Sup Veeky Forums,
Looking to buy an M3 in the next year or so and I'm currently having the debate of which would be better, an E36 or E46? E30 is out of the question, but if 996 911s keep falling that might be a possibility as well.
What would you prefer and why?
If you can afford it, E46. The E36 is a more fun car to drive at lower speeds, but mostly due to its lower limits, better midrange, and better steering feel. The E46 makes most of its power at high rpms and it's a way faster car all around so you really gotta drive like a fucktard to enjoy it.
They both have bad structural defects (subframe tears on 46, rear strut tower rot/tearing on E36), and the simpler, more reliable S52 is offset by being put into a older body made during a particular malaise era of BMW where they chose to put the cheapest plastic in places plastic simply didn't belong.
I'd get the E46 M3 definitely over a 996 911, and the E36 M3 over a 986 Boxsters S. Both are comparable, but the BMWs are far far cheaper to fix (just price out replacement engines) and have a better aftermarket. Cheaper and more practical, too.
The E36 is more akin to a S2000/RX8/Boxster S in performance. The E46 is closer to a Evo/STi/370Z.
Thanks for the feedback, I've been leaning towards the E46 all along, but in my searches I keep seeing the E36 pop up and they don't look bad at all (but I always kind of thought it was a bit lesser of a car).
It's definitely a lower performance car. It's still relevant in 2016 being as quick as many 10 year old sports cars and new sport compacts despite being 20 years old. But the E46 is still better.
Figure $10k for a nice E36 give or take $2k. The E36s are appreciating just because they're so old, nice ones are hard to find.
$16k for a nice E46 give or take $4k. There's more of them out there, but avoid SMG cars unless you can deal with changing a $2000 pump.
>e46 closer to a 370z or STi
stock for stock the E46 walks any STI, EVO or 370z every day of the week
Get a 996, it's actually a proper sports car and not an tricked out entry level luxury car
Not to mention even the base model 996s can outperform M3s
youre delusional as fuck
the m3 is faster on track and straight line than a 996 and has 10x more aftermarket and is 10x cheaper to upkeep
>The E46 is closer to a Evo/STi/370Z.
you are a fucking moron, A 330ci maybe but were talking about and E46 ///M3
>10x cheaper to upkeep
And you call me delusional
kek, even the ancient E36 M3 hangs with the 996 ''proper sports car'' lmao
you`re either a nocar or a complete retard
It's on average 2 seconds faster on those tracks, that's a huge difference
But I guess you wouldn't know since you've never been on a track
Those base model Carreras can be picked up under $20k in good condition too, the only E46 M3s I see under $20k are the shitty SMG cars
Fanboy hype. Its still a 333hp car in a 3400-3500lb body. The Evo/STis make a little less power (300hp) but weigh 200-300lbs less and have AWD. You'd be a fool or a idiot to underestimate them. Same with the 370Z, it makes the same power in a lighter car (it's more equal though being both FR Sports Cars)
>Euro E36 Evo vs early 996
>rear strut tower rot/tearing on E36
This is due to the lower quality steel they were using at that time. Corrosion also a big issue because of it so check the car out thoroughly.
an SMG is still better than the automatic transmissions from the 996
And the difference is so minimal you could shave off the 1.3-2 seconds with basic suspension mods and walk the 996 on track even with the 24 year old E36 lol.
But why the fuck would you buy a Tiptronic or SMG?
But whatever, keep chasing those laptimes you'll never reach you benchracer
Fanboy hype or not, the E46 M3 is way faster than those cars. Not even mentioning the interior build quality and comfort is out of any of the japs league, have you ever sat in one of those cars?
>slower
>hangs with
kek
Because all the cheap 996s come with Tiptronics anyway. Same with the cheap M3s with SMGs.
>someone with valid points and helpful discussion
>on my Veeky Forums
I'm impressed
Less than $15k US and it comes with a 6 speed
>B-but muh miles
It's a Porsche, not a Ferrari
Yeah I have, and either of the 3 won't have you replacing shitty rubber/plastic parts in places everyone else doesn't use plastic/rubber like the BMWs will. Never heard of a Evo owner replacing guibos or plastic water pumps or doing valve adjustments :^)
I'd seriously consider a 04-07 WRX STi/Evo but I'm not big on the Z. It's not as motorsports oriented (has bad cooling issues when abused, brakes and engine oil can get too hot too easily).
I unironically own a E36 M3.
Ehhh it has more to do with the strut mounts wearing out and moving around (trailing arm design moves in a arc, mount is meant to be fixed) + not enough sheet metal on the strut towers. Not surprising for BMW. Minis have a similar issue where their strut caps mushroom out instead.
Import a LHD E36 M3 Evo from Japan. It'll run you about the same amount. Your choice on 3.0 vs 3.2. I like the 3.0, it's simpler and a bit stronger.
For the price you can find a manual E46 M3 and it would still be cheaper to upkeep on the long run than a 996 (look up cracked cylinder heads, cracked driveshafts on the 3.4 liters). And it would be faster as well
If you think a BMW is expensive to upkeep you don`t ever want to get a Porsche.
>rubber/plastic parts everywhere
On the E36 sure.
I`m talking about the E46 M3
>cracked driveshafts
You mean half shaft? You know those are only $100 each, right?
I`m talking cracked intermediate driveshafts
Also you can read this
autofarm.co.uk
see
How about those rear subframes?
lol, if anything a cracked rear subframe is still much cheaper to repair than a fucked Porsche engine
It affected a small percentage of early E46s (2001) and pretty much every E46 M3 has the subframe reinforcement done by now, under warranty or not
Try to find a subframe cracked M3 nowadays i dare you
You didn't even read the linked post regarding the IMS, did you?
The parts alone cost 1900$, god knows about the labour costs
A subframe reinforcement costs about 800-1500$ on the M3, parts and labour
As I said, cheaper
>The parts alone cost 1900$
Nigga even the LN Engineering solution that converts the IMS design back to Mezger specs is only $1700, you still didn't read the post
>Paying for labour for a job you can easily do during a clutch change
I would get an E46. If it were just two normal BMW's, it would be a tough choice for me too, but the E36 M3 is generally regarded to be one of the more underwhelming M's. The E46 is more comfy, practical, faster, and ultimately still has god tier handling and feel.
You seem like you've got money so I won't harp on about taking care of your car, as long as you''re not the type to let a problem sit you're golden.
Otherwise, congrats and good luck. I guarantee you're going to love whichever one you buy.
E46 M3s still use plastic cooling system bits (expansion tank/rad/pump impeller/tstat housing), plastic seat gears, rubber guibos/driveshaft carrier bushings, rubber strut mounts, rubber differential and subframe carrier mounts, rubber transmission/engine mounts, etc. Just like a E36 does. And it has double VANOS.
The only difference is that they're
1. Newer (most important one)
2. The interior doesn't fall apart as quickly (yet to see a delaminating door card or headliner, this IMO has more to do with BMW "perfecting" environmentally friendly glue)
Yep. BMW parts are WAY WAY WAY WAY cheaper than Porsche parts. Just compare them on FCPEuro. I can get:
Lemforder Tierod Assemblies Made in Germany for $45/each side.
A Behr Z3M Radiator Made in South Africa is $160
A Saleri/Graf Made in Italy Water Pump is $50
Meyle HD Rear Strut Mounts are $15/each
Mind you, all OEM or better without the BMW boxes. The Porsche parts are all nearly double even x3-4 the price
>BMW parts are WAY WAY WAY WAY cheaper than Porsche parts
Makes sense
OP here, thanks for the advice all.
I'll continue looking for an E46 M3 like I have been, you've reassured me of my convictions.