I noticed that this board has a visceral distaste for Turkey and the Turkish people, why?
There is no way you can deny that the Ottoman Empire was a formidable Empire built on the intellect and prowess of the Turkish people.
Are you judging them by today's Turkey? If so, how come Veeky Forums still likes China and Greece, despite their relatively despondent modern statuses?
Ottoman Empire thread
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>I noticed that this board has a visceral distaste for Turkey and the Turkish people, why?
Literally every country that has interacted with them in the past hates them.
And they regions they controlled are less developed than the surrounding ones.
>t*rkroaches
Turkey's parasitic, unhealthy and imperialistic relationship with the EU
Turkey's parasitic, unhealthy and imperialistic relationship with Europe historically
No country has positively interacted with the Mongolians in their conquests and they were basically the USSR's pet dog for a while. Cant the same like I said be applied to Greece or China or Germany
In statesmanship almost every country cares by a longshot the most their own interests, just Turkey is more confrontational because the EU is more close knit with each other than it so it must take a stand the same way Russia does
France, Germany and Russia have all been parasitic and imperialistic towards mainland Europe, no
Memes mostly.
Not even kidding, I'm pretty convinced most people who dislike Turkey and the Ottomans do so because of the remove kebab and t*rkroach memes, which were born from the Serbia Strong meme.
The French, Germans and Russians can't lay claim to striking the final blow to a Kingdom/State/Empire that lasted 2000 years and is the is the bedrock for most of Western Civilisation, although the Germans certainly came close.
Historical relationships aside, It's important to remember that Europe is "pretty much" over It's old feuds. If we ignore the last two years in which the rest of Europe has come to hate Germany again, It's pretty safe to say Europe is on good terms with Germany even though they started the largest War humanity has ever seen and were the largest player in another war 20 years earlier which was also in the top 10. Europe is far more closer with each other and isn't going to get at each other throats for the foreseeable future, even If the friendships have turned sour recently. The difference between those and Turkey is that Turkey is still seen as a 'threat' to Europe, Russia is too and that's why you see a lot of people hate Russia aswell (less so on Veeky Forums, but a lot of other people hate Russia)
Sort of this, the hate is exaggerated through memes but don't pretend for a minute that Europeans actually like Turkey. Turkey is distinctly not European, and many Europeans dislike that Turkey wants to get closer with the EU.
Because Muslims. That's pretty much it. It's not so much about "the empire was bad to people", it's about "those muslims were bad to muh christians" and also "muh cosntantinople".
Turkey is a continuation of Ancient Rome
In all honesty, it's the smell.
T*rks are unanimously despised creatures. They're vile and treacherous, deceptive and gruesome.
I think people would be interested in it, in as far as people do like to learn about 'exotic empires', but I think people right now are sick of hearing about the middle east and islam for political reasons.
Islam doesn't seem so exotic after a terrorist attack, or when you can hear the muslim call to prayer from your northern england flat.
Im 6'8 (203 cm) and 120kg pretty fit and a drunk 150 cm manlet turk wanted to mug me in germany at 6am in a trainstation, (but after seeing that im not a pussy german but an eastern europen guy and seeing the handle of my.knife he went away) btw i cant speak german for shit, so natural dislike comes towards turk for me
But they kill kurds who i hate a lot, so i like turks too
Also they make some good electronics, kitchenware, firearms so we can say that they contribute something to society unlike kurds
Marry me? Not a girl btw.
No thanks
you STILL haven't released bannerlord yet
oh yeah and you still hold Asia Minor and Constantinople
fucking turks
Lots of Christposters who don't want to talk about history still mad about Constantinople.
You're welcome for the spices, jackass.
Because the board is filled with people from the blakans, because their autism leads them to be interested in history.
Eastern Europe, the Balkans, and Turkey should all just sink into a new ocean.
Turks aren't humans.
I hate German bogniggers too.
Really all you really need to tell why Turks are scum still is remind Cyprus happened.
triggered
>I noticed that this board has a visceral distaste for Turkey and the Turkish people, why?
Because of posts just like yours. The Turks basically just did a smash-and-grab of Hellenic culture while contributing virtually nothing to Europe for thousands of years besides invasions and occupations and yet have the sheer gall to insist that they're totally white and European and that they deserve to be part of the cool kids club while at the same fucking time directly funding terrorism ad deliberately shipping terrorists to Europe as a form of psychological and economic warfare - and considering that something similar has been the MO ever since Islam set up shop there, that's really all you need to know about them and find their opinions of themselves disgusting if not plain offensive.
You're a bunch of arrogant goddamn cockroaches with the unwarranted self-respect and delusion levels of Korean nationalists but are even slimier and ready to stab anyone who doesn't give you what you want in the back.
>Modern-day Egypt is a continuation of the New Kingdom
>smash-and-grab of Hellenic culture while contributing virtually nothing to Europe for thousands of years
stopped reading there, why even bother posting on the history board if you know nothing about history?
To be fair. Because they are turks and muslim, and being major twats to many countries that many of our fellow shitposters come from. Simply.
They are just trash
What the fuck are you retarded or something?
Stay deluded, son of murderers.
>oh look, their french allies liked their clothes for a while;
>It was fashionable for rich people to import luxury goods from Turkey to show off to their visitors how much money they had
Wew. Truly, Europeans would all still be mud-flinging peasants a la Monty Python if it hadn't been for the heroic contributions of Turkey to the fabric of western civilization.
Because Islam is the real life version of Chaos from Warhammer
Not him but while Turkey was still clashing with the Timurids, Europe was already in the renaissance. Turkey did make many contributions, however this level of wewuz doesn't help your argument.
so turkey protected Europe from genhis khan 2.0 and as reward, you call them roaches?
Islam is the fifth horseman of the apocalypse
Take an ideology that at its core is about conquest of the west, then have much of the west hate itself so much it willingly imports people that espouse it
It's not just that Muslims are savages - plenty of people are savages. It's that we're being murdered by Muslims who are being brought here by our fellow countrymen.
>protected
steppe tribes fighting as they've always done
if you'd call the occupation of all the balkans up to Vienna protecting Europe also then sure I guess
>if you'd call the occupation of all the balkans up to Vienna protecting Europe also then sure I guess
that was some power play between two european powers.
European do it all the time
...
I just love the byzantine empire and the ottomans and fucking venetians destroyed it
But Turks aren't Europeans
ur mum arent europeans lmao
>two european powers.
Aaaaand there it is.
>WE
was byzantine empire european?
if yes, then so are turks
>I noticed that this board has a visceral distaste for Turkey and the Turkish people, why?
Culturally displaced empire. They belong somewhere in Arabia, yet they ended up in Asia minor (quasi Europe) and Europe. They are just misfits.
And they were the only empire ever to never produce a scientist, mathematician, musician, or any other person of significance.
Are you implaying that Turks = Byzantine?
pic related
>Was the Iroquois League Native American?
>If yes, then so were the Pilgrims
Are you sure that's the line of reasoning you want to follow, my dear T*rkroach?
1. The Stormfags on this board get extremely triggered that a non-European, Muslim empire was able to become so powerful and capable of BTFOing Europe for a few centuries.
2. Turkey nowadays is an absolute shitshow that is actively making the world worse with it's policies and rapid Islamisation under Erdogan.
Why the fuck would anyone like the ottoman empire just because they were powerful? They occupied rightful roman land for centuries and still do, they tried terrorize and conquer europe and now their successor state is rapidly turning into an islamist shithole.
Fuck off turk, the world will be better when most of you are dead.
>implying it's only stormfags who hate the cancer that is the turkish nation.
True, it's only Balkanites who do.
Balkanites, poles, austrians, lots of people and for very good reason.
Oh man it seems that this thread is filled with underage faggots.
Also to the people saying shit like they no culture , they had you just don't know it because everyone concentrates on european cultural achievements.
An yes they were european as a large part of the empire's population and leadership became european over time.
turks are alright desu
t.baguette
pole here, the ottomans was the only one recognizing polish severeignity during the partitions , we should have allied with them instead of the eternal germanics
>An yes they were european as a large part of the empire's population and leadership became european over time.
WE
Try to give arguments against then faggot.
Okay autismo
I respect their efforts in exploring refined sexual tastes
we attract autismo's with ebin turkroach memes.There is also some butthurt among the cucked nations
thats pretty much it.
I like how this pic was made by some Russian living in a shitty commie bloc in a shitty city in a shitty country. Well, whatever gets his through his life, I guess.
REMOVE KEBAB
Sure, im sure you are rich like a sandnigger oil king
Success breeds jealousy :^)
Shut the fuck up algerian, you don't belong in france.
Yeah so all of europe can be an islamist shithole like a large part of the middle east is now, let''s spread the shit around and cover everything in it.
Epik mah friend, simply epik.
Seriously though, fuck the turks, they belong on the steppes of asia somewhere, not occupying land that should by rights belong to the greeks and armenians.
Because they were a degenerate empire
>The French, Germans and Russians can't lay claim to striking the final blow to a Kingdom/State/Empire that lasted 2000 years and is the is the bedrock for most of Western Civilisation, although the Germans certainly came close.
Pretending that the rump Byzantine Empire in the 15th century literally embodied Rome and its entire legacy is fucking ludicrous. In a political sense it continued to be the (Eastern) Empire but they hadn't symbolized Rome to most European Christians, and even themselves, in a long while. Not to mention the fact that it had been steadily stagnating since Justinian times compared to the far more dynamic Latin and Muslim civilisations that were surrounding it.
The fall of Constantinople was shocking, but not because it ended 'Roman civilisation' and its accomplishments in the eyes of most. Mostly some romanticists from Orthodox backgrounds tend to assert that point of view these days.
People caught up in petty squables of nations.
False equivalency
However they do enjoy funding terrorists but hey its their border why do I care
Underrated post, should have only added the historical butthurt folk that ottocucks subjugated, case in point
you seems frustated there my friend, calm down, let it go
>
>The French, Germans and Russians can't lay claim to striking the final blow to a Kingdom/State/Empire that lasted 2000 years and is the is the bedrock for most of Western Civilisation, although the Germans certainly came close.
Full fucking retard Byantine fanboy shit. I have nothing agains Germans or Turks but to declare that the fall of the Byzantines is more historically significant than the fall of Rome proper is obviously bullshit. The Ottomans didn't fucking topple Byzantine and send it back 500 years, they annexed it.
The real answer is Islam, people here hate the Turks because they are Muslim, and they made a Christian empire become Muslim.
I will grant that Islam as an ideology is as laughable as any other faith but as far as the cruelty of empires go the Ottomans barely crack the top fucking ten.
They are a clear example the Islamic world is one constantly on the offense.
They were the suzerains of pirates who were responsible for enslaving a massive number of whites.
But they have no historical guilt whatsoever and not a single liberal will try and shad an unfavorable light unto them because "muh islamophobia".
Nope, I'm an atheist turk, people hate me the same. There is actually a conservative turks saying that I love very very much. I'm paraphrasing but it goes something like this
"Even if we converted all mosques to churches, all minerates to bell towers, and praised Jesus contentiously, we will still be seen as a foreign, alien entity out to get them"
I would say he is right.
Do spaniards feel guilty for paying bucaneers to raid british ships in caribbean? I'm not saying this as whataboutism but Some posters itt are right. European on european violence is okay but if a non european does the same they get really really triggered.
pretty sure turks intermixed with byzantinians
also, had ottoman taken orthodox faith, you would have no qualm calling them europeans
You talk about Europe as if it was a country or unified culture. They were even more divided then, than nowadays and the Ottomans were just another powerhouse in the region.
I have a bone to pick work modern Turkey because it was built on the genocide and expulsion of non-Turks, but the Ottoman Empire was based
British and French greed in WW1, when they dissembled the empire and claimed its provinces for themselves, is one of the biggest mistakes in human history.
To give t*rks credit, all nation states are build on genocide at worst or expulsion at best in one way or the other. Take a look at the albanian population of athens when greeks got their independence.
they literaly achieved nothing but turning all the areas they ruled into backwards shitholes, even anatolia is mostly a passive region, even during the empire, compared to venice, austria or even russia they were basicaly a regressive military despotism with lots of vibrant multi-kulti trite and bling heaped around it, the only reason they even lasted so long after suleiman was they were by then 'too big to fail', so insted they just slowly decomposed for four hundred years, to the general misfortune of its unlucky inhabitants
in the meanwhile other people in europe printed books and wenth trough reforms and revolutions, though up new ways of understanding reality and developed science and technology, industry, trans oceanic trade and colonisation, everything developed in leaps century after century, everywhere except in those parts of europe under ottomans, there people remained practicaly illiterate, stuck in somekind of constant rerun of the 16th century
it was quite literaly like some p.k.dick nightmare, like on one side of the river 19th century europe was going on, while on the other people still dressed like its 1529 and got impaled on pikes and hooks in public
True but do not underestimate the westernization attempts of some sense able sultans who not only prolonged the empire but also paved the way to the modern republic.
Piss off, you ugly and smelly barbarian. You reek of dead innocents and desecrated nations.
>You reek of dead innocents and desecrated nations
proof turks are roman
Because Turks attitudes are generally fucked. Pic related.
Anecdotal: I run a small business renting apartments to tourists. Among the five worst I've experienced was a family of Turks. First, they were physically offensive -- all of them (mama, papa, two adult sons) were obese and stank to high heaven. I mean, like several-day-old bacterial funk, not fresh sweat.
Not the most gracious attitudes, but that's not a real problem. It's fairly normal for tourists who don't originate from Scandinavia/Germany/Netherlands/UK.
So, I'm showing the room, explaining to them clearly (and they did understand English) that if they need more towels, toilet paper, ANYTHING, just call and we're minutes away.
So the dumbfucks left a review on booking about how shit was dirty (though it was immaculate when they moved in), not enough towels, and several other forms of bullshit.
Never had a positive experience with Turkish guests.
Also: fucking ultra-nationalist genocidal maniacs with no cultural conscience -- with nothing in to be particularly proud of, lots to be ashamed of.
Argumentative/negative post here, I know, but you asked.
every time some sultan tried pushing any reforms they either got themselves into civil war or the reforms were mostly all torn down and discarded a generation later
this was mostly down to how it was actualy organised, the sultanate being more of a umbrella institution with lots of semi-separate military and bureaucratic bodies growing under it, and these rejected reform as a matter of survival
as a whole the ottoman empire showed a systemic tendency to be as reactive and regressive as it can possibly afford to be
>You talk about Europe as if it was a country or unified culture.
no I don't, what the Balkans were was Christian though - Christian lands being eaten up by a Muslim powerhouse
making it a clash of ideologies as well as a clash just between countries
You talk about European countries during the 15th century as though they hadn't drawn up the differences between themselves and Muslims
you mean a clash of religions?
Sorry italian bro, I wish they had better manners. At least we still don't have the reputation of chinese.
The imagery is very accurate. But its a two way street, Everyone hates turks and turks hate everyone. Everyone is out to get Turks and gib constantinopol , return to mongolia rhetoric does not help it that much.
"An ideology is a set of opinions or beliefs of a group or an individual."
???
so basicaly they themselves hate everybody
>Turkey wants to get closer with the EU.
I DISAGREE. Turks generally hate the EU and all of its member states. Even the government has done its fair share of alienation, particularly under Erdogan. Though their harboring of zillions of the migrants in the recent crisis does count for something positive.
Meh, in france and what is today germany, christians butchered other christians for belonging to the wrong religion. The "we are all christian" meme is a very recent invention.
The hatred was so strong that there is an orthodox proverb that states turks are better than catholics.
Oh really? the turks built a civilization rather then piggy backing off the achievements of others?
Hmm, no that sounds like bullshit. Get the fuck back to the steppes mehmet, you and your 15 or so cousins have been stinking up the place for faaaarrrrr too long.
We make desert and call it peace, just like Romans
>Get the fuck back to the steppes mehmet
Make me mr bitter diasporan who lives in west.
>The "we are all christian" meme is a very recent invention.
you don't do people in the past favor by acting like they were all retards who couldn't understand that ideologies on a completely different branch to their own didn't care about the twigs on their own branch
Byzantine Emperors frequently used their own Heretics as buffers between themselves and other peoples with other ideologies
like the Bogomils they put to oppose 'Scyths' coming across the Danube
is Mexico and Brazil native american?
How the fuck did/does the government stay in power when they're making all sorts of deals with the west? Do they frame it as some sort of necessary evil or do Turks write their government a blank check on foreign policy?
Second, but I would say that turkey is basically a satallite state of USA ever since Turkey pissed off stalin in WWII and begged USA to save them. However I do believe that NATO-EU is not compatible with turks, In mentality, in closeness etc. We should have alligned ourselves with russia-based assad-iran rather than west