Is BMW the brand that has fallen the most?

Is BMW the brand that has fallen the most?

Pretty much their entire lineup at the minute is shit. Overpriced, bloated, shit sounding, shit looks etc. Only exception is the M2 and even that is meh.

Has anyone else blundered more?

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They "fell" in 2010/11 when they were seriously being competed with by a Ford Mustang not only in 0-60, but with lap times as well by a car almost half the price. Even now the M2 is getting beat in every way by the admittedly expensive GT350R. True car enthusiasts are waking up and looking past the brand name and buying contenders and out performers for less. That is the downfall of the brand. They rode out the name without innovating much in the last 6 years and have been jumped on. In 2005 the M3 was the coolest car to own at the time for my age. Now it's gone stale. I'd take a S550 mustang and put the money into mods rather than buy anything BMW offers.

Before you call me a Ford shill, I've owned an 03 M3, a 530i and a 550.

In addition to that, I think the other part of their brand value proposition was that they were "sports luxury". These days, their interiors are just a notch above Ford and not even close to Mercedes, Lexus, or even Audis new interiors. I was very disappointed when I sat in the current M3 and M4.

Honda and Toyota are pretty bad. All they really make are normie cars these days.

And even their normie cars have been seriously cucked. Take a look at the CR-V...

>360hp M2 vs 512hp mustang
whew what a comparison
Anyway I'm pretty sure German cars have never had the best price/performance when compared to domestic. It's a much different story accross the pond

Oh great it's this fuccboi. Nigga BMW is shit now. Their glory days are gone.

Yet the M2 is still the best car in its class, same with the M3, X5M/X6M, M6 and more.
Expensive - sure but you get what you pay for.

What class? Overpriced German smallish coupe class? All of those cars are in retarded """"classes"""" so it's easy to say "Muh best in class". They are overpriced, overhyped shit. Increase the sample size and you'll see they aren't what they used to be. The fucking M5 is almost 100,000 dollars for fuck sake. The brand still riding off its name.

Audi RS7/RS6 and the Mercedes E63 AMG cost more, yet the M5 performs better than both of them.
Sure for 100k you can get a corvette or something but that is not the point

>"Sheer Driving Pleasure" (Worldwide)
>"The Ultimate Driving Machine" (United States, United Kingdom)
>"The Ultimate Driving Experience" (Canada)
>"Freude am Fahren" (Germany)
I think BMW are doing alright

If only BMW even made the M2 with a properly fucking aligned driver seat.

>BMW charge $53k for a 360hp car
>Ford charge $55k for a 512hp car
>GUYS IT'S NOT A FAIR COMPARISON
Get fucked bimmercunt.

Toyota interiors are insanely cheap and bland looking. Nissan interiors are a little upgrade but vomit inducing.

>itt: I HATE BMW THEY'RE ALL SHIT LE SUPREME GENTLEMAN OVERPRICED MY MIATA IS BETTER
>NO IT'S NOT BMW MAKES THE BEST RACING SUVS ON THE MARKET

Veeky Forums why the hell are you so predictable these days?

Uh the M2 has luxury unlike the Mustang.

>ctrl+f miata
>0 results outside of your post
Hrmm...

Have M cars ever been about track times though? I thought they were always just about being really nice cars to drive for enthusiasts.

>modern BMW
LMAO
youtube.com/watch?v=IMUV2u4Bp0A
youtube.com/watch?v=--3p20D5yH8

No BMW has not fallen. Have you tried driving the very car in your image? Its amazing. The new cars look great except for maybe the X6. It is not overpriced considering they have 30k models now and their sedan directly competes with Mercedes, not the accord or Camry you seem to be comparing it to.

They also still offer manuals, which is a huge plus in my book

>fake leather
>scratchy plastic everywhere
>muh soft touch
Natural that a bimmercunt has no real concept of "luxury"

explain

they indeed have always focused purely focused on driving fun while being a luxurious daily driver.
A Ford is domestic, so it's naturally cheaper. Not to mention the cheap build quality and cheap building costs.
The M2 is still a luxury car that can be comfortably daily driven, the Shelby is a track car

Due to cost cutting measures and engineering laziness, the M2's driver seat is adjusted to pass side crash safety testing. Instead of pointing straight ahead at the wheel/direction of the road, you are literally facing the left headlight and are tilted diagonally in the seat compared to the entire rest of the car. What the fuck

its sad when the 360hp car is faster

How are turbocharged inline 6s now making over 400 horsepower from the factory a bad thing?

>overpriced
like always
>bloated
like all manufacturers now.

I've got an older 135i. I dig it, it still comes with a 6 speed manual but has a modern twin turbo inline 6. The car was cheap. The other alternative car I wanted was an old termi but those things are 5 years older, shitty interior and cost about 5 grand more than what I paid for my BMW

The car MT tested was a pre production euro spec vehicle, literally no other reviewers have ever found the issue
And if anything, Chris Harris loves the seating position in the M235i/M2, lol

Ty for the info, saw other reviews but just assumed they failed to mention it. If it's not the case in US production models, then it's for sure the best current BMW product and I will reconsider it as my dream attainable driver.

Honestly literally no BMW car I can recall has had a completely "straight"
seating position, the steering wheel or the pedals have always looked like they're "offset", so maybe they were on to something.
But the fact that BMW seating positions are usually perfect for the driver, remains

BMWs glory days ended after the E46.

Thats no gut feeling, the always were a bit crooked and offset.

>Is BMW the brand that has fallen the most?

no, sales are good and the company is turning a decent profit, it hasn't "fallen" at all.

its a dual scroll single turbo you fucking faggot. your 135 is not twin turbo'd

Yeah but that RS7 is fucking beautiful man
I'd give up some performance for looks.
Especially when I live in Ameriland where I'll maybe get one of those cars to 130 on the open freeway before geting pulled over and shot on live news

ITT bunch of faggots assmad about cars they cant afford

You seem to know what you're talking about so I'll ask you, have you ever sat in an M6? Or could you give me an opinion on whether or not the newest gen is worth buying? Heard anything about the B7?

I'm in the market for a new car in the $100-150k range. I need 4 seats but not necessarily 4 doors if the back seats are usable. It has to be fast (sub 5 second 0-60) but also comfortable as I do a lot of long distance driving for my work. Other cars I'm considering are an S-class coupe AMG (upper end of budget, would like to spend less), Range Rover SVR (don't really need an SUV but it looks and sounds incredible), and a V8 Aston. Convertible is a huge plus but not a deal breaker. Any other cars I should look in to?

Pic related is my current car. Great fun but I can't live with just 2 seats and such poor trunk space as I have a dog and a girlfriend.

Lol

>stripped to ground shit base model
>can buy a Q50 fully loaded
Why BMW buyers so blind about their brand

worst bait of thread. Q50? have fun with your computer-fucked traction/nanny controls and imperfect drive-by-wire.

the z4 is fucking amazing

They are nice cars but they're not as fast as they are perceived to be. I have a 2015 mustang gt with a full exhaust, tune and intake and I pulled 3 car lengths on a 2013 M3 with the competition package on the highway. The M3 is 30K more ffs.

>comparing infinishit to BMW
top lel

...

Honda, same story but way worse interiors. BMW was at least good until the F30, Honda went to shit around the mid 2000s

wtf is pic related

Nope:

Honda
Mitsubishi

People like to harp on about price/performance forgetting you're not buying a BMW for that reason. You're buying it for the overall package. World-class handling, practicality, luxury, with decent straight line speed.

When every M3 was out there was ALWAYS some Jap/American car that was cheaper AND faster at the same time. The bigger problem with BMWs is that to compete with Mercedes and Lexus they've abandoned building sports cars for building isolated luxury cars then gone full retard with tech and lightweight materials to make up for the added weight making them even further from their original purpose.

1980s = E30 M3 = RX7 Turbo II and C4 L98 6spd

1990s = E36 M3 = LT1 Z28 and MR2 Turbo (admittedly the E36 was a special one-off car in a time "cheap sports cars" were getting rarer in the USA)

Early-Mid 2000s = E46 M3 = SRT4 ACR (there's actually a magazine comparing both, the Neon did fucking great), Evo 8/WRX STi, and 03-04 Mustang Cobra/C5 Corvette.

Late 2000s-Early 2010s= E90 M3 = Mustang GT Performance Pack/Camaro ZR1

how mad are you when my Infiniti sedan can fly by your shit base model BMW

Correction, what I meant to say was back in the 1990s the E36 M3 WAS the cheap speed car ($35-40k USD when your average Supra/300ZX/3000GT Twin Turbo cost $50-70k, and had better handling with slightly lower straight line speed)

>Has anyone else blundered more?
Lancia and Mitsubishi

>guys, I want to spend 15-20K more on a weaker, shittier sounding car with fake luxury and a "couldn't actually afford an m4" stigma, just to brag about beating a 2 ton American pony car by half a second

you'd be surprised, to the kind of people in the market for these cars new, marketing is way more influential than how a car actually drives

they hear bmw is sporty and believe it. they won't even consider something like a cadillac which is much sportier by now, BRANDS AND MARKETING RULE EVERYTHING

to that end, they can short change their R&D and dump that money into marketing instead and actually grow faster

Depending on the year, yes it is twin.

I'm just sad that the only interesting nip cars atm are like the 86, wrx/sti, 370z, gtr and MAYBE the mx5 (excluding lexus cause muh luxobarge)
rip the times when every manufacturer had like atleast 3 performance models or atleast not boring appliance cars

>cheap build quality
have you even seen the inside of a s550 premium? It's literally on par with BMW if not even better

yes it is...

BMW is the brand poorfags and nocars seem to talk about the most.

At least BMW had somewhere to fall unlike the majority of shit owned here.

>Has anyone else blundered more?

Yep

are you retarded. those are the only performance cars you could think of? every manufacture has at least one performance model.

...

>pretty much every LMP2 car has a nissan engine
>LMP2 cars are faster than GT cars

No shit. How much of a fanboi can one be?

>b-but muh pushrods are lighter than DOHC
>b-but muh torque

why is nobody using an LS engine in LMP2?

I'm not a GM fanboy senpai

well you are either a nissan fanboy or a gm fanboy, pick a side

what if I dislike both?

look nigger, pick a side and fuck off

my fav brand is neither nissan nor gm but i still had to pick a side

thats how Veeky Forums works

> audi interiors

lel

People that don't know cars think of them as follows:

>Super rich tier
Italian Stallions (Ferrari, Bugatti, etc)
>Rich tier
BMW
Audi
Jaguar
Mercedes Benz
Cadillac
"Sports cars" meaning anything that exposes the occupants to the elements
>Poor tier
Anything 80s -> 15 years before the current year
>Retro tier
80s and below
>Old man tier
Lincoln
Chrysler
>Normal tier
Ford
GM
Honda
Toyota
>Oddball tier
Saab
Volvo
Subaru
>Street racer tier
Anything with a spoiler or post-factory rice/body kit
American muscle

Thats not true you dumb fuck. Sit in the god damned car. That was one retard reporter and cucks like you gobbled it up

Real leather
Interior dripping with real carbon fiber
High quality design fit and finish

You want to see fake leather take a look at your shit mustang snd vinyl wrapped dashboard u delusional shit. You know how i know youve never even seen an m2 or mustang in real life?

Thats a lie and u know it. Stop being so stupid.

This. The seat is straight but the wheels and pedals are offset. Literally every BMW i have ever owned besides the X5 was this way. Its a non issue and you dont even notice. I have no idea why but i assume there is a reason

we oddball tier now
Although Subaru has become much more normal in the last 5-10 years imo.

The BMW costs 50k
The Camaro is 46k
Get fucked

>$4k to brag to the dude at the Maccas drive-thru about lap times
Benchracers, everyone.

I have an irrational dislike for turbos. I like anything N/A. Just sounds better.

we meant in quality of cars, not sales. BMW launching FWD cars (2AT, future 1 series and X1) and putting turbos on every engine (while 20 years ago they put out marketing promising to never ever turbo an engine)...

Mazda, since regaining their independence, has become the new Honda.

Subaru has basically become Volvo, now if only their marketing were to improve...

>Mazda, since regaining their independence, has become the new Honda.
I would agree entirely, they make relatively fun econoboxes with good interiors.

BMWs are just like women on Veeky Forums. Everybody pretends to hate them because they can't have them.

Chris Harris also likes it up the ass.

In the history of the company has BMW ever made a single mistake?

You're the one with the warped view, not "people".

Veeky Forums Car Tiers
>Total shit but drive-able
My car
>god tier
car I want
>absolute normie faggot shit only cucks and fuccs will buy
everything else

>leased automatic 318i
>"muh ultimate driver masheen"

Would rather get my hands on a manual 328i coupe and boost the everliving shit out of it.

no

...

Yes, they have become bloated cars for normies just like every marque. We get it, you're a californian, we won't blame you for being queer and unable to afford one.

E36*

I'm a pre-2006 BMW fanboy and I agree with this guy.

The cars have gotten stale. AMG blows M's out of the pond, both in performance and interior quality. BMW's have STI syndrome, they keep getting heavier and angrier, without getting much faster. BMW has started pandering to the same people that buy Lexus. Boring car that's "nice" in the words of normies, good enough to get idiots to waste their money, not good enough to live up to the standard that the E39 and E46 set.

You can literally buy a 2003 M5 for a fraction of the cost of a new one and it will be a better car. 300 horsepower stock, great interior, timeless body, great handling, and you won't drive a car that looks like every other modern piece of shit on the road. Same goes for M3's. It's a travesty that BMW has allowed far cheaper brands to catch up to them this much. I don't like mustangs very much, but the facts are there. It's hard to justify buying BMW for the feel and quality when it's just not there anymore, not like it used to be. As it stands, BMW's should be priced far cheaper.

Fucking BMW, they ruined BMW.

>you only pay for the engine

i find it funny how the biggest modern bmw detractors are huge bmw fans....just of their old stuff

bmw deserves all the hate they get right now by the way, fuck them
it's like they took all the engineers that know how to make a fun car and stuck them on the 2 series project, now it's the best thing to drive in their entire lineup hands down

>leased automatic 318i
>"muh ultimate driver masheen"
That wasn't my argument at all. Keep playing strawman though, if it helps you feel intelligent.

you're retarded if you think an e39 is a better car than the f10
amgs also cost a lot more.
and it's not wrong that a 50k mustang can keep up with a 50k m2.

it's not 1990 anymore, the car as we know it has basically been maxed out in all aspects.

Bugatti is French gay boi

>AMG blows Ms out of the water
Maybe the $600k SLS AMG Black Series
otherwise bullshit
M5 F10>E63
M3>C63
M6>CLS63
X6M>GLE63
M2>CLA45
etc.

>it's not 1990 anymore, the car as we know it has basically been maxed out in all aspects.
People like him can't accept that and are stuck with auto nostalgia. After the mid 2000s things stagnated and they will stay that way until we go electric. He's a modern day boomer

M3

the C63 weighs fuckin 3770 lbs
that's almost the weight of an M5 lmao

>land barge autotragic>manual M3
No.
People like you are the reason cars suck now a days.

jaguar f type r (sex machine)

bmw tested was 65k.

none of those were performance enhancing options

What should I know about Infiniti that makes them bad/good?