Crusades

Which religion was worse when it came to crusades?

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Islam DUUUHHHH.

They were both guilty of atrocities and persecutions.

>worst
roman catholicism
>best
roman catholcism
>avarege
roman catholicism

Christian did the most massacres and atrocities. Both to muslims-jews and to other Christians. Even Christian Chronicles rage about this, Read Matthew of Edessa and William of Tyre.

Where Muslims shine in Brutality is not levant but India. Since they were not people of the book like christians-jews-and sometimes zoroastrians they were really savage there.

Catholics, they even fucked over other christian states.

No other religion than christianityhas crusades so christianity is the worst. If you mean holy war than its islam by far.

>Crusades
>Judging them based on religion

It was a series of political wars and anyone who says otherwise is a fool.

Georgian Christians supported the Ayyubids while West European Christians slaughtered Greek Christians... while Saladin took his place by overthrowing the Seljuks.

Anyone who says Crusades were bad is a libcuck commie and needs to gtfo
Crusades were glorious, they saved the west christiandom and should happen again. I say this as a Protestant.
DEUS VULT

A Christian """""""""""""""Europe""""""""""""""" isn't worth saving.

So what if the west had been conquered by Muslims? You exchange one Jewish religion for another, big deal.

*tips fedora*

>Anyone who says Crusades were bad is a libcuck commie and needs to gtfo
>Crusades were glorious, they saved the west christiandom and should happen again. I say this as a Protestant.

Timmy!

>LE FEDORA MEME XD

Fuck off. Christianity and Islam are rotten fruit from the same poison tree. Just because you grew up with and prefer one doesn't make it any better.

>implying Christianity isn't heavily influenced by Hellenic philosophy
>implying Christianity isn't integrally linked to Rome
>implying Islam shares these characteristics
>implygin

The New Testament is literally written in Greek you ignorant plebeian.

Shoulda paid denbts

So le enlightened.

So what? It was written by Jews about a Jewish religion.

What is the point of this comment? What does this have to do with pretending to be enlightened or whatever? Do you just wait for anyone to criticize Christianity so you can respond with this stupid shit?

Luke was Greek.

good bait

Not that guy, but what's to say Islam wouldn't wind up taking on similar characteristics with time?

>"le deyus voolt xDDD"

Cringe

The fact that Islam is a product of Arab culture which is why the Koran is written in Arabic.

Also Rome plays an integral part in the Gospel narrative so it is woven into the fabric of Christianity and Rome itself converted before Islam was even a thing.

So Christians abandon God so easily for the sake of money?

What do you expect from a Protestant.

France

Destroying the Knights Templar over debts the crown didn't want to pay. Taking away the one unifying and organizing force for the Crusades. Leaving the Crusades to fall to the whims of petty monarchs and nation states.

>reposting

>The fact that Islam is a product of Arab culture which is why the Koran is written in Arabic.

The Old Testament was a product of Jewish culture and written in Hebrew. Christianity is ultimately just an evolution of that interacting with the local Jews, Greeks, and Romans. I see no reason to believe that Islam wouldn't change in the course of interacting with Europe. We can actually see Islam take on a characteristic of a foreign culture in its interactions with Persian philosophers. I guarantee you that in a thousand years (hell, maybe just a few hundred), if Europe became Islamic, we'd have people like yourself insisting that it's integral to European character.

>frogposting

youtube.com/watch?v=uJ-IBNPIVqg

i.4cdn.org/wsg/1469419629870.webm

>I see no reason to believe that Islam wouldn't change in the course of interacting with Europe.

That's probably because you don't want to.

Again the fact that the NT is written is Greek and the Koran is written in Arabic says everything about the differences about the two religions.

What is spain? What is Italy? What is greece? Conveniently forget the islamic coonquest there. The islamic conquests in north africa were also permanent.

>I see no reason to believe that Islam wouldn't change in the course of interacting with Europe.

That's probably because you don't want to.

Again the fact that the NT is written in Greek and the Koran is written in Arabic says everything about the differences between the two religions.

>Byzantine Trash Lord demands Europeans march over to go dick around against the ottomans
>The peasants assemble
>Trash Lord dies, Trash Lord jr. takes the reigns
>"wtf I didn't order these, take them away"
>no food to feed army on march back home
>essentially a death march
>siege or die


Didn't have a choice.

>I don't know history: the post

Don't post about things you're completely ignorant about.

>Again the fact that the NT is written in Greek and the Koran is written in Arabic says everything about the differences between the two religions.

Not really. What made Christianity European evolved out of it interacting with something written from a completely foreign culture in a language largely unspoken in Europe at the time.

>That's probably because you don't want to.

Or because you don't have a leg to stand on from an argument standpoint. Again, interaction with Persian culture made Islam in Persia into something very distinctly Persian.

(You)
(You)
(You)
(You)
(You)
(You)

Suggesting that Islam in Europe would ultimately take on a European character (whatever that would eventually mean, but Europe wouldn't be the same afterwards, as Christian Europe was not the same as Indo-European Polytheist Europe which was not the same as Pre-Indo-European Europe) and ultimately wind up integral to whatever European character would be at that point the same as Christianity now is does not qualify as bait.

Dismissing the differences between the foundational texts of each religion in favor of saying "well Islam would have evolved xD" is most certainly bait.

The foundational text of Christianity is the old testament. The new testament is the product of that evolution. I'm sure whatever philosophy and theology that would evolve out of European Islam would be written in English, French, German, etc. What, do you think Islam would just sit on top of European culture like parsley on a meal?

The foundational texts of a religion aren't actually the same as the central texts of dogma. Christianity grew out of the writings and sermons of Roman citizens in the first and second centuries. If Rome had suppressed Christianity to the point where it only survived outside of its borders, it wouldn't have looked the same as it does now.

Similarly, Islam looks the way it does now because in the 8th and 9th centuries Syrian and Mesopotamian settlers and converts settled the basics of the religion and its philosophy, which would have been different if the Caliphate had only managed to invade Roman provinces alone, or Persian provinces alone, or neither.

>The Gospels aren't thaaaaat important guise xDDDDDD

Jesus Christ the New Testament isn't European AT ALL besides the fact that it's written in Greek, the lingua franca of the Mediterranean. It wasn't even written by Greeks.

So yes, Islam might just as easily have evolved.

...

Okay congratulations one of the many authors of the NT might have been a Greek (he might have been a Hellenized Jew, too). Stop splitting hairs.

They are. It's how they're read and understood that sets the foundation of a major religion. Had Islam taken Christianity's place, we'd see Arabic have a more important role in the continent as a liturgical language at the very least, but that doesn't mean the rules that Late Antiquity writers from Basra came up with based on the Quran would be the same exact rules that first century writers from Anatolia or Italy would have come up with based on that same Quran.

>what is greece?
Conquered by the Ottomans because the crusaders weakened the Byzantines?

Since Muslims don't go on crusades by definition, wouldn't the answer default to Catholics? That's like asking who's worse when it comes to jihads or human sacrifices to sun gods.

I never said they weren't important. I said they're a product of a completely foreign religion interacting with the culture of Rome and its subjects.

>NT written in Greek
>One of the authors was Greek
>Earliest churches were in Greece
>STOP SPLITTING HAIRS IT'S THE SAME AS ISLAM!!!!1!!!!111

The language itself is essential bub and Greek is more "European" than Arabic. Regardless, you still can't ignore the fact that Rome is woven into the Gospel narrative.

Written in Greek.

I have enough bait for one evening but It's been fun lads. Goodnight and God bless.

So, are you just going to pretend as though Christianity itself isn't a product of Judaism? Not even Christian Identity is that fucking loopy.

>The language itself is essential bub and Greek is more "European" than Arabic. Regardless, you still can't ignore the fact that Rome is woven into the Gospel narrative.
It's not like Jesus was preaching in Greek to model Roman citizens. The language of the Gospels being in Greek IS essential, but in a way that just proves our point further. Had early Christianity not spread beyond Judaea, it would have likely not been Greek or as woven with Roman themes. Should Islam have spread into Europe and from both an early period and over the course of centuries been reduced into strictly European surroundings, it's not hard to imagine the Quran being written down or translated into another language.

Ok fine, one more reply.

Jesus did preach to Roman citizens:

>When Jesus had finished saying all this to the people who were listening, he entered Capernaum. 2 There a centurion’s servant, whom his master valued highly, was sick and about to die. 3 The centurion heard of Jesus and sent some elders of the Jews to him, asking him to come and heal his servant. 4 When they came to Jesus, they pleaded earnestly with him, “This man deserves to have you do this, 5 because he loves our nation and has built our synagogue.” 6 So Jesus went with them.

>He was not far from the house when the centurion sent friends to say to him: “Lord, don’t trouble yourself, for I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. 7 That is why I did not even consider myself worthy to come to you. But say the word, and my servant will be healed. 8 For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes; and that one, ‘Come,’ and he comes. I say to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.”

>9 When Jesus heard this, he was amazed at him, and turning to the crowd following him, he said, “I tell you, I have not found such great faith even in Israel.” 10 Then the men who had been sent returned to the house and found the servant well.

- Luke 7:1-10

Bye now.

>bye now

Oh wow are you mad.

Yes, just like how Muhammad had a Persian apostle who was very important and well-respected and said lots of interesting things about being a Persian in an Arab dominated land and religion, a complete coincidence I'm sure when one of the earliest and largest centers of early Muslim population in the 8th century was eastern Iran.

It's almost like religions were preaching to an audience they wanted to convert.

>Yes, just like how Muhammad had a Persian apostle who was very important and well-respected

And was also a traitor to his people and who is burning in hell as we speak.

t. Rostam Piruzdoost