Why doesn't Veeky Forums like STEAM? Artists are just as smart as you people. Probably even smarter

>STEM
>Is an acronym because they all relate and rely on each other
>art is a bunch of squares and period blood

that's because they had to create their own tools using science and math for example to get perspective right.
nowadays everything is already done by mathematicians/compscientists and conveniently packed into photoshop.
Imagine people altering images had to write their own code to apply filters.
occasionally you got people creating art like pic related where they write their own algorithms for an art project but even that requires less than 50 lines of code

OMG, arts department getting rekt. What to do to survive?

Ironically Veeky Forums wouldn't even consider psychology or sociology STEM.

I'd support steam if art = But , fuck STEAM. Artists are dumb as fuck now.

Basically this.

Because what they do is not arts. They do not make real art anymore. It's all modern art with paint dripped from vaginas or anuses
They make giant sculptures of loose labia out of feces
They take photos of horrifically fat nude women
Slam poetry

Fuck steam. They are not equal to the sciences and math and engineering.

>Renaissance
Artist were Proto-enlightment
Today artist are anti-enlightment

art doesn't just mean paintings you utter braindead STEM faggot. Art can mean anything from filmmaking to music to sound and graphic design. You have no idea what you're talking about.

art is important and producing good art takes skill, but galleries like to push bullshit so people make bullshit. even if art is made by a technically skilled artist, integrating it in to STEM is just pointlessly mashing unrelated fields together.

"STEAM" isn't even catchy. nobody will actually say it besides the arts majors who want to hopelessly convince themselves they're on par with STEM, and the fact that they feel the need to convince themselves of such a thing just reeks of inferiority complex.

>They can also make media to make white people feel guilty about nothing they have anything to do with or push agendas

>every trend in a subject I barely understand must be related to my political worldview
Wew

An elite music performance degree where you're expected to be in rehearsals or practicing 50+ hours a week, or a medical/legal illustration program where you have to basically get a degree in anatomy while having to master the principles of figure drawing in multiple media is going to be more demanding and more difficult than the average biology or mechE undergrad. On the other hand, an elite pure math program or med school is going to be a lot more difficult than the digital arts program available to me at my local junior college.

Also this this and this:

The creation process is identical to the scientific method.

can you measure their "smarts"?

This movement is nothing more than a frabication created by arts professors who fear the movement toward STEM in uni's will mean that arts programs will be cut thus them losing a job. There has been talk of completely removing non-necessary classes (arts, music, literature) from the graduation requirements of STEM students (similar to other nations) too which would basically destroy any job future of arts professors. Basically its about job security or a lack of for Arts people.

>elite music performance degree will be more in demand and more difficult than a biology or MechE degree
You never seen the inside of a physics or chemistry class have you? I ain't talking the chem and physics classes taken by non-STEM majors but the ones taken by STEM students (there is a difference).

Also I overlooked your drawing degree bullshit. Nigga, there is no need for drawings of anatomy, we have computer animations to show people.

I have a BS in mathematics.

Who do you think makes the computer animations?

Are you sure you know how to draw? There are tools to help, that's true, but getting perspective right still requires actual skill... Furthermore, the ability to use such tools doesn't mean that every artist uses it. Not everyone is a photobasher or someone who heavily references 3d scenes,etc...

I like it but I don't think a lot of artists qualify to be considered part of the steam subset. Artsits like van gough and dali sure do but your average flash animator probably doesn't. if i need to explain why then you dont belong on this sub.

andrei tarkovsky v. Michael bay.

to add to this i dont think steam is needed as those under the stem banner produce the best art.

...

What's the compelling reason for including the A? I just see it as a letter being jammed in for the sake of pointless inclusion.

While we are at it, let's jam an R in there for Religion. Then it will become STREAM.

Id say art is the process of analysis by creating something new by abstracting properties from mundane artifacts. Science and Math both abstract the truth from mundane artifacts and analyze it. Tech and engineering create new things out of these abstractions, art too can create with the truth. The only difference with art is the creative process is natural rather than formal.
They all rely on the same type of process.
My issues with STEAM is the same as my issue with STEM. its a bullshit collage of disciplines forced into a cringey public relations diagram. Just call it all academia or by its specific name and be done with it.

>cringey public relations diagram
*acronym
dont know where diagram came from

>implying artfags have any idea how their animation software works

The only true anwer

Go back to plebbit and tell them about how your dilation process is going

This is GREAT. Now "they" will stop pushing quotas in the real sciences because arts students are so over-diverse already so they will balance out our numbers.

It is because the worthless art-majors are disappointed they can't be group with the intellects. STEM is strictly the most intelligent and useful people around, but artists want to *feel* smart and useful, despite having neither of those characteristics. They do not drive the world. They do not invent new technologies. They do not cure diseases. They do not build great things. They do not probe the universe and its secrets.

They are artists.

stop stroking your ego man. Anyone can be in STEM, it just takes a slightly above average IQ and really that's only if you're going into the absolute toughest fields. You're essentially bragging about doing something any 110 IQ brainlet could do.

...

All art is for faggots only. Prove me wrong.

>probably
most artists probably dont even know what a probability space is.

>Anyone can be in STEM
Yes, but only a select few are willing to actually go into it. That pure curiosity and willingness to tangibly improve humanity's knowledge is what truly defines STEM as an idea. Its also what drives STEM students to learn and study, which is what actually allows them to outperform others academically, as opposed to IQ.
Here's a thought, out of Science, Technology, Engineering, Art, and Math, which ones values epistemology, logic, reason, and objective truths the most? You already know the answer, and its why no one will ever see artists in the same light as the other four, no matter how hard you try.

>ITT
Everyone ignoring the obvious fact that STEM is fact based and consistent while art I'd merely documented and anything could be art, same goes for psychology and sociology (both bullshit)

Derivation and fact based fields VS speculation and documentation

>speculation and documentation
Astronomy and other stamp-collecting fields BTFO.

well it all comes down to physics really, so you coulf say anything besides physic is bullshit

Well, I would agree that science boils down to physics. But not math. Physics hinges on math, after all.

There isn't as much raw knowledge involved with classical artwork but it is way more difficult to pull skillfully than anything your average plug and chug brainlet could do with math.

you sound like one of those artfags who think STEM is just memorization

No, just no.

>Here's a thought, out of Science, Technology, Engineering, Art, and Math, which ones values epistemology, logic, reason, and objective truths the most?

math and art. everything else while useful to society, doesn't require you to think outside the box or use logic or creativity beyond any other field.

But STEM is not supposed to define the set of subjects for smart people, it is supposed to lump together certain directions of study which have significant overlaps in their employed methods, something which most arts, at least as they are currently taught, do not fall under. There is no question that they may complement each other, but that is not the point of the acronym. [spoiler]This is actually a bait thread, isn't it? Oh well.[/spoiler]

yup
see above

false

Idk how it is in the US but there's a college in my town that's top notch for arts (esp. film, my sister goes there) then a few cities over there's a university that's good for medicine and business (I go there). I'm not required to take any arts shit at all (I'm in STEM). I'm pretty sure it's just that every school has their own thing.

On a related topic, is/are linguistics included in STEM?

>ITT: muh modern art
Guys if you can’t understand art produced since 1900 that’s okay, many other people are brainlets as well. Not everyone can be an intellectual and understand artworks that aren’t photorealistic paintings

technical skill > ability to fabricate meaning in a bunch of shit smeared on a canvas

"modern art" is going to be a laughing stock in a few hundred years

Yes absolutely, it is the scientific study of language. From anything to basic semantics, to cognition.

>math and art. everything else while useful to society, doesn't require you to think outside the box or use logic or creativity beyond any other field
That is incredibly narrow minded of you. All of the STEM fields require a very broad use of ingenuity in order to come up with/invent/investigate/measure/etc something original and unique. The low hanging fruits in STEM are long gone, so only the sharpest of minds have the greatest achievements.

You're saying this on an anime board.

Begone weeb

>I fought a war for you

1. That guy is not old enough to have participated in WW2.
2. That image is taken in Germany, so having fought in WW2 is nothing to be proud of.

If Germany won Europe would be united under a single nation with same laws and same currency, a normal fertility rate and very few migration
But you pref this timeline where blacked porn exists
Also you're a weeb

at it's most scientific (like how people learn how to talk or whatever) linguistics is a small branch of psychology
talking about like where a word came from isn't science

You mad that nips give the west decent art and culture?

>Artists are just as smart as you people.

No, they are not.

If it didn't effects on real life I wouldn't care, but look at average white weeb and you'll understand he'll never have children and is repulsive, he could be learning a trade, making money or making a family, but instead he screams "sasuke" and faps to hentai, reducing himself to the modern asian

Tfw I'm Singaporean

I actually feel sad that people often avoid math because math is boring to most people. All math is is simply plugging in the numbers for most people.A lot of STEM majors often feel superior but however, it should be the other way around. I feel bad that a bunch of students don't see the beauty of math because our math teachers and education system screwed them over.

Oh my freakin gosh, this.

Graduation requirements like taking art history class is nothing more than to just give teachers employment. I secretly hate my liberal arts teacher who teach art history and philosophy. I refuse to pay any attention in those classes.

It is so baffling to me how taxpayers money are being waste to give these teachers jobs. I feel offended by these scum general ed teachers.

"If we rewrite STEM to be STEAM and include my art degree in the acronym, my degree will be worth something then, right?"

Fuckin leftists, man......

Actually, its from Switzerland
Which did not fight in world wars

watching STEM guys arguing about art is just as funny as a bunch of painters trying to solve a quantum physics problem

Since when is the A for art? I thought it was architecture, that at least vaguely relates to physics (sometimes).

It ain't from Switzerland man (or at least it doesn't look like)

>read Descartes, Kant, Mach, Poincare, Frege
>dogmatism is bad
>intellectual intuition is impossible
>mathematics is ahistorical cognitivist but somehow adequate to reality
>matter is just extension in some quantity
>structural realism makes sense
>naturalism makes sense

>read Bachelard
>einstein was the end of traditional metaphysics
>we should no longer smuggle everyday concepts into our understanding of scientific reality, except as stepping stones
>even "matter" is only a convenient everyday term to allow us to visualize true reality
>true reality should be understood as mathematical functions describing structures composed of more elemental mathematical functions like "probability"
>structural realism makes sense
>naturalism makes sense

>read Guenon
>wait, matter = extension = quantitative magnitude makes no sense, because it presupposes unexamined qualitative determinations
>the structural paradigm presupposes qualitative differentiation, at the very least between ground and figure (container/contents)
>mathematical and structural realism can't work UNLESS by dogmatism
>naturalism makes no sense, except as a pragmatic philosophy for engineers

>read Godel, Husserl, Heidegger, Derrida
>wait mathematics isn't even ahistorical or transcendental, it's completely arbitrary
>many mathematics are possibly
>mathematics and all our implicit qualitative determinations have to deconstructed and reflected upon
>our mathematics is at best a tool for producing results whose nature is already foreshadowed by its axioms
>doing modern science is like saying a hammer "works" because the definition of a hammer working is that it hammers in nails, while going around hammering nails into everything
>without ever asking "why would i want to hammer nails into everything? why would that be the only thing i do? maybe that's useful sometimes, but not the only thing that's useful whatsoever?"
>naturalism not only makes absolutely no sense, it closes reality off by narrowing our view to one random, historically relative, arbitrary form of looking at it

>tfw realize philosophy like ontology and metaphysics are necessary to begin doing science in the first place
>tfw realize modern scientists aren't anti-metaphysical, they're doing just as much metaphysics as anyone, it's just that they're shitty at it
>tfw when any study wants to be "scientific" or seek after "truth," it models itself after modern scientists, who are basically retarded idiots with a completely a priori metaphysic that makes no sense
>tfw there are people doing psychology right now and thinking they are accessing true reality, by smuggling in the already-stupid preconceptions of stupid idiot scientists

Simple experiment to invalidate all STEAM fags claims of the validity of arts as a science:
Have all stem folks attend one arts 101 course (whatever) and all art folk attend one stem 101 course.
If the majority of stem can pass the intro to arts class, and the majority of arts cannot pass the intro stem course, then stem is officially superior (and vice versa of course).

I doubt most (if any) of the arts majors could even pass math 101

It depends on what subject specifically. Some of Psychology has actual rigor, like Neuroscience, some is basically glorified anthropology.

Most brainlets here can't even interpret this piece

>freakin gosh
I am also a Mormon

LE THIS

That's because those who fought for us sold themselves and us to racist jews into slavery and white genocide. Can't be helped, not all wars are won, some are lost. Weebs just don't agree to be breeding cattle, slavery is quite enough, thank you.

>50 hours of practice
>harder than MechE
Maybe certain subfields like ecology, but I'm always doing something research related and take my work home, so that's included on the 20 hours a week spent on studying.

If you throw "arts" in there whats even the purpose of the acronym? The entire point is that STEM covers the areas critical to the advancement of the human race. If you throw the very broad category of "the arts" in there now it basically covers every career out there. The acronym becomes meaningless, you might as well just change the slogan to "get a fucking job".

>scientists are stupid
Wow, you must be pretty smart!

STEM is about making money. that's IT. that's by far and away the most important thing that connects these fields.
how the fuck is an artist supposed to make money? There are some musicians, actors, painters...whatever who are just as analytical as the rest of stem, but no one should be promoting art as a career to high school students.

>on this sub

newfags these days have no self awareness

Sometimes it seems like all of academia outside STEM is just a big fucking circlejerk over one interpretation of a piece of art or literature.

there's nothing wrong with history and philosophy...depending on the topics of discussion.

It's money laundering, there's your interpretation.

>integrating form into function

The arts department will be furious

even better imho senpai

Science Engineering Art Technology

>Artists are just as smart as you people. Probably even smarter.

Lol, are you dumb? You try to bridge a gap between two groups by being a condescending cunt to one of them?