Daytrading

With a 95% failure rate in the short-term, and a 99.9% failure rate over any statistically significant period of time, it's not for anyone.

Except morons.

that's why you're either the 5% or you don't bother.

I know it's hard and not for most people

>hard to get hired
If you have the money to put up, they'll most likely hire you. It is a great learning experience but can be expensive to trade with a prop firm. Where are you located? Anywhere near NYC?

>would you be willing to let me try trading in your chat room
No sorry, we run a pretty small room and we don't get new people often. Not that we're all geniuses or anything but we all have known each other for a while. If you want to send me some journals or your execution charts though I would be happy to take a look, maybe after a while you can join us if you're still serious. [email protected] is my throwaway email, feel free to send anything you want looked at. Or just start posting them in this thread and we can take a look.

I could also recommend a few rooms that I know to be quality, they're all on a subscription basis though. What I used to do was try them all out for the trial period (usually a month) and see which ones I liked best. If you want I will get a list together for you.

>Thinks he'll be in the 5% to beat the odds.
>Thinks his "skill" or "experience" will carry the day.
>Thinks 95% should just "git gud."
Thank for the chuckle, kid. You remind me why lotteries make so much money. There's one born every minute.

Don't bother explaining yourself to people like this... waste of time and energy.

I will email you shortly, and yeah I get it so no worries. I will write up a bit about myself and some of my common trades/strategy in the email and would appreciate any of your help.
If you can send me the list of the trial rooms through email that'd probably be best. I've never tried one, I always heard it's hard to find a legit one with most of them operating for the monthly fees or not consistently showing profits. but we'll see

thanks for the chuckle too mr. 95%

Lip balm not lipstick. Lipstick is gay nigga

>Don't bother trying to perpetuate the myth of daytrading with rational-sounding arguments to people who know the truth and don't settle for bullshit answers ... waste of time and energy.
ftfy

Now get back to your safespace before you learn something useful.

Gentlemen.
The official chat is recruiting, we help each other out and make eachother money. We can use a few more leaders.

Come on in, this invite expires in 30 mins
discord.gg/yc965

bravo sir you know the truth indeed.

Live and let live. Sharks love to make money off retards like him. Let natural selection take its time.

>dumballs watched too much wolf on wall st
>wants to become rich from trading
>probably doing it because socially inept and thinks money = honeys
>will probably lose all his money as he said he's on the verge of it
>may or may not learn
>dies a poor virgin
>thatslife.png

shit ive been waiting for you guys to post for over a month, about time

Nice projecting... I've been consistently profitable for years and I enjoy what I do, enjoy your shitposting on the interwebs cuz that's probably all you have in life.

i've emailed you user, hope to hear from you soon.

lol I know right, I have already met a handful of them making serious money and doing it mostly for fun because they don't need to work anymore.

if the bar for entry is set low you're going to get a bunch of failures

95% failure means you don't beat the market.

Not necessarily that you wipe an account or lose money.

I'd take 6 years of daytrading averaging 30% per annum, and then being mediocre and not outperforming the market then getting cucked by 6-10% yearly returns.

The bar for entry to daytrading isn't low, considering the capital requirements established by FINRA to weed out the true beginners.

What's telling is that 99% of the those truly committed and backed by meaningful cash still can't make it work. On a risk-adjusted basis, day-trading is one of the worst ways to squander your wealth.

Yes exactly, anyone can trade. That statistic also includes people who basically opened a brokerage account, threw some money at a stock based on a rumor they heard, lost everything, and never traded again. Then they go around saying that the market is a scam. It's not my fault you were too dumb to make it...

>The bar for entry to daytrading isn't low,
You have no idea what you're talking about.

>failure means you don't beat the market.
Exactly. If you can't beat the market while still taking on greater risk, you're misallocating your capital. It's the definition of poor investing.

>I'd take 6 years of daytrading averaging 30% per annum, and then being mediocre and not outperforming the market
Sounds nice in your head, but you've got it backwards. You'll get a few weeks or months of outperformance every so often, but six aggregate years of underperformance. At the end of the day, you'll realize you failed to beat a simple index benchmark, and you'll give up. Or you'll keep doing it because you're too stupid to know otherwise.

>That statistic also includes people who basically opened a brokerage account, threw some money at a stock based on a rumor they heard, lost everything, and never traded again
No it doesn't. Read the studies. Your bubble of denial or ignorance only persists because you intentionally ignore the facts.

>considering the capital requirements established by FINRA to weed out the true beginners

Please, can you tell us what the minimum requirement for opening an account on Robinhood is?

>I would like to get some experience at a prop firm

Have you tried l looking at TopStepTrader?

futures.io/vendors-product-reviews/11360-anybody-heard-topsteptrader-review.html

reddit.com/r/finance/comments/165bbs/graduating_in_may_how_do_i_break_into_trading_at/
>I currently trade through them. They are extremely high quality and professional. Their sole purpose is to incubate traders through their simulator and once you have reached their performance objectives they will take you live.

reddit.com/r/traders/comments/kkh4d/i_recently_got_a_job_at_a_prop_firm_ama/
>if anyone is interested in futures prop trading I trade with a prop firm that funds traders if they can prove they can trade. It's not easy though.
No Buy in but there is a software fees for the data and such to prove if you can trade. Once you clear Combine under their parameters you get funded.

elitetrader.com/et/index.php?threads/non-employees-trading-prop-shop-money.296347/
>I'm not sure whether they'll necessarily fit into your definition of a "prop shop", but TopStepTrader will, if you can briefly demonstrate the reliability of your trading by passing one of their "Combines". They have some risk-management rules to be maintained, of course (as anyone putting up funding for someone they don't really know obviously would), but it's one of the fastest ways of achieving funding, if you can satisfy their parameters. They're well-established, reliable, responsive and ethical, and their profit-sharing terms are about as generous as you'll find.

faculty.haas.berkeley.edu/odean/papers/Day Traders/Day Trading and Learning 110217.pdf

>80% of all day traders quit within two years
>occasional day traders and first-timers account for 74% of all day traders

>Please, can you tell us what the minimum requirement for opening an account on Robinhood is?
What does opening a (limited) brokerage account have to do with day-trading? Please do some research before wasting our time.

Any chance you can share some materials suggestions on learning proper day trading?

futures.io/wiki/trading-wiki/FuturesTrader71
In 2011, FT71 took another step towards creating a retail trading experience that more closely resembled that found in a proprietary trading setting, when he became Executive Vice President of VanKar Trading Corporation. In November 2012, FT71 advanced those efforts when he created and became Managing Partner of a new brokerage, Stage 5 Trading Corporation. Along with risk monitoring and client interaction, Stage 5 implemented a structured learning environment for clients.

iqfeed.net/seertrading/index.cfm?web=iqfeed&displayaction=data§ion=software
Stage 5 Trading Corp (S5T) is a high-end online futures broker. Our specialties:
Specialized client services for the individual trader
Unique client monitoring system to provide personalized assistance to traders including trade analysis
Professional Trader (FT71) monitored client only structured learning environment. (Homework, Chat Room, Webinars, Etc.)

>What does opening a (limited) brokerage account have to do with day-trading?
Are you kidding? First you open the brokerage account, then you trade.

Are you just shitposting at this point?

futures.io/brokers-data-feeds/25174-stage-5-trading-broker-review-futurestrader71-www-stage5trading-com.html

>Anthony is great! Every single question I have he has an answer and there platform there allows FT71 to watch your trades so that he can give you feed back. I think this is great for newer people like me!

>What do you mean FT71 is able to watch your trades? He can see your chart? Your method?

>he can see your trades executed because is your broker but most important is he can watch your risk and help you
>FT71 and the others at Stage 5 do a really good job of trying to help their clients get the best education and help so they survive trading.

>I would imagine people that have that opinion fit into one of two camps.
>a) They think their method is top secret and want to protect their edge from prying eyes. Well, I got news, if you can't trust your broker then you shouldn't give them your money.
>b) They are embarrassed by their losses and don't want the broker to see them.
>I assume the case is (b) here, and I would encourage you to set aside that way of thinking and instead just openly ask for help. @FuturesTrader71 is one of extremely few in this industry that is really trying to help people and he tells it how it is. That is why I've invited him on futures.io (formerly BMT) for countless webinars and AMA's, I appreciate his work and effort in the industry.
>Bottom line, don't be afraid of your losing streak and just ask for the damn help. FT71 will give good advice to set you on the right path, and then if you are willing to do the work you stand a chance of learning to improve your trading.

>Stage 5 has a plugin that allows you to export a trade report so they can determine how your trade performed. They will also help you to better understand the market. I only used it through a demo and they treated me like I had a funded account and a VIP client.

futures.io/brokers-data-feeds/19758-vankar-previously-ft71-but-no-longer.html

>I have talked to FT71 many times, and he seems genuinely interested in being as different as possible from what is considered "the norm". He told me (I am paraphrasing here) he started the brokerage primarily because he found people were not being truthful with him when he was trying to help them with their trades. They would say they did one thing, when in fact they did something completely different. So FT71 was basically wasting his time because people were just flat lying to him. He wanted to be able to look directly at their actual trades, and for the client to give that permission, and if they didn't - he didn't take them seriously.
>if FT71 can prevent them from blowing up (huge if), then it would obviously be worth it.
>the reason to join VanKar. The reason is because you are a "student" of FT71, you like him and what he stands for, and you want his help to improve your trading. That is what he is offering, and it is a big item. I think people would join VanKar for this reason alone, and pretty much disregard almost everything else. FT71 says he wants to hold you accountable. He says he will call you up if you are making stupid decisions with risk loss limits on your account, and he will try to convince you to go to sim. This is the kind of stuff that separates him.

futures.io/brokers-data-feeds/19758-vankar-previously-ft71-but-no-longer-6.html

>FT71: I'm in charge of trading operations, handling traders as I did in prop and watching risk as well as helping traders to overcome their obstacles. This is what I like doing and is the reason I'm involved with brokerage. As a broker, I can see what folks are doing and can focus my analysis and effort on how they traded.

I highly doubt there are any profitable "intraday day traders" forex retail traders 2016. Just seems very weird idea altogether

HFT is a different world, that's insanely profitable money printing machine for even some smaller houses there is no question. Virtu had 1 losing day among 1238 days, goldman had 20 losing days past ~1000 days

blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/11/13/virtus-losing-day-was-1-in-1238-odds-says-it-shouldnt-have-happened-at-all/

>then you trade
Trading and day-trading aren't the same thing. Day-trading is a defined investment strategy. It has a specific meaning, used by both researchers and regulators. Not all trading, even short-term trading, is day trading.

I feel silly for not realizing I was talking to a total noob. No wonder you're having a hard time following the discussion.

You can day trade on Robinhood you dumbass

You can day-trade at any brokerage you want, assuming you meet the barrier to entry (i.e., the FINRA capital requirements). Your brokerage has nothing to do with day-trading itself.

>Are you mentally challenged? Your posts are all over the board. Maybe you should slow down and think about what you want to say before posting

Gentlemen, There is a difference between the rules for equities in a margin account and futures. The FINRA rule (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pattern_day_trader) requiring you toh ave $25k if you trade equities in margin more than 4 times per 5 days does not apply to futures and forex or even cash(nonmargin) equities accounts.

>futures and forex
Hue hue hue. You really want to open that can of worms?

These threads both make me chuckle and yet make me sad too. So much hilarious delusion and misinformation, and yet so many sad, pathetic people.

I concede Forex has a lot of problems but what do you think is wrong with Futures?

The PDT rules doesn't stop anyone from daytrading, it just establishes rules for settlement of funds.

I can walk into any prop firm with a few grand in my pocket and they'll back me with the firm's money, and then I can trade all day to my heart's content.

Dude sorry but you don't know what you're talking about... If I had fucking $10 to my name I could open an account and trade intraday.

I would love to hear what your background is since you seem sooooo knowledgable

OP here, sorry for the late reply. Checking those links out right now. Would you be opposed to chatting more in length off of here? thanks

I was fortunate enough to have a few mentors but I can tell you some of the books I've read and a lot of information is available via google and youtube.

Trade Mindfully - Achieve Your Optimum Trading Performance with Mindfulness and Cutting Edge Psychology (mental discipline)

Trading_in_the_Zone by Mark Douglas (more mental discipline and general info)

Jesse_Livermore-How_To_Trade_In_Stocks (one of the legends in trading/investing, his rules are very reliable today)

Market_Wizards by Jack D. Schwager (interviews some of the finest traders)

>The PDT rules doesn't stop anyone from daytrading, it just establishes rules for settlement of funds.
This is true. You can make more than 4 trades per 5 days with less than $25k by ditching the margin account and using a cash only account. But in this type of account it takes equities three days to settle and it takes one day for options to settle.

>I would love to hear what your background is since you seem sooooo knowledgable
And so it begins ... Every day-trading thread, every time ....

You morons don't like having the truth paraded in your faces. You don't like being told about the studies. You hate being called out for exaggerating your performance.

And so you attack the person who's trying to educate you. Great logic.

Protip: When your best, or only, retort is to attack the person you're debating, you already lost the debate.

why are you even posting?

>you morons don't like having the truth paraded in your faces

so quit wasting your time?

That's true. Also consider that you don't have to trade every single day. When I was first starting out, I would make trades and then have to wait for my cash to become available. Either that, or rotate cash used on a sort of FIFO basis like so:

>Monday trade with 5k
>Tuesday trade with 5k
>Wednesday trade with 5k
>Thursday trade with 5k
>Friday trade with 5k
>repeat

Not ideal, but you can do it. Anyone maxing out their buying power every single day is going to blow up eventually anyway.

I never said anything to attack you
I respectfully asked you what it your opinion is wrong with Futures.

So get lost loser. You aren't contributing shit. You haven't posted this "study", and you just deflected my question, so fuck off.

>you don't have to trade every single day
>Anyone maxing out their buying power every single day is going to blow up eventually anyway.
Recently I've been playing with some montecarlo type stuff and this makes me absolutely agree with you.

Let me rephrase that... you SHOULDN'T trade every single day. lol. A good trader knows how to sit on the sidelines for the right opportunity.

Just playing around with very simplistic MC has really shown me that with the same strategy but different randomized results you can get some WILD swings. And by focusing on managing risk the swings are greatly reduced.

Yep. That's why my recent studies have been on institutional levels on the 4H, 1D, 1W timeferames.

>what it your opinion is wrong with Futures
While futures contracts are not inherently more risky than the underlying asset, they are a poor choice for anything other than risk management and speculation. Compared to equities, you're automatically losing the approximately 2% dividend yield that boosts the performance of stocks as a while. I also strongly suspect that your overall transaction costs are higher.

Furthermore, while its not a knock on futures directly, the fact remains that they are very often mis-used by investors. As with options, the risk needle moves very wildly with futures.

And, importantly, adding leverage to your account doesn't change the odds of your bet being correct. It simply changes the stakes.

>so quit wasting your time?
I'm trying to save those who are smarter than you.

>If you only lose 1% every other day its much better than losing 1% every day.

oh yes very noble of you, save the ambitious people from achieving something you clearly cannot. good thing we have you here.

You're welcome. I also tell people that playing the lottery is foolish too. Like you, some people don't listen. But it needs to be said, nonetheless.

You've listed some pretty good reasons but there are some advantages to Futures such as

Futures have much better tools with much better information such as
volume delta studies that you see in MarketDelta footprint chart and SierraCharts numberbars charts. I dont know any equities brokers that offer such powerful equities trading platforms or even volume at the bid/ask data in their APIs, if you do know of such an offering please let me know.
and you have the Commitment of Traders reports which is absolutely a goldmine.

Futures are only traded on one exchange at the CBOT vs equities are traded on dozens and doses of exchanges around the country, only some of them are "lit" and many of them are "dark". This means in futures you dont have the all kinds of HFT arbitrage games that you do have in equities.

oh and I almost forgot

in equities its not always easy to short, for a variety of reasons including the downtick rule and whether or not your stock brokerage actually has any available stock to borrow, that's not a problem in futures.

and many equities (and forex) brokers do payment for orderflow, and like I said all futures trading takes place one the single central exchange at the CME so that doest happen with futures.

something else came to mind during a flash crash
in equities there may be halts or rollbacks you may think you put on a trade(such as a hedge) but later find out your order was cancelled and you where in fact dangling in the wind. during the event your orders where canceled but you dont know which where and which where not so you have no way of knowing how much risk is on and how much is hedged.
but during the flash crashes futures continued to trade without any trades being canceled or halts.

well yeah, the lottery is gambling.

Yes that's a huge part of any strategy. Have you read Van K Tharp's books? He does a lot of great work on risk management and sizing.

>later find out your order was cancelled and you where in fact dangling in the wind.

I actually have seen this happen to a couple traders. Ever seen a guy smash his computer screen apart with his keyboard? Lol. Let's say you buy at the bottom of a nasty flash crash, then sell a couple points higher as the stock recovers. It is possible that the exchange will break your buy order and leave you with just the sale- essentially sticking you in a short position when the stock is now rallying. And unfortunately there's nothing you can really do about it.

The day traders in this thread can you tell me does news effect your trading? Or do you rely on technical/ fundamental analysis for the most part?

Exactly what I was talking about.
and not being able to know whether or not one or more of your orders went through until after the fact because any one of them could be canceled has probably got to be one of the most worst aspects while trading equities during such a volatile event.

Now that I think about it more, Im not sure everything applies to equities in a country with a centralized exchange such as in Australia I think there is only one stock exchange because the exchange pretty much has a monopoly on all the liquidity in Australia vs in the USA there are many dozens of different exchanges and many of them are "dark".

I havent gotten to read these yet but they are on my list to get to
Super Trader. Make Consistent Profits in Good and Bad Markets
Safe Strategies for Financial Freedom
Trade Your Way to Financial Freedom
Financial Freedom Through Electronic Day Trading

technical analysis always. when you watch enough you'll see that news does nothing that wasn't already planned

For some of my strategies yes, news provides a catalyst. For instance some dumbass news comes out about a Tesla catching fire, the stock tanks, I will look for a spot to buy since I think the news is overblown. I don't trade solely on news though, it just provides the catalyst. You need something tangible for a trade. So lets say in this Tesla example, after the news hits, right away a bunch of small sell orders go off. That's the news algos. Then that is followed, with a little delay, by many more small sellers. That's retail chasing the news. Now it keeps selling off for a little bit, everyone jumps on the bandwagon, some stops get hit, Cramer says Tesla is finished, you know usual panicky bullshit. Now the stock is down a couple points, let's say it was at 220 and now it's getting close to 200. Well let's also say that's close to the 200 or 50 sma, where a lot of funds' buy programs will kick in. So I watch a little longer, and these little orders are still selling into the bid. 200, 300 share lots. Then it gets lower, and the offer starts getting taken. 100, 200 at a time. Then suddenly you see the offer light up. 100k appears on the bid. That's a buy. I buy right there. Not because of news, but because the news created this situation for me.

You write well.

>got to be one of the most worst aspects while trading equities during such a volatile event.
Yeah but that comes with the territory. These events also provide the opportunity for the biggest, quickest gains.

>Trade Your Way to Financial Freedom
Read this one first.

news algos? I didn't know that existed, thanks for sharing that.

pretty dodgy, you might as well go fund an account at an FCM yourself after trying the same thing for free on a sim

it isn't like they're really backing you financially either, seems more like they ramp up your size as you grow the account yourself... while carrying on getting a nice % of the profits regardless + whatever they load on top of clearing fees

you're also about a decade or so too late for a realistic shot at this game - if it was 2004 you could go to say marex in London, get put on a TT Sim for 8 weeks and if you survived get a funded account that could ramp up quite rapidly if you show consistency... draws from the account each month with the profit split applied - so you'll start each month flat. no need to 'grow the account' as you're trading their money and they're more than capable of ramping up your size and giving you X000 lots to throw around if you're at the top of your game

the thing is that this sort of stuff just isn't as viable any more, point and click trading + crude autospredders tend to lose to high frequency liquidity providers who can beat you to the front of the queue at any given price and will step out of the way at exactly the right time when you don't want to be filled.

there are still people making money trading manually but they're much, much rarer and they've generally extended their average holding period

I hear a lot of people say the HFT's will beat them and I don't disagree that you can't be faster and lose out on a few cents to them consistently, but I don't see why you can't make great money still today with a solid strategy and good management. Could you elaborate if I'm misunderstanding the situation?

Thanks. Just creating a situation like this in my head gets me all amped up lol. Watching a stock capitulate is really something amazing to see. A crazy phenomena of human behavior where we discover the value of something... and if you can make a couple grand off it then its even better lol

Yeah, pretty common. They are some of the easiest algos to create so there are a lot of small shops running them. All you have to do is screen for keywords, you know something like:

IF headline = tsla AND fire
THEN market sell 100 tsla

obviously that's not the exact code but not too complicated to make.

>you're also about a decade or so too late for a realistic shot at this game
Unfortunately, this. Prop firms have realized they don't have to risk their own money because every asshole out there wants to be a trader.

This is something I've been thinking about since watching 6B during the Brexit. The institutions said they collected their own data and ran models to predict the outcome and they concluded that Bremain was certain and they said that the interpreted a Leave as bearish and Bremain as bullish. Since their models where predicting Bremain they all piled on to long bullish positions. Then right as the first results where coming in watching the B6 "time and sales" and the orderbook you could see that there was a extreme disparity in the liquidity at the bid and offer. Pretty much all of the liquidity t buy was completely dried up because the market makers actually pulled their quotes. And there was a huge number of orders stacking up on the sell side to sell at market(sell with market orders). Nobody wanted to buy. The central banks themselves had to step in and be the market maker of last resorts because everyone else pulled their quotes. And this isnt the only interesting thing to ponder about this. The official position of the institutions was that Leave was Extremely bearish and that Remain was bullish. But a strong argument could be made that for many reasons the EU is a sinking ship and that remaining on that should ultimately be bearish, and the UK freeing itselm from that should be bullish. So in this, the fundamentals the institutions purported makes no consistent sense at all!
Unless the institutions where playing us all along. And this may be the case because the institutions are engineering "fake outs" at least once per weak on a scale smaller than the brexit. If you study market structure closely you can see at least once per weak what could only be described as the institutions engineering what looks like a perfetly good technical analysis signal but it ends up being in the opposite direction.

This orderflow is exactly what Im talking about.

Why should I learn day trading instead of just, say, counting cards?

well the issue is that lots of the edges, the things that people doing this sort of thing would have exploited, are less exploitable these days as a result of HFT firms going after the same thing and being better at it

I mean the low hanging fruit has truly vanished, some firms used to train grads to trade various spread strategies in STIRS - they'd have a room full of 20-somethings with auto spreading software quoting away, waiting for a fill... they'd get filled, wait for the spread to move, get filled again... just a room full of junior traders following a very basic mean reversion strategy while occasionally stepping out of the way of or trading the reaction to bits of news, economic releases etc..

that sort of stuff is easily replicated (much more efficiently) with a few algos these days and you can get rid of your room full of junior traders using crappy auto spreaders and replace them with much faster collocated algos being babysat by just one junior trader who occasionally has to react to unexpected events or stop an algo etc.. while his senior collages spend their day data wrangling and looking for new edges, making tweaks/adjustments to the algos

it isn't like the edges most of these locals were exploiting were particularly secret, the game now is simply being the first in line to exploit them by battling for queue position and as a result they've generally become smaller, less exploitable and the markets more efficient

Man, it's all about the order flow. When there's something real happening I don't even look at the chart, my eyes are glued to the level 2 screen. You see that red or green flying past and it tells you all you need to know...

Back in the old days they didn't have real-time charts, order book, and of these tools, and these guys still learned to crush it. Ticker tape didn't even tell you whether something was a buy or a sale- just the time, size and price. Ever read Reminiscences? Livermore was the fucking Da Vinci of tape reading. Unfortunately, nobody learns this nowadays. The only reason I trade this way is because my old boss has been trading for like 15 years, and that's how HIS old boss taught him.

tradingeducationblogs.com/tape-reading-the-stock-market/

what you described here and
>Just creating a situation like this in my head gets me all amped up lol. Watching a stock capitulate is really something amazing to see.

are exactly what got me interested in trading a few years ago. There are sites out there that show you the orderbook and time and sales of bitcoin exchanges and I was fascinated in watching the orderbook. It was thinking about the orderflow, it wasnt indicators, macd, stochastics, or whatever else.

Good passage

tradingeducationblogs.com/tape-reading-the-stock-market/

>He was simply reading it and found the reason amusing. Modern tape readers can use the news to trade stocks in play. The correct way to implement this strategy is to use the news as a catalyst to find stocks in play, but…you are ultimately going to trade the price action.

>There is a difference between a catalyst and trade management. Struggling traders believe a catalyst or an edge will translate into profitability. Your edge, or any reason to be in a trade, is only the first part of the trading equation. The money is made or lost in trade management.

The first trading book I read was Daemon Goldsmith Order Flow Trading for Fun and Profit

Man you will go far if you really are passionate about this niche... I mean it when I say it's a dying craft. What do you use to watch tape? The best I've seen is Lightspeed, also was helpful to be in the financial district so latency was very low.

this makes sense to me and fucking sucks lol. I hope I can find something where I'm not risking my own money eventually.

>The first trading book I read was Daemon Goldsmith Order Flow Trading for Fun and Profit
Submited post before finishing what I was going to say: after reading that book that sort of made it so I read everything else through these rose tinted glasses. As I read books like Schabacker ad Edwards&Magee I saw that the concepts underlying what they where getting at was the orderflow but they didnt use the orderflow terminology.

desu with technical analysis I imagined the market would drop a week in advance, and it failed to do so for about 4-5 days, so I thought brexit should take it there. I even predicted the first bottom in NQ futures, at 4341.75 and during the news about brexit it tanked, and bounced off of 4341.25 pretty hard. It was remarkable but that's what technical analysis is capable of. Unfortunately all brokers spiked the contract margin requirements that weekend and I was rejected when I tried to short just before the news came out :(

idk why it says desu but I meant to say "actually" lol

Won't happen lol. If you don't have any skin in the game, why should anyone trust you? Hedge funds even require a portion to be funded with management capital. The GP might fund 10% and the LP 90%, just to make sure the manager's interests are aligned.

When I traded for T3, my arrangement was that I put up my own equity and in exchange got the firm's leverage and systems. Then we split the profits 70/30 in my favor. So let's say I put up $10k of my money, the firm allows me to trade with $250k. If I lose a thousand bucks, it comes out of my account. If I make a thousand bucks, I keep 700 and the firm keeps 300. Kind of sucks that they shift most of the risk to the trader, but it's smart business for them.

do you know if that's how it usually is, with you risking 100% and making only a portion that you agreed upon? With the few clients I know who wanted to offer me funds to trade, I believe they were willing to split profits but take on the risk. i'm not ready for it either way but I would definitely prefer that of course

>Unfortunately, nobody learns this nowadays

not really true, plenty of algos trade off T&S data... frankly for liquid futures the human eye can't keep up with it, all you're seeing on the level 2/price ladder with retail software will tend to be a filtered view and even that is updating on a millisecond basis

>successful daytraders

you can find a lot of them in the scam and gambling section.

Thanks for this, I'll be reading it soon.