Were Normans more French/Frankish or Viking?

Tancred didn't do shit, it was all his sons
Tancred is barely even known beyond being the father of his sons

Why do we constantly argue whether they were Viking or French when they were neither? That's like asking are the modern Germans more Scandinavian or more Slavic? They were NORMANS, their own separate thing.

French speaking Viking rapebabies

Yeah I'm referring to the Tancred who was a crusader and prince of Galilee, not his great grandfather. Also the normans conquered Sicily and England so that proves they had Viking blood.

There were plenty of "frank" mercs in Byz employ fighting the Seljuqs long before the Crusades though
Adventuring wasn't exclusively norman

Was that the guy called Machefer ? Do you have any source on this ?

>Machefer
Taillefer

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taillefer

The culture was a blend

Probably the upper classes had much Viking blood and their ways passed from father to son

The vast mass of the population and ordinary soldiers were just French

Economically it doesn't make sense to bring over many females from Scandinavia, in terms of fighting and work power they are a dead weight

Beddoe stated that the skulls of Norman clergy in England tended to be round like the rest of the French population of the time

They're Frankish descendent's of Norsemen, stupid fucking thread

They were Norman. Full stop.

It's a unique culture of its own but one can consider it a subculture of Frankniggery formed out of Viking Settlers n shiet.

Forgive him, he must be American

Vikings were Norsemen, they were obvviously tall and blond haired, and they were described as so by arabs and french chroniclers.

If the Norman were Norsemen and not french they would have been similar to them.

They were christians, speaking langue d'oïl language, using the frankish culture with its great frankish symbols, like Roland. They weren't vikings at all, and they were really influenced by the neighboring much french Paris, Orléans or Picardy.

What do you call conquerors who sail to foreign lands in longships?

i'd say conquerors who sail to foreign lands in longships

>were the guys who intermarried with locals Norse

of course they fucking weren't

Definitely not Vikings because conquest is different than raiding.

So you be tellin me...

>what is the danelaw
>what is the kingdom of dublin
>what is the kingdom of the isles
>what is the duchy of normandy
>what is kievan rus'

>scots is more germanic
>scots weren't conquered by normans
>english is more latin
>english were conquered by normans
hmmmmmmmmmm

WE

The Scots language was brought to Scotland by Normans, ironically.

Bizzare post.

Its just a purer form of anglo-saxon that survived because the Scots weren't conquered by the Normans.

>Dublin
Literally a single city they got kicked out of a million times by goddamn potato niggers
>Isles
Wew, conquered those virtually uninhabited Hebrides and ended up assimilating to the local sheep farming gaels anyway, what fierce warriors

This

I could conquer the modern day Hebrides with a nerf gun and a butter knife

I feel like this is just another viking thread in disguise

David I adopted Norman culture and invited many Norman knights to Scotland, who would eventually become its kings, starting with Robert the Bruce. The Norman kings of Scotland established burhs and invited Middle English speakers to settle in them, their dialect would become Scots.

Scots wasnae brocht tae Scotland bi the Normans, and it sewrly isnae "puier". It's mair Germanic, sewrly, bit it's no ony mair breitherit tae Anglo-Saxon than modern Inglis be.

>Probably the upper classes had much Viking blood
William himself was 1/32th Viking and 31/32th French.

The culture wasn't a blend, it was pretty much pure French, with a handful of Danish loanwords.

This kills the nordicist meme.

You've muddled your chronology a bit. "Inglis", or the language that would become Scots, already existed in Scotland before the establishment of the Burgh system, since the 7th century in fact. The Old English spoken there was influenced by Old Norse when the area was settled by Scandinavians. It was also influenced by Gaelic, and it would come to be influenced by Flemish, Dutch and French, as well as Middle English, when the Burgh system was established.

Its certainly closer in vocabulary to modern day North Germanic languages, especially Danish.

Apparently, you call them "Franci".

>it was pretty much pure French
Yeah, all that talk of "Gens Normanorum" or "Normanitas" in Norman histories in England sure meant the wholesale subscription to French identity.

REKT

Savage

Yeah no shit Normandy has a name: Normandy. Not sure what your point is.

Daaamn

pretty much this

The norse blood was pretty limited and nowadays would have been very diluted.

The culture is what makes them dfferent

SNOWNIGS BLOWN THE FUCK OUT

French, but they were definitely hybrid.

/thread desu

>scots is more germanic

oh man

As someone who has ancestral claims in Normandy and is normamdy ATM
They had the fighting passion of the Norse but piety of the franks
And as war was more prevalent in feudal Europe I'd say more Norse

Sorry but the Normans actually won some battles norsenigger

I dont get it

Read the tapestry.

So did the norse, contrary to the hysterical ass-pained whining from obnoxious faggots like you.

kek

>norse delusion

>They had the fighting passion of the Norse but piety of the franks
I can't believe people are spouting this hackneyed nonsense in the 21st century without feeling embarrassed.

scandinavian obviouasly

it's a bit weird desu

the irish sources overwhelmingly refer to the normans as english, specifically saxon despite the fact most were welsh normans and spoke french

we don't know who made the bayeux tapestry anyway, it may not have been a self designation

Hardly, Germans are kind of their own thing created out of Nordic, Celtic and Slavic elements.

Really I thought the pope just let them best them in those battles, that England's rightful ruler was decided by a round of card games on motorcycles and that the crusader states were when brown Muslim apologists just let them into the castles which magically appeared

They liked the fight and pillage like the Scandinavians, but once they converted to Catholicism and the crusades were over they became quite pious
What's wrong with that statement

What would you call the People of Germania that killed varian's legion

You posted an image from the 21st century though.

He's pointing out that there was a Norman identity in the 11th century.

Idiot
"Gens Normanorum" means "The Norman Tribe/Nation/Clan."
"Normanitas" means "Normaness."

The Normans were literally creating their own identity for two reasons.
1) They were creating their own states in England, Sicily, and other parts.
2) They have to justify how independent they are. Calling themselves English/Sicilian would cuck them to the people they conquered. Calling themselves Frank/French means they are subject to a French King.

So they created an identity of WE WERE LE DIFFERENT UN MERDE by creating "Normanitas" which is highlighted by Frankbooness and excessive Martial posturing & military adventuring. Literally a combination of Frankish/Norse cultures, this time with Christfaggotry and Cavalry-fapping and crying over Romantic poems.

Norrman is literally what we call people from Norway in "scandi-tongue" but whatever.

>conquerors

>Celtic

they're germanic, not nordic, not slavic and certainly not celtic

cherusci, a germanic clan

And "Franci" is literally what that guys, who claimed Danishmen as adventurers, called themselves in the Bayeux Tapestry.

>Veeky Forums education

They were called Normans because they originally came from North and were likely Danes and Norwegians. After they settled in France they became French over the course of few generations. Spoke French, dressed like French, acted according to French customs and even after they conquered England a lot of Normans were born, raised and educated in France.

They were as French as Franks.

Germanic is a linguistic grouping not an ethnic one. Germanics spread to whole of Europe during fall of Rome. Visigoths even doing a whole Mediterranean tour and Vandals going to North Africa and then back to Europe again.

Normans had tried to settle irelend many times and even had settlements that lasted for centuries. These particular Normans came from france. In the advent of the black death, however, the irish colonies became weak and prone to attack by northern viking types. They eventually left or were killed - leaving ireland under the controll of the natives who had been at war with the normans and the northern civilizations at the same time, sometimes siding with eother side based on how they would benefit. When i think of normans i think "french".

What fucking pseudo-history are you spouting?

Norse had been in Ireland and western Scotland since the 8th century

Normans from England started their conquest in the 12th

The Black Death didn't reach Europe until the 14th century

The age of vikings was long over by then

What im saying is that Normans come from fucking France. Regardless of ancient family lines descending from the north. Normans were known for many things, but their history in ireland is interesting af.

If the point of your post was that Normans came from France, then why did you preface it with a bunch of misinformed history?

once they dropped their Germanic gods, and dropped their Norse language, they ceased to be Norse.

They entrenched themselves into the Gaullo-Roman culture, they could be thought of as "those Norsemen who became frogs" but not as Norsemen themselves.

>21st century
>same as 11th century

Fucking....idiot

They were Norman. Neither like most of the rest of France or the "Viking" countries/Kingdoms of the time. They spoke a version of French and adopted some more mainland European cultural aspects, but ethnically they were closer to Nordic mixed with some French.

So both and neither. The Normans were distinct from the Norse and the French.

>The Normans were distinct from the Norse and the French
The french were distinct from the french.
"French culture" wasn't a thing at this period besides having the same faith.

>Beddoe stated that the skulls of Norman clergy in England tended to be round like the rest of the French population of the time

and viking heads were shaped like what?