Is it plausible Jesus was a schizophrenic?

They're basically just cult leaders without the odium and malice
.

It sounds plausible to me. Hearing voices in your head that tell you to do something sure sounds like a type of schizophrenia.

That, or he was a conman. A good example of a "prophet" who was most likely a conman would be Joseph Smith. Especially considering his past.

That's not how you fedora properly...you should say

>Jesus
>real

Optional:

>*tips hat*

The word used actually could include mason.

Not much difference between a man working with his hands on wood, or on stone, or on both. There was a theatre constructed about the time of Jesus, in stone; He probably worked on it. It would have drawn tradesmen from all around the area.

Jesus came to earth humbly. Poor white trash, even. Mocked for being a bastard.

He's not coming back the same way.

>white

kek

Poor Light Brown Trash

Masons- no legal obligations (not serfs, no conscription), founders of the masonic lodge, thoroughly unionized through guilds, insured through guild organizations, select choice of apprentices

Carpenters- no integration of mathematics, no guild, no apprentices, literally any nigger with a hammer can do this, feudal lords often had serfs specialized in carpentry

The levant 2,000 years ago is not america, wood houses are considered shit tier. The only skilled wood workers are roofers

also I must stress masons are no longer middle class because they are barely unionized now and have little capital requirements

Carpentry even today is a skilled craft. Even more so 2000 years ago.

Not much is said about Jesus' working years from 15 to 32ish. He was poor, his dad was a carpenter, so people just kind of figured out He helped Joseph.

I'm not sure your freemason/union stuff was present in backwater Judea.

It was not considered skilled craft back then, and what they called back then a carpenter, is basically the modern day equivalent of day-laborer.

You can't really tell without a psychologist doing a sit down session. If jesus at least behaved like he's described in the gospels I'd say it's unlikely. He doesn't suffer from any cognition disorder it seems since his sentences are always coherent and logical. There isn't any bizarre persecution complex, that wouldn't come until later from his followers. And does he really ever describe hearing voices or having visions all that much?

It's actually interesting though because under the DSM5 a lot of religious experience and belief would fall under the definition of delusion.

>he doesn't suffer from any cognition disorder it seems since his sentences are always coherent and logical.
>people who wrote about jesus disagree about what he actually said and write different versions of what happened
>this is later translated and edited
>yells at fig trees

That's different, Schizophrenics will literally get their words jumbled up and the conclusion of a sentence won't be related to the beginning.

"To the store I go because that clock is giving me an odd look, that's my problem."

Jesus was never that incoherent. In fact he's pretty clear.

As far as yelling at fig trees, I think he was trying to prove a point.

>too autistic to understand what an allegory is

>Jesus was never that incoherent. In fact he's pretty clear.
Then why don't the Gospels agree on what he actually said?

Because they were written decades after he died and most people's memory is just not that exact.

Then how do you know what Jesus said?

Karl Jaspers, a famous psychiatrist, thought Ezekiel was schizophrenic; theres a study about it, but i don't remember the name.

Not all schizophrenics speak garbage due to a severe thought disorder, just the most severe cases. I've known two schizophrenics, both were speaking ok, one heard voices daily, the other had delusions from time to time. Schizophrenia is a very diverse illness.

That being said, I think most of prophets were schizophrenic to a degree, Mohammed especially.

mystic experience.

We can't be certain. We have some degree of certainty that he existed, because there are some roman documents that mention him.
But we don't know for certain what he actually did and said.

squid314.livejournal.com/324957.html

Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert, where he was tempted by the Devil. After various lesser trials and temptations, the Devil led Jesus to the top of an exceedingly high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world. And they stood there together, gazing upon the vista below.

"Behold," said Satan, mostly to break the awkward silence. "all the kingdoms of the world."

"They're very nice," said Jesus.

Satan's features - still faintly angelic - formed into a pout. "Really?" he asked. "Because I worked so hard corrupting them and turning them against one another, and..."

"No," said Jesus. "Not like that. I was just trying to be polite, really. They're teeming with sin and abomination."

Satan beamed. Some more awkward silence.

"So," said Jesus. "Is this the point at which you offer me lordship over all these kingdoms, if I only I bow down and worship you?"

"Nah," said Satan. "Like I said, they're kind of crappy. I'm here to tempt you, not insult you. I was planning something more interesting."

He waved his hand over the panorama, and it expanded in a hard-to-describe way. The three-dimensional view became four-dimensional; the vista became a manifold.

"Behold," said Satan again, "all the kingdoms of the world. Now and forever. Before you, the entire scope of history."

Jesus hesitated, not really sure what the polite response would be.

"You could at least smile!" said Satan. "Look! These people love you!"

Sure enough, it was true. Many of the kingdoms before them were Christian, building great cathedrals and writing beautiful works of theology in Jesus' name. Among the remainder, many were Muslim, revering him as one of the greatest of prophets.

"It's pretty encouraging," Jesus agreed. "So what's the catch?"

>a lot of religious experience and belief would fall under the definition of delusion.
Delusion is the most vague symptom ever.
It literally means someone is really wrong about how stuff works. Which doesn't make someone crazy. Now, once you go to visions and stuff, you get funky and possibly clinical stuff.
That's a complex issue, but if there's something wrong, it'd be because it's a compilation of biographies written by 4 different people.
If Jesus's words were illogical yammerings about flat bread and cuckoos, that'd be schizophrenia(or a result of being tied to a torture device in the middle eastern sun for days). Instead, Jesus's words are pretty philosophical and meaningful.

He told me in a vision

"Always the catch with you people," said Satan. "Well, if you insist. Take a look particularly at the psychiatric hospitals."

Jesus gazed through the manifold, where ten thousand psychiatric hospitals presented themselves simultaneously to his elevated senses.

"As you notice," said Satan "your popularity has had some fascinating side effects. In particular, a pretty good proportion of psychotics, sometime in their illness, think that they're you. I don't think either of us wants to sit here counting them all, but could we agree on a hundred thousand as a conservative estimate?"

"A hundred thousand psychotics who believe themselves to be Jesus Christ, across the entire scope of world history," agreed Jesus. "Sounds reasonable."

"And it's a pretty strong delusion," the Devil went on. "They'd dismiss the contention that they're not you with barely a second thought. Whatever their reasoning processes are, they seem to be bent in on themselves somehow so that they always affirm the conclusion."

"It's very sad," Jesus said. "I hope my Father in Heaven will have mercy upon them."

"That's not what we're here to talk about," said the Devil. "What I'm really interested in is this - given a randomly chosen person who's absolutely certain he's Jesus, what's the probability that he is, in fact, Jesus?"

"Well," Jesus answered "There are a hundred thousand psychotics who believe themselves to be Jesus, and only one real Jesus. So by Bayes' Theorem, we calculate that believing one's self to be Jesus gives one only about a one in one hundred thousand chance that one is actually Jesus."

"Your reasoning is impeccable," said Satan. "So, what is the probability that you're actually Jesus?"

"What?" asked Jesus.

"You are an individual with a certain amount of evidence that you are Jesus. Specifically, you believe yourself to be him. You have various experiences which your reason tells you are consistent with being Jesus, like memories of your mother Mary and so on, but these seem like the sort of thing a damaged intellect could create to support a delusion. You previously determined that a randomly selected person with the belief that he is Jesus has a 1/100,000 chance of being Jesus and a 99,999/100,000 chance of being a psychotic. So, Mr. Person With The Belief That He Is Jesus, do you think those numbers apply to you?"

Jesus thought for a moment. "I'm not a psychotic," he said. "I think I would know if I were psychotic. I'd have all sorts of symptoms. Hallucinations. Confusion."

"You know what the number one hallucination reported by psychotic patients is?" Satan asked.

Jesus thought for a moment. "What?"

"The Devil," said the Devil.

"Oh, that's just unfair," Jesus told him.

"Usually they report he's trying to tempt them to do self-destructive things. You know, like jump off tall buildings. Remind me what we were doing earlier today?"

"You set that up to confuse me," said Jesus.

"And you mentioned confusion. Tell me, where are we right now?"

"An exceedingly high mountain," Jesus answered.

"Which one, exactly? Because the tallest mountain in Israel is a bit under four thousand feet. That's hardly see-all-the-kingdoms-of-the-world height. Are you even sure what country we're in right now? And, uh, last time I checked I'm almost certain the world was a sphere. So what particular mountain do you think we're on that allows us to see all the kingdoms of the world?"

"Uh, well, there are no kingdoms in the Western Hemisphere at this point in history..." suggested Jesus.

"Wrong!" said Satan. "Zapotecs and Mochica! You don't know where you are, you don't know how you got here, and you don't know how you're seeing what you're seeing."

"You took me here," Jesus countered. "I assume you used some sort of devil-magic or something. I didn't watch where we were going."

"Oh please," said Satan. "Outside View! In general, when someone says the only reason they don't know what country they're in is because the Devil is magically clouding their mind, does that make them more or less likely to be mentally ill?"

"Mrhghn," grumbled Jesus.

"So let's recap. You believe yourself to be Jesus. You admit that you have been seeing the Devil, and that he commands you to jump off buildings, a command you resist only with great difficulty. You don't know where you are or how you got there, and your only weak explanation is that malevolent demons magically transported you there and meddled with your mind so you don't remember it. Using the Outside View, what is the probability that you are even remotely sane?"

"Look," said Jesus. "Could you just tell me what the temptation is already?"

Satan waved his hand, and a syringe materialized within it. "5 mg haloperidol, IM" he told him.

Jesus looked at the Devil. He looked at the syringe. He looked at All The Kingdoms Of The World. He looked back at the Devil. His brow furrowed in thought. He looked at the syringe again.

Then his eyes shone as the Holy Spirit flowed through him. His indecision vanished. "Your lies have no power over me, demon," he told his tormentor.

"Please calm down," said Satan, only now he spoke with the voice of a middle-aged woman. "We're just trying to help you, Mr. Anderson. Please just hold still and let me give you your medication."

"Get thee behind me, Satan!" shouted the Christ, and he pushed the Devil off the mountain. Satan screamed as he plummeted, screamed with a woman's voice, until he vanished from sight in the depths below.

Speaking of, they actually put 3 "Jesus's" in a room. They got along pretty nicely.

That makes sense. I bet they each felt sorry and compassionate for the other two crazy people. ("I hope my Father in Heaven will have mercy upon them.")

>Fig tree represents Israel. You do the math.

My jizz represents you, that doesn't mean you are my spawn.

I have schizophrenia. I've met a lot of schizophrenics through the mental health system. 30% of schizophrenia cases are terminal. Another 30% never get better, but at least they don't waste away, freeze to death on the streets, or kill themselves. Keep in mind that these numbers are with the understanding, treatment, and medications that we have today. There's a reason why Nazis gassed schizophrenics. Antipsychotics hadn't been invented yet, and the disease was progressive and almost untreatable. That is a horrifying prognosis. In the ancient world, most schizophrenia cases were probably much worse than they are today. If Jesus wasn't the Son of God, and wasn't lying, He might have had some form of psychosis or mental illness, but probably not schizophrenia. Also, His culture was different. I think it's projecting a bit to try to label Him a schizophrenic when He lived in a highly religious culture and we live in a culture where all religious belief is frequently called "delusion."

Not really.
They just didn't bring the subject up, or rationalised ways they were all Jesus at the same time and stuff like that.

>schizo says something
Wow that's so deep teach, that was totally a metaphor explaining fundamental truth. Let me write this down. Yo Joe, let me see your essay. What the fuck, how did you get this from what he said, your interpretation is completely different from mine.

So we have all these essays. Yeah. But teach died and he can't grade them. I can't make heads or tails of this. Lets just grade them on how well they match up with each other and seem reasonable to us. Good plan.

>3 gods
Literally no contradiction according to Christians.

Not all schizos talk like that. For example, Unabomber. I'd even say most schizos talk really coherently. Schizotypals are the ones you're thinking about probably.

To what extent do they not? Do you expect each witness to give an identical account?

Do you realize that would be proof of collusion?

Israel. Looking like it should be bearing fruit, since it has a temple, and priests, and animal sacrifices and all going on.

But when you get to the Temple, there's nothing of God there. It's just commerce.

It is cursed for not bearing the fruit of God. Love, Mercy, Justice.

It is destroyed. The Romans carry out the destruction order 38 years later.

...

>implying it isn't the other way around
>implying we aren't telling our generation's prophets that they're insane and drugging them until they no longer hear the voices of the gods

Well we also went through a generation when scientists popped LSD and thought they were talking to ayyliens/ayyngels

Alot of modern cult leaders have had a big amount of followers and were charismatic. They are also batshit crazy.

We know literally nothing about jesus, so there is no way to answer that question

Jesus was an extraterrestrial.

Mediterranean if you consider that white. Sure as hell wasn't black

these people are descended from the original inhabitants of israel from jesus' time and before, they don't marry outsiders or accept converts

>Bible says satan hates you
>Read bible
>Let yourself be beaten and turn the other cheek, give away your money, hate material goods, your sexuality is wrong and you can only approve of this one I'm telling you, a person that is rich as fuck is under God's wrath apparently since they cannot go to heaven now and must inmediately become poor, a person that's having all sorts of kinky and hot sex is also apparently under God's wrath since God hates your happyness.

Oh wait no, the bible was rewritten by satan, if you are a feminine boy, rest assured this is what God has gifted you and may even improve it.

>N-no, you're going against God's will if you do that.

Weren't God's commandment in the heart? My heart sure desires lust, buttfucking, money, drugs, and all sorts of things.

>J-jesus says the heart pours evil

Oh? So jesus contradicts God? Wasn't the christ not here not to change the law but to accomplish it?

>y-you desire sin

First of all kinds you are to prove this is sin by doing a miracle proper of a God that proves you come from the actual christ and the one TRUE GOD.

>tfw read unionized as un-ionized and had no clue what the fuck you were saying for five minutes.

Pchem has become an integral part of my thought processes apparently.

The synoptic problem already raises the problem of collusion by method of adaptation so that's a foregone conclusion anyway.

>witness