Do you have a question about a Japanese visual novel or a translation of it?
/vn/ is ready to answer it. We are not them.
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Last thread:
>tfw western artists can't emulate eastern style
A pity bump before I go to sleep.
Pretty sure that's bullshit, if I posted Danganronpa art you'd say it'd Deviantart tier. Reality it's about skill not nationality.
nobody can replicate chen either
Bumping bred
Who's ready to be disappointed by Highway Blossoms?
Considering all the different styles of "eastern" there are, including stuff that wouldn't look out of place in your standard Sunday Morning Funnies section, you're fulla shit, mate.
It's kinetic. How do you even get hyped for that? I mean, is there even a good kinetic VN out there?
if you're including jvns, remember11 is actually a very good example
it's not quite kinetic but it's close enough to be comparable
how bout higurashi/umineko? Though they're a completely different genre that wouldn't have been able to be boring if it tried. And have a long-ass chapters. And a shitton of cool characters.
Can't tell if this is a serious question or not.
Oh, and considering the main appeal of romantic games is being able to pick your partner/develop relationships with them through choices, making your romance VN kinetic is, well, pretty unusual.
Whenever I hear a KN dev (someone who is SOLELY a KN dev) talk about their work, they're always talking in terms of Their Vision. "You don't understand, man. This is my Vision. This is how I See The Story. You're here to experience My World. If I gave you choices, the story couldn't work!"
And then they give me a fucking slide show. Do something with the medium? Why? You just need pictures with lip flap, boobs, some royalty-free music, and some pretentious writing, right?
You're not fucking auteurs. You're just too lazy to make a movie or animation.
>Put artificial choices in your linear story or I'll whine nonstop on Veeky Forums about muh branching paths.
For me, it doesn't even have to be choices as long as it's not a fucking slide show. Do SOMETHING with the medium other than partial animation, text, and music. Hidden object games have more of interest for me than a KN because I can interact with the world somehow. Learn from adventure games. WE CAME FROM ADVENTURE GAMES. Learn your roots, whippersnappers. Fuck with my mind a little. Immerse me in your world. Do something other than just have souless animu waifus lip flap at me while spilling your Message like spaghetti on the floor.
Sounds like a case of stop liking what I don't like.
Some of the best VNs ever made were linear with no or almost no choices.
Okay - we'll agree to disagree. I don't think KNs are doing enough. You think they're the greatest. No room for compromise there.
You seem to have this weird idea that to be good or interesting something must be intractable or offer choices in some way. Never read a good novel, have you? It should be about the story, the world, the characters, and how they are represented. Not whether you can choose between left or right, up or down, red or brown occasionally.
That's not what you think based on what you've said. Your opinion is you're tired of western devs making KVNs. You don't think English KVNS aren't doing enough.
EVNs in general are still growing, you sound like every other idiot commentator who has never played much JVNs but wants to insist what devs must do to appease specifically you. You sound exactly like JP. It doesn't fucking matter what western devs do because the medium is still growing, budgets is honestly 100x lower right now than what it should be to produce a VN on the level of a JVN right now. So until that happens stop being the fucking anchor dragging EVNs down with your misguided opinions & hot takes.
I'm not that user, but reading a book is not at all like reading a VN (unless it's presented as a book with no "game" objects like sprites, sounds, is arranged in a NVL format etc).
There was an article on gamasutra I think about the need to break up the routine in any video game (including VNs), and choices and interactivity segments accomplish that. (the deal was something like the intensity of stimuli in vidya is much greater than when you're reading words on paper/watching a movie etc. and the brain needs it to be broken up in smaller chunks or have a breather every now and again).
There's also the issue of price relative to content available, if you price your KN like a book on kindle I'll have 0 complaints.
>Video games
>Including VNs
Into the trash it goes.
kys desu
Reminder: this is the kind of autist you're enabling by adding meaningless choices on a work you were planning as a straight line.
If you don't feel your story requires choices, just don't do it. You're distracting your readers from what matters by pandering instead of just telling an entertaining story. If it sounds interesting enough without branching, go for it.
Oh, if my opinion doesn't match yours, I'm not allowed to have it?
For the record, none of my argument has a damn thing to do with budget or even art style. There is more than one person talking here about not enjoying KNs. Maybe you're talking to them.
My self esteem. It is shattered. I've been called an autist on Veeky Forums. You must really mean it.
I don't give a fuck if someone wants to make a linear game. I've played many story rich linear games and enjoyed them. I actively dislike meaningless choices. If you do that, there's a good chance you're fucking your game up. If you want a linear game experience, that's fine. Make that game. I'm not stopping you. I'm just saying that an anime slide show is not what I, personally, look for. I think KNs can be something more interesting than a slide show, is all.
I had a great time reading sea cats for a while. I still think it's completely up to how the story is told, and how interesting the world and characters are. I think interactivity is absolutely not necessary. Then again, I'm a bit on the older side, so maybe the younger audiences of today are of a completely different mindset. To me it doesn't matter if I can click anything other than the 'next' really as long as the story is compelling. If the story is bad, clicky stuff won't save it in my eyes.
>KVNs are shit, stop making KVNs!
>But that's stupid
>It's just my opinion man!
Naw, if you don't like KVNs than don't play them. Don't tell us what we can or can't make. You're completely allowed to have your terrible opinion.
You're just an asshole and literally no one cares. Please stop shitting up the thread.
Apologies to Jake, but I think this is worth linking: twitter.com
To add my own two cents, kinetic novels have no more gameplay than comic books, so it's not really acurate to label them viyda. Even calling a choice-system gameplay is a bit of a stretch. Choices usually serve to immerse the reader into a world and increse their investment, but rarely to entertain or challenge.
>There was an article on gamasutra I think about the need to break up the routine in any video game
This can be my problem with pure KNs. I get restless and have to take breaks a lot. It's not that I don't like reading, it's the format.
I don't hate them (though they're not really games) but it's hard to stay focused.
And yes, sometimes a fairly artificial interactivity can mitigate that. See 'Magical Eyes'. There's no story branching at all, but there's a good bit of sleight-of-hand to make you feel like you're DOING something to get to the outcome.
I'm not saying every game should try to pull those tricks, of course, just that you can try to jazz up a linear story if you want to.
>mfw trying to keep thread active by starting discussion
>no discussion, only flames and closing the topic
>can't have discussion on other forums because topic too sensitive, apparently
>ok
>starting discussion
>YOU'RE SHIT IF YOU DON'T DO THIS THING I LIKE
Let's just hope you're an artist or something doing assets and not in charge of communicating verbally, for everyone's sake.
>can't be bothered to read the thread and reply to the sensible posts right above me
>will just whine instead
Just how many people do you think are involved in this discussion? (Hint: more than two or three.)
Some people are turning off their brains whenever you say 'anime slide show' because this is too often used as mindless bashing of VNs, so using it makes them think you don't have any real argument and are just being a shit.
The other problem, of course, is that most linear stories in videogames are surrounded by GAMEPLAY, and most evn developers couldn't code gameplay if their lives depended on it. And if they did, they'd suddenly face 'not a VN' and getting kicked out of the club.
Only my Waifu can tell me what to do.
>Ask an innocent question
>It inevitably turns into shit.
Well... fuck.
Can't we just talk about what makes a good vn?
Would like to hear more thoughts from these people, if they're still around. Probably won't be able to reply until tonight, but will look forward to reading.
Some questions: what did Magical Eyes do? (Spoilers fine.)
Do you care that your game is labeled a "VN"?
Why do you feel choices don't usually challenge or entertain? (This is the one I really hope gets responded to, if nothing else.)
>what makes a good vn
not being a boring slideshow :^)
Good writing. If the writing or story is better because you couldn't/didn't want find any place where exploring the "what-ifs" would work, then good for you, but a big appeal of vns is exploring those "what ifs".
I'd say it's harder to write a good KVN than a branching one, simply because it's harder to be engaging to the reader when the reader isn't able to engage in the story in any way. Reading speeds in KVNs are also a lot slower than a normal book, so there has to be something to keep the player/reader from becoming bored.
Just my 2c
Is this the worst text box of all time?
> kickstarter.com
$40,000 with three days left
Why aren't you a succesful businessman like AJTilley yet?
>what did Magical Eyes do?
First, it's a 'mystery' game, so as you go along you're collecting keywords and shit, and then every so often there are little quizzes where the player is meant to demonstrate that they understand the story so far, by filling in questions with those keywords. (In this particular case, getting the questions right also unlocks some bonus scenes, iirc.)
It's just a little quiz, not real gameplay like danganronpa, although you could insert something like that there if you wanted.
Second, between scenes you use a map screen to find the location for the next scene, and to choose between going straight to the next 'main' plot scene or looking at an optional scene first. It's a tiny interruption in the process of reading that makes you do a little something else.
Both of these things sound like busywork if handled poorly, but handled well they can keep the player 'active'.
Kinetic novels are digital plays.
To be fair it's not just one game that they're making. I'm not at all surprised with the results. Though I'm shocked with the number of people with such shit taste in art.
It's up there along with worst character design
Can't comment on Magical Eyes, I'm afraid I'm not familiar.
It bugs me a little when my VN is labelled a game, but it's not something I lose sleep over.
Its not that choices CAN'T entertain or challenge. Off the top of my head, Undertale provides a few choices which really are just for laughs (Anime is real, right?). Phoenix Wright is an example of challenging the player to think in order to solve each trial, with a light penalty for failure. In the case of Phoenix Wright, the clear establishment of a win condition and a failure state is what pushes it more toward the game side of the spectrum.
In Dating Sims,choices such as "tell her you stole her pen" or "lie to her face" don't automatically present a win/loss state. It could be argued that an ending where your partner leaves you isn't a bad ending, but a permutation of the story that is no less valid than a happy ending. That is also a choice which isn't "gamelike," in that making the choice isn't necessarily fun. As another example, a choice such as "Shoot your girlfriend" or "Shoot your mother" isn't fun (unless you are a sad person) - it's to make the reader think about those actions, and to explore the ethics behind them.
Basically, there are VNs which lean more toward being video games, but not every VN includes the elements I'd say define vidya (challenges of knowledge, skill, and/or luck, with a win and/or failure state).
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The H patch for Highway Blossoms was delayed by "a day or so", so now I can wait to play it later.
The top of her head is missing.
Your assertion is both logically valid and consistent, but you are forgetting the existence of communist China.
This takes same face syndrome to a whole new level
what the fuck? i can't stop laughing at this. it gets worse the longer i look
10
Same body syndrome.
Quality!
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again
If you decide to make terrible jokes in your game features, please at least have some of the facts in there. I'm going to be passing on Highway Blossoms because I cannot gather any sort of actual information such as estimated length or content on it.
Also small white font on a yellow background should be a criminal offense as a game designer.
Wow, I didn't realise until now that they put that jokey shit in the steam description. That's fine to do in one random blog post when the real information is available elsewhere, but very unhelpful to someone who's not heard of the game before...
Since I am on the complain train and /evn/ is ded, it is also kind of scumbaggy to put your own "user-defined tags" such as "cute", "great soundtrack", and "story rich" before the game is even released. I'm half-expecting to see self reviews next...
is anyone actually buying it?
I don't have control of the Steam page, but I'll see if we can't try and put some legit info in there. The game is rather straightforward though.
Don't think that was us. We had several people play test it beforehand, and some of the tags seem like terminology they would use.
I specifically think it's shit to put 'great soundtrack' in the tags as a dev because it's a value judgment. Other tags I don't think are necessarily so bad. 'Visual Novel' is itself a user-tag, not a defined genre.
>Don't think that was us.
It was. It pretty much had to be. Actual user tags have to reach a critical threshold before they'll display on the steam page, one that is EXTREMELY unlikely to be reached from beta-testers, whereas tags added by the development team before launch are automatically displayed.
I mean, if you had 20 beta testers and ordered them _all_ to use those specific tags you might get them in through testers, but otherwise no.
(which is not to say you didn't have 20 testers, but 20 testers who are all willing to use the tagging system and tag the exact tags you tell them to, because they'd all have to do it without fail...)
I see. I'll ask around and see who tagged them.
WITH YOUR FEET IN THE AIR AND YOUR HEAD ON THE GROUND
The discussion page for the game estimates at least 4 hours of reading time. And the story of the game is really self explanatory. It's a slice of life yuri road trip with a treasure hunt, Americana, and some comedy thrown in. It's also kinetic, so you're there for the story.
What dank meme is this?
Highway Blossoms is now out.
guys stop dying
Torrent where?
Fuck you
mega link where?
Yes, please. Since I fixed my sleep pattern and can't shitbump the thread through the night, you fuckers have died at least 4 times.
I am beginning to think I cannot trust these writers to produce anything worthwhile.
Beginning?
Don't let your dreams be memes, amigo.
watch a let's play
memes were a mistake
Is the art in Highway Blossoms all by the same person? The sprites look a bit different from a few of the CGs.
The first few CGs were done by the same person who did the sprites. It's just that someone else colored the sprites (with one sprite being done by Myuto). All the other CGs were done by Rosuuri or Weee.
So is it any good?
it's ok
>that gui
>yellow textbox
>white letters
>1080p despite sparse details
what were they thinking?
It hasn't hooked me yet, but high contrast mode saved it from being returned.
i think the textbox is fine. no i'm not the devs.
isn't it technically their first completed work? It's bound to be shit in one way or another.
That's understandable in part, but the specific feedback that user said has been thrown at the devs for months, I'm not sure if they expected opinion to suddenly change overnight.
KOJIMA OF EVN
didn't they implement the other optional textbox because of that?
It has better contrast but an even uglier color selection.
High contrast mode makes it readable.
Regular mode is hard to read and a terrible graphical design. You want the words to be easily read and stick out, not blend into the both the textbox and the general environment.
What are you talking about? Whenever someone on /evn/ complains they change something. They're like little dogs, it's great.
It's like some businessman with zero clue about VNs, anime, or anything relating to those things noticed something called visual novels were selling well and easy to produce so decided to hire some people to make the game that his market analysis skills dictated would make the most profit for the least amount of work.
"Alright, big boobs are bouncy, and little kids and manbabies love big boobs, so let's call it the bounce series."
"Every guy loves huge boobs, so let's have all the bodies exactly the same. Hot V shape with huge knockers. Yes, I'm sure that will sell just fine."