STINGINESS GONE WRONG

The ironic part is the client is an agency within the US government.

you'd think they'd follow the law, but they happily ignore it if it saves them moneys.

Nice.

I do tile jobs. My prices are pretty reasonable for tile work. I gave this lady a pretty fair quote to retile a massive his & hers shower. She says it's too much.

I email her a few weeks later to follow up and she says she chose another company in town who wanted about 1/2 the money I asked. She said the job went horrible and her shower looks awful.

Now I show her email to customers who think my prices are too high.

>take care of PBX in a hotel with super cheap owners
>always late on payments, question everything, general PITA to deal with
>don't pay a small invoice. Decide fuck it I'm done with these bitches
>get a call a few months later "Our phone system is down. Help us Obi-wan. You are our only hope.
Really am their only hope since the bastards are so cheap very few techs know the system.
>Ok, you owe me $xxx for previous unpaid invoice, plus xx penalty and this service call is COD and my new hourly rate has gone up.
> ok, ok just fix it.
Felt good

>100$/rung
Whoa that sounds like a pretty snazzy gig senpai

in my experience all hotel owners are super cheap despite making bank

I've dealt with them too. Insanely cheap. But I guess hotels don't really need repeat business. So as long as people see the sign, stop in and get a room, well, that's it then.

b8

I translate from Spanish and English into German. The pay is terrible and the work is sweat shop-tier. That's why 95% of my work is interpreting. Fuck translating.

do you sell to /vr/?

hipsters will skip eating to buy a retro game cart yet spend years ignoring emulators on purpose, it's fucking amazing. not a lot of places in my town to find these sort of things but once in a while I do and always sell it online for 500% and it's gone within 30 minutes

even gamecube games are starting to shoot up in value, it's not even that old

How terrible? Do you at least get min?

How much did you get?

I used to work in web dev during the dotcom boom. I could write a fucking book about this shit. Everything from unsecured plaintext SSNs to web pages that made geocities look professional. I've literally seen home grown web pages with over 500MB of gifs embedded in them. In fucking 1993.

Now I work in property management for rentals. Mother of god there are some stupid property owners out there. Yeah sure, you tell me to take my 10% cut and shove it when everyone else is charging 6-8%. Have fun when your renting to section 8 tenants that you can't evict because your property managers don't put in any legwork to screen tenants, and you have no paper trail for anything. Professional tenants will bleed you dry, and physically destroy your house. My cut is 10% because I make you more money in the long run, and if you somehow get a bad tenant, I can have them out on the street in less than 25 days. I can have them, and their shit, out in 5 if they threaten physical harm to an employee wearing a body cam.

My favorite was a guy who was new to landlording and who bought a duplex. I gotta hand it to him, he did score a damn fine property at a foreclosure auction. He put a little bit of work into it and it was perfect for renting in a nice location with a good school district. Could have EASILY cash flowed for ~750 a month on that property alone, and that's with long term expenses and assuming 10% vacancy. For a property that cost him about 94,000 with the repairs, that's beyond fucking insane. That's damn near 10% ROI a year, with vacancy factored in, and before leverage. With leverage it's well into the 25% range. Long term. Even thinking about this would make any decent landlord drool. Not to mention the market there is steadily appreciating, so it could be sold in 5-10 years.

So what does this guy do? He hears my cut of 10%, and realizes that he'd be making ~400 instead of ~750. Declared me a highway robber and storms out of my office.

cont...

...cont

6-7 months later he comes into my office having a borderline panic attack. He'd not screened his tenants well, if at all, and had rented to the prototypical section 8 tenant with 5 kids and 4 untrained pitbulls owned by her felon of a boyfriend. They had taken the keys, walked in, and smashed out the fucking walls between the units, then invited boyfriends family to live in the other unit. Thanks to the ridiculous failure that is HUD in this state, they got free legal aid to run the property owner through the ringer, and he couldn't get rid of them.

Cost him 30,000 in legal expenses through me alone to get them out because he did stupid shit and had basically threatened them, so I had to unwind a phonebooks worth of court documents, and contest dozens of fraudulent restraining orders against John Does since they never learned my name, or the name of my employee on the job. Once I had the writ in hand from the eviction hearing they knew they were fucked, so they just utterly decimated the place. Ripped out every piece of copper from the walls, took a saw and a sledge to some of the floors, and countless other things like the basement that was packed solid 2 feet deep with McDondalds trash. I think they raided a dumpster for that.

The piece de resistance though.. That was the bathrooms. Words don't do it justice. They took sacks of quikrete and plugged the drains. Then proceeded to shit in the tub until it was overflowing. I wish I could make this up. They deliberately turned their bathroom into a hazmat situation. There was liquid shit smeared into the hallway, and profanities written in shit on the 10 foot ceilings of the bathroom. It was insane. You functionally could not physically be in that part of the house without a respirator. I don't understand how it's physically possible for a dozen+ people to live like that.

I've tried over the years, and I'm just mentally incapable of comprehending it, let alone expressing how awful it was.

cont...

cont..

All's said and done and it cost him over a year of lost rent at about 50,000, about 40,000 in legal fees on top of what went through me to clear up criminal proceedings against him, a cool 180,000 in property damage, plus my cut which wound up being something to the tune of 50,000. Grand total is somewhere in the ballpark of 350,000. This doesn't include the hard to quantify parts like the bit where every single judge, DA, and most of the cops in the county know him now. If he ever does anything in person without a property management company again, and it goes to court, he's going to get reamed.

I wish I could say he learned his lesson, but 5 years later, he tried arguing with me about something, and I just dropped him, and the 4 properties I'd make successful for him on the spot. He tried coming back to me a year after that when 2 damn fine tenants filed suit against him after he was retarded enough to send them a certified letter threatening to extort them. At that point I just had my lawyers send him and his lawyer a brutally worded C&D with a phone books worth of supporting paperwork because he was getting increasingly aggressive and I was out of patience. I'm told his lawyer dropped him as a client within a few hours of receiving that C&D, but I honestly don't know anything past that.

It really makes you wonder how people like this have money.

One thin that i learned is people who own business lie a lot. I used to be a stock broker and talked to people who managed their companies while trying to make them invest in stocks on our totally-not-fraudulent-platform.

Shit they always say:
>i have no money man
>i just invested EVERYTHING in
> i live from month to month, barely scraping money
>mfw they invest thousands of dollars few weeks later

How the fuck weren't the tenants on the hook for that 180k? what kind of shitshow are you guys running over there?

Software developer contractor here

Basically every single fucking job I do is a result of stingy businesses having outsourced to some dirt cheap and/or foreign software house and now they need to pay megabux to fix their shit since they are over their deadline and haven't got shit to show for it

Couple of reasons for this.

>Section 8, and any government subsidized income, has extra legal protections in general.

Basically, in some states, they cannot be held liable for a lot of stuff. They can lose their housing vouchers, and some other benefits, but the bar for doing that is extremely high, and many people working within HUD will actively try to trip you up into making some mistake that they can use to kill the process. It's not worth most landlords time to peruse things further since they won't get any money out of it.

Why the fuckheads in most county HUD groups aren't eagerly trying to cull the bad people so that the good people aren't waitlisted for 3-5 years is beyond me. Generally seems to be a mindset of landlords are evil, and we take pleasure in destroying the livelihoods of poor people, combined with this belief that everyone can be helped/is deserving of help. It's just naive if you ask me. Don't get me wrong. I've got nothing against section 8 intrinsically. Some of my best tenants are section 8 tenants, usually ones with physical impairments from work related injuries. They were good people before they were in section 8. That's the difference. The vast majority of people who grow up in section 8 and never leave are purely entitled trash.

It's just a poorly managed program, and a lot of the people running it have lofty ideas that aren't based in reality.

If I'd been managing that property, the instant the boyfriend showed up, I'd have my lawyer drafting up hatemail to HUD and have a cure or quit notice on their door telling them that he is not authorized to be there. That alone is enough to lose benefits, especially when this weeks boyfriend is a felon. That usually scares them into behaving for a while.

Surely 180k worth of damages and literally having to hire a hazmat crew would be worth pursuing

What "type" of people are the worst renters in your opinion?

The real problem though is:
>So what if they are liable?

How are you going to collect debt from a poor person? You can force them to lose benefits, but you won't see a cut. The government pays their rent on time like clockwork, but they aren't going to do fuck all else to compensate you. Most of these people make so little money that you can't even effectively garnish them, assuming they even have a job. This is why screening tenants is critically important. You can demand good tenants, and as a free bonus, you automatically remove more than 95% of all section 8 tenants in a way that cannot be defined as discrimination against section 8, even in states where you can't outright say "no section 8".

The best bit of revenge you can get after things have gone to shit is to feed them to the IRS. I've never done it, but a colleague of mine forgave a debt on a commercial tenant that was already in hot water with the IRS because of some creative accounting practices. 800,000 dollars of income via 1099-C. Which of course dipshit couldn't afford to pay taxes on, so he wound up in a criminal case for felony tax evasion.

>Surely 180k worth of damages and literally having to hire a hazmat crew would be worth pursuing

You get a judgement, and nail it to their credit report, but it's purely a civil matter. If they can't pay it, you can't collect. Your best bet is to cut your losses and try flipping it to a debt collector, but they generally aren't interested in touching it for any real money because it doesn't matter if there's 4 zeroes or 6.

I personally don't run into these problems more than once every couple of years, and never to this scale because I screen, screen, screen, and screen some more. Better to have a place sit empty for 6 months than to risk a bad tenant. For small judgements I'm willing to forgive some of the debt if they can make interest payments continuously, which is a great small tax write off for me.

>What "type" of people are the worst renters in your opinion?

It has nothing to do with race. It has a bit to do with income, but less than you might think.

Mostly it's entitlement, and staggering incompetence issues. Sov Cit types are awful human beings, and frustratingly litigious. But really, anyone who openly talks about their religion, their organic/vegan/whatever the fuck food, or tries to talk loads of shit about 'generic group' is someone you don't want to do business with. You don't have to be intelligent to know not to bring those topics up in casual conversation.

It's just business. I want tenants that wont bother me by being late/not paying rent, destroying my property, or causing liability concerns. I really don't give a fuck what your views on homosexuality are, but if you are stupid enough to complain about 'the gays', you are stupid enough to cause problems down the road. Maybe you start some fights. Maybe you just get it in your tiny little ignorant head that I'm not first on your list of people to pay off. Maybe you will be an amazing tenant. Thing is, I can't predict the behavior of an irrational person, so I don't want the risk.

Ever made a bad decision in this area? Allowed someone tenancy who turned out to be a nightmare?

Problems are best nipped in the bud early. The spectacular cleanups that I do are always a result of someone somewhere else cutting corners. Either they didn't screen properly, or they didn't establish a paper trail. I've had some crazy tenants, but I have always approached things from a cover your ass standpoint, and I never process evictions personally. Let a good eviction attorney rip crazy's fabricated testimony apart in court. A lawyer is a relatively fixed fee. The faster I can get crazy out, the faster I can start turning a profit again. When shit goes wrong, paying someone to fix it is just good business sense, as is the whole point of this thread.

Worst I've ever dealt with was a cunt that called CPS on me after I gave her a cure or quit for her pits, and she taunted me about it. Needless to say that didn't go over well in court. Cost me a few thousand to get fully cleared up, but I let the professionals ream hear ass in court, and she lost most of her meager inheritance a few years later from that judgement.

Not my monkeys. Not my circus.

>It really makes you wonder how people like this have money.

I sued a landlord like this last year. Bong btw

>Rent a room from this guy. He doesn't meet me, just gets another lodger to show me around
>Pay the deposit and one months rent
>He sends a battered old contract a month later which he obviously copied from the internet. It references Canadian property laws so he couldn't even be bothered to find a UK one online. Completely invalid.
>Move out 12 months later after paying full rent and leaving the place immaculate.
>No sign of the deposit. In the UK deposits are protected under a government scheme.
>He hasn't protected the deposit, and his house is not registered with the council
>Demand my money back one last time
>He says he can't afford it
>Do some searching online, find him on property118 bragging about his investments and properties
>Find out he bought the house about 50k above what it was worth pre-crash in 2007

cont

>Landlord insists he can't afford the deposit, he's broke, pensioner etc.
>Go to court
>He doesn't turn up. Judge awards me the deposit amount x 3, one months rent and my court fees, interest and transportation
>£350 owed to me is now £1600 and counting
>Fucker owes me £1600 and still won't pay.
>This shit is personal now, so I get a CCJ and the bailiffs on his ass
>He barricades his house and hides his car
>He appeals the court decision on the basis that the court is 'too far away'
>The appeal is heard in a court 200 miles away which also happens to have the longest waiting time, 14 months for the appeal hearing
>Hearing comes, turn up to court, waiting to go in
>Scruffy looking degenerate turns up wearing a tracksuit and fishing jacket. He stinks. It's him.
>Landlord gives the judge some sob story about being poor etc.
>I give evidence of all his investments, property, motorhome etc.

cont

>Judge tears into him, threatens prosecution if he keeps abusing the system
>Total bill for him is over £2000 and he now owes over £2000 to the court for the costs he incurred them, balliffs etc.
>Get an order to force his bank to hand over the money
>Finally get paid, nice profit overall
>Find out the rental house is up for sale at 80k less than he paid for it

Here's the icing on the cake

>He sends me a letter complaining he can't get new mortgages because of the CCJ judgement. He begs me to remove the CCJ (Legally I should because the money has been paid)
>I move house and ignore the letters
>CCJ still there lel. I'm doing society a service stopping this fucker from borrowing more capital.

Feels good man. But how the fuck do people this dumb get the money to invest in property.

Seems bizarre that it takes that long to get a judgement. Then again, everything housing related in the UK is arcane magic from what I can tell from my view across the pond.

Regardless, I love hearing about stories like this. The thing people don't get is, yeah, you can save tons of money by cutting out short term expenses, and deferring maintenance a few years, but unless you flip the property to some gullible schmuck, you are going to get hurt in the long run. Furthermore, if you treat your tenants like shit, chances are you don't have your paperwork in order to protect yourself, because there's no good reason to do treat them like shit while doing paperwork. It's actually easier to treat them decently if you are doing the paperwork. All it takes is one tenant who knows the system, and you can get stuck dealing with tens or even hundreds of thousands in costs. Once word gets out, you can bet your ass there's going to be professional tenants lining up to fuck you sideways.

You did good work. Not professional tier, but solid. Next time take some time to investigate just how thoroughly you can fuck your landlord up. There's all sorts of dirty shit you can pull that racks his court costs up if he doesn't have a rock solid paper trail. In many jurisdictions the judge will massively favor the tenant. Especially if you can play the "I just researched this on the internet, and legal aid told me this. Can you walk me through this subsection" card.

Little things like tampering with the hot water heater every few weeks, so that it's never properly fixed, and you have a long list of maintenance requests for it. All it takes is him slipping up once in an email or text, and you've got him by the balls for failing to provide a habitable dwelling. I'm not saying you'll find a cash cow, but it takes very little effort to milk shitty landlords till their sore and bloody, and it certainly doesn't hurt people like me who have good record keeping.

>500MB of gifs embedded

I just finished dealing with a shitty landlord situation myself this week. Fucking scumbag.

>$3750 security deposit is owed to us
>Landlord ducks us for 3 months
>Doesn't return calls, doesn't show up to do a walkthrough, etc
>Finally get him on the phone right before we go to court
>"We are in the process of filling out the paperwork and we're going to ask for 3x the deposit since you fucked us around"
>Landlord caves
>Get the check 2 days later

feelsgoodman.jpg

Honestly. Why didn't you just immediately file in small claims?

One certified letter demanding relevant damages, and file with the court as soon as possible. Some areas you can file the 31st day, some areas you have to wait for return receipt on the letter. Best case they pay you your damages and you eat the filing fee when you dismiss the case. You still come out substantially ahead. If they send you a check for the deposit, but not the damages, do not cash it, and continue the court process. They just gave you evidence that a judge will have several interesting questions about. Once it gets to that stage, you cannot lose. Even in conservative locations with awful tenant protections, judges fucking hate shitbag landlords. There is no reason to compromise. You gain nothing from it.

He's an entitled little shit who doesn't understand or doesn't care about consequences because generally he can get away with abusing people. He is going out of his way to try and dick you, so bend him over the kitchen table and teach him what a good old fashioned hatefuck is all about.

You are spot on and I would fuck the guy up worse next time. If anything it is a diversion of money from idiot rent seeking landlords to honest tradesmen who fix the shit.

UK housing law is massively in favour of the tenant. I'm a landlord myself now and would never piss off my tenants because of how much they can fuck me over if they wanted. If someone knows the law and is degenerate enough to do it, you could actually live rent free in the UK just by continually playing the system and moving between rentals.

This guy wasn't the first one to pull this shit, but the first one had the sense to dodge court and pay up at the last second. That guy actually paid me on the steps to court. They have no fucking shame these people.

>He hears my cut of 10%, and realizes that he'd be making ~400 instead of ~750.

Nice story but explain to me how your 10% cut of 750 translated to 350.

Did I misunderstand something?

My cut is the total rent. I collect one month's rent when placing a tenant, because that involves a lot of paper/legwork. After that 10% of the collected rent goes to me, and I pass on anything left to the landlord.

Anything left over after expenses is profit. So in this case the guy would have been making 750ish a month self managed in pure cash flow, after all expenses when fully mortgaged, or he'd have been making 400 using my services. Combined rent of the two units was about 3600 a month, so my monthly cut would be ~360.

>Why didn't you just immediately file in small claims?

Basically the guy was sketchy as fuck and we were afraid he'd just go dark. Winning in court is one thing, actually collecting real money is a whole other story.

>combined rent is 3600
>after the expenses only 750 is left (or 400 after your services)

Why are the expenses so high? From your story I understood that he bought the duplex fully. Or did he get a mortgage?

>I collect one month's rent when placing a tenant
>After that 10% of the collected rent goes to me
Do you get the rent for the first month?

On average, how long do the tenants stay in the units you rented out? Are the contractually obliged to stay for a year (or other period) or can they leave whenever?

>tfw judicial system in my country is barely functional and clogged to hell so nobody uses it

Out of curiosity, how do you people deal with lawyer costs? If I wanted to sue somebody here it would take quite a long time, couple of years even and whoever sued would try to evade me by drowning me in lawyer fees. Makes no economical sense to sue someone for 1000$, spending 1000$ in fees and even if win and he's forced to pay up the costs as well, collecting is questionable.

750 was with a mortgage, at the undervalued price he bought it for. Realistically it was a 330,000 dollar property. There's tons of dimensions at play in a situations like this. Because it was a pretty high end property when in good condition, the maintenance would have been pretty high. With a bigger mortgage his cashflow would have been reduced, but he could have generated a profit flipping it to the bank as well. Literally could have been cash flowing a little on an investment of negative dollars while generating equity, and reporting a net loss on taxes. There were some basic improvements that would have driven rent up even further as well, but they were time intensive and he wanted to hit market. Absolutely golden property.

Quick and dirty rule in places in the US without massively inflated land value is the 50% rule. Half of your rent, whatever it is, will go towards maintenance, taxes, vacancy, etc. Mortgage payments are on top of this. Some properties are 40%. Some are 65%. Because this one was bought dirt cheap, these were a more substantial portion of expenses than they normally would be, since they are based off the 'real' value of the house, so that's where the math gets funky and the rule breaks down. The other rule is the 1% rule. Rent should be at least 1% of the real value of the house every month.

If your expenses are nearly exactly 50%, and you get a 100% 30 year mortgage in the 4-5% range, you can break even with 1% value in rent every month, and build equity. Yes, in practice this is impossible, especially post housing crash, and even if you could get a mortgage for that, there's enormous risks because you have no overhead to work with, but it can be done.

I won't speculate about areas outside of the US and Canada, but these are very consistent here. If they break down, it's usually a good indicator that there's something seriously fucked up, either with the house, or the market.

10% for your service is not high at all. I'd use a service like that if I was renting out property just to save hassle of dealing with it.
Though if you factor in the first month payment that you take, your effective cut is about 17,5% for the first year. Which still isn't that much imo and it will become lower the longer the tenants stay.

That's why I was wondering how long do the tenants that you find stay. Could you answer that question?

How many properties are you managing at the moment?

in bongistan you can take someone to 'small claims court' for £50. I think there is something similar in the US.

If you win then the £50 is charged to the person you sue. If you lose then the guy you sue can counter-sue for his legal fees.

It's pretty good but obviously anyone with the money and knowledge can play the system, as I found out.

I never use lawyers, I just study the law, desu with something like housing it really isn't that hard for an intelligent person to represent themselves.

As I said the guy used all sorts of tactics and even moved the court 200 miles to the court with the worst backlog just to put me off. It was a fucking war of attrition.

>Do you get the rent for the first month?
Tenant pays me for the first/last/security. I eat the entire first month's rent. Owner sees nothing. Security gets handled in some appropriate fashion for the state/county, and the last month rent generally gets thrown into the general expense fund. Property owner gets paid out in subsequent months. The first months rent is mine though as my fee for placing the tenant.

This is industry standard. We don't really gain anything from this since placing tenants is a lot of work, so there's no benefit to abusing it, and many contracts with property managers have provisions that make us liable for evictions due to bad tenants in the first couple of months, so even if it could be profitable to constantly place lots of tenants, we'd be facing enormous liability issues.

In that case I would probably just use the threat of court to get someone to pay. If they know the system however, they'll know they can just give you the run around until you give up. Often it's not worth it for such a small sum.

>On average, how long do the tenants stay in the units you rented out? Are the contractually obliged to stay for a year (or other period) or can they leave whenever?

Varies too much by area to give you specifics. I demand 1 year leases, and proof of income/credit/background checks. Once the lease is up it goes month to month. I have incentives for renewing leases, since it gives me leverage to keep someone paying. I charge more for month to month, and month to month is subject to more frequent price adjustments. With a lease, you are locked in at a price for a year, but if you jump ship I you forfeit your deposit/last months rent. With month to month, either party can terminate with 30-60 days notice, and that can leave you trying to rent in January when there are no tenants looking.

Generally speaking, if a tenant has a good history with me, I'll let them out and give them their deposit back, and prorated bits of their last month's rent, but I put restrictions in place. They have to do a mandatory walkthrough, and they have a very thorough checklist to get through, as well as agree to scheduled showings of the place, and have things relatively neat during the showings. Basically, I agree to modify the lease and allow termination in exchange for them forfeiting some of their privacy, and returning the property to me in good enough condition to instantly rent it.

If someone just fucks off, or worse, fucks off and leaves a mess, I have the leverage of the lease to financially brow beat them. If they are a mediocre or bad tenant, I'm under no legal obligation to to do them any favors. In either case, they forfeit the last month's rent, security deposit, and I can pursue damages until I place a replacement, or the leas would have expired. Leaving in the middle of winter is a bad time because placements might take 4 months. You forfeited 2 months rent, and owe 2-4 on top of that.

As for how long my tenants stay. It really depends. I'd have to break things down into categories. College buildings are obviously high turnover, but you can pack them like sardines, so even with high vacancy rates, there's good room for profit. Other places have tenants that are rock solid steady for years. Decades even. My first tenant placed in 95 is still with me. Charming immortal widower type living off a nice pension with no real family left in the country outside of his church. 21 years and counting. He's never going to leave unless he goes into a nursing home or dies, and hell will freeze over before I evict him. By my count he has made me about 75,000 over the years by himself in pure cashflow, not to mention equity. I was careful, but ignorant, back then, and got phenomenally lucky.

I like long term tenants, because as I said with maintenance, you can just fuck off and let things take care of themselves. Good tenants tell you when they notice something odd about the property, and that lets you fix shit fast. I'll gladly write the expense report to put someone in a decent hotel for 3-4 days so I can rip out the floor and repair water damage without disturbing them. They told me about it quickly, and a few hundred dollars for a hotel when they saved tens of thousands is an obvious no brainer. A shitty tenant won't communicate with you at all. Lots of times, you can't get truly long term tenants. Realistically, your budget should assume they will stay a year at most. If they stay longer, it's just pure profit.

Figure out what vacancy rates are in your area, and budget for it. If you provide a good service, yours will be lower than average. If your budget can handle things when they are rough, you'll be great when things are doing decently, and positively golden when things are doing well.

Is there a market for a "business" whereby landlords might hire me to ensure that someone vacates their property?

Simply, I use devilish dirty tactics to make scumbag tenants GTFO. I have heard of this happening in London where these guys are called in to make sure squatters get out of property that is very expensive. They do things like pumping smoke into the air vents and other shady stuff.

Probably, but good luck with any regulatory body if you get caught.

In the states, you have to be really careful of violating 'right to quiet enjoyment' and trespassing can get you shot, especially when you've got fucking retarded felons running around with guns. If it's a high end property, going through legal channels is going to be cost effective. Most states do not have horrendously powerful tenants rights.

You also need to consider the abject squalor that some people voluntarily live in. Maybe 18-20 years ago I'd have thought otherwise, but after seeing countless houses with people literally living in dog shit, cat shit, rat shit, bat shit, and human shit, racks of dead animals, fridges filled with weapons grade biological experiments, and cut off utilities, I find it hard to believe that dedicated trash will give a shit about some smoke.

Sounds like you have a problem with how hard it is to get rid of people, which creates the black market, and the fact that you aren't dealing with genuine trash, which means they have actual standards of living.

LOL, love this thread already OP. Good for u. Frugal is one thing but dont be a cheap cunt. Stupid mutherfuxkers around here though. Id say 1/4 of my customers were this guy.

>be me
>work in quarry all my life
>get balls buy a 10 wheeler dump truck for to haul rock (gravel...) to oil lease roads, farmers, ranchers and the like as a part time business
>mfw 3/4 of the time user asks what rock do i recomend. Tells me no, they want (this) rock
>whatever faggot i learned not to argue
>also get more money when your road is fucked in a month
>user is now mad and tries to blame me, talks shit around town i brought wrong shit.
>lolol! NOT TODAAAAAY
>mfw i give 0 fucks and work a 50 hour a week job already
>mfw i set up a hidden camera and record all conversations about what rock where, then take photographs of my work when i leave all jobs
>mfw "wellll, user dont like u, said this and this blahblah.
>show them vidya
>ayyyy lmao
>of corse user tells user
>user twice as mad
>mfw am bros with my only real competition and we blacklist customers for being cunts
>mfw i work at local quarry and load trucks from 100 miles away for simple job because me and conpetition (are too busy)

>mfw

Noce work user. U still dealing? Got any old broken ones i can use the cases for?

Also, any experience with the new re-released nes and new 10$ contollers?

Can possibly trades uf u want. Its not hard to do yourself but i have been making cash off of gutting old nes controllers, instal usb extention cord, and thumb drive inside controller. Glue up so bottons work but are nonfunctional. Resell.

People eat them up.

Can trade u other shit if interest?

God stories like this make me happy inside. Its like u get to be an asshole trole but still have a heart because u fucked up a jew. U did the world a favor by being a fair businessman and taking money from these fucking cucks.

One time this store owner had a habbit of riping us all of. Buy shit for 7 bucks or whatever. Pay with a $20. Get change back for a ten. Get mad. Owner threaten to kick out.

Was nice the first 2 times thinking maybe he was slow or something.

Nope. 3rd time im pissed but still calm. Really like this store. Suggest he do a better job of keeping his books and when he 10 bucks ahead today to set it aside for my next visit. 4th time. Scoot right passed mad to done. Also that day several others and me get together to discuss rather we beat this asshole or nah.

I got an idea.

Mfw i started giving a bunch of my stuff and paying my friends to rob this store blind and vandalise shit. They eagerly do it cause they were also victimized.

Mfw 3 weeks latter "muh going out of business sale.

Mfw i walk up with as much shit as i can carry. Uhh derp thatll be $40.

"Well, just take it off of what you owe me"

"Wat?" Yeah man, u ripped me off over $50. Trying to be nice here.

Get out of my store.

Lolol, friends fuck that store up and leave a note that says, just take it off of what you owe us. Have fun going out of business faggot.

Mfw people drag the toes off their boots for minimum wage.

Fuck that.

Good for u user.

>new to landlording
>me

Any tips. At the first chance i am hiring a property manager because for 1 fuck tenants and for 2 i 100% approve of paying a fair price for quality work. If i can make the numbers work Nd i dont here from my properties manager unless its important or they wanna play golf id pay them 99% of my fucking income. I grew up in a trailer park. My grandparents had of 40 rentals once.

I know all about the section8 cockroach infested fucking cucks.

So, any tips on how to hire a legit property manager?

U work near Southeast Kansas? I have a shithole I will pay u 15% to manage if you do me a solid and do some handholding. Working on my second rental. Another shitty duplex at a steal. Im not fucking around here. I spend 5 hours a day learning to be a real estate investor.

Good lawd my sides. Serves that faggot right user. U doing gods work protecting the common sense investor that wants to truly make a business and not a quick buck. God i hope u live or do business in kansas...

Yeah, bit probably developed that habbit as defense towards everyone trying to get in their pockets. I see it every day. I know a group of multimillionaires extremely well. I try not to be in the way but if i see them hanging out having a beer i fucking stop in and say high. They legit guys and i try not to be a kissass. Salivate everytime they talk about a new deal.

Laugh at all of the rest of the goddamn peasants come hang only to beg.
Laugh even harder when liberals bitch about no free shit. Make it a point to tell them to get a job and earn it. Or better yet learn to do business or invest or both so u dont have to work and u can employ your cucked liberal family.

>mfw millionaire jawdrops at me, working class, bitching at other working class for being wagecucks

>mfw they keep talking about real estate deals and i politely as i can explain how they are fucking up if i catch a major flaw.

>mfw soon one of them will come to me and ask them how i do my deals and offer me money, and i tell them to make sure because im not a wagecuck moneybegger. I can get my own money.

Mfw they say i know and we all make millions.

Feels goodman

Thank u for sharing user.

My 1 rental is currently empty because it is next door and i fucking hate tennants. Im bad at screening. Guess i try and see the good in people but shouldnt....

Gonna just hire a property reter or make it a storage shed. Im a fucking hoarder and the house is a shithole anyway.
If u dont mind my asking what kind of properties do you do business with?

I am so very happy about your service user. Your service to humanity that is.
I got one i guess. Not really that big of a deal. But fantasric nonetheless.

>be me
>poorfag
>rent shithole for like $350 a month years ago
>have contracterbro help fix the place up cause desperatly need deposit to move into better place
>talking track down used fixtures and shit and patch holes in walls that were already there
>shampoo carpets and shit
>place was 4/10 moving in and easily 8/10 moving out after 2 years treating it as my own

>mfw, no deposit. Doesnt even give reason or anything. Simply no.

>lol, u fucked up faggot
>jew starts plumbing company some years latter
>need about $500 plumbing done to my house
>have a frie d call him and get the work done
>comes to collect after trying to reach me
>files some sort of paperwork to have me pay or court
>send him back a letter requesting call logs of when i called him and tell him i never needed service
>have friend call again to give him his $500. Say sorry, i guess u went to the wrong house, told u wrong address, etc.
>have her say my car broke sown but come 1 hour drive away and i will leave cash in mailbox as we are going away for the week

>mfw asshole stiffs me $350
>mfw years latter i get $500 work out of him and make him drive 1 hour 1 way to open a letter
>mfw $500 monopoly money and a note that says, no deposit. Fuck u

Fuck yeah there is demand. But its a shady road and the tenant knows the landlord is behind it.

I would say better to fight it out in court. And if u lose, pay some buddies to rob their ass a year or 2 later. Fuckem.

Amazing. Good to know there's others like me out there fighting the good fight

You're literally the exact type of person I would want managing properties. Out of curiosity, what state are you in?

I'll go broke trying to fuck over a financial rapist.

My old boss is the biggest form of scum.

The type of guy to piss away his fortune over a land dispute he is 100% wrong in.

I am gonna fuck him over soooo hard one day.

And then probably beat his ass because

>muh $1,000 bail
>muh assault charge

Mfw in my hometown and 2 of 4 jailers are lifelong friends.

Mfw push me around all u want faggot. I spend 10% of my time making assets and 90% trolling u faggots and protecting mine.

I'M NOT WORTH SHIT DRON.

>rent cars for a living.
>cheap fucks find corporate rates on google
>family comes in with some bullshit rate code for some fruit company
>offer insurance.
>they decline because the credit card covers rental cars
>2 weeks later they return half way through rental
>huge damage, car totalled
>everyone ok no major injuries
>a month or more later they return
>ask me if I can remove the corporate rate code
>impossible
>the credit card won't cover them because the corporate rate code
>enjoy your new totalled car

> Work for small IT firm
> have a property development/management company as client
> client is notorious tight ass despite making mad bank
> only pays for 5 hours of support per month and is constantly going over by 10 or 15
> Legacy systems. Legacy systems everywhere.
> wants to host their own servers to save costs instead of migrating to cloud
> software company says "fuck you, we wont support you."
> specialty software and we dont have a DBA so we cant support them properly
> cancels contract and tells owner that they are shopping our contract
> keeps opening support tickets even though they are now having to pay hourly rate
> ignoring calls and emails about contract status
> owner decides its time to teach them a lesson
> hourly rate goes up 100%
> STILL ignores calls about contract, its been weeks now. Properties cant process rent payments. accounts payable cant post payments because their computer is down.
> wont approve hourly work
> cue catastrophic server failure
> "I'll renew"

MFW their monthly costs have now quadrupled

>in bongistan you can take someone to 'small claims court' for £50. I think there is something similar in the US.
Yup, it's identical here, also called small claims court. You're limited to suing for damages less than $10,000, but like yours it has a super low filing fee, something like $20 or $50.

Pffft kek, good. Fuck em. I can't stand people who are so retarded that they try to cut costs in a minor way just to end up way the fuck worse off later on. Especially when they have more than enough money to do it correctly the first time. I hope that shit hurts.

Same level of retardation as a soccer mom spending 2 hours clipping coupons to save $4.00 at the grocery store, then driving there in her huge stupid range rover SUV that gets 8 miles to the gallon.

I hate stupid fucks, but I especially hate stupid fucks who have money they don't deserve.

>clogged to hell
>noboby uses it

Doesn't compute user

I will never understand why people want to cut IT budgets. Half the reason my business is so successful is because of the magic of computers.

Cameras are cheap. Hard drives are cheap. VOIP phones are cheap. You have no excuse not to, and it will save you money in the long run. Retaining some good fullstack developers is one of the best choices you can ever make if you want your business to grow rapidly. It just utterly baffles me that people can have this explained to them, and then voluntarily choose not to follow through at all, or they hire some shitty company that either is staffed by India, or outsources to India.

another one for you then

>renting a room in a house while at university
>electricity bill is shared between 4 people
>pay the bills quarterly, get money off everyone and pay it myself
>this goes OK because they all have middle class parents to bail them out
>suddenly one guy disappears from the house, owing me £200
>read his letters
>owes 2k to the bank, 2k on credit cards, student loan maxed out, owes the landlord 6 months rent
>his room is full of mountain dew bottles and stinks of piss
>try to contact him, he just ignores me and blocks me from facebook
>contact his parents, send polite message saying maybe he forgo etc. they put the phone down and block me on facebook

cont

>do some more digging, read his bank statements
>he bought brand new pc, £200 keyboard, top end everything. loads of steam store purchases and other random shit as well as constant dominoes orders
>his dad owns a successful business
>do some digging
>people online complaining that the business ripped them off, won't pay invoices etc.
>basically a family of debt ridden theiving cunts
>this is war

cont

>have friends post on all his facebook events with his friends
>thieving cunt, give my mate his money back, pay your bills etc.
>relentles
>he makes his facebook private and blocks everyone
>still hasn't said a word to me
>drive 350 miles to his house and knock on the door
>fat fuck of a dad opens, assumes im his friends and leaves me in the hallway while he gets the kid
>look around and find massive gaming throne chair thing, huge screens, sterring wheel etc.
>house is full of shit paid for with other peoples money
>kid comes down the stairs and recognises me
>hes shaking with fear, promises to pay me
>nothing for another month
>conspire to spray paint PEDO on his house, set fire to car and all kinds of shit
>preparing the mission with my friends - removed no. plate from motorbike and ready to roll out
>leave him one last anonymous message, threatening what im gonna do
>suddenly 200 appears in my account

Yeah, no. This didn't happen. If you actually threatened him, he'd have you by the balls on extortion alone. Not to mention possible harassment/stalking charges if they had any clue about keeping track of things.

Oh, and a side of mail tampering to boot.

Lets see...
>Work for an shit dip little hosting company as a sysadmin
>Work over nights because I prefer nights and not dealing with manager bullshit.
>Come in one day sick as hell because they can't get someone else to take over my shift.
>Have more OTC meds in me then a PA has meth.
>Fall asleep for 30 minutes.
>Owner finds me because he likes to do surprise night inspections because he doesn't believe people actually work without any manager there.
>Get fired on the spot, even though I am very visibly sick.
>Gather my shit and peace the fuck out.
>Get a new job doing contract work about a week later.
>6 week later I get a frantic phone call, telling me I need to come back.
>Backup system that only runs at night and only I know how to work is fucked.
>Tell him my base rate now, plus 50% for emergencies.
>He says nothing and hangs up. I tell my current boss what's going on.
>Current boss laughs.
>2 hours later, still at current place of employment.
>Old boss calls up screaming. They can't figure out what is wrong.
>Tell them new price, he flips and hangs up.
>OK, fuck you.
>1 hour goes by, he calls up and agrees to the price.
>I will be there, I want cash for 6 hours worth of work.
>He flips because he knows I know he has stopped checks before.
>He agrees. I tell the boss, he laughs and says "Go for it".
>I show up, he has no cash. I walk back out to my car.
>He flips and hands me a check. I laugh.
>He goes to the bank and takes out $1,200 and brings it back.
>I start the restore job from the latest backups.
>Tapes are corrupt because no one ever changed them out and are 7 years old.
>I tell them what happened, they shit themselves as I start a restore from 6 and a half weeks ago.
>He says he will sue me, I laugh and walk out the door with my money.

Admit, more of a story of just general stupidity but some stinginess in there.

sure, if you can prove any of those things with some solid evidence. they had so many people after them that i doubt i would be under the spotlight if anything happened

brilliant

Still fucking love it.

"I'll sue you." Litterally makes me lol. By definition i own dick nothing and refi my shitty house every 6 months just to have a record of it "as the norm" just in case litigation against me.

In my study of asset protection i have discovered a goldmine of fuck you's. I dont understand most of it but 2 attorneys assure me it is legal and common practice.

>be me
>sets up company in such a way
>get sued
>lose
>KEK, still have the ability to dump 100% of company revenue back into company to grow it. Constant growth, take 0 advantage of tax loopholes. Business pays taxes and reinvests in itself.
>faggot that sued and won also now owes his share of taxes. No money to pay cause invested back into company
>continue this until his life is ruined. Offer to take back 90% of his holdings and pay his taxes if he doesnt piss me off again.

>have him by the balls the rest of his fucking life!

>/fucked

>I spend 10% of my time making assets and 90% trolling u faggots

P R I O R I T I E S
R
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>read his letters

You're aware that's a federal crime, right?

bump

I have no idea waht you just said

>hiring from Veeky Forums
You're literally the type of person nobody wants to be employed by

>property manager looks like he knows what he's doing
>being associated with Veeky Forums's business board is a dealbreaker
You know there's a guy here with a verified networth of over 10 million dollars? Reddit may be a better place for you, friend.

Depends. If you work for translation agencies, you can't live from that. Direct clients pay you well.

I wouldn't use any references off of Veeky Forums regardless of context. I take everything said here with salt. There's a reason why I haven't answered anything substantial about how many buildings/units I manage, my general location, or any other jobs I do. My statements here have been accurate, but I certainly don't expect anyone to believe me verbatim. It's recreational shitposting and entertainment for me, and I have no problem admitting that.

I've caught employees talking about my business and myself on Veeky Forums before, but truthfully, I really don't care. As long as nothing is personally identifiable outside of the vaguest of vague senses, and their work gets done, it's not my business.

More content.

Wrapping up a court case in the next week or so. Some people try to use me as a tenant placement service, then renew management contracts elsewhere once I get things running smoothly. I don't mind doing that, but the rates for that are substantially higher, since I need to offset future revenue. Unfortunately there's a lot of shitty owners out there that try to pull a fast one here, so I have a bunch of severance terms in my contracts that are extremely severe, and those are well worth throwing prospective clients out of my office over if they argue with me about them at all.

In this case, a former client and I parted ways because he brought a partner on board that was functionally useless and wasted hundreds of hours of time per month, so naturally we billed them for it because he was interfering with our day to day operations and making other things difficult to work on. New partner managed to convince my client to drop things and go with another company instead of getting himself canned when there had been very few issues in the past. Enter our lawyer and they receive a very blunt letter reminding them that we are owed X every month as part of our severance because they breached the terms of the contract. Now my best guess is that their lawyer told them they were utterly fucked if things went to court, so they dutifully paid for a while.

Then they started passively refusing to do maintenance on the properties with our tenants to try and bump the tenants out and weasel out of most of the fees by having the tenants voluntarily vacate. Well, they fucked it up, and badly. Several tenants of the 20 or so buildings sued them over habitability reasons, and left. A couple of buildings wound up condemned because of utility pissing contests. One of the tenants actually moved back into a unit with us immediately after filing suit with them, bitching to their former and once again PM the entire move in walkthrough about what fucking cunts these people were, which I personally find to be sensible chuckle worthy. This person had been a tenant for nearly a decade and we'd never had a real problem with them. They'd been jerked around and were practically giggling at the prospect of sharing mountains of evidence that they'd accumulated with our lawyer. Hell, they offered to testify. If you've ever worked with good lawyers, you should know about that eerie glow they get in their eyes when they get a real taste, and the blood madness descends.

In short, the tenant court cases that slammed them clearly showed a breach of good faith in their contract with us, so we had an extremely simple case to tighten the screws on and extract a large lump sum with. So here we are. Several years later, and they not only lost a bunch of very good tenants, but got sued several times for solid torts, including paying us even more than it would have cost to keep us and have us do work, and court costs. I don't even want to know what sort of perverted things the local HUD is preparing to do to them. All so that they could save a couple thousand dollars a month.

i think people tend to underestimate Veeky Forums, especially the professional boards. you realize that this entire website gets 8 million unique views a month, yet it still manages to attract skilled and thoughtful people. anonymity is a beautiful thing.

Oh definitely. If you've got the skin to deal with the oceans of shit flinging, there's lots of good stuff here. You just need to have decent idea of what you are looking for if you expect to get anything besides entertainment out of it.

I run a small digital marketing agency, mainly focused on SEO/ PPC but we do a fair bit of website development and graphic design.

We built a website for a guy who sold bodybuilding supplements and other shit like that. He was the definition of a meathead, but he was doing surprisingly well, with about £15k going through his site every month.

After 2 months of work the new sitewas ready to launch, sent him the £30k invoice and waited to receive payment.

A week later I get a phone call from the guy, he's just discovered wordpress and is furious that we never told him he could "download an entire website for free" (i.e install a theme).

He refuses to pay the invoice, and tells us to keep the site we built, so I start preparing for legal proceedings against him.

Get a call a few days later, he's almost crying on the phone to me. He got his mate who's 'good with computers' to set up his new wordpress theme who obviously fucked it up, and now his site is making absolutely nothing.

I ended up charging him £35k, £20k for the website and £15k for all the work in repairing the damage had been done, including re-uploading close to 100 products that his mate had deleted.

Dont you have contracts in us that make tennants liable for any damage?

Wondering about this as well.
It seems like it's really easy to get fucked as both landlord and tenant in the US

You can't get moneys out of a brokefag anyway so it doesn't matter.

How many times has this been mentioned already in the thread...

Even if they're liable, you win in court, etc, it doesn't mean you will actually collect payment.

Amen user.

I've started to consider myself as a proffessional troller.

>be me
>buys yeti cooler
>Custs bottom seam and insert gps
>puts home servailance cameras at several angles, light, rig car alam and light switch to small spring. People try and still this fucking thing like once a week. I then extort people and threaten tresspassingcharges if they dont sign a waver to let me make a youtube video of them.

/trolled.

Lol, i know a guy with $40,000,000 in his bank account for the next few days. Should i post proof?

Like mining for gold user. I spend many hours on 4chin a day and any time i try and leave i strike gold.