much faith in emotional or social intelligence as spatial or any other specific, it isn't implausible that blacks would score higher in some areas.

Supposedly they have a more developed pineal gland. I wouldn't be surprised if that were true. Liberals, conservatives, and different races have all been proven to have different brain structure. That doesn't mean one is superior to the other, necessarily.

>Liberals, conservatives, and different races have all been proven to have different brain structure.
You need to go back

False-flagging /pol/-ster. You go back.

>/pol/-ster
They're called poltards, polluters or stormweenies buddy.

> under/rape/crime was far less worse 40y ago.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
no, the war on drugs has and continues to be the largest perpetrator of violence, and """"crime""""

black iq is 90 tops

btw if subsaharan iq is 80, then american black iq should be 80*0.2 + 100*0.8 = 84 (averaging works here because intelligence is complex)

flynn put it at 85+ in the 2006 paper
peterdanpsychology.ro/ro/pagina/25/files/docs/black iq gains.pdf
NAEP which is 17 yo, but has the advantage of being representative is 90+

there's also the question whether ameriniggers, who were slaves are actually representative of your actual west africans

anyways i really dislike american niggers, but it's funny to me that their iq is most certainly 85+ and people want to tell me indians, indonesians, arabs, mexicans, and even some white peoples(albanians) are as dumb as blacks - either IQ is flawed or the estimates are faulty

so the black estimate provides a sort of a lower boundry for me in a way, not that 90 is even that low, nig problems are of a different nature than the intellectual one