Simple or complex?

If a black hole is the most information-dense system possible, does that make them "simple" or "complex"?

hahah nigga how can a black hole have information its not a hard drive nigga haha

>2017
>Not using black hole storage devices

It'd be simple, right? I'm only basing this on knowing that people have said the brain is the most complex system in the universe, and they knew about black holes when they said it. I'm guessing black holes owe that to their isotropy.

That's what I suspected too.

The Bekenstein bound states that the information that can be stored in a finite region of space has an upper bound.

It also happens that a black hole occupying such a region of space reaches this bound of information (Bekenstein-Hawking entropy).

This means that if you wanted to describe perfectly everything that fell into a black hole, you would necessarily need a bigger region of space.

The black hole is the ultimate compression device, therefore it's the most complex one (because it always requires a bigger region of space to describe in detail what made it)

Ohh thank you, cobber.

s-so our brains aren't the most complex thing? :(

The write-speed is great, the read-speed not so much...

As soon as your brain can make it's own nutrients and oxygen, it'll be as neat as a black hole

You don't know me.

Yea i do that

But mass, charge, and angular momentum are the only quantities you can "read".
Agreed that a BH can swallow more into than anything else, but is the information still "in there"?
Debate rages.

"brain is the most complex system in the universe" is a boast by people who've never left the surface of the Earth. MAYBE it's the most complex system on Earth. Maybe.

>Agreed that a BH can swallow more into than anything else, but is the information still "in there"?

Holographic principle says yes. Even Hawking agreed (eventually).

Can I just interject to ask what simplicity and complexity actually mean to you guys?

t. brainlet

black holes arent complex in theory. you take mass and keep adding mass. you add mass until surrounding matter cannot escape and continue until the gravity surrounding it is so high, light cannot escape. people mistake black holes as being complex just because we dont know what happens to the massive "singularity" at the center when, in reality, the system makes total sense.

the human brain is far more complex and only takes a fraction of the time it takes to form a black hole.

>and only takes a fraction of the time it takes to form a black hole.
hahaha ye sbecause that fraction of time is impregnation of cum semen insde an uterus, thats less time that a lot of mass condensing in a point

Bump?

just order them in radians

Har har

?

I thought information was destroyed once it crosses the event horizon.

Though, I've also read some shit about all the mass of a black hole existing on the event horizon, and there is nothing inside.

Information can't be destroyed, which is what led to the holographic principle. Information about 3D objects falling in is stored/preserved on the 2D surface.

Time slows to zero on the event horizon, so there's nothing "inside" it. The limit of information contained by a black hole is a function of its surface area, not its volume.

Does a black hole actually have a volume, or is that a mathematical construct? If there's nothing within a black hole, I imagine this includes no perfect vacuum, surely it would have a 0-volume in reality.

>Time slows to zero on the event horizon
wrong
>The limit of information contained by a black hole is a function of its surface area, not its volume.
correct
>Does a black hole actually have a volume, or is that a mathematical construct?
a black hole's volume is hard to define, because the geometry inside the black hole isn't just flat spacetime. But it's certainly not 0.

To an external observer, an infalling object moves slower and slower as it approaches an event horizon, never quite reaching it. and its rate of time appears to slow more and more.
To the infalling object, time passes normally and it crosses the event horizon without event, and continues on its way to the singularity as expected.
Time stops having any meaning at the singularity.

if you don't define simple and complex than this is just philosophy

Don't you already have definitions for those terms?

Simple is a time signature where every beat can be split into 2 notes
Complex is the set of all numbers that can be expressed as the number a+bi
I don't think black holes are either of these things

The only way to really answer this question is if you go in the black hole user

Ahah

ahaha

back to /mu/

>black hole's volume is hard to define
We can't extrapolate the volume of the sphere even when we know its surface area? Are the pi-radius equations no longer valid?

that was my first thought, but no.

To see why, we can take a simpler case: you have a sheet of plastic on a table. Put a heavy metal ring that matches the circle on the plastic so that it doesn't move.

Now pull or deform the plastic inside the circle. It will start stretching and have a funny shape once you let go. If you're a 2D being living on the sheet of plastic, outside of the circle's delimitation and unable to see what's happening inside it, nothing looks too strange. It looks like a circle and that's it.

But we know that the surface of the plastic contained inside the circle is actually bigger than that of just a simple disk with the same radius.

This is an analogy, don't take it literally, but it shows how you can't assume the volume inside a sphere is easily related to its radius

A complex structure can make some things easier. For example, evaluating integrals is typically easier than finding sums because the continuity of the real line allows you to have more sophisticated techniques at your disposal.

Ahh, so it's one of those "triangle-with-more-than-180-degrees" types of shenanigans.