Are you Veeky Forums if you do 90% of your 'reading' via audiobooks or does it not count?

Are you Veeky Forums if you do 90% of your 'reading' via audiobooks or does it not count?

Other urls found in this thread:

nymag.com/scienceofus/2016/08/listening-to-a-book-instead-of-reading-isnt-cheating.html
psycnet.apa.org/record/1978-21860-001
forbes.com/sites/olgakhazan/2011/09/12/is-listening-to-audio-books-really-the-same-as-reading/2/#5d0801243225
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

Write a paragraph right now about the last book you listened to. That will show us if it "counted" for you.

I'm looking more for a general consensus on the credibility of audibooks vs. reading.

It depends on how much attention you paid.
>does it not count?
The fact that you are even asking this shows you value having read books more than having understood and enjoyed books. So no, it probably doesn't count, because you were probably driving or working while listening, and misunderstanding, trying to get through it as quickly as possible just to check off another book on goodreads.

If you can't even write a paragraph about something you "read" then it doesn't count. Doesn't matter what consensus your illiterate friends reach here.

if you listen to a college lecture does the information you learned count since you didn't read it? kill you're self my man

I'm glad I could help you achieve a judgement boner but your assumptions are quite off base, it's simply a question for debate. I wanted to discuss if something is lost by listening instead of reading, or gained, or both. Even though you're taking in the same words the difference in method of delivery feels significant and as someone who's team audiobook I found it worth discussing.


I don't want the discussion to be about me, I want it to be about the merits, differences and credibility for two different information delivery formats of the same material.

Quality literature is, at least in part, meant to be read from a page. There is a visual component to it; the letters and words each contain endless character, and their arrangement on a page is an essential part of the art of literature. An audiobook of poetry, or say Joyce, loses so much of the original work. To a much less severe degree it seems to me akin to reading a piece of sheet music rather than listening to the music. It is the work once removed.

Not even to start with the fact that, unless you are a prodigy or genius or have read quite a lot, then any multi-leveled text requires slow, careful reading and rereading to be fully apprehended in all its nuance.

just my two cents. Audiobooks a shit. Especially since, most people who listen to them do so for the purpose of multitasking - no one sits with their eyes closed and focuses on the audiobook. If they did, why not just read it aloud to yourself?

they really seem useless to me if you really care about fully experiening the medium

If you can give me a paragraph about what you learned. Lectures almost always require readings and note taking, two things obvious not happening in this case.

You literally can't write a single paragraph about what you've read? I mean you have your answer right there, friend. Audiobook listeners, everyone.

Good post, thank you for contributing. I'd say a really good performance can add a dimension to a work, but that what is lost vs. reading from the page is still a net loss overall.

I basically agree, but I think I could write a paragraph about the books I listen to rather than read. I couldn't write an essay, because it would be hard to do an intensive close reading, but I made a lot of solid informal points.

90% is far too much. You also have to be discerning about which titles you pick. I only listen to books that I don't feel I need to study very seriously

are you aware that audible, the most successful audiobook merchant was founded by jews and continues to be controlled by jews even after its sale to amazon? oh whats this? you've discovered a new appreciation for audiobooks?

Look it's like a Turing test. If you can fool everyone into thinking you've actually read it, then how could anyone possibly say you haven't. All that's left is unverifiable here say about visual textures and ineffable experience, worthless drivel honestly.

But the issue is you haven't fooled everyone, anyone actually. We all see through you and refusing to write even a single paragraph summary when you've written a page of crap no one cares about and even I didn't read is a smoking gun if I ever saw one (I haven't).

I'm not writing a paragraph for you just because you demand it of me, it's irrelevant to the discussion. If I were to post a paragraph on a book then the topic would shift focus from the credibility of audiobooks to my opinions on the last thing I read which no one else gives a shit about. Find a different thread because I'm not dancing to your tune.

Do as I say or your audiobooks will never count. Is that what you want?

Why are you obsessed with making this about me lol

>meant to be read from a page
You make really good points, but don't forget that most authors through history could never have concieved of audiobooks, so you don't know what they might have thought about them. Some even embraced them, more or less. Lots of writers read their own books for the audio version. Frost made records of his own poetry. The Iliad and Odyssey were based on oral stories. My point being you can't say across the board that literature was meant to be read in printed books. You also can't say that there's inherent value to the visual component of litearture without also acknowledging that the auditory experience has its own inherent value, whether it's the same or different.

I don't know who you think you're talking to, I'm not OP and I haven't made any other posts besides that one.
Your diction makes me sick, by the way. You need to take a step back from your life and figure out who you are.

Am I caught in the middle of both sides of an argument? I'm not the other guy. I don't want you to write a paragraph right now. I'm not asking you to do that, and if somebody else is, then I agree you should not do it.

How many paragraphs of nothing are you going to write before writing a book report of your last listen? Debate this back and forth all you want, but the proof is in the pudding. If you can't make it count, then it doesn't.

What
No
>>/pol/
All of my favorite favorite books, assuming I like them for the prose, which i typically do since form and style are my favorite aspects of literature, I try to read aloud on second reading. I agree that the auditory component is near essential, but i think it is (just slightly) secondary to the visual component.

Do you consider listening to podcasts reading? Your answer will dictate the answer to the overall question being asked here.

I say this as a person who likes to listen to audiobooks on long commutes.

I apologise for mistaking you as siding with this paragraph weirdo, good point about Iliad and Odyssey, maybe it could even be argued a well performed audiobook could be the definitive version of these works.

Podcasts are conversations, not books read out loud. I'd describe audiobooks as reading by proxy, personally.

First, it sounds like you still don't understand, I am not the person you've been talking to this whole time. I am someone else. Look at the number of posters. It's more than 2. There are more people in this thread that you and him.

Second, if someone who had listened to an audiobook did write an essay about it and posted it here, that wouldn't prove anything about the quality of the audiobook experience. Whether or not any given person can write a decent paragraph about a book they listened to is totally anecdotal. It doesn't matter, and it wouldn't prove anything. Beyond that, obviously no one is going to do what you ask. Nobody wants to do that amount of work for next to nothing, and nobody wants to take the risk of subjecting their writing to your judgement. Not necessarily because they can't weigh up, but because nobody has any reason to trust you to be honest. You have open biases, and you've made it clear throughout this thread that your goal is to prove the point you came in here trying to make through agression and hostility, and to attack and humiliate everyone else in the process. You aren't making a good argument for your own side. Your logic is bad and your rhetoric is bad. All you're doing is openly acting like a pretensious megalomaniac. Genuinely, you need to stop and take a look at yourself.

I like that reading strategy, although I don't do the same thing. I also think that it's important to process what you're reading through your own mind under your own control, meaning at your own pace and grounded in your own reactions to the text. You need to allow yourself to read closely and not have your experience dictated by the person reading on the recording.

My points in favor of audiobooks are really just this: it's ok not to read intensively all the time, and you can't appeal to the intent of the author vis a vis literature as something meant to be read in print

>I apologise for mistaking you as siding with this paragraph weirdo
appreciated, though I also can't keep track of who's who's and what confusions are and aren't cleared up at this point

>maybe it could even be argued a well performed audiobook could be the definitive version of these works.
Yes, maybe. I definitely think it would be cool to hear them recited in ancient Greek, even though I don't understand ancient Greek. On the other hand, you could argue that the print version is more definitive because they became canonical through people reading them in print. If you were an Enlightenment scholar, say, you would probably care more about the printed, even translated versions that Enlightment thinkers were exposed to than whatever was closest to the absolute original

>come back hours later
>still no paragraph
Did you retards even listen to these books, or are you pretending to do even that? Holy shit how illiterate are kids today?

They're consuming literature without reading. I say this as somebody who loves audiobooks because I have 8 hours at work plus commute time 5 days a week where I need my eyes but not my ears. I love audiobooks, but they're not reading. With that being said, this is Veeky Forums not /read/

but so what, the words are going in your brain. sure, you don't want your kid listening to the audiobook instead of doing the reading for school or something, but once you're at a certain level of reading nothing is to be gained from reading on the page, besides don't you get that thing where you like see the text of stuff people are saying in your head from time to time? it's like reverse subvocalizing, i think once you get that there's no need to worry that audiobooks "aren't real reading" that said i only listen to non-fiction audiobooks and lectures, i always read fiction, i guess i just have weird spooks like that

Do you read anything I say? You really are a repulisve piece of shit, you know that?

My theory is that you see all language as a series of frenetic images that lack any connection to what is being communicated and occasionally someone will say something to you and your response will make sense just based on astronomical coincidence.

At this point I've pretty much exposed the reality of people who listen to audiobooks. They retain so little, they won't even dare to try to write anything about what they read, can't even talk about it. The really mysterious thing is why they are on a literary forum. Isn't it simply because they want to talk for pages upon pages and hours upon hours about reading instead of what they read, wax poetic about what it's like to read or endlessly debate where to start reading, how to read, or who best to read instead of simply shutting up and reading?
>does it not count?
I think anyone taking a look at your behavior in this thread can answer with a definitive "no." No, it does not count. And I daresay, from what I have seen here, there's little else that would count with the likes of you.

You sound like a douchebag

You sound like someone who listens to 90% audiobooks.

why are you projecting so hard? we get it, you listened to an audiobook and didn't remember anything because you're an adhd spazlord, not everyone is as retarded as you, how did you even make it through college if you can't write a paragraph about a lecture?

you literally told everyone in the OP you listen to audiobooks 90% of the time instead of reading. Why would you say 90% instead of just "mostly"? Isn't it because you know personally that it is 90% for you? I'm merely stating the facts you yourself said. Your denial of this merely reinforces the fact that you're deeply ashamed of something which you should be. Personally, I have a near photographic memory, but that doesn't mean everyone does, and you certainly do not seeing as you could not even remember your own OP.

if he listens to audiobooks 9 hours a day at work and then reads one hour at home at night, he's still consuming a hell of a lot more literature than you

If you eat shit nine hours a day then go home and shit for one hour day, you're consuming a lot more feces than I am. What's your point?

all you're doing is making the same statements over and over again without ever acknowledging anything that was said in any of the posts that you replied to. You're operating at a level of autism deeper than I've ever seen before.

You're so fixated on whether or not people can write a paragraph, but I don't think you have the ability to understand any communication at all. I'd like to see you write a paragraph, because I'd be shocked if you had any ability to understand written text at all.

Absolutely, reading is what you do with it, not what you simply take in

...

Did you know that wasn't actually an "accidental flash photo" but like the 10th in a quick series of shots taken by a paparazzo? That's why they're already looking at the camera.

Is that Jay

I don't want to communicate with you, dumbass. I want you to write me a fucking paragraph about what you read. Anything else you have to say is totally worthless to me and, for that matter, everyone else here. I'm asking for the last time. Do as I say. Do as I say right now or you will never count for anything again in this or any other life. Have some pride in yourself. Be a man. Do what's right. Do as I say.

>To a much less severe degree it seems to me akin to reading a piece of sheet music rather than listening to the music. It is the work once removed.
I know I'm a day late responding to this, but as a musician I find your analogy inappropriate. A musician who is "literate" in the language of sheet music would learn more from looking at a chart than he/she would from listening to the music.

those noodles look really nice

I've made my stance on your demands for people to write paragraphs very clear.

You're alone in your insistance that someone writing a paragraph would mean everything.

Everybody in this thread sees that you're out of your mind and nobody supports you.

You have no authority to give anyone commands and nobody has any reason to do what you say just because you demand it.

You're wrong in every respect.

I hope you are asking for the last time, because you've asked and asked to no end so far.

It would be great if you could end the grotesque tirade you've spent this entire thread going on and act like a rational person.

You aren't who you think you are.

You aren't smart.

You don't have good opinions.

You aren't good at arguing.

You need to take a step back and look at your life.

You need to learn to live in the world and communicate respectfully with other people rather than acting like a small child.

You need to leave this board for your own sake and come back when you've learned how to be a fully realized person.

> All these posts and no evidence or research posted, just ad hoc ""theories"" on "what counts"
nymag.com/scienceofus/2016/08/listening-to-a-book-instead-of-reading-isnt-cheating.html
psycnet.apa.org/record/1978-21860-001
forbes.com/sites/olgakhazan/2011/09/12/is-listening-to-audio-books-really-the-same-as-reading/2/#5d0801243225

these are valuable, so thanks for posting, but the 'ad hoc theories' are more important in this context

first study talks about how reading and listening are the same from a cognitive perspective
second is a study where people who listened to audio vs. read print were shown to be equally capable of summarizing plot
third is an article repeating the claims of the first two studies.

None really acknowledge the potential to do a close, analytical reading as opposed to a casual reading, and they also don't speak to the idea that the intergrity of books as works of art could be important. For the first thing, I'd need to see a study where people were made to do a more serious test of comprehension than just plot summary, and the second is 100% a matter of philosophy, i.e. couldn't be proven or disproven by any study

Well fair point but what's needed then is more research into the topic, not more ignorant pseudo-theory spouting.
I don't claim to know anything about whether it counts or not from an actual neuroscientific standpoint or one that actually matters.
Some of the value judgments are extremely dumb though.
> He listens to his books rather than reading them? GOD, I bet you listen to anything other than 90s black metal recorded with a potato too

Are you healthy if you consume 90% of you nutrients anally or does it not count?

Maybe, but I think that research is impossible to conduct. I doubt you could ever design an indesputable study that measures critical engagement with art. IMO, the closest thing to definitive answer to OP's question is that it doesn't matter and people can think whatever they want and judge by their own experiences
>Some of the value judgments are extremely dumb though
What can you say? Aesthetics are not very straightforward

I mostly listen audio books. I'm dyslexic and very slow reader so listening to them is better for me. Some people make the mistake that they can do something while listening to audio books like play games or exercise which usually doesn't work since your focus will multiple times wonder to the thing that you are doing and not what you are listening. You have to have the same focus when listening and reading. Tough thing about audio books is that even just sitting still can make your eyes wonder and you can more easily get lost in thought than when reading. That's why I don't listen to audiobooks while commuting because you are not gonna give full attention it.

I always learned better listening in class than reading the books too. I do recommend writing down what you have listened/read so that you actually have to use it and not just passively take it in. If its non-fiction I usually write atleast a page after every chapter.

I don't give a shit about what counts. I give a shit when a bad narrator or recording ruins a good book, or when a excellent reading elevates it.