Why America is a leader in science yet has a third-world style education system

Really? What if this happened to many other states, predominantly in the south? There's a lot of people there. I imagine that having that many uneducated people would ruin a democracy in voting.

You could convince them of anything since they won't even know what's going on.

Seems like bad reasoning. Why not just have the national government control education, like most other countries, and have them give a really good education? Where's the problem?

They're rebellious so it won't work.

Because that is too much effort and migco managing. At best you can give suggestions and HOPE the states take it to heart and the school boards aren't legit malicious cunts.

because it's the leader in the sense that a lot of strong private industry is centred in USA, foreigners are fuel for it. These things are removed from the education system.

Mississippi is 4638% niggers. Eventhough the Jews tell everyone they're humans, just like everyone else, they do not allow them into Israel.

Blacks are advanced chimpanzees not human. I'm not even racist at this point because I don't even consider them a different race but instead a closely related but different species.

>No wonder you never see USA-born white scientists

You literally have no idea what the fuck you're talking about you stupid worthless chink-loving faggot.

Do you think all non-whites are chimps then? Seems like you're not self-aware

Says the guy on Veeky Forums, rather than doing groundbreaking scientific work

Only a liberal/Progressive like yourself would make an arbitrary and self hating distinction between white and non-white.

Your religion is showing.

>muh federal government is the problem
As if everything would get better if states had control. The average American is fat, unimaginative and lacks will. They can't and never had competed with the cream of foreigners. It's no coincidence the rise of America as a scientific powerhouse comes after the mass exodus of scientists from Europe to the US.

How is it self-hating?

Ever go to a uni? It's a 30% Jews, 40% Asians and the rest maybe white.

This, and also 5% of America is Chinese/Asian, yet they make up around 20% of grad school. Around 0.6% of Americans are Indian, and they make up 15% of grad school. Euro-American people on the other hand make up around 75% of Americans, and they clock at 50% of grad school.

>the rest maybe white.

Need to cut that up with foreigners, long history or recent immigrants.

Fake news White native Americans have excellent scores

In the meantime 80% of Indian engineers are unemployable in the software sector
blog.hackerearth.com/2014/02/90-indian-engineering-candidates-employable-why.html

They are rich, so every smart person wants to move there.

because brain leak

>alphabet CEO Indian
>mastercard CEO Indian
>citibank CEO Indian
>Microsoft CEO Indian
>Adobe CEO Indian
>Berkshire insurance CEO Indian
>Pepsi CEO Indian
>softbank CEO Indian
>1% of the population
I'd say they're doing alright

Didn't you know? To not be a white supremacist is to be a white hater. Milo told him so.

USA values entrepreneurship and self improvement through experience, not education.

you kinda answered your own question their. In reality what 5th grader makes groundbreaking scientific discoveries. The university level is where all of that progress begins to happen, and by the time that happens people have already surpassed the hurdle of the public education system.

in fairness there could be some sort of federal benchmark but common core is not the answer.

You know the idea of a more privatized school system makes sense if done correctly. There would have to be a couple of key aspects that would need to exist.

1)The public school system still exists and all children are eligible to advance through the years until graduating high school.

2)These new private schools that form must have tuition costs that are affordable for working class to middle class families. Somewhere in the range of 5k to 10k a year.

3)There must be a barrier to entry that keeps riff raff out but allows people who have existed in poor public systems to move into the private systems. Something like an essay, community service, letters of recommendation etc.

I feel like this would be a nice system but i have a slightly off world view about the public system as i went to a extremely high quality public school that actually outperformed the private schools in my area. What does Veeky Forums think of this argument?

>I can imagine it now: Mississippi bans evolution teaching, requires creationism to be taught in all grades.
Who gives a fuck as long as they get the math right

Given half a chance the state governments would institute a theocracy based on Christianity and outlaw teaching any science that contradicts the biblical cosmology. Its a miracle the education in America is even as good as it is currently.

you cant be real right now, yeah man lets add ANOTHER socioeconomic barrier to our country despite the fact that its already littered with them, THAT WILL SOLVE IT
signed t. upper middle class white guy

The actual truth is that no one in america gives a shit about education whatsoever because they think people should just suddenly make themselves better and overcome muh adversity

>the whole point of putting her there was to dismantle the federal education system
you mean for her and her charter school friends to make money.
>give choices back to individual states
so the south is gonna be one big special ed classroom.

there's a simpler solution:
>ban private schools
>rich forced to go to school with poor
>rich donate money to school so their children dont end up dumb
>everyone profits

Hey, you should continue the sequence of events. Allow me to do it for you.

>Rich send their kids to study outside the US, like they do with their money
>Less revenue for schools inside the US
>Less money get taxed
>Less money for public schools
>Public schools get even worse

>Rich send their kids to study outside the US
to where exatcly?

Aren't public schools in the US usually funded by local property taxes?

>if my kids have to go to a shit school, everyone should have to go to a shit school!
Fuck off with this crab bucket shit.

To Europe or Asia.

Yes. The big problem is that poor areas pay little taxes meaning the schools get little money, while wealthier areas pay more taxes so schools get more money. A solution would to instead make all school funding occur at the state level, so everyone in Minnesota pays taxes and then ever school gets an even share. The problem is that the rich then either leave or just find a loophole because they want their kids to have the best education and/or don't want them associating with niggers and/or the poor. There's also the problem of "the rich" not having enough money to fund the entire state. Every school being equal means nothing if the money taken from the good school is split up such that every other school only gets an extra $50 per month.

No, what happens is that Liberal Whites and Jews use school redistricting to keep the "riff raff" out of the schools their kids attend. Samantha Bee and a bunch of other HILARIOUS and WHACKY late night Comedy Jews got caught doing this in NYC to keep niggers from going to the same school as their kids.

Which leads us into
Devos is in place to keep things from getting worse. This is a fundamental problem in American society: The Democrat Party's complete and total strangehold over American politics has throttled any hope of education being changed because any change must be done in a manner that benefits the Democrat Party rather than the students. Michigan has a big problem with the Teacher's Union having a huge monthly due and something like 90% of that money then goes to paying members of the state Democrat Party. This leads to the Libertarian Solution as I call it:
>I'm too scared to criticize someone's bad behavior so I will instead advocate destroying the system by which they operate

Devos being in power means that the Democrats can't make the system any worse; at best she'll tear things down, but that's a shitty solution because having a Department of Education that is capable of doing things is actually a really good idea.

That's pretty much the entire point of School Vouchers:
>Everyone pays school taxes
>For every kid you have, you get a voucher
>Whichever school you send your kid to gets your voucher
>That voucher gives your tax money to that school
>The money gathered from the people who don't have kids gets redistributed evenly (but is to a degree weighted to favor schools with more children) amongst all schools throughout the state
>Schools with more kids thus get more money; parents have a greater say in what their kids learn as schools are dependent on parents for funding
This works out generally except for one thing: The Democrat Party doesn't want our school system to be efficient. And why would they? They extract a huge profit from it and if school funding actually goes to funding schools then it doesn't go to the Democrat Party.

Our school system works just fine. The problem is that it's being weighed down by massive amounts of corruption and inefficiency. Why do teachers need to pay ludicrous sums of money to be a teacher? Why does every school need four "Diversity Officers" and eight times as many administrators as teachers? Why are subjects taught to the lowest common denominator? And on, and on, and on.

Because we are THAT fucking smart. Imagine how we'd be if we got our educational system up to speed -- it wouldn't even be fair to the rest of you..

80% of Indian Engineers IN INDIA, probably because IIT is the only amazing school system there + most people are poor.

In America, I'd say 0% of Indians are unemployable.

I'm not white, so it's not self-hating, I guess.

This is Veeky Forums. We need science and scientists too.

I lived in Mississippi for 4 years in high school. One of the assignments literally said "God gave us these numbers" and was forcing religious BS down my throat with my math education.

It isn't supposed to be the final solution to it. It's Benchmark that is the minimum (it higher then several states standards currently) and states+ school can surpass the standards anyway they see fit.

>There must be a barrier to entry that keeps riff raff out but allows people who have existed in poor public systems to move into the private systems. Something like an essay, community service, letters of recommendation etc.

That would not even work at all. Galan Galeno

Lol no. Americans can't speak a 2nd language if they can depend on it and get antsy if they area minority i language or in appearance.

New Zealander here
Anglo education system for children sucks
We can see this in America, NZ, Australia, etc
However, Anglos and Jews have higher levels of creative thinking than nonAnglos and nonJews, despite being dumber than nonAnglos in other ways
Thats why nonAnglos destroy Anglos when it comes to regurgitating information in school, because asians and yuros are like automatons
However when it comes to understanding concepts deeply, Anglos and Jews destroy nonAnglos and nonJews which is why nonAnglos and nonAshkenaziJews all around the world flock to be taught radical concepts in Anglosphere institutions of learning, so they can return to their home countries and regurgitate the concepts they learned from Anglos and Jews
America by sheer numbers has the most Anglos and Jews in the world, so it is not surprising they have the most toptier universities in the world and the most scientific discoveries and innovation in the world

Innovation is led by money.

America is owned by the world bank which is owned by a small group of rich ppl. They don't desire the citizens to be smart, just docile, so they don't mind all the ass fucking that goes on. It makes it easy to circuvent laws that get in the way of efficient business. Influx of capital leads to research grants, leading to innovation, keeping them on the cutting edge and always capable of influencing the markets. Control the flow of the money and control the science. America isn't a country so much as an idea that allows for these rich motherfuckers to rule the world.

except rich people don't live in areas where there are massive amounts of poor people.Unless your talking state revenue, local taxes and school boards wont change shit. The schools in rich neighbor hoods would only get better.

like i said earlier I'm biased because i did go to a really good public school.But i do agree that our school system isn't entirely broken.

why not thats literally how university works.

so i might be reaching here and off base, but is this the reason why despite a large amount of asians/Indians populating these amazing universities, they really don't account for a large amount of CEO/politicians because the skills required for those jobs can not be read from a book?

Since no one has actually answered your question OP, it's because the US education system is build to provide the brightest with the best tools largely at the expense of the rest.

Average students, school quality, and teacher professionalism are better in many countries, but few really push talent like the highest tier American schools.

In short, show great promise and be born into opportunity and you'll be lavished with anything you could want. [spoiler]And the reason why we're in trouble now with an electorate that earnestly believes in Drumpf is because we've been leaving behind the vast majority of students for decades.[/spoiler]

No you fucktard the whole point of putting in Besty DeVry was to satisfy her Blackwater Brother. The woman is grossly under qualified to the point where only an idiot thinks she was put there to do something meaningful.

Any move she makes is 9 times out of 10 ordained by the Heritage Foundation. Who would actually have the means to see such a revamping of the education system through.

By ignoring the PISA rankings, they're already skewed due to China's bullshit (using select provinces instead of the whole country is like the U.S. using select states instead of the whole country).

He should also bring over Japanese teachers to train future U.S. teachers and help revamp the curriculum.

it was part of the bargain for federal funding in 2009. You were forced to sign on if you wanted money.

The problem with vouchers is that the private schools accepting those vouchers often have almost no accountability and that's not likely to change under Devos's Dept of Education. The schools taking vouchers are as likely to be Jesus indoctrination camps rigged up to milk the voucher system as they are to beacons of the advantages of privatized education.

Because in the name of diversity, American school are not allow to separate smart students from slower learning students. Thus smart students can only learn as much as the slow students can learn.

Zero of them have their early education in America.

You seem to assume that parents in Mississippi for some reason will be fine with their kids being at a disadvantage to the rest of the country -- I doubt this will turn out to be the case.

Personally, I see no need to add Creationism to any school curricula, but in spite of being wrong it would seem a comparatively harmless thing to be added.

Most of us get through the productive portions of our lives in exactly the same way we would if we believed in Creationism.

Most of us were taught that Santa Claus is real, that George Washington was somehow incapable of lying, that an atom looks like a little solar system -- and then got older, looked around a bit and found evidence that those things are not true. As someone else mentioned -- get the math right, everything else is going to be largely irrelevant or correctable.

>I imagine that having that many uneducated people would ruin a democracy in voting.

Explain to me how you would be worse at voting if you know everything you know now, and believed everything you believe now, except that you were a creationist.

Also, would you be open to the suggestion that a centralized education bureaucracy pushing common core might not be going to turn out the most well educated citizens?

>have them give a really good education?

Like Common Core?

Also, here are some interviews with products of the education provided by the federally-driven education system -- just for your contemplation.

youtube.com/watch?v=nlr-YPTxN6w

>They are rich

That, I suppose, is a lucky coincidence?

>>rich donate money to school so their children dont end up dumb

You need one more step -- school pairing, where donations made to your school are split with a partner school -- you then partner up rich schools with poor ones. Otherwise schools in richer areas do WAY better than schools in poor areas.

>>ban private schools

What about those private schools which are providing a better education and a safer environment in poor areas? Not sure I see a big advantage in shutting them down and putting poor kids from those schools back into poor public schools.

Yes and no -- a large portion comes from distributed federal money. But rich areas with a richer tax base can add more resources on top of that than a poor area can, obviously.

>having a Department of Education that is capable of doing things is actually a really good

Unless it does counterproductive things, in which case it is a bad idea.
I'm not sure why you assume that the programs and ideas and policies coming from a federal burreaucracy will be better than those coming from more local entities. And at last without the requirement to all get on the latest Federal Bright Idea, we have a laboratory where different ideas and policies can be field tested.

Did you learn any math?

>It's Benchmark that is the minimum

It is also a stupid set of mandates on how to get there.

I'm not saying it's perfect, I'm just explaining how it'd work because most people who shit on the voucher system have absolutely no idea what it actually entails. While proponents say that worries about accountability are handled by parents just removing their kids from shitty schools, you're putting an awful lot of faith in parents' ability to not only know with omniscience exactly what is going on inside a school AND in their ability to know precisely what is best for their kids.

I personally am an advocate of just making school funding work at the state or in-state region level, firing everyone who has ever voted Democrat, and importing Japanese teachers to undo the damage the Democrats have done. Every system works poorly when run by corrupt morons, and our system works just fine when run by people who give a shit.

Yes, but are you sure you want to point to modern Universities as an exemplar of a system that works really well?

>The woman is grossly under qualified to the point where only an idiot thinks she was put there to do something meaningful.

While I am not a fan of hers, you may be missing the point based on the fact that your idea of something meaningful being is out of sync with hers.

Shutting it down would e pretty fucking meaningful, and she seems qualified to do that.

Whether it would be good or a disaster, it would be an accomplishment with just scads and scads of meaning.

Not an american but despite the retarded american education system meme, it is, overall, not too shabby and with such a large population, and a decent quality of life combined with the competitive nature of free market society you're guaranteed to produce a huge number of successful scientists

They hire the best of the world. Two professors that developed new tech were called to made their PHd there.

Not im California. More like, 40% Asian, 20% white and 40% Hispanic

This the truest answer niggas

Yeah but based on the fuckery that Texas tried to pull with its education standards, I would rather not then be in charge of education.

Well global warming isn't gonna affect me as a religious creationist because God will save us all!

Barely. The teacher always got too caught up on religion. Thankfully, I'm studying math now.

Dysgenic populations and immigration policy, black and hispanics are low hanging fruit, Somalis in Minnesota, however, degrade a school system overnight.

Mother fucking good post user

>importing Japanese teachers to undo the damage the Democrats have done

That won't do jackshit though dumb weeb. Japanese teachers get paid well compared to the ass wages in many poor school districts in the states.

>What about those private schools which are providing a better education and a safer environment in poor areas

Very rare because you can't make much money off the poor.

Because That's like the equivalent of making a cripple from birth jump over a hurdle.

Can't really have a chance to do all that shit if your educational career from the start was already fucked from the begging

>You need one more step -- school pairing, where donations made to your school are split with a partner school -- you then partner up rich schools with poor ones.

Isn't that easy to bypass though? Like if antioxidant are effectively halved then can't I jsut simply set up an student "event" drive and donate through that? Better yet you think people will be fine with their donations effectively getting semi-taxed, like people do shit like cutting up school boards to avoid being in the same ones as the poor kids or gerrymandering schools districts what makes you think they'll agree to this?

I went to a pretty decent public school. It was 98% white out of 1500 kids. That 2% was mostly Asians of all kinds. There were 3 black kids. Now, it's 90% with 5% nigs.

It's was getting worse as more nigs moved in, but teachers changed the way they taught the curriculum rather than the curriculum itself changing and now it's actually pretty decent now, and I wish more schools would do this. Schools get dumber because folk from an anti-intellectual culture move in and nig shit up for a year before they drop out. Most of the ones that do stay usually do on par with the white kids.

It was*

Also, I'd argue that more nigs did stay and did well because teachers were good enough to adjust their styles to compensate and overcome that shitty anti-intellectual mindset in a lot of students.

Plant good seed in fertile soil, yield a good harvest.

You sure showed me user, I guess America is too poor to pay Japanese Teachers a good salary to help fix the U.S. education system.

I guess we're better off continuing to throw millions in the hole for a system and teachers who don't work so more...