Why isn't Renault in the US?

>french cars are for fags
>wants the faggiest car to ever roll on the road

>Twingo
>not Espace F1

Why drive a meme MPV when you can drive a F1-powered minivan?

Safety and emissions standards.

Because they're shit.

But then again I still see a lot of Fiat 500/500Ls so normies seem to be attracted to shit cars.

>doesn't like the twingo
Could you be a bigger faggot

America has much higher reliability standards than everywhere besides Japan.

Hideous

That's not a valid excuse. Especially considering Renault owns Nissan and a LOT of their cars are virtually interchangeable with Renault's.
>Nissan Versa/Renault Clio
>Nissan Sentra/Renault Megane
>Nissan Altima/Renault Laguna
>Nissan Rogue/Renault Koleos
>Nissan Juke/Renault Captur
and the list goes on and on. All Renault's current models, including the Twingo (because it's the sister car of pic related) can be easily made to conform to USA emissions and safety regulations with little effort/cost.

I thought Germany had pretty high standards

because even the average normie will think that they are too slow so imagine with the us safety standard.

I mean in terms of market expectations, not legislation

>I thought Germany had pretty high standards
That's the best joke I've ever heard.

I'm not sure about other bits of legislation, but EU regulations on diesel cars are more lenient than US ones. That's why VAG cars only exceeded the emissions limits by 8 times in the EU and something crazy like 30 times in the US.,

Safety and emissions standards are higher in the EU.

Go fuck yourself american piece of fat shit. Go drive your little penis compensative truck, faggot. Same for everyone ITT.

Safety and emissions standards legislations are more restrictive in the EU
Americans never cared about CO2

Much higher in EU

Which fucking sucks because its a major reason the japs didnt sell many of their more niche and enthusiast cars here.

depends on which emissions you're talking about. Yes, the Europeans are extremely strict on CO2 emissions (which makes no sense to anyone with a functioning brain and leads to everyone driving a 0.8L diesel econobox), but not much else. Meanwhile, Americans and Canadians are MUCH stricter on all other emissions like Nox levels.

In general, due to this, it is usually 1.2 to 2 or even 3 times as expensive to get a car to meet American emissions than to meet European emissions. American emissions are actually harder to pass.
>that moment you realize that while an American Chevy Silverado truck with a 5.3L V8 will produce a LOT more CO2 than your 0.8L Fiat Panda, the Chevy will actually pollute less actually harmful emissions than your Fiat.

Standing deal with Chrysler/Dodge?

Jesus christ the autism is palpable

>renault not in mexico

wat

That's not autism that's just being European

>Yes, the Europeans are extremely strict on CO2 emissions (which makes no sense to anyone with a functioning brain and leads to everyone driving a 0.8L diesel econobox),
SO MUCH THIS!

If the government was so worried about CO2 emissions, why not institute a tax for breathing or farting? It makes no goddamned sense. Farting cows make more CO2 emissions than cars ever have.

If that's true, why spend money to compete with yourself?

Because, to my knowledge, the Renault versions use conventional automatic transmissions instead of those god-awful CVT's Nissan loves to whore out. It's completely normal for a Nissan to go through 3 or 4 transmissions before hitting 100k miles.

>>that moment you realize that while an American Chevy Silverado truck with a 5.3L V8 will produce a LOT more CO2 than your 0.8L Fiat Panda, the Chevy will actually pollute less actually harmful emissions than your Fiat.

Fucking faggot
You are comparing a gasoline (the Chevrolet) to mostly DIESELS (60-70% of the market in europe). How does that make sense?
Diesels are only bought here because they consume less diesel and diesel is cheaper than gasoline. This is different in the USA because reasons i don't know probably cheating and eating Mcdonald are factors that plays a role also being huge cunts might get yourself a cheaper gasoline price.
But yea, we do have gasoline engines just like you do in america. Actually the only big difference between usa and europe's markets are the existence of trucks in the usa and not in europe.

Which harmful emissions is more harmfull than the others is another debate than i never will have time for.

>This is different in the USA because reasons i don't know probably cheating and eating Mcdonald are factors that plays a role also being huge cunts might get yourself a cheaper gasoline price.
It's different in the USA for the same reasons. It's a valid comparison.

We have cheaper gasoline because the US doesn't have as punitive a gas tax as EU countries do. They are intentionally herding you into buying diesels. Diesel is cheaper to refine, but wholly shit, the gasoline tax in the EU is phenomenal.

mexico here

we have renault, and peugeot, and seat, and essentially all the cheapo european brands except FUCKING CITROEN

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

this triggers the fuck out of me, because EVERYONE below mexico gets cozy, beautiful citroens BUT WE DONT. BRAZILIANS HAVE CITROEN, and we don't. we even get the hideous dacias like the duster rebranded as renault.

but still, no citroen.

we don't even have twingos. renault has no good cars here besides that new clio hot hatch thing.

Making vehicles fit US spec and safety is expensive. Done intentionally to not gray import vehicles (thanks mercedes).

After importing into the US some vehicles could be priced out of the bracket they appeal to. Acura TSX is the Accord in Europe.

No it's not.

He compares european diesels to american gasoline and then say american controls are better because they test NOX and other shit.
Basically what he said was fucking retarded.

Comapre american gasoline engines to european gasoline engine and oh my god it's the same fucking thing except europeans controls care more about CO2 emissions than the americans will ever do.

I'm european and I never drove a diesel in my entire life.

>wanting citroen

M8 they crap

Because American teenagers/young adults would rather buy old muscle cars/pickups than new hatchbacks.
Renault are popular in Europe because we have smaller roads and people are looking for sporty looking, yet practical cars. The American market isn't the same.

Would anyone really want a Renault? They are slow econoboxes, they look ugly to boot.

They're awful. Even America has some taste.

We have enough cheap shitboxes in the US, I don't think Renault would ever get a market share big enough to be worth it. And 'Murricans don't want city cars, the Fiat 500 sells but not very much. They also don't give a shit about 160HP city cars that clam to be fast, see- Fiat 500 Abarth.

I'm excited for the Alfas though, I think they realistically have a chance with their lineup. Plus they already have the Chrysler dealerships fo sell through.

>They are slow econoboxes

The Smart car still has a gaint ass waiting list in the Americas

...

>slow

>slow

>econoboxes

>slow econoboxes

>slow
youtube.com/watch?v=sEESHsPqx5k

>slow
youtube.com/watch?v=nzKMPIS3IAw

But they stoped making good Alfas like 5 years ago

What did these things actually cost new? It's one of those cars that neckbeards and benchracers would love to have, but never actually have the money to buy them. When they grow up a little bit and end up in a position financially to afford a car in that price range, they buy an E-Class or 5-Series. That's why the secondhand market for cars like this is always so fucked.

Oh come on now everyone, put aside the whole safety and emissions standards nonsense. There's one reason Renault along with virtually all the French and Italian makes are no longer here.

The 1970's and 80's.

Reliability and rust issues put a black cloud over all those brands, and as they were all occupying niche markets to begin with they couldn't attract enough buyers and so all bowed out of the U.S.

Which is sad because they've all made some really interesting, often very advanced cars, and some of the perceived faults were more lack of support here rather than poor design there.

They are coming back into market one at a time, Alfa and Fiat are back, it wouldn't be surprising to see Renault, Peugeot, or Citroen make the jump sooner or later.

The biggest obstacle they face now is all the Muricans out there with their Fix It Again Tony jokes who find it unfathomable that in twenty to thirty years a car company might be able to fix some defects in its product line...

I'm still down wit the Giulia.

V6 166 kW = Clio + 300 kg
2.0 130 kW = Clio sport

V6 was expensive, heavy .. but iconic

£26k new look at what they are selling for now

pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/renault/clio-v6

the v6 is extremely sought after, for such a young car the market has done really well with them.

I've only ever seen a couple of them and they were parked with the supercars at shows (not saying it's a supercar obviously) but for what the owners pay for them considering it's just a mk2 clio they seem to consider them worthy cars.

Only ever heard good things about them.

youtube.com/watch?v=mo6J53w-MzY

>£26k
So that thing will probably be $45k by the time it gets to the US and the buyer ticks a couple options boxes. There are a lot of other cars on the US market for the mid-$30s that would appeal to single guys in their late 20s to early 30s making $60k-$75k a year. STI, Golf R, Evo X, Focus RS...

but people want to be different, hence why the european focus rs sold so well over there. if they had released it to the american market in limited numbers no doubt it would have sold

>muh cc

But the few people wanting to be different doesn't translate into a lot of sales. Most car makers don't make much money at all on those performance versions, they bank on the regular econobox models. And I don't think French city cars will sell well at all in the US. We aren't flooded with Smarts or 500s yet even though they have been here for quite a few years. 'Murricans don't like going any smaller than Civics and Corollas. If you drove a Fiat 500 on our highways with all the giant trucks and Chebby Impalas, you would see what I mean.

yeah you're right, but what i mean by muh cc is that surely it being a 3.0 V6 must account for something when compared the I4 engine in those other rival options.

surely the american shopping in the market for a import hot hatch would prefer the car with the larger CC.

most of this is wrong, honestly.

Yeah man I agree that it's always cool having more hot hatches and sports cars in the $30k range, but like I said they are normally subsidized pretty heavily by sales of the lower trim models and I'm not sure Renault could ever take off in the US. At least Fiat and Alfa already have the Dodge dealership network setup to sell out of, so that is a big step. And Meecedes dealers sell the Smart cars. So that's another huge undertaking. Renault would need a partnership with GM dealerships or something to make that transition a little easier. Maybe even manufacture some of their cheaper cars in North America like VW does to keep costs down.

soon...

C5 is lovely

i quite like the giulietta

How so? They were all here at one time or another, most were gone by the early nineties, Alfa Romeo being the last to leave if I'm not mistaken.

They all tried to exist primarily as semi-upmarket, niche brands and all ran into trouble with quality issues.

Hell, Lancia had to buy Beta's back en masse as they were practically rusting on the dealer lots.

To be fair, Renault itself did seem to be the best of the group build wise, at least in the eighties, though its dealer-network became the unreliable bit.

The muddled mixture of Renault, AMC, and then Chrysler via AMC's purchase left Renault without its dealer network and with a shady future regarding future sales and support for cars sold.

Today though, being grouped in with Nissan they do potentially have a strong network if they do return. And with Infiniti aiming high at BMW and Mercedes, Renault could potentially slot between Nissan and Infiniti in the U.S. market.

Nigga, are you high?
>Versa/Clio
The Versa is a subcompact, the Clio is a supermini
>Sentra/Megane
Sentra is a compact, the Megane is a small family car, so it is much bigger.
>Altima/Laguna
The Altima is a mid-size, the Laguna is bigger.
I won't argue about the SUVs.

>not understanding what VW actually did
>posting a facebook meme
Your kind should stay in the Jalopnik comments section.

wut?

Those size classes actually amount to the same size you fucking retard. He was right.

I do drive a 500 on the highway m8. And I don't see what you mean. You sound a bit booty blasted about small cars desu

>booty blasted
Wut?

I don't like driving small cars personally, and there's very few reasons to do so in the US unless you live in a very congested inner city. I mean, they get the job done, but you might as well just get a Civic or other compact or mid size sedan in 95% of the US. Not even like gas mileage or price is going to be a big enough difference to make people choose a tiny city car over a Civic (assuming they are willing to drive them anyway).

Judging by the amount of Smart Cars and Fiat 500s on the road, I'm not the only one who dislikes driving small cars. And at least Fiat's design is somewhat exciting so they can sell some 500s to middle aged women, but Renault wouldn't have that going for them if they came into the US market.

>We aren't flooded with Smarts or 500s yet
Those cars are memes. I've only ever seen people driving them as status/fashion symbols. The only Abarth I've ever seen was driven by an old lady. It's the same with Minis too.

That's kinda the thing. Aside from the meme city cars, do you think the rest of Renault's lineup is exciting enough to make sales over the existing cars on the US market? If they could offer Kia-tier pricing and options, I could see people buying them, but I don't think that's going to be the case. At least Fiats and Alfas have the Italian "muh passion" meme going for them. Plus like I mentioned earlier, Fiat and Alfa have the Chrysler dealership network to help them out too.

>Plus like I mentioned earlier, Fiat and Alfa have the Chrysler dealership network to help them out too.
and Renault has the Nissan network to help them out.

>what is a gross exaggeration

Ahh, that is true. I forgot Renault was still aligned with Nissan.

I don't think I would ever step foot into a Nissan-Renault dealership. Who the hell buys Maximas and Altimas anyway? Is there anything about them that is better than their competition? I would consider Infinitis over Acuras although I'm not really drawn to the new Q series. I liked the M sedans.

Fuck I want some of these so badly.
>$30+k to import a decent one
kill me

The upshot of Renaults in a Renault/Nissan dealer is the Renaults would be more reliable because no CVT.

The autonotsotragic gearbox of the Talisman is godly.

youtube.com/watch?v=sm_4DWsT4D0

THIS IS WHY THE GOOF NISSANS STOPPED BEING SOLD.
1999 buyout of Nissan by Renault. The 240sx stops production in the states, the skyline stops being sold everywhere a few years later. The only performance vehicle in nissan's lineup for the next few years I the lackluster SE-R and the slowZ.
Fuck renault

if it weren't for renault, nissan would go bankrupt and end up dead you deluded weeb

It would've been better to die than to suffer a death through warranty replacements of CVT transmissions. Those CVT transmissions have to be losing them millions just because they have to replace them so often via warranty.

Maybe booty blasted was the wrong phrase, but you are most definitely biased against small cars. But you only keep bringing up the 500 and fortwo, and those aren't the only tiny cars on the road ( for glorious USA anyway). Prius c, spark, mazda 2, Yaris, etc.
Also I think you're missing a valuable piece of car buying , what it looks like is important and a lot of Americans want a strong looking car so they will stray away from the "cuter" looking rides.
Even though it's a bit anecdotal, I'd like to mention that the amount of 500s, I've been seeing day today has been increasing, I see more and more being parked in driveways, and I hope this is a national trend cuz i quite like my fiat and would like them to stay put in the states this time around.
>middle aged women
>it's a girls car
As far as I've seen, it's about a 50/50 split, so you're just h8n senpai

I do think the civic (or other midsize) is a better purchase in the current market, in america, for an average buyer. So I agree with you there.

>higher government standards in EU

Totally wrong. It's not so much that one is tighter than the other, it's that they have completely different focus. EU crash tests focus on offset and angled impacts, US crash tests focus on dead-ahead impacts. US safety requirements include protection for unbelted passengers, which the EU lacks, while the EU includes standards for pedestrian impacts, which the US lacks.

As for emissions, the EU regulates CO2 directly, while the US doesn't regulate it at all (except indirectly through CAFE). However the US sets much stricter standards than the EU for pollutants that cause localized urban smog (NOx, HC).

Even the lighting requirements are different. EU mandates standardized colors and locations for running/signal lights, US doesn't care, but focuses instead on minimum sizes, heights, and viewing angles. As for headlights, they have completely different patterns they have to match - the US's more focused on downroad visibilty, the EU's more focused on glare prevention.

I do know that a lot of otherwise-ok european cars don't make it to the US simply because the interiors can't be made to pass our asinine unbelted-passenger test - rigid structural elements too close to the driver with no room for padding, that sort of thing.

That's not the american impression of a Renault. The American impression of a Renault is a rusty-ass '83 Alliance sitting on a flat tire, abandoned in the gravel lot across the street from the Walmart parking lot. If you see them on the road at all, they are holding up traffic, belching blue smoke, and shedding body parts.

I saw a really, really clean Renault last weekend, though. It was fucking mint, something like 40k miles, must have been an actual little-old-lady car. It was in a Pick n' pull yard and had old auction stickers on the windows. I walked past it to grab some Cavalier parts.

>The biggest obstacle they face now is all the Muricans out there with their Fix It Again Tony jokes who find it unfathomable that in twenty to thirty years a car company might be able to fix some defects in its product line...

Except that they are jumping into the American market and doing the exact same thing again. The 500's are some of the least reliable cars on the American market, right down there with the Dodge Journey, the new Cherokee, and the GL Mercedes. It certainly didn't help that this time they hitched their wagon to Chrysler, the company who's produced the least reliable American brands for at a minimum the past decade.

>surely the american shopping in the market for a import hot hatch would prefer the car with the larger CC.
You'd think that, but it doesn't work out that way. A "3.0 V6", to an American, makes us think of a lazy, high-torque pushrod V6 that you use to push a Taurus or Camry or Lumina up to freeway speed without the 4-speed automatic ever breaking 3500 rpm. The hot-hatch crowd in the US loves to brag about high redlines, kind of the exact opposite deal.

When Ford brought the original SVT Focus to the US, it put "7000 RPM Redline" in the TV ad.

Also, modern turbos are just so good and lag free now, they they can reproduce the kind of low-RPM grunt that american's used to get from large-displacement engines.

I swear, the current Passat, the car weighs as much as a mid-80's Crown Vic, yet that 1.8 turbo pushes it around in stop-and-go as effortlessly as the vic's 5.0. Always low RPM but with power always just right there, no need for downshift.

i didnt think people actually bought the magazine anymoire

Easier to pirate.

I've done warranty work on a Versa and the part box has both Nissan and Renault on the box.

But Renault only uses CVTs on 2 or 3 models and it's not exactly popular. Meanwhile, at Nissan... It's in fucking everything.

>old car looks good
>new one doesn't
Le surprise!

I barely see any of those Mazda 2's, Yaris's, or any other tiny shitbox on the road either. Chevy Aveo didn't sell for shit. Those are the cheapest possible cars and with the leasing and financing in America, why not get a more practical car for $20/mo more? Those tiny cars don't even have the parking space meme going for them in the US. I'm just saying I'm not the only 'Murrican who doesn't like small cars. And I live in a fairly urban area. More spaced-out suburban areas, seems like it's the middle aged houswife who traded her ML or X3 for the Fiat 500 because the kids are grown and she wanted something cute.

I'm down to see more Fiats and Alfas on the road, but who the hell is going to buy a Renault? The tiny cars don't have a market, and I'm not sure what they can do with the rest of their lineup unless they can get some fleet deals going with big companies. It's not luxury like other European brands. It's not known for reliability like Japanese brands. And it's not a Ford.

At least Kias look mildly good and come with lots of options and a decent warranty at an affordable price. Renault needs to do something like that to reach the average American and I don't see it happening.

Not my fault you bought a girl's car. But I think Fiat at least has a better chance in the US than Renault does.

>Chevy Aveo didn't sell for shit.
They sold like wildfire from 2004-2006. Enough that GM actually thought of launching performance parts for it through GM Performance Parts.
Among the proposed parts was a Cobalt Ecotec engine swap kit.

>you're comparing a Co2 spewing machine, meaning emissions that might be able to be easily recaptured and might cause ocean acidification and higher temps at the worst if left alone
>to a shitbox that causes acid rain (and, if it's a bimmer, doesn't do anything to reduce it)
>how does that make sense?

How was that not his point?

Yurop = Co2 is a scary buzzword, let's focus on that. The fuck is a nox?
'Murica = Priorities in order