ITT: People who should've ran for president

>implying he wouldn't have been more pro southern than Andrew Johnson

>Did the same thing to the South that Confederate heroes were trying to do the north
>just better at it

lol, cry some more

Sherman had an interesting upbringing.

Was from a huge family, second eldest boy. His father was well off and an important lawyer or something, but he died when William was still a child. His mother was left with this huge house of little children to raise, and she had huge amount of trouble doing so. The two older boys, William and his older brother, ended up being fostered by a family down the street- these were the Ewings, a HUGE political family. They had known and admired the father, so they raised the two boys up as if they were their own. The elder brother, now essentially adopted into this political family, ended up becoming a senator. The second oldest boy, William, did what second sons often did in very important families, and was sent off to school at West Point and became an officer.

Commissions were strange in this era. In order to become an officer your commission required a bill by Congress itself. Back in Great Britain if you were born into a noble family, it meant you could become an officer. It led to a lot of really incompetent officers over the years. The U.S. thought it was more populist because anybody could, theoretically, become an officer. Yet it was still an incredibly corrupt system where if you had powerful connections, or enough money to bribe, you could get any rank you wanted, regardless of connections. So Sherman had all the connections he needed, but thankfully he had the proper training at West Point, and was very skilled as an officer.

Still, even when officers were in the field, during the war itself, it was a very political job. There are all sorts of people trying to stab your back, steal your command, journalists trying to ruin your reputation back in Washington, even if you're hundreds of miles away. And the higher the rank is, the more political it gets. All that shit about Grant being a drunk, for example, was just tabloid journalism. So yeah, he got sick of the game.

It most certainly isn't

>>Did the same thing to the South that Confederate heroes were trying to do the north
'no'
the CSA made ONE incursion into the north

the rest was always the north attacking the south

sorry you can't justify yourself

so this guy walks in late war after the south has expended all it's best men and resources in a series of humiliating victories over the north just in time to commit war crimes, and we're meant to praise him?

"it's not bad when i do it"

why are northerners such children?

“You and I…must consider its effect on the country [i.e. the Confederacy] as a whole. Already it is demoralized by the four years of war. If I took your advice, the men would be without rations and under no control of officers. They would be compelled to rob and steal in order to live. They would become mere bands of marauders, and the enemy’s cavalry would pursue them and overrun many sections they may never have occasion to visit. We would bring on a state of affairs it would take the country years to recover from. And, as for myself, you young fellows might go bushwhacking, but the only dignified course for me would be to go to General Grant and surrender myself and take the consequences of my acts.”
t: Lee

youtube.com/watch?v=A5ra9cXx1-o
youtube.com/watch?v=A5ra9cXx1-o
youtube.com/watch?v=A5ra9cXx1-o

A man who never won a battle and had a mental breakdown should be president? No thanks.

>being this mad

ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON
ALEXANDER HAMILTON
>ALEXANDER HAMILTON

Still would have beat Johnson.

yep

Burr should have done it earlier

say that to my face not online and see what fucking happens

he actually said in the Federalist papers that foreign-born individuals should never run for president
guess where Alexanded Hamilton was born
the man had enough integrity to follow his own rules, and that's enough for me

Why the fuck do Yankees worship this insufferable cunt.
Is it because hes literally one of the only somewhat competent generals the North had at their disposal.
Or do they just rejoice at the destruction of history and private property.

I mean, not like any other of the founders were born in the US...
:^)

But Hamilton wasn't even born in what would become the US.

the devil and this guy

Two-time SoS and had a shitload of support among the elites. The funny thing is Zachary Taylor offered to make him VP, so if he took it he would've been the pres.

oops i forgot this guy ran for president during that clusterfuck election when four whigs ran

Changing my vote to this Blackjack Pershing. Beloved war hero who would've made a much better president than Harding.

>Denying the state's right to kill civilians
Why Southerners want to limit civil liberties and state's rights?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryland_Campaign
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gettysburg_Campaign
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan's_Raid
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price's_Raid
A half dozen raids in Pro-Union Tennessee by en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Bedford_Forrest
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_Heartland_Offensive

Some of these are borderline (it depends on how you consider the border states really), but the South never had any pretense of staying out of the "North." Now, Southerners who marched North were arguably much, MUCH more considerate of private property and the locals, but the South certainly had more than one incursion of Northern territory.

I'm not even really a big fan of the Union but you're statement is retarded.

Whether you agree with Sherman's tactics on a personal level or not, he really embodies the North's love of efficiency and is a very human realization of retaliation for against the South for starting a war that the North didn't actually want to fight.

>The elder brother, now essentially adopted into this political family, ended up becoming a senator.
I think you're confusing him with John Sherman who was William's younger brother and one of the most prominent/important political figures of the latter half of the century.

>the man who should have been president

>shit pussies say
Jackson4Life

Nope.

The made three major incursions into the North and got their asses handed to them every time.

But I'm not talking about major incursions, but raids. The kind of thing Nathaniel Bedford Forrest was popular for. Flanking around the enemy, attacking their supply lines, interferring with the offensive but not putting up a real fight.

Sherman wanted a confrontation with Hood. Instead Hood kept running from Sherman's army and kept trying to attack his supply lines.

Sherman got fed up with chasing him, so instead he went and attacked Hood's supply lines, which happened to be the Deep South. When Hood finally did make a stand he got his shit pushed in, AND Sherman tore the shit out of the Confederacy's supply chain.

>People who should've ran for president
Patton

>Sherman wank

He was murdered to ensure that never happened.

You have a very broad way of looking at things to consider the CSA's incursions into the North as getting "their asses handed to them".

>user re posts an image I made in some other civil war thread
I... I'm not sure how to feel about this.

Sherman isn't in any of those. That image is just a collage of Grant failing.

Sherman is a bigger fuck up all the same. Name a single major battle against an equivalent or superior army that Sherman prevailed against. There isn't a single one of those.

He razed cities.

He didn't win any actual battles on the basis of generalship, tactics, or combat maneuvering. He's a fucking joke.

>1861
>1862
>1863
>failings of Grant

2badass4life

Sherman's corp at Shiloh got fucking ass blasted early on though. It wasn't really Sherman's fault desu, the Rebs basically stormed over his camp while him and his men were still half asleep. Sherman would also manage to recover the camp on the Second day too, so it wasn't really a huge loss.

Crockett > Jackson

...

>retaliation for against the South for starting a war that the North didn't actually want to fight
holy shit, is this actually what Northerners believe? Even when it's to forcefully stop someone's attempt and leaving, it's always them under attack.

>The made three major incursions
>But I'm not talking about major incursions, but raids
then they're not major incursions

Could Johnston have held Sherman's March to the Sea back until after the election? I know Johnston was cautious, but he couldn't have done worse than Hood.

The South fired on Fort Sumter.

They literally shot first. You can't claim a war is self defense if you fire the first motherfucking shot.

We can endlessly discuss Lincoln and Cameron's political maneuvering or how they forced the South into action, but it doesn't matter, because at the end of the day the South literally started the war.

Prior to Sumter, opinion in the North toward secession was basically, "meh, good riddance." It wasn't until after Sumter that the North decided to launch an all out fight for Union, firing on Fort Sumter may have brought all the South into the Confederacy, but it also united the North behind a common goal and started the war. With how public opinion was in the North both before and during the war, if the cotton states had peacefully seceded and held proper referendums, it's highly likely the political elite in the North would literally not have given too shits about forceably keeping the South in the Union.

Ironically, the South literally shot their own cause in the foot by attacking Sumter because of "muh sovereign ground." If the Confederate government had waited one more day, it's highly likely Sumter would have been abandoned and no war would have happened, and the deep South could have peacefully gone on to become it's own independent third world shithole.

So yes, Northerners felt like they had been attacked. They didn't sacrifice 400k and millions of dollars because they particularly cared about the independence of the Southern states, they did it because they wanted to ensure that the South's attack on their government would be punished with by the complete and utter destruction of the Southern way of life and economic practices.

And this is coming from someone who sympathizes far more with the South.

whereas most folk would simply be mad that their position was destroyed, im going to instead thank you for teaching me further and giving me a better perspective on the events that happened.

so, thank you, i see clearer now.

Read McPhearson's Battlecry of Freedom if you want an excellent (but still easily understandable) overview of the huge clusterfuck that was antebellum politics and the lead up to the Civil War itself. The whole book is great, but specifically McPhearson pays more attention to things like civilian opinion and background economics than other books on the Civil War.

It's where most of my understanding of the actual causes of the war comes from, and McPhearson's book makes a pretty good case for Sumter drastically changing the North's reaction to secession.

As more disclosure than anything else, I actually feel that a properly held secession referendum was and still should be legal for any state that wishes to leave the Union. I think the South (despite the fact that I disagree with slave holding on personal level) had every right to leave the Union peacefully, but firing on Fort Sumter (and I would also agree with anyone who points out that Lincoln basically played the shit out of the South in political terms here) was not a proper response to it's occupation.

i like types like you. ill try and go ahead and read that book.

Wasn't Van Buren Dutch?

dat sexy Sherman, I need a poster

Thank god

>it's highly likely Sumter would have been abandoned and no war would have happened, and the deep South could have peacefully gone on
>yankees actually believe this

>mcphearson

yeah the guy who spent 900 pages rambling on about muh lincoln and never once mentioned the Corwin Amendment. He's a hack.

t. Daniel Walker Howe

>is tactically at fault
>is strategically at fault
>was in command
>has the burden of leading and organizing his forces
>fucks up completely
>"It wasn't his fault"

Reminder that Sumter had literally been sold to the US government decades before secession and was not part of any southern state