So why didn't the vikings stick around in North America?

So why didn't the vikings stick around in North America?

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Because Injuns fucked their shit up.

I don't think that the Norse settlements that were found up in Newfoundland were permanent to begin with. More like temporary stops or warehouses than residences, if I remember correctly. Anyways, a combination of fighting with the skrælings, if the sagas are to be believed, and environmental pressures probably kept the small number of Norsemen who were sailing around the area from pitching their tents for the long haul.

Too far away and dangerous to set up trade.
Too cold and hostile maintain their lifestyle

>Too remote
>Inviable population size
>Hostile natives

Do we have any idea of how much contact they had with natives? I know we've found coins in native settlements, but I have no idea of the extent of actual contact.

Wouldn't the native population have been much, much, much larger at that time, also? This would surely have something to do with their short stay I'd think.

And why didn't smallpox spread like it did after Columbus?

because angry sagaves

>And why didn't smallpox spread like it did after Columbus?

Why would a few boat loads of people necessarily bring smallpox with them?

Their economy was too weak. Maybe if Hardrada had conquered England, Scandinavia would have been rich enough to make it's colonies self-sufficient.

>be viking
>wash up on mysterious land
>ask red people if they want to start trading stuff
>OGGA BOOOG WE ATTACK YOU
>viking goes back to iceland


Stupid indians could have learned metallurgy and made armor and swords

I guess not necessarily but Columbus brought smallpox with his voyages so I wouldn't say it's an unreasonable assumption

It's not an unreasonable assumption that if there is contact between the continents for long enough it will eventually spread, but there's no reason it would always be the first voyage, or the 5th etc.

Or they could have learnt how to make alcohol and then they'd be living a 21st century native lifestyle

this, and it's all because some dipshit indian dindunuffin.

That's mean, user

wew

That house looks max comfy
How did they build houses like that?
How can I get a house like that?

For diseases like smallpox to thrive you need cities with large numbers of people and animals; Vikings obviously didn't have these, so there was no smallpox or other devastating diseases to bring with them.

>vikings arrive in north america
>they attempt to kill the locals and fuck their women as usual
>the locals have shit covered sticks (weapons)
>AWW shit manng ruunnn

Noone to rape and rob.

You mean the white bearded gods from pre-Colombian legend?

They had metallurgy.
Probably more accurate.

doesn't that mean that without norse landing on vinland, aztecs wouldn't thought that cortez was a divine entity so they would've just shot them dead at beach?

>The first occurrence of smallpox in the
Western Hemisphere was on the island of
Hispaniola in 1507, following an importation
from Spain. The epidemic which followed
exterminated whole tribes, but eventually
died out. Most subsequent importations into
the Caribbean islands, Mexico and Brazil were
associated with the African slave trade, which
began in about 1503. In 1517 an outbreak
occurred among African slaves in the mines of
Hispaniola and spread rapidly to the Amerindian
population of that island, killing about
one-third of them. Smallpox spread to Cuba
in 151 8 and Puerto Rico in 151 9, where over
half the native population succumbed to the
disease.
>In 1519 Cortes and his followers sailed
from Cuba to Mexico and arrived in November
in Tenochtitlin, whose size and splendour
amazed them. Jealous of Cortts' good
fortune, the Governor of Cuba sent another
expedition under Narviez to replace CortCs.
Narvhez landed near present-day Vera Cruz
in April 1520, and his entourage included an
African slave who had smallpox.

No.

I think it's cute you think nords wound have been any more advanced than the Americans they encountered.

>metal weapons
>shields
>armor
>clothing in general

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingittorsuaq_Island

Have any of you ever heard of this?

>be an explorer in early 1800s
>see island that is literally just a giant rock
>land on it and climb to the top
>find hundreds of years old runes stacked in a group of cairns

I can't even imagine this happening, it's like when you were a kid and you went exploring in your backyard hoping to find treasure. Except you actually find something on a barren, remote island.

I'm just so fascinated by this

climate got too cold and the abandoned NAmerica and Greenland.

>thinking people who lived in fucking Canada didn't have clothing
Also it doesn't look like Viking armor and weapons did Greenlanders much good against Inuit/Thule raiders.

Most estimates put the pre-contact beothuk population (the natives living on Newfoundland at the time) as very low, even compared to other tribes in the New World. They never really formed large groups, and were fairly isolated from each other, so that might be why disease never really spread.

Speaking as somebody who's half native, he's not wrong.

>Dig a pit
>Build a frame and a roof out of timber
>Cover the whole thing with sod (basically dirt)

People still make roofs out of that stuff. Its a cheap, natural insulator.

native drove them out because natives are fucking scary.

Supposedly secret message on the rocks too.

Remember that there were a fuckton more natives running around when the vikings were there than when europeans tried to colonize north america

Native population was small and isolated, vikings were also generally small population settlers

Also worth noting that later colonists were butt-fuck retarded and frequently came across the Atlantic horribly under-prepared with a wide cross section of fucking idiots so more likely you'd have ill people on board

The Greenlander's barely got enough iron to make knives at the late stage of their colony since the trade with Europe broke down. They probably didn't have an abundance of swords and armor

I read somewhere that the vikings gave them milk or cheese or something and it made them sick since they were lactose intolerent and thought they were trying to poison them

Superior Indian bows strung 700 times

The Inuit have stories about battling Vikings in the days of yore

>steelfags
>able to compete

The Northmen opened hostilities

Mini-ice-age lead to the abandonment of Greenland, and thus the New World vikings lost their supply-chain

Also ferocious natives that didn't take to kindly to barbaric pigskins that liked to sacrifice people horribly to appease their blood gods

I remember Jared "meme" Diamond claiming this. I wonder if it's actually true.

What caused the population decrease?

Possibly Indians attacked them
Possibly they just were absorbed by Indian populations
Possibly they migrated elsewhere due to climate change, either back to Scandinavia/Britain or further inland down the river where it was warmer

Also they recently discovered a second village on Newfoundland

>Possibly they just were absorbed by Indian populations

>yfw modern-day Swedes get right of return to America

In some areas a major factor was environmental degradation and overpopulation leading to conflict or abandoning the area, see the Anasazi, and Cahokia.

Not to mention
>advanced seamanship/navigation/boat building
>actual farming techniques
>better house construction, especially in variable climates
>domesticated animals for farming
>horse riding
>alcohol

Natives, especially in Canada were really pathetic

There's zero evidence of this
Really there isn't any evidence of violence with the Inuit either

Wen they Spanish landed they told stories of gigantic (for them being 5'7 Chicanos) Indians with red hair painting themselves blue and milking deer/goats to make cheese

Source?

One of those .edu sites with primary sources would be nice.

Disease coming up from spanish contact in mesoamerica. Also this . There are deserts in the US that were forests before human intervention

But Vikings came before Spanish, right?

>Really there isn't any evidence of violence with the Inuit either
On Greenland? According to oral Inuit legends written down in the 19th century, there was.

Yes, which is why there were shit tons of indians when the vikings were there, and hardly any when england and co colonised it

>The white devil came to our lands and stole them from us
>They killed our people and forced us out
>White devil gave us land that we could do whatever the fuck we wanted on
>Darn Americans forcing us to drink and drug ourselves to death
>Things were much better back before Americans
>Back when we had no concept of land ownership, were able to kill our people and force them out, and do whatever the fuck we wanted
>Striking Buffalo, pass me the whiskey.

>And why didn't smallpox spread like it did after Columbus?
I think the answer to this is probably also the answer to OP's question. Viking's brought disease, watched the indians drop like flies seemingly for nothing, decided the place was plagued or cursed, noped out of there not realizing they were the carriers all along.
provemewrongprotipyoucant

Speaking as a full blooded Dene, your opinion doesn't matter halfbreed.

>great grandfather drunk himself to death
Chief Blackwood no handle firewater well

I know it's asking much, but do you know of any good websites/videos teaching this technique?

After the "Greenland" real estate scam why the fuck would anyone want to stay

Had there even been any big epidemic outbreaks in northern Europe at that time?

Do you know what actually break Tatars hold of Russian princedoms?
Few waves of disease in ordas.
Sure their rule where declining and their importance weaning but suddenly they got hit and go into trash.
The sudden expansion of Russia into the East and practically unopposed march to the pacific was possibly only thanks to sudden depopulation of Siberia.
Kamchatka was reported by Russian explores as having plenty of native villages and even towns and then suddenly bum few villages and population in hundreds where tens of thousands live before.

>Also ferocious natives that didn't take to kindly to barbaric pigskins that liked to sacrifice people horribly to appease their blood gods
You do realize that the Greenland colonies were christian by the time that Lief Erikson sailed to Newfoundland, right?

>Probably more accurate.

No, not really. The Cheese theory is more probable.