Is anybody else on these niggas' level? Asking for a friend

You're the one defending a pleb writer.

Sprachen vous francaise?

Oui, mais il est juif.

>I speak 5 different languages, but yeah no french and german

lol take about fucked up luck

Juif ist superior to any other nation

Gas yourself

Non

wow woooooow bro you are right!
How didn't people realize Proust is a shit writer before? Your are a fucking genius man, my god, all those decades of hype wasted, all his influence and gigantic work? All fucking shit, you really shed a light in the literature world

bro, bro come on, kill yourself tonight!

>How didn't people realize Proust is a shit writer before?

They did, that's why his books were burned in Nazi Germany

He was jewish

German here: Why? He isn't even peak German.

Name one better writer other than maybe Geothe

Goethe was specifically who I had in mind so you excluding it doesn't count. Also I love Mann I just never considered him to be as far up there as you say.
What are your favourites?

Reading "Zauberberg" right now and the amount of beautifully written passages and mind-fucking dialogues and monologues is amazing. My favourite book so far (together with V.)

Goethe doesn't fit with the other modernists. I would say Kafka is the greatest German (language) writer of the 20th century, but Mann is more similar to Joyce and Proust.

Yeah I love Kafka but he's not particularly technically impressive which this category is about

Perec is better than Proust.

>I would say Kafka is the greatest German (language) writer of the 20th century
You should be ashamed of yourself, kraut. Honestly, despicable giving a mediocre jewish writer such esteem. Though I know you're only saying that because you come from a conformist culture that has dictated that very answer to you (literally, there was a story on here about exactly this last week).

Kafka may have been born Jewish but he had a Christian soul. Its where a lot of his problems stemmed from

I'm not German, but nice try, *nglo.

Please, let's not have a rerun of that embarrassing "people only like Kafka because they're brainwashed" episode...please...

This is why everyone loves /pol/crossposters

Hermann Broch
maybe Robert Musil
maybe Alfred Döblin

These are jews or lost goyim whose wires get crossed when someone disrupts their judaic cultural conditioning to say, and accurately and sensibly so, that Kafka was a shit writer.

Post a pic of your room

This is a combination of (You)-seeking 8/8 b8 shitpost and /pol/tard autism. Why don't you "accurately and sensibly" explain why Kafka was a shit writer other than just putting multiple parentheses around his name.
>inb4 teen angst (as was brought up last time we had this thread)
If you read something like "In the Penal Colony" and think it touches on something no more profound than adolescent feelz, then you just might be in over your head.

reading mann's stories at the moment
houellebecq said mann and proust were the last real europeans. what did he mean by this?

Probably that they had a belief in the European project and identity before the entire continent became ironic LARPers on the backs of American-Judaic culture

lol

So you want a definition of "shit"? I'd rather you learn through internal shame that you have juvenile tastes and aren't yet mature enough to appreciate good writing, and then ultimately better yourself. You are 19 and retarded, I don't even hold it against you that you like what you're told to like and have a stunted sense of quality.

Whenever someone claims to speak "5 different languages" they usually include Spanish, Italian, Portuguese or other shit-tier languages that are basically the same

Wow, what do you know, no argument whatsoever. Yes, you certainly sound like a bastion of maturity. Really now, you won't even go into a wee bit of detail about what makes Kafka so shit?

Meme writter/classical visionary/god of writting and human understandings

fucks joyce doing there? Why isn't he sucking the farts of his wife?

>classical visionary
What did u mean by this

ok. ok. wow. just. ok. here are the true rankings, and I would go as far as saying that the rest of fiction as a whole is a waste of time, and you're better off reading poetry or watching TV instead of reading authors who are not in this list

SUPREME MASTER GOD TIER: THE MASTER OF ALL IN THE KINGDOM OF GREAT WRITERS IN HUMAN HISTORY, AT THE TOP OF THE HIGHEST TOWER, MASTURBATING 10-15 TIMES PER DAY, AS THE HAND WITH WHICH HE WRITES ARTISTIC MASTERPIECES IS MORE SEXUALLY APPEALING THAN ANY ADONIS THE GODS CAN CONJURE
>Proust

VICE-SUPREME MASTER GOD TIER: THE ONLY WRITER DESERVING TO BE IN SAME ROOM AS THE SUPREME MASTER GOD
>Joyce

GOD TIER: OCCUPYING THE MARBLE CASTLE WITH THE SUPREME AND VICE SUPREME MASTER GOD
>Tolstoy
>Homer
>Dante
>Dostoevsky
>Shakespeare

ANGELIC DEMON TIER: PATROLLING THE CASTLE WALLS OF THE GOD TIERS AND ABOVE, AND DOING THEIR BIDDING ACROSS THE UNIVERSE, CAPTURING AND PILLAGING ENTIRE PLANETS TO TO INTO PLANET-SIZED "THE MATRIX"-TYPE BODY HARVESTING FARMS, BUT THEY HARVEST HUMAN FARTS INSTEAD OF ELECTRICITY, PACKED IN DIAMOND JARS, FOR THE FART-LOVING PROUST AND JOYCE TO HOLD UP TO THEIR NOSES AND SHIFT THEIR NOSES LEFT AND RIGHT ALONG THE RIM OF THE JAR LIKE SNIFFING A FINE WINE, THEN TAKING A HUMONGOUS INHALE AND ACHIEVING UNFATHOMABLE ORGASM, "AH, A 2017 RUSSIAN LUMBERJACK FART, GOOD YEAR" THEY SAY, NODDING THEIR HEADS AT THE ANGELIC DEMONS WHO DO THEIR BIDDING, THE ANGELIC DEMONS' HEARTS FILLED WITH JOY AT THE HONOR OF SERVING THEIR MASTERS
>Goethe
>Kafka
>Chekhov
>Morrissey
>Nabakov
>Melville
>Chaucer
>Cervantes
>Ambrose motherfucking Bierce!

HONORABLE DRAGON WORK CREATURE TIER: THESE WRITERS' SOULS HAVE POSSESSED THE BODIES OF DRAGONS WITH LIME GREEN FUR AND FLORESCENT TIGER STRIPES WHO BREATHE GAMMA RAY BURSTS AND CIRCLE THE SUPREME MASTER GOD'S KINGDOM BY THE MILLIONS, AND OPERATE AS A HIVE MIND, AND HAVE BEEN GENETICALLY MODIFIED WITH TARDIGRADE DNA TO SURVIVE IN SPACE AND EVEN BLACK HOLES, TO HONOR WORKS THAT I ENJOYED PERSONALLY BUT THAT MAY NOT BE AS JUSTIFIED ON AN ARTISTIC LEVEL BY CONSENSUS
>Hesse
>Pynchon
>Hemingway
>Foster Wallace
>Woolf
>Flaubert
>George Eliot
>Balzac
>Borges

That i really really like the magic mountain

Based post

What do you want me to say, guy? His style is below average for European standards. Kafka just wasn't in any way a gifted writer, but jews aren't good writers so this fact is hardly surprising. The actual substance is also subversive and designed to increase feelings of alienation among young people who read his work, hence why I said those like yourself who are inclined to jump to his defense have juvenile tastes, yet to emerge your teenage 'me against the world' cocoon. But as I also said, I don't blame you for this. I'm trying to help you here.

Thank you for this.

>Putting Foster Wallace in the same level as Borges or Hesse because of a meme book.

Infinite Jest is great but please stop the delusion.

It's insulting to Mann to put V. anywhere near the galaxy of any of his works.

Y'all, Mann is great but he is one of those guys whose seemingly unparalleled cuckery automatically demotes him several pegs. He was a pathetic man.

Céline was better than Proust.

A lot of people were. Proust isn't actually a good writer qua writer. His status has been inflated and Veeky Forums is full of kids who crowd the bandwagon since they are incapable of discerning merit beyond overreach that signals they are knowledgeable about that which they they've been told will bring them status for pretending to be knowledgeable about.

And Beckett was better than Joyce

I hate Anglos.

Lmao what the fuck are you even trying to say atleast offer a critique of proust in a paragraph dedicated to discrediting him

Funny thing to say while frequenting an English language forum Pedro

>no mention of the Billy G Tha God

If you expect serious responses from others, please use proper punctuation in your posts.

Musil > Mann > Broch

Arguably Witkiewicz.

Please stop anglo, Proust is an amazing prose writer.

This is completely wrong. It's utterly disgusting that you would unironically think this. Firstly Proust's actual writing style is flawless. Secondly the content of his writing is life changing and makes one appreciate the real world better. You've ventured out there - the real world - once or twice I assume? Try to remember what that was like. Well, Proust makes that even better.

Please kill yourself.

No, he was not.

how?

Alright, I'll take your word for it that you're "trying to help." I'm still not convinced, and I think you assume too much about me; I know I am no bitter Holden Caulfield type. But if you are willing, create an Anti-Kafka list, both literary and philosophical, and maybe that will be a strong argument.

I hope someone jams a fire hose up your ass then turns it on

I have many times the life experience you do and am better-read as well. I'm not surprised people like yourself feel adamant that you know what you're talking about, especially if you've devoted a large proportion of what little time you've been in existence to reading ISOLT, but you don't. You are a fair-weather reader who is defending a bad writer because you've been told he's a good writer and because you are incapable of making such distinctions yourself. I understand.

The remarkable comedic wit of the Proust reader.

swap tolstoy with proust and proust with joyce and we'll be friends

>I know I am no bitter Holden Caulfield type
Making, or merely picking up on, such a distinction likely means you're on the right path.

You are one of the most pretentious faggots in all of Veeky Forums. I've read over 400 classical fiction and philosophy books and only a few writers come close to Proust. I assume you simply did not read Proust, or you could not properly appreciate it because your goldfish attention span was offended by the long sentences, and gave up 30 pages into Swann's Way. His brilliance is very obvious in his prose and insight into the mind on every single page. Did you actually read ISOLT?

Sounds like you got me beat in the pretension department (and I'd reckon the mendacity department as well). Perhaps you should try to have an honest discussion with yourself about your mediocre taste in literature. Not sure what you expect me to say.

And the pretension continues. You're worse than that Gil character from Midnight in Paris. Name your top 3 favorite books if you're so tasteful. I'm sure the best of them is less than 1% as good as Marcel Proust's worst excerpts

Funny how a self-described voracious reader gets his allusions from movies by jewish pedophiles. You're just swimming in the jewish culture, aren't you? This is likely the main reason why you have bad taste.

Wow. Ok. And yet you still cannot name one work better than ISOLT. 8/10 troll

Thank you, but will you create the Anti-Kafka list? It doesn't need to be long. 3 to 5 books, really. I don't intend to use this list to jump on you and criticize your taste; you've piqued my curiosity, is what it is. I assume you are the same one in this thread who is arguing against Proust. This only adds to the intrigue.

This is not about my tastes or interests.

I'd rather not divert the thread away from the mediocre tastes and emotional reactions of Kafka/Proust fanboys and am running out the door anyway, but I'll think about it.

Nice deflection faggot but the entire thread is about determining who can match Proust and you have yet to name one author because you literally can't. The truth is that in the history of,the written word no one could compete with the godliness of Marcel Proust. Joyce is the only one who comes close.

>his only articulated point against Proust is "MUH JEWS"

C'mon guys, I'm hoping for that list.

Again, my point here is only to highlight the immaturity of people like yourselves, whose rebuttals seem to rest on the notion that I'm incapable, even with the internet in hand were I to be exaggerating about being lightyears ahead of you in literary knowledge, of conjuring up the names of a few writers, which is obviously not the case and a weak stance to boot.

However, since I try to be forthright in all things, I plugged in ISOLT and listened to it while I was walking my dog and was able to with greater clarity recall, being unlike yourselves now past the days of my juvenile reading habits that included jokes like Proust, why I hold and have held the opinion that it is overrated and mediocre as a work of literature. I appreciate, even prefer, long sentences, but Proust is not only awkward and choppy in his attempt to construct them, he is equally unskilled at filling those sentences with any kind of beauty or meaningful substance in general. Jews are simply not good writers. They have concept of the aesthetic. And this has always been the case because prose is a European specialty and jews are semites from the desert. This is just how nature works.

Not that either of you were ever interested in material discourse though, ammiright?

I'm not going lather praise over any writer because I'm no longer at a point, unlike the gentlemen above, where I express adolescent admiration and unswayable affection for any particular writer. I more or less agree with a lot of the names that often come up but address them these days more on strengths and weaknesses than a juvenile, emotional connection less-well-read and more inexperienced individuals are liable to use as metrics. I appreciate the craft -- prose stylists, verbal beauticians -- because that is where the difficulty lies ... and Proust doesn't belong in the fucking conversation.

Literally why

>immaturity of people like you
what the fuck are you talking about you fucking faggot i bet you suck monster tentacle dicks for breakfast fucking fag
>lightyears ahead of you in literary knowledge
clearly not based on your analysis of Proust, but you have the right to your opinion even if it's shitty
>listened to audiobook of ISOLT before this post just to confirm your bias
faggot
>overrated and mediocre
it's underrated imo. it's regarded as one of the best works of the last century, possibly of all time, which is underrated as it should be regarded as the greatest piece of human creation
>awkward and choppy
if you have the reading level of a middle schooler
>unskilled at filling sentences with any kind of beauty or meaningful substance
not according to James Joyce, Nabokov, Woolf, Morrissey, and basically every other notable literary icon who ever read him. but hey, who should i believe, some faggot on the internet or the world's best. you're like some fat faggot in a bar saying "doyyyyy no Scottie Pippen was da best NBA player evah" while LeBron James and Shaq are saying Michael Jordan was.
>"MUH JEWS"... but look at muh material discourse
okay, /pol/
>i'm not going to lather praise over any writer because i'm actually wrong a-a-a--and fuck Proust
jesus christ you're a fucking idiot

I love how no one ever complains that Morrissey is above Melville in this pasta

And where's Beckett??

Oh, my ... this is Sperg-Level Supreme posting lol. But it makes, and in quite spectacular fashion, my original point: the non-jews you'll see go balls-out for Proust are emotionally juvenile individuals and end-of-the-spectrum sheep personalities who have no sense of quality in literature themselves, but are merely aping an opinion that has been passed down to them. It's rather pathetic, as the above poster shows.

Depresses me that Veeky Forums is literally the only place I've ever been to where people say things as interesting as this. Expand on what you mean, user.

you can't just diss someone without suggesting a positive alternative

this

you've yet to identify any author that is superior to Proust, simply because that does not exist

When I first read some excerpts of Kafka's works, I had no idea that he was Jewish, but I was still moved by what I read.

I'm open to the idea that whole generations of men can live and die in error, but please, if you know the answer, if you know someone far better, so much better that Kafka is mediocre, please tell me who it is! This isn't a game or a ploy either, I'm quite open to someone better, or even a specific knowledge of Kafka's flaws in a way that would ruin the works for me.

Shouldnt we just rename this board "/jews/"?
Is literally the main topic

Why is Proust so good? Genuinely curious because I've never heard any of his work.

>because that does not exist
This type of Proustian fundamentalism is indicative of an immature individual who lacks knowledge and experience, and that is precisely the connection I'm drawing attention to.

The mature reader does not engage in blind hero-worship like this toward any writer because they have studied a wide variety of authors and have a deep understanding of their strengths and weaknesses.

Who is better than Proust? Isn't it obvious that there's a long list? But I'm making a larger point that will get lost if I stoop to the level of under-read children and get into some Proust vs fill-in-the-blank dick-measuring contest. There are different categories of writers, it's not as simple as just posing an alternative, but if my point has been made and someone poses a category more nuanced than 'on the level of___,' then put out some real parameters.

mann? he's not even a third-tier writer, he's one of the most overrated writers in history. your fucking list is idiotic and absurd.
no homer?
no plato?
no aeschylus?
no sophocles?
no marcus aurelis?
no virgil?
no dante?
no augustine?
no cervantes?
no shakespeare?
no flaubert?
no baudelaire?
no huysmans?
no mirbeau?
no lorrain?
no d'annunzio?
no schnitzler?
no giovanni papini?
marinetti?
sartre?
hermann kasack?
mishima?
thomas bernhard?

honestly, drink strychnine and kill yourself, kill this post, kill your existence, kill your parents for conceiving you, obliterate your existence, burn your notebooks and erase all traces of your sad, silly life

ruskin
carlyle
shelley
keats

Not him but Kafka has a strong Christian guilt vibe, almost Catholic really

Of course you were moved by it, you were, what, sixteen? Kafka's work appeals to the undeveloped male mind and is meant to exacerbate the individuals' feelings of alienation, to dwell on such things instead of helping one to conquer or overcome them. This is particularly jewish and Kafka is required reading in high schools because he is subversive, but that's getting into some big brain nigga territory most aren't ready for.

Name one person on this "long list" if it's so long

Forget that; just give us a sentence- a single sentence- that you particularly admire. Or will that still be too much of a "dick measuring contest"?

I said I would if you provided parameters. What is it you think Proust is so good at?