Who here /keto/ ?

Who here /keto/ ?

Me. I've had a bad week relearning how to lift weights on keto as a type 1 diabetic. Workouts 1-3 were fantastic. Upping the protein to fat ratios did not affect my blood sugar levels or insulin dosage, and I remained in dietary ketosis for the first week. Once the nasty initial ones were out of the way, on workout #4 I decided to go really hard. 6 hours later, my blood sugar dropped to 20 mg/dL and kept getting low for a few hours. Ended up aborting keto by having to eat around 150-200g of sugars to stay conscious. The next day, I took 50% more insulin than usual, yet kept riding at 250 mg/dL no matter how much I threw at it despite fasting. Almost back to normal levels after 3 days. Ketosis probably barely reestablished. Tests irrelevant due to high blood glucose levels. Haven't decided yet how to approach this issue in the next attempt. Go easier on myself? Reduce basal dose by 30-50% on workout days? Fucking trial and error. Anybody here have advice?

>blood sugar dropped to 20 mg/dL
Holy shit, man. Were you using insulin at all that day, or is that just what happens when you burn all your blood sugar by lifting weights?

I've never seen a blood sugar level below 70 while on keto. OTOH the most exercise I get is the occasional walk on the beach.

You know what, I don't really understand how it works. I think I've been a little bit too pragmatic about it. Basal insulin dose was the same. Blood glucose had been normal for the first week: 70-90 all day. The beginning of the second week was an off day. Now I was running a little bit lower, like 60-80. I probably should have taken that as a sign that I needed to slightly lower the basal. I had been pretty sedentary all winter there.

Here's where it gets weird. I split workout #4 into two parts. I did an hour in the morning, then did some errands, and another hour in the afternoon. After part 1, my blood sugar was uncharacteristically slightly high. 150ish. No corrections were made, it just went back down by itself before part 2. What the shit? Was that a workout-induced glucagon phenomenon? And I only get one of those or something when in dietary ketosis? Like I said, I went all out.

meme diet for retards that can't count calories.

It was a funny, low too. Like sneaky. None of the dizziness. The only thing that brought me to test was a blind spot. I had to keep turning my head to use my peripheral vision to read the meter. Did you ever read that story about the doc that put a bunch of obese patients on a controlled keto diet, and they were all walking around with normal cognition and ridiculously low blood glucose levels?

I've been doing it on and off for almost three years. It works for me, it's mostly a lifestyle change at this point. I will pretty much have to stay keto 90% of the time so I won't be fat.

Say what you want but me and my gfs lost a hundred pounds each on keto without working out

> and my gfs lost a hundred pounds each
The fact that you had that much weight to lose in the first place proves his point.

>me and my gfs lost a hundred pounds
How fucking fat were you?

As with any meme diet, the weight is due to dietary changes and being more in control of what you eat.
cals in, cals out, and this is a scientific fact.

Different food is metabolised differently though. Some is filling some isn't.

I haven't eaten for 16 hours right now and I'm not even hungry at all. I find that lack of hunger on keto so liberating. Plus I've lost 10kg over the last 2 months, went from overweight to healthy weight.

>be fat
>people talk shit
>do something about being fat
>people talk shit about your methods

When I started keto I was like 293 pounds. Counting calories is fucking torturous and unsustainable for me so how about I stick to what works (for me) regardless of how much of a meme you think it is

It's vegansim for right wing retards

>cals in, cals out, and this is a scientific fact.
True, though my experience on keto was that I didn't feel hungry as often, so it was easier to resist temptation.

I water fast on four days and eat on three. Eating consists of wolfing down ~2200 calories in one sitting to avoid unnecessary insulin spikes. The food is basically a big pile of baked/roasted/fried meat and cheese with spices, sometimes a few veggies (dark leafy, broccoli, etc). I mostly avoid processed meat like sausages and ham. The first week was total shit, headaches, dizziness, carb craving. Nowadays I have zero carb craving, never feel hungry and the fasting is easy-peasy, which I guess is because I'm already used to metabolizing fat. I work out a bit every day, which I did before fasting/keto as well. Ketones are around 6 mmol/L.

All in all it's great, meat and cheese are delicious, meal prep and time wasted eating are at a minimum. I'm never hungry, never tired and I'm losing weight.

>cals in, cals out, and this is a scientific fact.

>hurrdurr I FUCKING LOVE SCIENCE
>completely ignores BMR changes

>keto
>diabetic

Dude keto can kill you.

>Who here /kidneystones/?

I'm also type 1. Enjoy your grand mal seizures bud. Once you dislocate both your shoulders the first time, it's a lot less painful when they pop out from thrashing around. Try not to bite your tongue off or barf too much!

>doesn't know that keto includes drinking gallons of water

>blood gets full of toxic ketone bodies since the lack of dietary carbohydrate prevents the Krebs cycle from working normally
>have to drink tons of water to excrete them so you don't die
>have to constantly replenesh the electrolytes lost due to this by consuming tons of salt and bone broth
10/10 diet

>being hydrated is bad

Nice try soyboy, HOWEVER

>some soy foods contain high concentrations of oxalate and/or phytate. Oxalate is a component of calcium oxalate kidney stones

Had a nice poale saute of chassuers chicken last night. roux-less and thickened with xanthan gum.

So does spinach. Nobody gets kidney stones from eating spinach in the amounts any normal person does

I'll add it to the long list of things that can kill me, but haven't.

Jesus, you've dislocated your shoulders during a seizure? That fucking sucks. I haven't had a seizure since college. Although years ago, due to repeated work-related stress I managed to have a couple rotator cuff scares. After that, I started building up my upper body muscles to give me more resilience to injury. It worked. But as you know, athleticism for us is another layer of complexity. Not impossible, but challenging.

I think what I'm gonna try is a very slight reduction of the basal on workout days, with some pre-workout sugars to prevent dipping into the emergency glycogen stores in the liver. Should be able to burn them off immediately. Bolus dosing as necessary should be fine with sugars up to a certain amount. I'm really good at getting back into dietary ketosis after fuck ups at this point. Might be that I have to go right up to the threshold of glycolysis, with two off days of very strict keto in-between. Kind of a mixed metabolic approach. The really effective muscle gains are when you kick your ass.

The diet actively works to dehydrate you. If you were hydrated, you wouldn't need to drink a quart of salt water every hour.

You don't. You just have to (read as recommended to) drink 3 litres. No different than any other diet.

>Photogenic image
>Cauliflower, the most carb-rich vegetable

>3 carbs in 1 cup
What a fucking nightmare holy shit. That's totally different from any other vegetable like spinach or broccoli.

the entire process of estimating your intake of carbs requires counting calories, you retard. and a lot more useful information about the ratio of macro-nutrients to boot

>dehydrate you
what do you think fat cells are full of? are you honestly shitting on a diet for depleting fat?

No no, you're right. We should all go back to eating low-fat chips and cardio so we don't risk losing weight.

>the most carb-rich vegetable

Keto fags and their hyperbole. If you eat two ounces you're only up to 10 grams. That still leaves you plenty of room to stay ketogenic all day every day.

Not that keto has any real advantage over low carb, but whatever floats your boat.

Ketosis happens on and off in all humans, regardless of carb consumption. It's just more frequent and effective when you are carbless.

Oops, I meant 8 ounces ... fucked up my sane to burger measure translation.

>what do you think fat cells are full of?
Fat, you tard.

The glycogen in the muscles is why body builders dose insulin for sick gains. My understanding is that insulin is the messanger molecule that tells muscles and the liver to lace up the long chained glucose into tight-knit glycogen to be stored in the muscles or liver.

It's interesting that as diabetics, only lacking insulin-producing beta cells, our alpha cell feedback system is also fucked. Even though we have glucagon capabilities to unlace that glycogen in the liver, our bodies will just let us die when our blood glucose crashes. Strange, stuff; I've never gotten an answer to it from any endocrinologist I've asked.

Can you share any insight on how this process differs under the effects of ketosis? It's the Krebs cycle from what I understand, but I don't know much about it. Don't have a biochem education, just bits and pieces from bending the ears of doctors and reading medical texts on endocrinology.

Wondering about how upping my protein would affect me. I recalculated for my new weight and for my increased activity level, but it spit out a fucked up ratio for keto.

Lifting weights a few times a week at 290lbs, this is what my new macro ratio is. I know that fat has more calories than protein and carbs, but it still makes me nervous.

I've been on a LCHF diet for years now, and I've had DM type 1 for 8. If you've been keto adapted, and have done the diet for long enough, your glycogen stores should be nearly empty. You still need insulin to function properly, but much much less. If you inject too much, along with the hypoglycemia you're inhibiting Hormone-sensitive lipase, the protein moving fatty acids around. I feel comfortable with 25-30mg/dl, because most of the neuroglycopenic symptoms don't affect you. If you go low for long enough, it will though.
Also, as a working out diabetic, know that you can use only so much grams of protein per kg lean mass, for me after 160g and 180g on workout day, all excess protein gets converted to sugar in the liver after about 3 hours, so I try to never eat about 40-50g of protein per meal.

>keto
>plate of carbs

You can have all of that on keto. That entire plate is probably around 15 net carbs.

Yeah, I only have a liberal arts-tier science education as well. Experientially though, I believe my liver glycogen stores are unlocked in extreme hypoglycemia. When I was younger, I've blacked out and regained consciousness several times. The other day where I split that workout into two parts, how else can I explain the higher blood sugar level after the first part? Just like every other day I had not eaten at that point. I have to assume you only get one of these until however long it takes for it to replenish itself. What is it they say, around 100-150g of glycogen is stored in the liver? This is why the endos tell you not to ride out lows, I guess.

In dietary ketosis, supposedly there is considerably less to no glucose stored in the muscles. It makes lifting feel less explosive. You can still do it, but I guess you're using a different energy pathway which makes it take longer to get your sets completed. This is why I'm thinking about trying dosing small amounts of fast carbs right before sets. As long as the net carbs don't exceed your ketogenic threshold it should burn that first, right? Hypoglycemia also feels different in dietary ketosis. 40-50 mg/dL hardly feels any different than 70-80. Hell, that 20-something low felt fine except for not being able to fucking see! I was just too chicken shit to try to ride it out without my glycogen stores. I'm not sure I would try if it happened again either. It is interesting stuff. This might be one of those things that has so many individual patient variables that they just can't give you a definitive answer. Only vague, theoretical ones at best. It's definitely a razor's edge, but I'm pretty good at routines.

Hm. This is useful. Thanks.

By the way, would you ever ride out a low of

Bruh, that shit's going to put you into a coma. Talk to Veeky Forums about that stuff as well, I'm sure there's more than one T1 diabetic bodybuilder fag that can help you.

I need some high fat low protein foods. I keep going over on my protein and barely meeting my fat, and it pisses me off when I can't balance that back out.

>cals in, cals out
How about "don't eat refined sugar, you fucking ponce"?

I recently rode out a 30mg/dl for 2h up to 99 because I'd had too much protein and I knew it'd go back up.
>I need some high fat low protein foods.
Add butter?

Considering. Either Kero or Paleo or Caveman or whatever the fuck you want to call it. Trying to get Veeky Forums and in general less processed foods is always a good thing.

Still, it's not easy cutting carbs out. And I'm not sure I want to, I've seen the studies (even though there are conflicting studies) but nothing about the long term effect of it. I just feel I need to study the subject more before making the jump in.

What's considered low carb? Between 50 to 100 g?

>>being hydrated is bad
blatantly retarded strawman

do you have too many chromosomes or is it something else impairing your cognitive ability

>be fat memerican
>people talk shit
>do something meme
>people still talk shit

youre retarded, people always talk shit


>I believe
>only have a liberal arts-tier science education
>>I believe

I believe I have some shit talk for ya. You type like the stupidest motherfucker in the thread thus far. Good job.

Shit diet if you are normal weight and don't have problems with insulin sensitivity. And even then it's highly questionable.

ITT: buttblasted carblets everywhere

Anyone taking multivitamins? I decided to just go for it because I'm definitely not getting certain things at the levels I should be. Not that I was before I started keto, mind you.

Only thing I'm lacking now is potassium, which I get from my drinks, magnesium which I get from nuts, and phosphorous, which I also get from nuts.

>le I only get my facts from outdated studies and HealthLine articles faec
Read up on keto. We've been through this so many times with other people in other threads. It's tiring at this point.

>le i only get my facts from alternative medicine and conspiracy blogs faise

>le I never read recent peer reviewed studies and research papers on the matter written and conducted by people who aren't armchair nutritionists

I've read a hell of a lot more papers than you have, and not just recent ones that you've seen news reports about.

No, hadn't heard that. I'm a T2D using keto to control my diabetes and test regularly; mine is typically between 70-95. I'm not all that strict, though, and after a meal where I do have some carbs I can see levels in the 120 range.

>long chained glucose
No such thing. Any "chain" more than two units long is called "starch", and if you have starch floating around in your bloodstream you've got some serious problems that are unknown to medical science. Any two-unit chain composed of two glucoses isn't "glucose" because it's either maltose or trehalose depending on how it's bonded. Glucose is, by definition, a monosaccharide.

I take a multi occasionally when I remember to. I take a potassium tablet about every other day; I could avoid that if I'd just eat more avocado, but I don't particularly like avocado. I take an "omega 3 salmon oil" thing on days when I don't eat a huge slab of salmon.

>dude carbs are evil
>that's why we've unearthed humans who had evidence of bread and grains in their stomach

Atkins recommended under 50, keto says under 20.

Some people can handle higher amounts without falling out of ketosis, but I can't, so I try to stay under 20.

>Still, it's not easy cutting carbs out.
You'd be surprised, once you get used to eating that way. Instead of Doritos have some pumpkin seeds. Make pizza with a sausage "crust" instead of bread. If you go out to eat, have a steak. It's all a matter of making healthier decisions.

Fat is a limit, not a goal. You need to get enough protein to maintain your muscles; the less fat you eat the more you'll burn.

>Cauliflower, the most carb-rich vegetable
>Keto fags and their hyperbole. If you eat two ounces you're only up to 10 grams.
Can you guys not math? Google says it's 3g of carbs per 100g of cauliflower. You can eat a pound and a half (666g for our metric friends) and still not exceed your daily carb limit.

But have you considered the possibility that eating bread and grains is the reason they died?

>Read up on keto.
I do every time I post that and it's the same result, it's an inherently bad diet that has a few very specific uses which cannot be generalised. The very concept is stupid and ven in diabetis treatment other, better diets are proven successful.

Jokes on you faggot. I don't have a cable package.

Not on keto. Keto is high fat, moderate protein.