Can we have a thread about Eastern Europe? Why is it in the state it's in...

German empire funded Lenin to overthrow the tsar and launch a revolution in Russia. Russia then forcefed everyone communism after their military victories in WW2. I'm fairly certain than outside of the USSR, more Eastern Europeans liked Hitler than Stalin before and during the war (of course there were also countries like Poland who hated both).

>Yugoslavia

Tito pretty much killed off everyone who opposed communism, most notably the Ustashe and the Chetniks.

They are subhuman. If their countries were inhabited by germanics they would be much better.

yet they were the first to send a man in space while scandinavians were nothing more than albino niggers who couldn't put two sticks together

Mexican please

You can't thrown them into one bunch, only the 40 years of communism linked them together, at very least break them into groups, rhe states that had Catholic Kingdoms (Hungary, Czechia, Poland, Croatia), the Balkan countries (Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Albania, small states)), main USSR succesor states of Russia, Ukraine and Belarus, and the Baltic countries.

You could say each of the group roughly followed the same path but of all the four really only come together after 1945.

Hungarians are not Slavs you dipshit and neither are Romanians.

What are they then?
>inb4 gypsies
Do gypsies really make up the majority of hungary and romania?

Hungarians are Finno-Ugric people you idiot.

OP said Eastern Europe, both Hungary and Romania are Eastern European. Also Hungarians are a genetic transition between Slovaks and Croatians, only their language is Uralic.

>stupid people are easy to manipulate
I dont see difference between Eastern and Wester Europe or even America

>tfw no Mitteleuropa

I blame the jews.

>only
genetics is irrevelant to ethnic identity

>(You)

>being an illiterate turd

But that's totally wrong you faggot, if nothing commie regimes cared far more about "enlightening" the people in general than any regime previously or current regimes.
Now culture is infected by imported Western trash like reality shows, whores whoring themselves out, consumerism and illiteracy.
Communism had many shit sides but claiming they ruined everything is gross exaggeration.
For Balkans it was Ottoman rule, the rest were always behind West and Balkans.
Russians had Mongol issue, Ukraine had Tatar issue, Poland was a chaotic semi-anarchy, Hungary was okay but never near West, Estonians and Latvians were literally serfs owned by Baltic German minority, and so on.
I shit on "everything was great before communism" meme.
If you really read about life in Bulgaria and Serbia before WW1 you'd see how it really was.
And lastly, I don't support fucking communism, I'm just saying that communists didn't ruin us.

what is the difference between a slav and a balt?

Slavs speak Slavic language and Baltic people belong to Baltic group (Lithuanian, Latvian, Old Prussian).

You literally use pape-thin 2D cliches on the countries you mention, a lot of which were manufactured by centuries old propaganda, and then you get angry about your pet ideology. You must be horrible to be around.

Oh and communism sucks, starves tenths of millions and belongs in the trash. Deal with it.

>But that's totally wrong you faggot, if nothing commie regimes cared far more about "enlightening" the people in general than any regime previously or current regimes.

opinion disregarded

>state I don't like communism and accept it had many flaws
>UGH YOU DARE SAY COMMUNISTS WEREN'T SATAN URE A COMMUNIST!!!!11
Quality argument.
>centuries of propaganda
All I said was true even if very general because I can't describe detailed history of such a big group in two sentences.
But "communism is the reason we're poor(er)" is absolute bullshit.

>I shit on "everything was great before communism" meme.
It wasn't, but stuff was starting to catch up before that.

And it was "catching up" during communism too. It just never caught up.
I just hate this pretending that before communism EE was some highly advanced society. And then some Pole posts a poster showing how their reforms would go.
Meanwhile in 1938 Soviets had higher GDP per capita.
Again, nationlist romanticism is not reality. Communism was shit for many reasons but it didn't really destroy anything, on the contrary.
We maybe missed chances but then again seeing where West is heading now makes you wonder.

hungarians are finno-ugric and catholic/protestant
romanian are latin and orthodox
gypsies are about 10% of the population in both countries but a lot of them declare themselves as hungarians or romanians respectively

You don't really get much real history based on facts OP. A lot of the "history" is just he said she said bullshit.

>But "communism is the reason we're poor(er)" is absolute bullshit.
GPD 1938-1990.png

>Hungary was okay but never near West
In the last peaceful year of the Austro-Hungarian era, Hungarian gdp per capita has estimated to rose to 70% of Austrias average and had consistently higher rates of growth since the 1890s.

This was larger than Spain, Portugal or Greece, ans on par with Finland and Italy.

Yes comparison of GDP per capita when former communist economies collapsed due to neoliberal reforms (1990).
Also, no comparison with Belgium, Germany, France.

like this?

>10%

More like 5%, but it's hard to tell because those that decide to settle down and end up marrying Romanians or Hungarians(or Slovaks for that matter) deny being gyppos. I believe Slovakia has the largest gipsy % in Europe, but that may be due to the fact that Hung gypsies and Rom gypsies would rather declare themselves to be part of the ethnic majority

>le cherrypick
post Poland, Czechia, the baltics/whatever

>GDP matters

Russia has a very high GDP. Care to guess what the serf classes live like?

considering that most of them only started settling down a few decades ago one can hope they will be on the move once again in the near future

>it didn't really destroy everything, on the contrary

I assume you're not thinking about free thought, the intelligentsia of EE, freedom of speech, the middle class, human decency, etc

The only time the intelligentsia of EE have been worth a damn has been when they've been repressed.

>move once again
I'd rather have them settle down , build homes, work, shit like that. In the end a gyppo is a derogatory term that the most decent of them try to escape from.

You're ignoring that Austria wasn't really wealthy in comparison to Germany, England, Belgium, France.
Spain and Portugal were pretty poor, so was Italy.
Even today, this is all fictional wealth. See what will happen when EU is gone.

I too like baiting and shitposting and /pol/posting

>I'd rather have them settle down somewhere else. but i do know some really decent ones

I'm not joking, I'm deadly fucking serious. Think of the interwar Czech intellectuals: fucking useless. Compare them to the interwar Hungarian intellectuals under the Admiral's fascism.

You get one more (You) from me

Strawman harder lad

>intellectuals
>useful under any circumstances

the greentext is accidental

Are you seriously implying wealth inequality was lesser in 30's Poland, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, or before that?
If GDP per capita doesn't matter, than what matters?
On what are you basing your claims?
As I said, it's just simple nationalist romanticism.
I disagree with communism of course and it was an episode that should never repeat itself, but ''commies destroyed everything'' is simply false.

I'm not implying that, I just meant that gommies broke the spirit of many EE nations. The point was that wealth distribution is so fucked in some countries like Russia or Ukraine, a rise in GDP is barely felt by the general populace

>broke the spirit
That's a different subject, and on that I can agree, but communism also prevented us from going the same way as West is going now.
In every evil there is some good.

>the same way as West is going now

2 things lad
>now that it's clear that we're both from behind the Iron Curtain, where are you from that you hold these views?
>which way is the west going?

Dunno how it's in post-AH countries, but Russia there were no such thing as middle class before communism. 90% of population were illitarate peasants

>post-AH countries

There was a middle-class and it was blooming, especially in the late 30's. Fascism and communism put a solid end to that

I agree about most of countries you mentioned.
The only true victims of communisn are Czechia, Hungary, Slovenia and probably Poland. Others only took advantage from it. Espesially central asian shitholles and caucasians republics.

Oh, so Slovakia, Romania, Croatia, Bulgaria, the Baltics, Ukraine, Albania or Serbia didn't suffer at all during communism, no, not at all, no sir. They were fine.

>Baltics, Ukraine
No. They only got. It's commies returned Vilno back to Lithuania and Lvov to Ukraine. It's commies builded their cities, factories and nuclear power plants. It's commies saved their languages from complete extinction.

sure, especially in baltics by invading and annexing them

> Crimea
> Ukrainian

Triggered

> It's commies builded their cities, factories and nuclear power plants.
Yeah! Like colonialists build all infrastructure in Africa. Sure they are good guys.

>It's commies returned Vilno back to Lithuania
After annexing Lithuania as a whole

>It's commies saved their languages from complete extinction.
By constantly trying to remove it from public use and replace it with Russian? Just because they failed doesn't mean they didn't try.

> Just because they failed doesn't mean they didn't try.
They actually didn't try. National autonomies was strong in soviet union.

>It's commies builded their cities, factories and nuclear power plants
You mean cities that they destroyed during ww2 and then filled with those shitty commieblocks?
Or nuclear power plants that that were unsafe by their own shit standards?
Or factories that were so terrible they had no way of competing with anything outside USSR?

> nuclear power plants that that were unsafe
They are perfectly safe. Literally can't name even one problem where plants was fucked up without some huge fuck up from people.

In any public event that had music, at least more than half had to be Russian. All documents had to be in Russian - Lithuanian was optional. There was no TV in Lithuanian, only Russian. That's just to name a few.

>what is Holodomor Alex?
>what are the mass deportations of Lithuanians?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_deportations_from_Lithuania

> what is Holodomo
Not intentional in every sense of the word

t. Marx Leninistovici Kommunistov

>starving out 4 million ukies is not intentional

Fuck off comisar

>sure, especially in baltics by invading and annexing them
First you should remember it's commies gave them independence. So the alternative to commies was a Tsarist regime, which were much more oppressive.

Colonialists in Africa used Africans as slaves. Commies incorporated local elites to their system and forced them to conduct progressive reforms. Like in Khazakhstan. Commies literally forced nomad people to settle in cities and start normal life. Now Khazakh GDP per capita is higher than Ukrainian.

What was the alternative? To be annexed by Nazi Germany, I guess.

>By constantly trying to remove it from public use and replace it with Russian?
This is not true. Of course, the language of culture was Russian. It was (and still is in Central Asia) the language of international communication. Like English in Europe and whole world. Can we say that Americans trying to remove all languages by English?

were the many more millions of starved Russians genocided intentionally too?

Stop shilling the USSR fuckface.

>full damage control mode

lmao, a famine is not a genocide senpai, period

t. far from a gommie

>far from a gommie
Sure you are Appaatchikov

>a famine is not a genocide
This one was

>What was the alternative? To be annexed by Nazi Germany, I guess
At least they only sent mostly jews to camps, not everyone. Also they weren't as poor.

>Can we say that Americans trying to remove all languages by English?
So americans are dictating what language can and cannot be used in documents, literature and such?

>this one was
how was it different from the (far worse) famines in russia?

> This one was
Because commies can apparently control weather at the scale of entire country.

> not everyone
How many Lithuanians was at camps?

>You mean cities that they destroyed during ww2
Oh, stupid commies. Sorry, I always forgot it's commies are responsible for ww2.

>Or nuclear power plants that that were unsafe by their own shit standards?
As this guy said, they are safe. Chernobyl happened because one retard was incompetent.

>Or factories that were so terrible they had no way of competing with anything outside USSR?
Why do you thing they would build better factories if not communism? What countries not affected by communism we have to compare with Ukraine? Probably Greece? If so, I don't see any good industries in Greece.

>how was it different
the fact that there was actually enough food, but it was all sold because they didn't like farm workers going on strikes

>Why is it in the state it's in?
1) It's not in such a bad state. Drunk guys in tracksuits running around and beating everyone to death with pipes is a Veeky Forums meme.
2) The area has been exposed to various barbarian invasions for centuries like Avars, Mongols, Magyars, Turks, etc. from the East and German imperialism from the West.
3) The North wasn't historically as connected to the rest of the world as Western and Southern Europe and the Balkans is a pile of mountains which is why so many tiny states formed there in the first place.
4) Early medieval Eastern Europe was more advanced than Western Europe, but lost the advantage during Christian-Islamic wars. The Fourth Crusade specifically was a bit turning point. Crusades and sacking Constantinople brought massive amounts of money into the West and enabled the later development of capitalism, also Turkish invasions caused many Eastern intellectuals to travel West.
5) It's not a coincidence that colonial states have an Atlantic coastline.
6) Communism

>I always forgot it's commies are responsible for ww2.

>splitting up Europe with Hitler and giving him more power has nothing to do with WW2

Question, are you Russian or just a pre-drop-out westerner who's never been near eastern Europe?

>shit-tier engrish
>commie

Where are you from sweetcheeks that you think communism is so good and all EE fags on this board have no idea what they're talking about.

> ongoing famine
> actually enough food
Really? This is what we supposed to believe?

> giving him more power
Well...
You should blame England and French for this.

>agricultural heart of the Russian Empire
>gommies arrive
>worst famine in the history of the place

Sure, it wasn't the commies' fault you see. Stalind a gud boi, he dindu nuffin

>You mean cities that they destroyed during ww2
That's Nazis. You know, the guys who killed 30 million Slavs.
>Or nuclear power plants that that were unsafe by their own shit standards?
That's one single power plant. The many other Soviet plants work just fine. Chernobyl helped everyone improve their own nuclear power security, including the West. Welcome to technology.
>Or factories that were so terrible they had no way of competing with anything outside USSR?
You mean the ones that put the first man into space? Or the ones that won WWII?

Man, you commies are on full throttle ITT. But sure, come to EE, declare yourself to be a gommie, see how people react

I'm an Eastern European right-winger, and there's plenty of nostalgic commies here.

>Other countries had some smaller part it it so it means Soviets did nothing wrong, including fucking HELPING Germany with Poland.

>You mean the ones that put the first man into space?
That was the early 60's. In 10 years' time the US has put 12 men on the Moon.

>Or the ones that won WWII?
And stagnated in tech for 50 years.

Go to sleep Comisar

Old fags who were in the state apparatus. You'd be hard pressed to find someone under 50 who's like that.

>splitting up Europe with Hitler
Non-aggression pact do not imply alliance or something. Also, same Hitler had same non-aggression pacts with literally every European country.
>giving him more power
What do you imply by this? Trading? Hitler traded with all European countries, including France and England, and they were larger trade partners than USSR.