Why does the author of this Leftist propaganda book refuse to acknowledge Africa as the epicenter of natural resources?

Why does the author of this Leftist propaganda book refuse to acknowledge Africa as the epicenter of natural resources?

Other urls found in this thread:

reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/2bv2yf/guns_germs_and_steel_chapter_3_collision_at/
reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/2cfhon/guns_germs_and_steel_chapter_11_lethal_gift_of/
theoccidentalobserver.net/2017/07/28/anthropologys-obsession-with-african-origins/
science.org.ge/old/moambe/2-3/Gordon Whitteker.pdf
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/IndoEuropeanTree.svg
d3jc3ahdjad7x7.cloudfront.net/NRUTVm6ZhlKhuLUJiV0EMwP1RzD8YcWzShoETQ3DN3aPcGWE.pdf
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

why don't you call him up and ask homo

Because he's jewish and hates white people and therefore doesn't want to acknowledge that European dominance stems from genetics. Not simply IQ but creativity resulting from European individualism, which is something clannish semites and other groups lack.

>oil, gold, and literal diamonds overflowing from the ground
>huge swathes of arable land
>rich luscious jungle, wildlife, rivers, oceans
>hurr durr europeans had a natural advantage

Who the f*ck are you quoting?

I can think of many reasons to criticize this dated and beleaguered work, but this is not one of them.

>thinking oil makes a successful early civilization
>thinking diamonds are useful when you're getting anally ravaged by the bottom of maslow's hierarchy of needs

mate ur just retarded there's not much else to it. yeah maybe black people have a lower iq or something but the main point of this book is still largely true, as geography is probably one of the most important factors and easiest to consider

something like "niggers are stupid!!" is not very easy to test nor is it really all that plausible for the most part. yeah, they might be, but that doesn't explain most of it

Who the f*ck are you quoting?

>mostly arid land, with the small slivers of arable land generally surrounded by shit land and separated from sources of trade by an endless desert
europe is factors more arable.. sorry if this doesn't fit your /pol/-tier hypotheses

>maybe black people have a lower iq
There's no "maybe" here, hombre. That you're dumb enough to believe there is, contributes to why you make equally dumb statements like this:
>this book is still largely true
The book is a sham and Diamond is an anti-white propagandist. The end.

quoting dees nuts retard, and why the fuck are you here anyway? just because guns germs and steel is a book doesn't mean this shit belongs here. go make this post on Veeky Forums pussy and see what happens

If European dominance stems from genetics, why were most Western Europeans barbarians living in huts up until very recently, while the Middle East has been the cradle of civilisation after civilisation since the dawn of time?

How useful was that oil before the industrial revolution?

Reading is for fags and I will not leave until you bookcucks get your useless board deleted.

>this book is still largely true
>the main point of this book is still largely true

if you can't see the difference between those two statements you are completely fucking brain-dead. the point is that geography played a large part in which civilizations became successful. you can't even dispute that, everyone fucking agrees. the reason people have a problem with this book is because it's very one-dimensional. yes, it played a large part, but what does "large" mean? 20%, 30%? jared pretends like it was 100% ie he ignores everything else and hones in on his theory of geographic luck

First of all, they weren't living in huts. Second, you don't know your ancient history very well if you think the people who inhabit most of the middle east today were always there -- they weren't. Indo-Europeans created the Sumerian/Mesopotamian civilizations, and Egypt as well. They used to live throughout the region, which is why Indians and Persians to this day speak Indo-European languages. The Sumerians also spoke an Indo-European language until it was overtaken by Akkadian. Semitic tribes originally inhabited only the southern portion of the Arabian peninsula, but have been spreading like a disease ever since.

lold

Still doesn't explain why Germans, Anglo-Saxons and Nordcucks were barbarians for most of human history.

Sweet "master race".

They weren't barbarians, you're just uneducated. They were in many ways more refined than the Romans, and men like Tacitus attested to this.

I don't understand how anyone can take the book seriously. He clearly set out to disprove racist biological determinism, and in a post hoc manner made every theory and interpretation of his confirm his thesis.

Some guy on reddit did a chapter-by-chapter refutation of the book that's worth reading

reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/2bv2yf/guns_germs_and_steel_chapter_3_collision_at/

reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/2cfhon/guns_germs_and_steel_chapter_11_lethal_gift_of/

This post was pretty zesty but tbqh it had 0 actual content in it. Could you try to make your argument in a more meaningful way next time?

Not very. Actually that's the only reason why Scandanavian countries like Sweden became what they are today instead of devolving back into a shithole like it was in the Viking era.
Also what is a obvious /pol/ brait thread doing with so many replies. Sage and report.

You want others to be your personal researcher for black IQ stats and an old book that's been debunked 1000 different ways? Stop being a moron.

>Be given infinite resources so you never have to work harder than plucking food off a tree
>"Why aren't you niggers working harder?"

Because they didn't need to. Necessity was the creator of shelter, clothing, pretty much everything that gave us chilly white men impetus to develop our technology. Then we came along and did exactly what we were supposed to do, take from them because they were still infantile and retarded.

If they do have genetically lower IQs, you can probably trace it back to there never having been an evolutionary need to develop beyond Adam and Eve style gathering in order to survive or compete.

Here's a good article related to how we even got to the point where Diamond could get away with writing tripe like GG&S and be supported by the academic and media establishment.

Same old story, anyone over 18 with half a brain and an internet connection should not have trouble connecting these dots anymore.

theoccidentalobserver.net/2017/07/28/anthropologys-obsession-with-african-origins/

>Occidental Observer
but that's racist!

Best site on the web though.

What meaningful distinction are you making?

Bump

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Reading these posts, actually pretty enlightening, and I'm learning a lot about the Incas.

>oil is useless, it could never help Africa develop
>Sweden developed solely because of oil

nice logic there bud

it's just pleb pop history, why do you care?

so much this

>small slivers
>practically all of sub saharan africa
>can't trade amongst themselves like East Asia before sill road despite massive size of land
>can't build boats either
>for some reason can't trade with bountiful Egypt despite Nubia literally being connected with it
>get enslaved by Egypt instead
>justniggerthings

meant as a reply to this guy:

I don't see anyone here ever necessarily taking the book seriously, it's clearly just popsci; rather, the most basic points of the book are enlightening in the sense that hey maybe there's more to European dominance than "niggers r stupid". The reddit guy (who admittedly loved this book) picks passages, mostly ones making very specific biological or historical claims and then proves them wrong, and he helps us realize that Jared is logically deceiving us. The book turns into a teetering Jenga tower, but by the end it's still apparent geographic determinism is a valid theory with plenty of evidence but perhaps nowhere near the whole picture like Jared portrays

>The book is a sham and Diamond is an anti-white propagandist. The end.

sam with noah hariri, his sapiens book is more propaganda, don't forget he was originally a scholar who studied the history of european covert operations...and then one day he decides to start writing these "humans are all one big happy family" bullshit from his israeli settlement, not to be trusted

KANGZ

The aforementioned book you fucking mong

>America the best as usual
feels gud mane

Why does Veeky Forums hate Guns, Germs and Steel? It seemed like a nice little book about the history of conflicts in North America to me. Then again I only read the first couple chapters.

did you people even read the fucking book?

Yes, africa has rich natural resources, but most of the are useless if you haven't gotten out of the stone age yet. In order for agriculture to be a viable alternative to hunting and gathering and to provide enough food for people to do things other than farming, you need domestic pack animals like oxen or horses that can plough fields.

Sub-saharan africa didn't have anything. At best it had water buffalo, but even white people haven't managed to domesticate those because they're so damn temperamental

>well why didn't they import them?

There's this thing called the sahara, you might have heard of it? It forms a barriers across half the continent that pretty much only camels can cross, and they're useless outside of the desert.

On top of that the high heat of the jungle and bush makes it a haven for diseases and parasites that limit the human ability to perform labor, which the heat itself does directly since the body can't burn as many calories without dangerously overheating making exhaustion an evolutionary advantage

>why didn't they build boats and sail around the continent?

The savannah has sparse timber and the jungle wood is inhabited by poisonous snakes and bugs, violent wildcats, parasitic ring worms and botflies, and mosquitos with hypodermic mouthfuls of malaria and yellow/scarlet fever

reading is new male shit die wittol

It never ceases to amaze me just how fucking stupid bigots are. Not only are the ignorant they are generally unwilling to learn and ignore any any facts that contradict their retardation. If someone who upholds the ideals they believe in turns out to disagree with them they label them a shill or traitor and fucking abandon them without a second thought

what about human agency tho? are you trying to remove agency from people of color? sorry but determinism went out of style in the 70s

Bigotry is natural. The kind of ignorance you're displaying has to be taught, and only sticks to the dumbest like yourself.

Im not familiar with Noah, but he sounds fully spook from your description.

free will is a load of horse shit and you know it

people who see darwinism as an ideal social structure really aren't all that different from animals.

wait, what the fuck am I saying? I've actually seen animals show some fucking compassion for creatures other than themselves. I have yet to see a social darwinist even come close to being on par with an animal

yeah, he says a lot of stuff that is true or at least sounds very plausible, but then he throws in stuff like saying jews weren't allowed to integrate into europe because whites are racist, but it's the jews who refuse to integrate, so his shit is like 98% legit scholarship although a bit sjwish, and then the other 2% are whoppers, very sneaky juif

>free will is a load of horse shit and you know it

dude, have you not been to university in the last 30 years? marxist determinism is out, "human agency" is in, just because academia is full of sjw doesn't mean they're marxist

as I said, free will can go fuck itself. This is a bohmian mechanics universe

you're never going to get tenure with that attitude

>This book is wrong for literally thousands of different reasons, but I can't actually mention any.

/pol/ has arrived.

Black people do have statistically lower IQ though, just like northern Europeans have statistically higher IQ, and South Koreans have the highest avg. IQ in the world.

The myth that brain's power cannot be measured is dumb.

The abundance of resources in Africa is why there wasn't as widespread advancement of technology and culture. Civilizations need scarcity and alternative uses for resources to develop trade and more complex societies. If basic shit like food, water, and space are freely available and not under risk from massive population growth, a civilization isn't going to need to continuously advance and reorganize itself to stay around. It's like if you had a fully stocked refrigerator and bank account without having to ever get a job. You wouldn't need to develop career skills or knowledge of a trade, you could just smoke weed and play video games all day and be perfectly well off.

Africans are also resistant to many things that just end white people, like malaria. Their biological and societal advancements reflected their environment, one which was and still is largely inhospitable to whites.

>in the sense that hey maybe there's more to European dominance than "niggers r stupid"
Does any serious person say otherwise? If IQ were the only relevant factor when it comes to a particular society's success, then we'd all be living in an East Asian hegemony. Suggesting that while the evidence the book puts forward is obviously nonsense, that the book doesn't deserve our scorn because its central thesis might have an element of truth to it is a really obnoxious form of apologetics. We're talking about the book, not the concept of geographic determinism. If the book fails to defend its thesis, then it's a bad book no matter how valid its thesis actually is.

fpbp

This isn't going to convince anyone. The importance of genetics when it comes to intelligence is too well-established. Racism can be wrong from an ethical perspective, but trying to argue that all races have brains that are equally suited to our current economic system is ridiculous. If you believe in evolution, then you must believe that tens of thousands of years of separation in diverse environments with distinct selection pressures leads to populations with different adaptive traits.

Calling people who point this out "stupid bigots" is going to drive the reasonable people who understand reality further towards the extremes. If only the alt right is pointing out the truth of racial differences, then the alt right is going to appeal to people who care enough to find the truth out.

>Suggesting that while the evidence the book puts forward is obviously nonsense, that the book doesn't deserve our scorn
not what i said at all, i'm saying the thesis of the book and many of the main points are quite intuitive which make it work as a popsci book

>If the book fails to defend its thesis, then it's a bad book no matter how valid its thesis actually is.
i disagree in both ways. i'm not going to search through the dumpster to find my copy of the book again for citations but there's plenty of examples that strongly support the thesis. there's also countless ones that don't.

i don't think the conclusion is false just because many of the premises are false. i concede the book is dated, and much of the information was incorrect to begin with, but i simply disagree that it completely failed to defend its thesis

If you're determining the effects a particular environment has on its native biological organisms, you're studying how adapting to that environment shaped the biology of those organisms. The book set out to do the impossible: it's attempting to disconnect the environment people adapted to from the traits that that environment selected for. You can't disentangle biological from environmental determinism when speaking of native populations.

Is there some kind of correlation between intelligence and leaving a desolate, unviable, non-arable shithole to improve the lives of your children?

Are you talking about Veeky Forums?

>The Sumerians also spoke an Indo-European language
That's completely wrong, though. Sumerian is not an IE language, it has separate and unknown roots. Stop WE WUZing.

WE

WUZ

KANGZ

No, you are wrong. It was Indo-European prior to the semiticization of Mesopotamia.

science.org.ge/old/moambe/2-3/Gordon Whitteker.pdf

Civilization is synonymous with white people. Wherever whites go it springs up. Wherever jews follow then open the gates to brown people, it is destroyed. This is how history has occurred over and over again.

bump

That .pdf talks about external, IE influence on the Sumerian and Akkadian (which is semitic) languages. As I said, you are WE WUZing very hard. Fuck off.

It literally says the Cuneiform writing system and the Sumerian and Akkadian lexicon were influenced by a preceeding early Indo-European language, and the word "external" doesn't even appear in the text because you completely made that part up. Why are you lying?

When you are influenced by something, that "something" is by definition external. Are you saying that Sumerian is that Euphratic, Indo-european language that somehow influenced itself?

did you even read the book you dumb slut? Out of all the reasons to criticize you're picking the stupidest ones.

Indo-European tribes created the civilizations in Mesopotamia, Sumer in this case. They were replaced by semitic tribes and the semitic language Akkadian replaced the Indo-European language, which the author terms Euphratic.

Still doesn't explain why there aren't any "Masterful works of literature and drama from Abimbola Manbunga", or "Chieftain of Mathematics and Physics Oboogu Boonubu from tribe Niwi"...

Resources have fuck all to do with any of that.

>ABSTRACT. It will be argued that the cuneiform writing system, the Sumerian and Akkadian lexicon, and the
place names of Southern Mesopotamia preserve traces of an early Indo-European language, indeed the earliest by
more than a millennium. Furthermore, this evidence is detailed and consistent enough to reconstruct a number of
features of the proposed Indo-European language, Euphratic, and to sketch an outline of Euphratean cultural pat-
terns.

Of course, you start spouting unrelated statements. Somehow, IE tribes *created* Sumerian culture, even though your pdf argues only for their influence on their writing system and city names.
Come on, give me a clear and scientifically-approved proof of Sumerian being an indo-european language, not some claims barely related to our discussion.

You shouldn't expect others to hold your hand through complex subject matter. Yes, I could go into depth about the Hittites and bronze age archeology and the details of the Indo-European migrations, but you could also educate yourself on those things and I wouldn't waste my time only to have my efforts not be appreciated. Civilization is and always has been a product of (indo) European peoples. If you choose to take the time to study ancient history, you will understand this. Just google Indo-European + Mesopotamia if you want to start the process. Good luck.

Nice copout faggot.

You avoided giving me an answer quite elegantly. You probably feel very smart right now. But you still seem incapable of actually describing the linguistic history of the area logically and clearly. I am not a historian but I've come across the statement that Sumerian language has unknown roots a fair number of times. Your suggestion to google gives additional proof, since the first result contains this image upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/IndoEuropeanTree.svg that, interestingly, doesn't mention Sumerian language.
Have this link instead. It is a translation of The Epic of Giglamesh by a respected scholar, Andrew George, who translated Akkadian and Sumerian literary texts.
d3jc3ahdjad7x7.cloudfront.net/NRUTVm6ZhlKhuLUJiV0EMwP1RzD8YcWzShoETQ3DN3aPcGWE.pdf
Note this sentence on page 17 (xvi in the text):
>One was Sumerian, a language without affinities with any known tongue
It's really not that complicated. Just give me a link to a text by a scholar that clearly says that Sumerian is an IE language. A language belongs or doesn't belong to a family, you don't have to read multiple books to understand that.

>It's really not that complicated. Just give me a link to a text by a scholar that clearly says that Sumerian is an IE language.
I literally did that ... and you tried to contest it on points you were wrong about due to the incorrect assumptions you were making.

Oh, so a language belongs to a family if its writing system and city names are influenced by a language from that family.
Got nothing to say regarding that link I sent? Andrew George knows less about Mesopotamia and linguistics than you?

No, and I outlined the basic points yesterday anyway: I did my research into this stuff a long time ago; I'm simply here to encourage others to do their own, not hold their hand through it.

Indo-European languages belong to a family. I provided you with a study indicating one of those languages preceeded the semitic languages that took over in Sumer. If you want to have a discussion you need to communicate more clearly.

>still ignores my link

>one of those languages preceeded the semitic languages that took over in Sumer.
Yeah, sure, great. You still haven't proved >The Sumerians also spoke an Indo-European language

>You still haven't proved
Listen, we're talking centuries here, guy. There was not a continuous group of people living there, but the original group who started the civilization were Indo-European prior to the semitic takeover. And in 5000 years there might be some sap just like you saying British civilization was also started by semites. There's a pattern you cannot yet grasp because you're only able to see pieces instead of the whole.

>STILL ignoring the link

>nigger apologists unironically tell themselves these fairytales
>meanwhile whitey moved in and was able to prop up enough agriculture to feed the entire continent within a couple of generations

...

Yes, they literally do. Fertile valleys, riverlands, and the like are the places where civilization develops, and there are hardly any areas like that in Africa that are not isolated and of high enough quality to have allowed any sort of development. The best places in Africa for this were in North Africa, and in places like Mali. Literature is a product of high civilization, which can under flourish under such conditions.

Hint: In order to write things down, you need lots of trees and the equipment to turn them into useful things. That isn't the case in most of Africa.

Or Africans are just less functionally capable and have been for a very long time.

OP here. Why would you bump this blatant racebaiting?

>Indo-Europeans created the Sumerian/Mesopotamian civilizations,
Holy shit, how fucking retarded can you be

He is no retarded. Indo-Europeans literally created everything meaningful (both culturally and physically) known to us today

Exactly, and the reason for their incapability stems from the way they adapted to their natives climates, which were abundant in food resources, but not in resources which allow civilization, like animals that can be domesticated, the presence of grains and other crops that can be farmed on a large scale, a suitable body of water, low enough temperatures, etc.

Correct, and I am who he was responding to, so thanks. Many are under the false assumption that "civilization" is something that springs up randomly and can be developed and maintained by any group, when it is and always has been developed and maintained by one group: Europeans. And there are reasons for this: Europeans are the most non-kin-based and meritocratic, and the least kleptocratic and clannish group of people, so they are the only ones capable of creating high trust institutions that can last a long time. Beyond the evidence that supports this in the case of Mesopotamia, Egypt, and elsewhere, it should be plainly obvious that the semites currently squatting in those regions today were not building civilizations millennia ago since they can barely maintain the backwards societies they have today.

Whites need to think long term and try to see the big picture. What is happening throughout western civilization today is exactly what happened in Mesopotamia, Egypt, etc., thousands of years ago and was the reason those civilizations collapsed -- they were overrun with semites.

what is China

I don't think you can handle that redpill, bruh.

So what part of your meme picture ties the culture and civilization of China to an all knowing Indo-European and how does your argument hold up when, regardless of paintings found in a cave, Chinese and other Asian peoples have sustained their own society without white leaders?

Sarcasm and possible ancient Indo-European connections aside, China was a backwards place until very recently, and as someone who has lived in China I can tell you it remains a very backwards place in general. Chinese societies were molded by authoritarian rule, which molded the population into submissive people who defer to the oldest person around, which, while they are non-violent, intelligent, and highly capable people, has historically limited their ability to innovate or optimize their creations. And to this day their success relies largely on their ability to reverse engineer what comes out of the west. They are smart and capable people, but largely lacking in the creativity necessary to build lasting civilizations that can advance intellectually and technologically on their own.